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Nintendo hasn't played nice with third parties since SNES
- Thread starter Fantasmo
- Start date
Theognosis
Member
The only good 3rd party games on consoles are sports games and even so the next gen games are nothing but visual upgrades--they're the same fucking banana. Thank goodness the very best western devs have focused their attention to smartphones. I'll take iOS/Android games over walking games (a.k.a. action adventure TPS games with tons of movies that add nothing to gameplay) any time of the day.
Theognosis
Member
VR will make all current gen consoles obsolete--and that includes the PS4 and XB1. Using the PS4 as VR machine is similiar to what 3D games were like in the original Playstation.
Another reason I believe Nintendo doesn't get the support they want is the fact that third parties kind of expect platformers holders to get into bidding wars to gain exclusive DLC, extra content or other megadeals; Nintendo would rather pick up games like Lego City Undercover, Bayo 2, Hyrule Warriors and others stuff. The Nintendo versions of multiplatform games they did receive (the majority) didn't have the same perks as the PS/Xbone versions and don't get as much media attention. In the end they end up selling badly and the cycle continues...
LegendofLex
Member
It's not like Nintendo can force third parties to get on board for a market they don't want to sell to in the first place.
Natureboy99
Banned
Some first generation 3D games, like Gran Turismo and Metal Gear, were considered fantastic by many. Even if you have a fair analogy (which I don't think it is), the first VR gen on consoles could come up with some great stuff. The PC experience is superior, but it will cost more and be less uniform, just like early 3D.
What do you think would have happened to Nintendo if the N64 was only capable of playing 2D games?
Schnozberry
Member
Do you go around polling people about their thoughts on PS4 exclusives outside of gaming forums?
Killzone
Infamous and Last Light
Knack
Resogun
Driveclub
That's pretty much it for major PS4 exclusives until 2015.
Natureboy99
Banned
You forgot LBP3, and a bunch of smaller games.
Northeastmonk
Gold Member
I don't think that's a big deal IMO. I'm fully aware of that, but I've also owned a PS since PS1. The whole fanboy thing is quite frustrating. I think people use that as a way to own a console, but I've seen it before and it's nothing new. I'm happy with what the console has until 2015 and beyond. I think the person who may of started gaming in the last 10 years might have to look at that. I think that also goes for people who own a Wii U too. It's still a brand. I'll get it because I enjoy what the brand normally gives to their fans. Single console hatred is stupid.
theprodigy
Member
How is what he said "anything but the games" when he explicitly mentioned sports and shooters as the system sellers for the PS4?
Best part is that Knack and Resogun are the best games on that list haha.
Nintendo's taking their future hardware cues from Apple rather than Sony it seems. Can't really blame them, 10 million in 8 months versus 10 million in one weekend.
For 3rd party on console I see them trying to leverage Japanese publishers from their handheld side (via unified architecture/OS) and continue the work with western indies they're already doing console side. Not really a horrible approach although it's also probably a gen later than it should've been. The large western publishers will come if the platform sells, and if it doesn't they won't.
Good thing it has 3rd party support then.
Wii U, on the other hand, has neither 3rd party support nor must have exclusive games.
in your opinion, of course
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
posted in a topic inspired by butthurt about bayonetta 2
Yet it continues to kill the wii u in sales.
Schnozberry
Member
Well, whether games are must have is subjective, but comparing the Wii U exclusive list to the PS4, I would lay down cash for a Wii U.
There is no question the PS4 has superior 3rd party support.
LegendofLex
Member
LBP3 is not a PS4 exclusive.
Phones and tablets are what most people game on. Nothing wrong with aiming high.
JordanN
Banned
Nintendo owners also own Playstation/Xbox/PC. So it's not like they'll disappear.
If Nintendo releases Mario on another platform, they can just migrate there.
WrenchNinja
Member
The Wii U would be selling well if it had either of those, so I'm not sure ìt's just an opinion.
LegendofLex
Member
Yeah, that 80m bump in console purchases last gen totally came from people who are "Nintendo owners who also own PlayStation/Xbox/PC."
Schnozberry
Member
Right. First impressions are everything. Nintendo did a poor job getting the Wii U out the door. The development kit was a disaster. The launch games were mediocre at best. The name of the console was and still is stupid.
Then, Microsoft completely borks the Xbox One reveal with their initial anti-consumer policies, and then prices it way too high for the market. All Sony had to do was get the price right and not come off as blatantly anti-consumer, and they were backing up the money truck. The momentum has only gotten stronger from there. It's not like the PS4 is some revolutionary piece of tech. It's middle of the road PC equipment in terms of performance, and the OS is even sorely lacking. On top of that, the games haven't really been there yet.
Sony did everything right in terms of marketing the PS4, and it has paid off in spades.
synchronicity
Member
Nintendo is who they are. I don't see them doing things differently. If they did, they wouldn't be Nintendo. I love Nintendo and always have, but you really have to accept the good (the amazing first party software) with the bad (they're always going to dance to the beat of their own drum, even if it kills them- which could be viewed as a positive and part of what makes them great) with them.
JordanN
Banned
Are you talking about the Wii? Because I don't think casuals were buying Metroid in huge numbers (relative to install base).
If anything, there are Nintendo games that could actually do better if they were also made availiable on Playstation/Xbox/PC.
Nintendo won't dump their own dedicated box just to work on someone else's dedicated box that raises their costs and lowers their margins.
If they killed their console business they'd simply double down on handheld. If they killed their hardware business entirely you'll probably see them follow the mainstream to Apple and Google, not PlayStation and Xbox. A 3rd party Nintendo would probably look a lot different than what GAF fantasizes about.
one and done.
ShinMaruku
Member
And wrong. 3rd parties had more choices in the 1980s than they do today.
Maintenance
Member
Yep. Nintendo isn't perfect: their account system is shit, there is no cross buy, but I still can't relate this to Bayonetta 2. If you want the game, buy the console. I'm not going to cry in PS threads that Bloodborne is coming to the PS4 and I don't have enough money to buy one and they should port it to the PC and X1, I'll work somehow and get money to buy one. If I just moan that I wanted it but couldn't get it, then I didn't want it enough to go the extra mile.
EDIT: And we're already at Nintendo going third party? Seriously?
there is no guarantee that would happen. that's why I'm saying it would be a bigger risk to go 3rd party than to continue making hardware. they're giving up money by going 3rd party so they'd have to be 100% sure they'd make it back with software sales, and that's not likely to be honest.
o·pin·ion
/əˈpinyən/
noun
a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.
JordanN
Banned
Guarantee as in "it's not 100% fact"? Sure.
But historically, there's always been fanbases making migration and Publishers seeing more success for it. Final Fantasy, Resident Evil, DMC, a ton of PC games, etc.
And to be honest, I think the risks are less than making a console. MS or Sony would kill to gain some kind of exclusive deal with Nintendo.
MS payed more than $2 billion just for Minecraft. Imagine how much money Zelda alone could be used to offset any costs for going 3rd party.
If Nintendo makes a console, they're looking to sink $800 million in R&D and hope for another Wii miracle (which only happened once with no competitors like Apple around).
WrenchNinja
Member
re·al·i·ty
rēˈalədē/
noun
1.
the world or the state of things as they actually exist, as opposed to an idealistic or notional idea of them.
here I'll break it down
"Wii U, on the other hand, has neither 3rd party support nor must have exclusive games."
the 3rd party remark is false. the Wii U has 3rd party support, just not the 3rd party support that most want. the must-have exclusive games bit is an opinion. because it's an opinion.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
If you go with Sales = Quality, then Taylor Swift is one of the greatest musicians in the world alive today.
LegendofLex
Member
Of course they weren't. But Metroid is supposed to be (read: was originally) the game for expert players, so I don't see why you would have expected them to. And Super Mario Galaxy only sold 1m or so more than Mario 64. But you also had this thing called "New Super Mario Bros." that drew over 25m players.
The size of the Wii install base reflected the lineup: you had games for N64/GameCube players (which sold in N64/GameCube quantities), games for lapsed NES/SNES players (which sold in NES/SNES quantities), and games for brand new players (which sold in Wii quantities).
Nintendo's success was 100% owed to the fact that they were able to target players that they couldn't have otherwise. That would not be possible on PlayStation/Xbox, where they'll only be able to capture the audience that buys both their games and PlayStation/Xbox games (due to having no control over the user experience).
Yeah, 3rd party devs got tired of having to cut off fingers to save face when their games failed to meet Nintendo QA standards.
Manmademan
Member
sörine;132604157 said:
Not since Nintendo launched the NES they didn't. Since we're talking about NINTENDO'S third party practices what Atari did with the 2600 or Mattel did with the intellivision is irrelevant.
Nintendo had a virtual monopoly in the NES era backed by extremely anticompetitive practices on the retail end designed to keep it that way. This is what got them sued to oblivion in the EU and nearly dragged in front of the US supreme court.
The genesis succeeding where the master system was a miserable failure in comparison was not just a happy accident on SEGAS part. The barriers to competition had come down by then.
Shmuely Bully
Member
It's the opinion of just about everybody or it wouldn't be so closely matching the Dreamcast's sales trajectory.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
Sega and Microsoft were also part of that self-same price fixing investigation, and it was nothing to do with how they handled third party publishers.
LegendofLex
Member
When you're talking about a product, the only opinions that matter are the ones that influence your behavior. (You can say lots of things on message boards, but they don't necessarily reflect your or others' behavior.) That being the case, the large number of people not buying Wii U is a pretty good indicator of the general opinion of Wii U. (After all, the ultimate question of "will you buy this?" depends on people's opinions.)
Shmuely Bully
Member
Sure, in the same way that the Ngage had third-party support. It's possible for something to be technically correct while still being entirely misleading and disregarding the point that someone was trying to make.
Isn't context wonderful?
It's an opinion shared among consumers. The vast majority of consumers decided that Wii U has no must have exclusive games.
It happens to be my opinion as well, but that's irrelevant.
WrenchNinja
Member
You clearly understand why people say it has no 3rd party support and what people mean by that statement. But since you want to be literal, you should understand that if the Wii U had "must have" exclusives, then the Wii U and its titles would be selling well, as the games are "must have". But that isn't what is actually happening. That's not opinion.
Sales aren't the be all measurement of quality but they are a measurement.
yeah this whole line of dialogue started because I called something someone said an opinion and some posters refuted that. I wasn't really arguing anything other than what the poster said about "must have exclusive games" was an opinion.
I'm not really sure why so many felt that was incorrect.
sure it is.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
The multiple of opinion is "perceived fact"
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
So very well done for it's time and extremely popular. Good to hear!