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Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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I don't even know why they're getting so defensive about it, since according to the genius that is Tom Warren, a 4TF console has beat PS5 to the punch?

I mean, yeah, on paper we could have done this, then that, so our console would be even more powerful... but oh, wait, we have Lockhart, guys! We're saved!

I swear, these people really can't figure it out...
The guy isn't wrong though, you're just pissed it's an Xbox director saying it. A stable 1.825Ghz will be easier to target and develop for. The devs know exactly what to aim for and what it can maintain at those speeds. Developers on the PS5 much choose the best frequency for their own goals and that could add complications in development. The thing that irks me about these PS5 arguments though is that 90% of what we know about it is from Cerny's presentation and a few pre-planned trailers and demos. Absolutely nothing concrete says all these implementations and wonder work Cerny described will actually let a 9-10.2tf console pull ahead of a sustained 12.1tf machine with more brute force computational power.

This SSD seems an awful lot like the secret "dGpu" rumours that Xbox had in its controller (lol) or the blistering fast but hard to develop for ESRAM. People are either going to be disappointed or blown away in July when Xbox shows their first party stuff. The skeptic in me thinks they've been keeping quiet for the last few years and deliberately holding back on showing to early to have an all out blowout for the launch of next gen.

They bought a shit load of studios in the last few years and have had them quietly working away on their new games. We have yet to see ANY of them other than Hellblade 2 at the Game Awards. Theres a pattern to it all too starting from when Phil took over. They were blasted for low power and high price, bad policies and weak first party titles. Then came the XB1X, a direct opposite to its XB1 predecessor, the most powerful console on the market and smallest Xbox ever made. They gave BC all the way back to the OG with no extra cost on any of it, they made Gamepass which developers seem to be praising and fans seem to be loving it too. As i said, they've just went on a buying spree of big name and small name developers and they're message on Series X is firmly on raw power and efficieny, games first.

I mean, if you cant see the writing on the wall yet them i cant help you either. Now that the Xbox is ahead in raw power, that doesn't matter and only the games do now so everyone best buckle up if Xbox start hitting homeruns with their new studios and IP because the weak hardware argument wont matter anymore and neither will an ultra fast SSD if the games are the only important piece of the puzzle.
 

xacto

Member
The guy isn't wrong though, you're just pissed it's an Xbox director saying it. A stable 1.825Ghz will be easier to target and develop for. The devs know exactly what to aim for and what it can maintain at those speeds. Developers on the PS5 much choose the best frequency for their own goals and that could add complications in development. The thing that irks me about these PS5 arguments though is that 90% of what we know about it is from Cerny's presentation and a few pre-planned trailers and demos. Absolutely nothing concrete says all these implementations and wonder work Cerny described will actually let a 9-10.2tf console pull ahead of a sustained 12.1tf machine with more brute force computational power.

This SSD seems an awful lot like the secret "dGpu" rumours that Xbox had in its controller (lol) or the blistering fast but hard to develop for ESRAM. People are either going to be disappointed or blown away in July when Xbox shows their first party stuff. The skeptic in me thinks they've been keeping quiet for the last few years and deliberately holding back on showing to early to have an all out blowout for the launch of next gen.

They bought a shit load of studios in the last few years and have had them quietly working away on their new games. We have yet to see ANY of them other than Hellblade 2 at the Game Awards. Theres a pattern to it all too starting from when Phil took over. They were blasted for low power and high price, bad policies and weak first party titles. Then came the XB1X, a direct opposite to its XB1 predecessor, the most powerful console on the market and smallest Xbox ever made. They gave BC all the way back to the OG with no extra cost on any of it, they made Gamepass which developers seem to be praising and fans seem to be loving it too. As i said, they've just went on a buying spree of big name and small name developers and they're message on Series X is firmly on raw power and efficieny, games first.

I mean, if you cant see the writing on the wall yet them i cant help you either. Now that the Xbox is ahead in raw power, that doesn't matter and only the games do now so everyone best buckle up if Xbox start hitting homeruns with their new studios and IP because the weak hardware argument wont matter anymore and neither will an ultra fast SSD if the games are the only important piece of the puzzle.

I mean it's ok that you cannot help me, you don't really need to; I also cannot help you either - neo account, the name of your account, it's absolutely all right to be defending your piece of plastic.

Just don't pretend you're here to "save" or "help" anyone since that's not why you're here at all. Just carry on with "raw power" and "games first" and "efficiency" that the talking heads back at Microsoft are throwing around, because obviously their tactics are working; there's always people like you who take it all in, hook, line and sinker.

You're next generation Xbox's hope to sell anything at all this generation.
 

icerock

Member
The guy isn't wrong though, you're just pissed it's an Xbox director saying it. A stable 1.825Ghz will be easier to target and develop for. The devs know exactly what to aim for and what it can maintain at those speeds. Developers on the PS5 much choose the best frequency for their own goals and that could add complications in development. The thing that irks me about these PS5 arguments though is that 90% of what we know about it is from Cerny's presentation and a few pre-planned trailers and demos. Absolutely nothing concrete says all these implementations and wonder work Cerny described will actually let a 9-10.2tf console pull ahead of a sustained 12.1tf machine with more brute force computational power.

This SSD seems an awful lot like the secret "dGpu" rumours that Xbox had in its controller (lol) or the blistering fast but hard to develop for ESRAM. People are either going to be disappointed or blown away in July when Xbox shows their first party stuff. The skeptic in me thinks they've been keeping quiet for the last few years and deliberately holding back on showing to early to have an all out blowout for the launch of next gen.

They bought a shit load of studios in the last few years and have had them quietly working away on their new games. We have yet to see ANY of them other than Hellblade 2 at the Game Awards. Theres a pattern to it all too starting from when Phil took over. They were blasted for low power and high price, bad policies and weak first party titles. Then came the XB1X, a direct opposite to its XB1 predecessor, the most powerful console on the market and smallest Xbox ever made. They gave BC all the way back to the OG with no extra cost on any of it, they made Gamepass which developers seem to be praising and fans seem to be loving it too. As i said, they've just went on a buying spree of big name and small name developers and they're message on Series X is firmly on raw power and efficieny, games first.

I mean, if you cant see the writing on the wall yet them i cant help you either. Now that the Xbox is ahead in raw power, that doesn't matter and only the games do now so everyone best buckle up if Xbox start hitting homeruns with their new studios and IP because the weak hardware argument wont matter anymore and neither will an ultra fast SSD if the games are the only important piece of the puzzle.

giphy.gif
 
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Absolutely nothing concrete says all these implementations and wonder work Cerny described will actually let a 9-10.2tf console pull ahead of a sustained 12.1tf machine with more brute force computational power
@nush - The key here on the ban message is 'The usual '9TF' console warrior nonsense. [ ]....post is obviously meant to antagonise.'

@captainraincoat can make their appeal of why they are dropping the '9TF' argument other console warriors are known to use, and have also been banned for. Without that qualifier the post is fine. With it, it's just there to antagonise people. If you can provide the confirmation that the console is in fact 9TF (by which we mean runs at a majority of the time at 9TF as per the insinuation) and not 10.28TF as detailed in the release materials, then we can roll back now. Until then the onus is on @captainraincoat to provide that evidence via the appeal address. Or alternatively justify what the purpose of dropping that statement was. It should be relatively easily to clear up.

The bait comment was in response to baiting other posters (probably Playstation owners) to come in and go through the same cyclical argument of 9TF, it's not 9TF etc. We see no reason this is not the case here. It did not need to be mentioned to make the underlying point. But we are open to being convinced otherwise.


EDIT: In fact, I will lift the ban, I will message @captainraincoat directly and delete the post. They have no priors so I'm sure they will be receptive to this action instead.

You have proof of that?

tenor.gif
 
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LED Guy?

Banned
That was a demo pushed pushed to show the best possible graphics in 5min, knowing that most people will watch this online. Big difference with a full game on 4K tv's.
Full games will be harder to push at 4K though, I hope you got my point because I have written a very long comment with irrefutable concerns and facts, I mean it even goes without saying that 1 console baseline is better than being 2 consoles and being held back by a weaker one.
 
You have proof of that?

tenor.gif

I suppose not, a mod can edit if they feel like doing so or just ban me whatever, its the usual action anyway. I just saw the 9tf rumour floating around on here constantly so its stuck in my head as that is what it was with the variable clock speed talk going around ect. A genuine mistake, don't shoot.

Still even when corrected, 12 > 10 in this case is true and no amount of discediting me over a one off post will change that. Unless we're just not allowed to talk TF's anymore incase some sensitivie soul is offended and wants to mock my account some more, feel free.
 
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xacto

Member
I know the XSX has more flops and is more powerful than the PS5. It's people making claims of the PS5 being 9.2 TFs and not providing proof that bothers me.

But in a way, that's just fine, really, it's the fastest and shortest way to end this pain, of trying to make the 9TF narrative stick. The ban list is full of people who make this claim, so maybe it's all for the better.
 
I suppose not, a mod can edit if they feel like doing so or just ban me whatever, its the usual action anyway. I just saw the 9tf rumour floating around on here constantly so its stuck in my head as that is what it was with the variable clock speed talk going around ect. A genuine mistake, don't shoot.

Still even when corrected, 12 > 10 in this case is true and no amount of discediting me over a one off post will change that. Unless we're just not allowed to talk TF's anymore incase some sensitivie soul is offended and wants to mock my account some more, feel free.

Nope we don't appreciate people making claims without any proof. At this point claiming that the PS5 is a 9.2TF console is just trolling unless you have something that counters Cernys or Sonys claims.
 
But in a way, that's just fine, really, it's the fastest and shortest way to end this pain, of trying to make the 9TF narrative stick. The ban list is full of people who make this claim, so maybe it's all for the better.
I wasn't trying to make anything stick, i have no stocks are stake in how much the next Xbox sells. I wont benefit in any meaningful way from it thats for sure. I just constantly saw it on here over and over again and now i'm being chastisized for it cause i don't have my head firmly stuck in GAF threads 24/7 to read every post and be corrected.

Whatever, be bitter about it all you want.
 

I was re-reading this before and do we know what happened to this guy?

I remember when he withdrew what he had said and I remember seeing comments on twitter somewhere from the hardcore xbox side, he got slated, all was dismissed and he was branded a liar...

But seems poor chap was just being honest.

I think everything that's come out since has only strengthened his statements, with things like unreal engine 5 and praise showered from all devs and people like Tim sweeney etc. Epic VP calling PS5 a masterpiece of design.

True or not it was probably not only violating NDA, but also taking on a role as a representative of the company that he had no right to.

Wait, what did i even say that is wrong though? Honestly if you'd point it out i might not make the same mistake twice you know.

PS5’s GPU to be down-clocked to 2.0Ghz wouldn’t make any sense with how it has been described so far, which is that it spends most of its time at or near 2.23Ghz, with only a “few percent” down-clock required to be drawing 10% less power, which in a system that targets fixed power means not a lot at all, just enough to tame power hungry moments which aren’t what we associate with complex graphics, but uncapped map screens or some kind of system using a lot of AVX instructions (of which a fixed clock system has to assume minimal usage for the same reasons).

That’s why the “9TF” label now needs to be qualified to not be seen as derailing/trolling.

To suggest the clocks vary from 2.0-2.23Ghz has no grounding at all.
 
Jesus christ, i said one thing wrong and now i'm spreading FUD. Honestly it's whatever at this point, i admitted my mistake and want a mod to edit it if they want to or just go ahead and ban, it's easy enough to make a new account anyway but seriously, the reaction is just way over the top and uncalled for when i've admitted i was in the wrong.
 

icerock

Member
Sue me, i'm an Xbox fan it's not a crime by the way.

Again with the persecution complex....

I could waste my time and energy trying to pick your post apart bit by bit but all the arguments in there have been beaten to death by me and many other posters in this very thread. Feel free to dig through.

That GIF is appropriate given the nature of your post and its tone. If you were interested in generating some meaningful discussion then you could’ve dropped the aggressive warrior rhetoric. But given your short and brief posting history, I somehow doubt that. Have an enjoyable stay, feel free to stick me and others who you feel are picking on you on ignore.
 

Neo Blaster

Member
The guy isn't wrong though, you're just pissed it's an Xbox director saying it. A stable 1.825Ghz will be easier to target and develop for. The devs know exactly what to aim for and what it can maintain at those speeds. Developers on the PS5 much choose the best frequency for their own goals and that could add complications in development. The thing that irks me about these PS5 arguments though is that 90% of what we know about it is from Cerny's presentation and a few pre-planned trailers and demos. Absolutely nothing concrete says all these implementations and wonder work Cerny described will actually let a 9-10.2tf console pull ahead of a sustained 12.1tf machine with more brute force computational power.

This SSD seems an awful lot like the secret "dGpu" rumours that Xbox had in its controller (lol) or the blistering fast but hard to develop for ESRAM. People are either going to be disappointed or blown away in July when Xbox shows their first party stuff. The skeptic in me thinks they've been keeping quiet for the last few years and deliberately holding back on showing to early to have an all out blowout for the launch of next gen.

They bought a shit load of studios in the last few years and have had them quietly working away on their new games. We have yet to see ANY of them other than Hellblade 2 at the Game Awards. Theres a pattern to it all too starting from when Phil took over. They were blasted for low power and high price, bad policies and weak first party titles. Then came the XB1X, a direct opposite to its XB1 predecessor, the most powerful console on the market and smallest Xbox ever made. They gave BC all the way back to the OG with no extra cost on any of it, they made Gamepass which developers seem to be praising and fans seem to be loving it too. As i said, they've just went on a buying spree of big name and small name developers and they're message on Series X is firmly on raw power and efficieny, games first.

I mean, if you cant see the writing on the wall yet them i cant help you either. Now that the Xbox is ahead in raw power, that doesn't matter and only the games do now so everyone best buckle up if Xbox start hitting homeruns with their new studios and IP because the weak hardware argument wont matter anymore and neither will an ultra fast SSD if the games are the only important piece of the puzzle.
All this text and he just ignores what Cerny said about developers not having to optimize at all...but you can continue pushing your narrative.
 
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Again with the persecution complex....

I could waste my time and energy trying to pick your post apart bit by bit but all the arguments in there have been beaten to death by me and many other posters in this very thread. Feel free to dig through.

That GIF is appropriate given the nature of your post and its tone. If you were interested in generating some meaningful discussion then you could’ve dropped the aggressive warrior rhetoric. But given your short and brief posting history, I somehow doubt that. Have an enjoyable stay, feel free to stick me and others who you feel are picking on you on ignore.
Alright i guess. fair enough.
 

Neo Blaster

Member
Jesus christ, i said one thing wrong and now i'm spreading FUD. Honestly it's whatever at this point, i admitted my mistake and want a mod to edit it if they want to or just go ahead and ban, it's easy enough to make a new account anyway but seriously, the reaction is just way over the top and uncalled for when i've admitted i was in the wrong.
Ok, time to call Mod of War Mod of War ...
 
Have you had other accounts? Kind of strange why you bring that up. At most you would have gotten some time off but now you just make yourself look suspicious.
Hardly suspicious when I’m outright telling you though is it? Yes I’ve had another account on here and yes, I may be a loudmouth fan of Xbox and again, yes you can look through my post history and see that i do in fact prefer Xbox.

I just get in to the heat of it sometimes but other than that I’m just a regular poster like yourself.

make your own judgements about whatever you suspect me off, go for it, knock yourself out.

I can be your new boogeyman I suppose?
 
People like this, with this "it's easy to make another account anyway" mentality are people who do not learn from their "admitted mistakes", because they know they can be back and keep on truckin'.
You’re really offended aren’t you? Hopefully the mod isn’t as stupid as you and take it so seriously.

“People like this” 🙄
 

J_Gamer.exe

Member
The guy isn't wrong though, you're just pissed it's an Xbox director saying it. A stable 1.825Ghz will be easier to target and develop for. The devs know exactly what to aim for and what it can maintain at those speeds. Developers on the PS5 much choose the best frequency for their own goals and that could add complications in development. The thing that irks me about these PS5 arguments though is that 90% of what we know about it is from Cerny's presentation and a few pre-planned trailers and demos. Absolutely nothing concrete says all these implementations and wonder work Cerny described will actually let a 9-10.2tf console pull ahead of a sustained 12.1tf machine with more brute force computational power.

This SSD seems an awful lot like the secret "dGpu" rumours that Xbox had in its controller (lol) or the blistering fast but hard to develop for ESRAM. People are either going to be disappointed or blown away in July when Xbox shows their first party stuff. The skeptic in me thinks they've been keeping quiet for the last few years and deliberately holding back on showing to early to have an all out blowout for the launch of next gen.

They bought a shit load of studios in the last few years and have had them quietly working away on their new games. We have yet to see ANY of them other than Hellblade 2 at the Game Awards. Theres a pattern to it all too starting from when Phil took over. They were blasted for low power and high price, bad policies and weak first party titles. Then came the XB1X, a direct opposite to its XB1 predecessor, the most powerful console on the market and smallest Xbox ever made. They gave BC all the way back to the OG with no extra cost on any of it, they made Gamepass which developers seem to be praising and fans seem to be loving it too. As i said, they've just went on a buying spree of big name and small name developers and they're message on Series X is firmly on raw power and efficieny, games first.

I mean, if you cant see the writing on the wall yet them i cant help you either. Now that the Xbox is ahead in raw power, that doesn't matter and only the games do now so everyone best buckle up if Xbox start hitting homeruns with their new studios and IP because the weak hardware argument wont matter anymore and neither will an ultra fast SSD if the games are the only important piece of the puzzle.

Parts of this post are like a fart in an elevator. Just wrong on so many levels.

The ps5 is stated as the easiest console to develop for....

The 9TF is more nonsense.

No one said the ps5 will pull ahead but things like the faster clock has advantages, also cache scrubbers for potentially higher CU occupancy. Devs are saying they are close and this is why.

Devs might use locked profiles but games will use the full boost. Not sure developing for a profile is much different to fixed clock...

The SSD is nothing like a secret GPU situation. As shown in my post the other day the insane speed means only 1 second of gameplay data is needed in ram. Meaning more can be used for what's on screen.

A slower io system would need more seconds of data stored in ram, so less for what's on screen. So that's more that might only be potentially used...

At the same fidelity level with much faster io you can move faster through the world.

Little to no pop in and lod....

The benefits are many and large, it's a game changer. You don't get all the hype and praise from guys like Tim Sweeny at epic (unreal engine 5) and many more for nothing.
 
Keep digging that hole.
Well if I broke any rules by having another account then ban me. Honestly at this point you guys can’t even be remotely reasonable. I’ve said I was wrong initially, what more do you want? Cancel culture be rife in here because dare you say one thing wrong that you’re completely unaware of then god help you, you’ll have Mod of War called on you by his triggered minions.
 

PaintTinJr

Member
…. I just saw the 9tf rumour floating around on here constantly so its stuck in my head as that is what it was with the variable clock speed talk going around ect. A genuine mistake, don't shoot.

….
Is that really true on neogaf in the last 10days - the duration of LeftThumbstick's account?

I'm still relatively new here, and I don't see that type of talk used liberally in threads without people being banned for it.
I'm now intrigued to know which threads this is happening in.
 
Is that really true on neogaf in the last 10days - the duration of LeftThumbstick's account?

I'm still relatively new here, and I don't see that type of talk used liberally in threads without people being banned for it.
I'm now intrigued to know which threads this is happening in.
Just cause my account is whatever days or hours old doesn’t mean I haven’t been browsing NeoGAF since 2013 btw.
 
If you really are an Xbox fan then would it even matter if PS5 had better graphics at the end of the day or vice versa?

Would it make you buy the other?
A lot of people buy due to the exclusive games they like. Power is far down the list and even more so that these are going to incredibly close machines.

I mean yeah to me it personally does. It’s like asking someone if they prefer x car over y car because one is faster than the other which is down to personal opinion and I have mine. Some people prefer other things about cars that sways their own decisions.

At most it will make me buy one before the other.. Xbox first most likely then a disc less PS5 you know?

Mind blowing stuff I know.
 

sircaw

Banned
I mean yeah to me it personally does. It’s like asking someone if they prefer x car over y car because one is faster than the other which is down to personal opinion and I have mine. Some people prefer other things about cars that sways their own decisions.

At most it will make me buy one before the other.. Xbox first most likely then a disc less PS5 you know?

Mind blowing stuff I know.

The real question is do you watch DEALER GAMING and COLTEASTWOOD? if you do, your DONE. :messenger_beaming:
 
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bitbydeath

Member
I mean yeah to me it personally does. It’s like asking someone if they prefer x car over y car because one is faster than the other which is down to personal opinion and I have mine. Some people prefer other things about cars that sways their own decisions.

At most it will make me buy one before the other.. Xbox first most likely then a disc less PS5 you know?

Mind blowing stuff I know.

Well if graphics are that important then I wouldn’t pick a side just yet.
 

J_Gamer.exe

Member
The real question is do you watch DEALER GAMING and COLTEASTWOOD? if you do, your DONE. :messenger_beaming:

I occasionally watch Dealer for a laugh to see the spin and then call him out with facts and educate in the comments lol...

He often says things along the lines of the xbox is the far superior hardware....

Its tough who to believe...

Devs says they are close..

Dealer says xbox is far superior and tweets about it being at least 40 fps better....



Who to believe....
 

sircaw

Banned
I occasionally watch Dealer for a laugh to see the spin and then call him out with facts and educate in the comments lol...

He often says things along the lines of the xbox is the far superior hardware....

Its tough who to believe...

Devs says they are close..

Dealer says xbox is far superior and tweets about it being at least 40 fps better....



Who to believe....


Yer i recall that tweet, it is beyond ridiculous for him to make a statement like that.
I mean he is obviously a total xbox fan boy probably getting dividends from his man Phil.

His quality of his videos are actually decent in production value but if your after a fair shake in whats going on in the console market, he is best to avoid watching.

Tbh i don't even know, who is on the straight and narrow anymore.
 

roops67

Member
Wonderful stuff as usual from this channel:


Hold onto your papers fellow scholars
Imagine this if you will... Having a AI powered GPU, generating graphics not through hardcore calculations done on CU cores but from what's its learnt on it's neural network. Yeah NVIDIA are using Tensor cores for DLSS2.0 for very convincing upscaling. Could there come a day where the graphics for games are generated by what it has been trained? The above video has shown machine learning can be trained to replicate realistic physics, acting like it's calculating the results but infact is guessing the results from what's its learnt, and doing it much faster than actual calculations! Analogous to baseball player batting a ball without calculating the trajectory. Could this be the future of realtime rendering, computers moving away from doing intense calculations but instead accurately guessing the results from learnt experience and much faster, this could mean it would be recognizing and aware of what it is rendering (or is it imagening??). How far down the road would that be from it being self aware / sentient?? It's feeling like we are entering the Twilight Zone
What a time to be alive... but not for long 😂
(If our demise is not by the uprising of the machines then defo it will be by the cats!)
 
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