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[MoGamesXNA]

I'm ok with this. More Bioshock would be a good thing. Having more material to make music videos from would be great

 

[CHEEZMO™]

Would never happen. Ken Levine can't write a villain if there's a chance his target audience might not agree with his(Ken's) views. Old timey racists, tea party nationalists and Ayn Rand are easy targets because they're basically strawmen in real life. Just look at how he pussyfoots around the Vox, effectively creating a moral equivalency between revolutionaries and their racist oppressors because they dared to take up arms against Sky Hitler.

Dude should probably stop pretending at the political commentary and just write old timey gangsters/Victorians going mmyeah shee/my word and shooting at each other like he wants to.

Yeah the treatment of the Vox post-uprising was annoying as fuck.

Stop telling me who and what I'm supposed too find abhorrent, Ken.

 

[Coxswain]

If they keep making Bioshock games centered around political themes, they have to do better than just cycling around between ideologies just because they 'haven't gotten to them yet', or because they're the opposite of what they used in the last game, or whatever.


Bioshock 1's critique of Objectivism/Libertarianism/etc was effective and meaningful mostly because it's a viewpoint that actual people, today, right now, actually believe in and will evangelize. You can look into the game, and you can see Irrational's take on what the end point of those policies would be, and how a society built around those principles would function (and then not-function).

Bioshock 2 was ostensibly about 'Collectivism', but it didn't really have fuck all to do with that political philosophy, and there wasn't really anything interesting about the villain's plot, because it relied on basically magic psychic brainwashing and obviously has no grounding in any actual, real-world political belief.

Bioshock Infinite was - when it dealt with anything political, which was not a lot of the time - kinda-sorta-almost about religion, and old-timey classism and racism. But it sort of fell apart too, because you really got the sense that nobody at Irrational could really wrap their heads around how someone could be that religious, that racist, or that classist. Instead of having characters that felt like actual people, holding actual racist or classist beliefs, you basically had the language of the modern-day used to describe those things, only delivered with a sneer and followed with a guffaw (Fink was especially bad for this). It all kind of felt like a cardboard cutout of cartoon characters who believed what the writers thought those people must have believed. You could never really confuse any of those characters for actual people who you know, so it just didn't feel genuine or real when it dealt with those issues.



I think, for that reason, neoliberalism probably actually is one of the only political belief structures that could be effective in a Bioshock game - it's the beliefs that the entire western world revolves on, both for "left" and "right" wing politics.
However, it would also be incredibly, incredibly difficult to encapsulate and portray inside of a video game, both because of how all-encompassing it is, and because it would be really hard to do it in such a way that players would actually understand what the critique is.


To be honest though, I think they'd be better off just dropping the political angle altogether. There are plenty of ideas that don't have a whole lot to do with politics, but could be explored through Irrational's style of writing and design.

 

[Sneds]

They're both flavors of capitalism, but neoliberalism is more tied to imperialism while objectivism would probably be more tied to isolationism. Objectivism is a totally wacky philosophical concept that lends itself to anarcho-capitalist fever dreams, neoliberalism heavily relies on the existence of the state to protect the "free market" as it rapes and pillages across the world.

Right. I see that.

Edit: Although Bioshock so far has been about isolated city-states and I'm not sure the neoliberalism you describe lends itself to that.

 

[Heart of Black]

At this point I'd prefer they just take the pen away from Levine.

 

[badgenome]

I am pretty amazed that there are people who have played any BioShock game and walked away impressed with the quality of the criticism it offered of a political ideology.

 

[Sneds]

I am pretty amazed that there are people who have played any BioShock game and walked away impressed with the quality of the criticism it offered of a political ideology.

I think it's a case of beggars can't be choosers. Bioshock tries to be about something other than just shooting people.

 

[RustyNails]

iirc, they're described as anarchists.


Like people already said though, socialism has kinda been done before (in everything from Animal Farm to Bioshock 2). It'd be kicking in an open door, especially in the US.

I have a hard time seeing them making a credible critique of another ideology in the same sense that they did in the first three. They've already touched on most major ones.

The one thing I'd want for the next Bioshock is just a 100% faithful to the world current events type narrative, but with plasmids through the magic of parallel universes. Like a Bioshock that starts out on Wall Street during the Occupy protest and directly tackles the stuff we see today. It'd be a gutsy as hell thing to do, because everyone's expecting a new retro art-deco or art-nouveau or art-whatever themed game. So instead, they should just make it ruthlessly realistic in terms of art direction.

Spoilers ahoy below

Well the Vox was basically an armed Occupy Wall Street with a central leadership. The Vox railed against the Prophet and the elites who amassed wealth at the top, while the folks in Shanty Town were living in dirt. You see that after Vox takes over Columbia, the rich people are strung up and their wealth looted. The voxophones of Daisy Fitzgerald talk about rich hoarding away too.

 

[guggnichso]

Think about it. First one was about libertarianism gone awry, with massive references to Randian thought and morals. Next one was about political history mixing with religious fervor in an explosive manner, with Industrialism and anti-union undertones. The next one could very well focus on 'the collective', about how a society is a single organism. We can have a Socialist leader like Lenin, broadcasting socialist ideals and forming a revolution.

With choice inspired quotes like:


laying the groundwork for revolution and overthrowing of the ruling class. Of course there can be the father of Socialist thought himself, Karl Marx. It doesn't necessarily have to be in US. But after the ending of Bioshock Infinite

Spoiler

, it could be just another version of US where socialism takes root

You seem to be a US citizen, aren't you? Because you seem to confuse sicialism with radical communism.

 

[Scrabble]

Would never happen. Ken Levine can't write a villain if there's a chance his target audience might not agree with his(Ken's) views. Old timey racists, tea party nationalists and Ayn Rand are easy targets because they're basically strawmen in real life. Just look at how he pussyfoots around the Vox, effectively creating a moral equivalency between revolutionaries and their racist oppressors because they dared to take up arms against Sky Hitler.

Dude should probably stop pretending at the political commentary and just write old timey gangsters/Victorians going mmyeah shee/my word and shooting at each other like he wants to.

I never felt in Bioshock or Infinite that Ken was preaching at me though, and it would have been much easier, and far less interesting, if the Vox had just been portrayed as this one note moral high ground where it's beaten over my head how awful the white man is.

 

[AppleMIX]

Guys, this would be like setting the next Columbus/Rapture in Canada.

 

[Tummi Gummi]

Bioshock 2 was ostensibly about 'Collectivism', but it didn't really have fuck all to do with that political philosophy, and there wasn't really anything interesting about the villain's plot, because it relied on basically magic psychic brainwashing and obviously has no grounding in any actual, real-world political belief.

I didn't think so. The "magic brainwashing" in Bioshock 2 (Sisters and Daddies, Alexander and Eleanor) was about as ubiquitous as it was in Bioshock 1 (Sisters and Daddies, pheremone control of spliced populace). The backstory to Lamb's movement was fairly similar to Fontaine & Atlas' approach - creating an army out of Rapture's underclass, minus the criminal and financial element. And Lamb's personal beliefs were mostly a melange of social-re-engineering fantasies popular in the 50s-70s within Psychology/Sociology/Anthropology. It was no more shallow or exaggerated than in Bioshock 1.

 

[Flatline]

I think many people confuse state capitalism aka authoritarian communism with socialism. Until the OP explains what he means by "socialism" I see no point replying to his suggestion.

 

[rosaceadude2112]

Guys, this would be like setting the next Columbus/Rapture in Canada.

you go to sweden and see all the kids in public schools playing on their ipads during the dedicated minecraft hour and go "wow that is so lame but I admire their energy policies" and shoot everyone

 

[ilikesanta]

I think it's a case of beggars can't be choosers. Bioshock tries to be about something other than just shooting people.

Yet we still shoot a hell of a lot of people. I'm in the camp that there doesn't need to be another Bioshock. Move on to something else. Bioshock 1 and Infinite have good stories, but basically the games boils down to (and most games these days) go here and kill everyone you see along the way.

They can still make games like Bioshock(story wise) but they don't have to keep making them shooters.

 

[Amir0x]

I'd be happy if Bioshock ended with Infinite. The first was awesome, the second was alright and the third isn't as good as people think it is, in fact it's quite a disappointment and no one has the balls to admit it. Please no more Bioshock, go make something original.

Not only does it have nothing to do with balls (I love the game; do you know me to lack balls when it comes to game criticism?), but it's also far more original than 90% of the games on the market. I'd say they did enough. it has plenty of problems, but please stop projecting. It's a really shitty way of arguing a point. If you think Infinite sucks, attack it on its merits, not some mystical fanbase you believe has no balls.

 

[conman]

Bioshock and Bioshock Infinite are focused on dominant American political ideologies. Socialism has never had much of a role in domestic American culture or politics.

Also, folks in this thread really need some history lessons. Lots of confusion between Socialism and Communism. And both are alive and well in the world. Strange to see people saying that they are "failed" or "dying" ideologies. Further signs that education is in the dumps.

They're both flavors of capitalism, but neoliberalism is more tied to imperialism while objectivism would probably be more tied to isolationism. Objectivism is a totally wacky philosophical concept that lends itself to anarcho-capitalist fever dreams, neoliberalism heavily relies on the existence of the state to protect the "free market" as it rapes and pillages across the world.

Even if Objectivism is "wacky," it's been on a major upswing amidst the rise of the Tea Party and modern Libertarianism.

As for Neoliberalism, it's so pervasive that pretty much all games engage with it in some way, from military shooters (CoD-style imperialism) to simulation games (SimCity-style infrastructure) to iOS games (upgrades, microtransactions, and the laissez faire App Store). IMO we already have one of the best critiques of Neoliberalism in gaming: Little Inferno.

 

[badgenome]

I think it's a case of beggars can't be choosers. Bioshock tries to be about something other than just shooting people.

Possibly. But the games seem to be less about the particular ideologies than they are about the fanatical certainty of the antagonists. Levine himself has said as much, so I'm not even sure if it's his intent to offer criticism. And although no other ideology would have justified the establishment of Rapture quite as well as Objectivism did, you could plug in basically any other one and it would still work.

I definitely think they've done an impressive job of using ideology to flavor their games, but it's quite something to see people laud them for offering a substantive rebuttal to Rand or whomever.

 

[RustyNails]

I think many people confuse state capitalism aka authoritarian communism with socialism. Until the OP explains what he means by "socialism" I see no point replying to his suggestion.

I'm talking about a Lenin-inspired revolution to establish a socialist state. I'm not talking about universal healthcare. Some of you are awfully pedantic.

 

[Imbarkus]

Bioshock Infinite was - when it dealt with anything political, which was not a lot of the time - kinda-sorta-almost about religion, and old-timey classism and racism. But it sort of fell apart too, because you really got the sense that nobody at Irrational could really wrap their heads around how someone could be that religious, that racist, or that classist. Instead of having characters that felt like actual people, holding actual racist or classist beliefs, you basically had the language of the modern-day used to describe those things, only delivered with a sneer and followed with a guffaw (Fink was especially bad for this). It all kind of felt like a cardboard cutout of cartoon characters who believed what the writers thought those people must have believed. You could never really confuse any of those characters for actual people who you know, so it just didn't feel genuine or real when it dealt with those issues.

I did not relate to the decisions of Andrew Ryan, and believe they were mostly there to bring about a certain impact on the player character. Similarly all the crazy sub-bosses (the Doctor-guy, the Theatre-guy?) in Bioshock, and Atlas himself. The success of the first Bioshock in spit-roasting Objectivism has nothing to do with the story. It has to do with the world Rapture becoming the logical outcome of that mode of thought taken to its Nth degree. Rapture is the character who matters.

After all, the philosophical "debate" about Objectivism had kind of been resolved by the time you arrived.

This is why Bioshock 2 is a thematic failure, as the main character, the setting, has nothing to do with Collectivist propoganda spouted by Lamb. The use of the plasmid powers and distribution of them is in fact inherently at odds with the nature of her dogma. I felt this throughout the whole narrative. Thank God for Minerva's Den. It was like a spring of Ginger after a sour Sushi roll.

And this is also why Bioshock Infinite fares better IMHO. Columbia, as a main character, is the ultimate expression of Manifest Destiny, i.e. American Exceptionalism. Independent, moralistic, racially-pure. Floating above the world and meting out justice even to China, and then flying away, consequence-free.

That this political allegory doesn't command center stage, I think, is a result of Infinite being better than the previous two at making a compelling character. Elizabeth was such a vibrant, vital character that her arc demanded that the personal story and emotional resolution take center stage.

However, like in Rapture, the seeds of destruction for that ultimate expression of an idea were already built-in to its conception. In this case the racism and superiority which enables paternalistic smugness, as well as the inequality Columbia depends upon. Certainly not the same flaws highlighted in Rapture, where every citizen's access to essentially unlimited empowerment simply led to unlimited corruption. It was distinct to itself, and Fink's area really revealed the cracks in the foundation of the ideal presented: it can't exist without an angry subjugated sub-class of people.

I will give you that the message that the resultant rebellion in Columbia being just as brutal and heartless is probably the biggest let-down in the examination. But it is accurate, if you look at history's examples like the French Revolution or the Bolshevik Revolution. I accepted that this was a good point for the personal story in Infinite to take over, once the situation became "well now this situation is all fucked and now let's just get her the hell out of here."

tl;dr I remember Fink's name. Don't remember the name of any of the sub-bosses in Bio1. Both games use their city setting as the main "character" to express inherent flaws in a socio-political ideal. I don't see the distinction you do.

 

[Vamphuntr]

Would never happen. Ken Levine can't write a villain if there's a chance his target audience might not agree with his(Ken's) views. Old timey racists, tea party nationalists and Ayn Rand are easy targets because they're basically strawmen in real life. Just look at how he pussyfoots around the Vox, effectively creating a moral equivalency between revolutionaries and their racist oppressors because they dared to take up arms against Sky Hitler.

Dude should probably stop pretending at the political commentary and just write old timey gangsters/Victorians going mmyeah shee/my word and shooting at each other like he wants to.

Yeah, I got that feeling as well when playing the game. They ended up painting the Vox Populi in a way as awful as Comstock and co after you jump in the dimension where the revolution is taking place.

I guess they needed to make a "every ideology is kind of awful in the wrong hands" scenario to not anger players or something.

 

[ChoklitReign]

Just look at how he pussyfoots around the Vox, effectively creating a moral equivalency between revolutionaries and their racist oppressors because they dared to take up arms against Sky Hitler..

Spoiler

The Vox murdered children and scalped their victims. Is that supposed to be better than being a racist?

 

[RedSwirl]

Think about it. First one was about libertarianism gone awry, with massive references to Randian thought and morals. Next one was about political history mixing with religious fervor in an explosive manner, with Industrialism and anti-union undertones. The next one could very well focus on 'the collective', about how a society is a single organism. We can have a Socialist leader like Lenin, broadcasting socialist ideals and forming a revolution.

 

[rosaceadude2112]

Spoiler

The Vox murdered children and scalped their victims. Is that supposed to be better than being a racist?

The first thing never actually happened as I recall and yes, I believe that second thing is a lot more justifiable than creating an oppressive regime.

 

[Purkake4]

There's no way in hell they'll make another Bioshock, so naturally Ken Levine's next game will be a new IP and a retread of SS2's plot again!

Yup, I wouldn't be surprised in the least.

 

[Slime]

Spoiler

The Vox murdered children and scalped their victims. Is that supposed to be better than being a racist?

My issue with the Vox was that they just seemed to become evil bogeymen out of nowhere. You see the plight of the lower class, you see that someone is speaking out about it, you feel sympathy for their leader...then you get a bit of flavor text and dialogue about how they're "just as bad" as Comstock without seeing why anyone would think that...and then all of a sudden they're

Spoiler

almost killing children and smearing blood on their faces.

It just felt like we missed a huge chunk of something, almost like a chapter from the game was chopped out, or they forgot to add a few Voxophones. Just felt incomplete.

 

[Apophenia Overload]

Fresh, hot leaked concepts from Ken Levine's next games

 

[Scrabble]

The first thing never actually happened as I recall and yes, I believe that second thing is a lot more justifiable than creating an oppressive regime.

fitzroy tried to kill fink's kid, it's not unheard of to suspect children were killed. Also I can't believe someone would believe racism is worse than murder, seriously?

 

[Flatline]

I'm talking about a Lenin-inspired revolution to establish a socialist state. I'm not talking about universal healthcare. Some of you are awfully pedantic.

So you're talking about state capitalism, not socialism. Your definition of socialism and thus your thread title is wrong.

 

[Sneds]

Yeah, I got that feeling as well when playing the game. They ended up painting the Vox Populi in a way as awful as Comstock and co after you jump in the dimension where the revolution is taking place.

I guess they needed to make a "every ideology is kind of awful in the wrong hands" scenario to not anger players or something.

Yeah. Booker says something like "they're all the same" when comparing Comstock to the Vox even before the revolution really gets going.

Possibly. But the games seem to be less about the particular ideologies than they are about the fanatical certainty of the antagonists. Levine himself has said as much, so I'm not even sure if it's his intent to offer criticism. And although no other ideology would have justified the establishment of Rapture quite as well as Objectivism did, you could plug in basically any other one and it would still work.

I definitely think they've done an impressive job of using ideology to flavor their games, but it's quite something to see people laud them for offering a substantive rebuttal to Rand or whomever.

Sure. I agree with that. But when you have a game that even mentions a political ideology, it seems like a breath of fresh air.

 

[Velvet Cyberpunk]

Actually, BioShock 2 dealt with communism, and yes there is a difference between communism and socialism.

 

[rosaceadude2112]

fitzroy tried to kill fink's kid, it's not unheard of to suspect children were killed. Also I can't believe someone would believe racism is worse than murder, seriously?

The villains were exaggerated to such a cartoonish degree while the oppressed minorities were just that. Oppressed minorities. To suggest that rebelling against their own systematic exploitation is somehow wrong is like saying Luke Skywalker shouldn't have fought against the Empire in Star Wars.

 

[Apophenia Overload]

• BioShock – A city under the ocean (not Atlantis) is populated by murderous psychopaths. Everyone here also has superpowers. A little girl and her dozen twin sisters wander around needing to be rescued. Andrew Ryan talks to you about why his city is so great. After you kill everyone in the city the moral of the story is that killing children is bad. (Chance to prove that videogames can have moral messages just like movies?) I think this game could give people a lot to think about, like how it’s dangerous to give everyone in a city inherently destructive superpowers.
  
• BioShock Infinite—A city in the sky is populated by an evil Tea Party analog (to prevent moral ambiguity make sure their eyes burn and they roar like monsters so there’s no confusion over who the bad guys are). Everyone still has superpowers like in the last game and they use them primarily to destroy things. This is our chance to finally prove that videogames are art and can be as deep as political cartoons. (Possible moral: next time you build a city 10,000 feet up in the sky make sure it has a big fence because otherwise immigrants will just hop over.)
  
• BioShock Beyond—A steam powered city on a hill (a steam powered hill?) is run by a guy named Edward Jonathan. The city is divided into two factions: Jonathan’s religious cult and a rebellion of evil witch scientists. Everyone is still a murderous psychopath and they all still have superpowers. After you exterminate the evil witches you learn that they were actually not evil and that Jonathan is the real bad guy so then you get to kill all of his people too. The moral of the story is that evolution is real and that through the power of science we can give ourselves totally sweet superpowers. I like this part because I get to make up my own science and you get to listen to a dozen audio logs explaining it.
  
• Super BioShock—A city in Earth’s orbit (note to self—research if steam power works in space) has fallen into chaos because everyone got superpowers and turned into murderous psychopaths. An oil tycoon named Benjamin Peters is destroying all of the city’s surrounding wildlife in order to drill for more oil… except that it’s not really oil. It’s the very substance that gives people superpowers and makes them crazy! You must stop him at all costs, even if it means killing every last human being in the city (fortunately it does!) You’ll be given choices throughout the game to use steam or gas powered machines. If you use gas then at the end of the game it turns out you’ve released so much carbon into space that Neptune melted and flooded Earth.
  
• BioShock Unleashed—A city was built in the lowest circle of Hell by a guy named G. R. Inch who is determined to destroy Christmas. This actually isn’t hard though because everyone in his city has superpowers and is mentally unstable. It’s your job to find the little girls wandering around and give them dolls (or other female-appropriate toys). If you give them male-oriented toys then you get the bad ending where independent women overthrow the patriarchy. (This is bad because if little girls aren’t characterized as weak and passive then we won’t have anyone for you to rescue.) But either way the game ends when you realize that Mr. Inch was right all along and Christmas is just an opportunity for the bourgeoisie to exploit the working class and that you have been a drone of commercialism all along. Hopefully we can slate this game for a holiday release.
  
• BioShock—Whenever the next generation of consoles come along I figure we might as well just reboot the franchise. There are a few ideas I have that I think could improve it too, like maybe a villain named Robert E. Bart.

 

[xam3l]

It's time for Bioshock: Space Nazis.
With all those crazy Nazi experiments, but in space!!!
(Something like Return to castle Wolfenstein but... you know... in space)

 

[Anticitizen One]

Bioshock 2 already did this

 

[Scrabble]

The villains were exaggerated to such a cartoonish degree while the oppressed minorities were just that. Oppressed minorities. To suggest that rebelling against their own systematic exploitation is somehow wrong is like saying Luke Skywalker shouldn't have fought against the Empire in Star Wars.

Except for the parts where they kill children and anyone else who doesn't join their cause in terrorizing and destroying the city.

 

[tauroxd]

I really don't get why people are talking about a Bioshock 2... I don't get it at all. There are only two Bioshocks: Bioshock and Bioshock Infinte. Go ask Levin in how many Bioshock has he worked on and he'll tell you that.

Spoiler

Yep, bad joke.

 

[A Human Becoming]

Bioshock 2 dealt with socialism, although not especially good.

But does it allude to Obama?

 

[RustyNails]

So you're talking about state capitalism, not socialism. Your definition of socialism and thus your thread title is wrong.

Whatever makes you sleep better. Thank you for your contribution.

 

[Velvet Cyberpunk]

fitzroy tried to kill fink's kid, it's not unheard of to suspect children were killed. Also I can't believe someone would believe racism is worse than murder, seriously?

You realize that racism breeds murder, right? They go hand in hand.

 

[TheRedSnifit]

Haven't you played the second one?

 

[Purkake4]

Perfect.

Spoiler

I do really like how the Many is just doing its thing and getting more desperate to survive towards the end instead of wanting to destroy the world etc.

Fresh, hot leaked concepts from Ken Levine's next games

Seems about right.

 

[Scrabble]

You realize that racism breeds murder, right? They go hand in hand.

Obviously, doesn't make racism in its self worse than murder though.

 

[Apophenia Overload]

Except for the parts where they kill children and anyone else who doesn't join their cause in terrorizing and destroying the city.

Every revolution has terrible things happen on both sides, plus the only child murdering we see is done by Daisy. Also, given this is a fictional revolution it's fair game to critique the people who created it for making it a cop-out by have it be really heavy-handed and demonizing the Vox Populi who did have legitimate grievances.

 

[rosaceadude2112]

Except for the parts where they kill children and anyone else who doesn't join their cause in terrorizing and destroying the city.

This was a very sudden shift that doesn't really jibe with what they had shown before the revolution started.

Obviously, doesn't make racism in its self worse than murder though.

The citizens of Columbia weren't just racist though like they'd cross the street if they saw a black man coming down the sidewalk. Their entire society was built on their forced labor and they'd haul them out into public to kill them for entertainment.

 

[spekkeh]

If they keep making Bioshock games centered around political themes, they have to do better than just cycling around between ideologies just because they 'haven't gotten to them yet', or because they're the opposite of what they used in the last game, or whatever.


Bioshock 1's critique of Objectivism/Libertarianism/etc was effective and meaningful mostly because it's a viewpoint that actual people, today, right now, actually believe in and will evangelize. You can look into the game, and you can see Irrational's take on what the end point of those policies would be, and how a society built around those principles would function (and then not-function).

Bioshock 2 was ostensibly about 'Collectivism', but it didn't really have fuck all to do with that political philosophy, and there wasn't really anything interesting about the villain's plot, because it relied on basically magic psychic brainwashing and obviously has no grounding in any actual, real-world political belief.

Bioshock Infinite was - when it dealt with anything political, which was not a lot of the time - kinda-sorta-almost about religion, and old-timey classism and racism. But it sort of fell apart too, because you really got the sense that nobody at Irrational could really wrap their heads around how someone could be that religious, that racist, or that classist. Instead of having characters that felt like actual people, holding actual racist or classist beliefs, you basically had the language of the modern-day used to describe those things, only delivered with a sneer and followed with a guffaw (Fink was especially bad for this). It all kind of felt like a cardboard cutout of cartoon characters who believed what the writers thought those people must have believed. You could never really confuse any of those characters for actual people who you know, so it just didn't feel genuine or real when it dealt with those issues.



I think, for that reason, neoliberalism probably actually is one of the only political belief structures that could be effective in a Bioshock game - it's the beliefs that the entire western world revolves on, both for "left" and "right" wing politics.
However, it would also be incredibly, incredibly difficult to encapsulate and portray inside of a video game, both because of how all-encompassing it is, and because it would be really hard to do it in such a way that players would actually understand what the critique is.


To be honest though, I think they'd be better off just dropping the political angle altogether. There are plenty of ideas that don't have a whole lot to do with politics, but could be explored through Irrational's style of writing and design.

As always cock-swayin has the best post.

 

[Vulcano's assistant]

Next logical step:

 

[Angry Fork]

Spoilers ahoy below

Well the Vox was basically an armed Occupy Wall Street with a central leadership. The Vox railed against the Prophet and the elites who amassed wealth at the top, while the folks in Shanty Town were living in dirt. You see that after Vox takes over Columbia, the rich people are strung up and their wealth looted. The voxophones of Daisy Fitzgerald talk about rich hoarding away too.

This is really annoying/disappointing if true. I haven't played the game yet but was excited to hear of an anarchist/socialist group in it.

I was really hoping he wouldn't go all "if Occupy had their way, they would be just as bad if not worse than the current people!". Is that how it ends up?

 

[Grisby]

I'll echo some others in this thread and say play Bioshock 2 OP.

 

[pants]

I'd be happy to see the back of Bioshock after this gen.