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Nintendo takes aim at Apple as "enemy of the future"
- Thread starter badcrumble
- Start date
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
A LOT has changed since 2004. The iPhone and Facebook are quickly becoming the top "platforms" for casual gaming. Given that reality, I'm frightened as fuck at the thought of Nintendo trying to compete with Apple's variety of casual gaming. FUCK THAT.jakonovski said:
Expand DSi Ware, put some serious energy into casual-friendly IPs (Pokemon, Nintendogs, Mario all fit this category well enough), and perhaps even find ways to link to social network sites... That's good enough to compete, and wouldn't sacrifice Nintendo's core identity as a gaming company.
ICallItFutile said:
Its dangerous territory for Nintendo.
They've always done one thing only and one thing really well.. make it all about games and gaming.
They let Sony and Microsoft beat the hell out of each other in the all-in-one set top box race for the living room, while they stuck to pure gaming and rode it all the way to victory this generation.
Now they're going to try and take on the iPhone, which is a different beast altogether. Is Nintendo prepared to try and make an all-in-one handheld? Their company culture says NO. They've been very resistant to doing things like this is the past. They came to the online race kicking and screaming, and their online setup is still pretty poor compared to their competition. They've resisted against doing things like including a simple DVD player in their home console. Hell, they never even bothered updating the original DS Lite so that it would accept WPA security encryption over wi-fi, which has been the standard for quite some time.
Nintendo as a company really only wants to do one thing - sell you a piece of hardware to play Mario, Zelda, Pokemon, and Metroid along with their various spin-off games of these franchises.
They will need a completely new line of thinking from the top down within the company. They will have to reach out to third parties and build a development community to make apps for their system - Nintendo in and of itself is far too slow in software development to make a halfway decent app store that compares to Apple. Apple has legions of people who can write software, get it on the app store, and sell it to you quickly. How will Nintendo compete with iTunes? Its almost laughable to think that anyone could put up a serious challenge to iTunes. It would take Nintendo years to develop relationships with the movie and music industry so that the big N could sell these things in their own store.
In my mind, Nintendo would have to do a few things (just off the top of my head):
1. Move faster as a company in terms of software development and third party relations
2. Not be so much of a closed company when it comes to helping their partners
3. Get ready to spend a lot of that profit they've made over the last few years.
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Isn't farmville flash based?Ninja Scooter said:
I know there is an iphone app coming, but farmville is available on any platform that meets the browser requirements, being platform agnostic is what makes it so popular in the first place. And thats forgetting that Zynga's entire revenue was ~$100 - $500 million with absolutely no mention of profit, Nintendo slumped to $1600 million in profit.
Ninja Scooter
Member
poppabk said:
my only point was that games like that are becoming increasingly more and more popular, and it won't neccesarily take Apple getting a "Mario killer" or a "Pokemon killer" in the traditional sense in order to get a piece of the handheld gaming market.
Nintendo consistently innovates the gaming market both hardware wise (d-pad, analog stick, rumble, IR pointer, motion control) and software wise (tons of examples here, Mario Galaxy being the most prominent in recent years).Rabbitwork said:
Apple led some pretty significant innovations of the computer OS and portable music player markets.
Completely subjective. As far as I'm concerned no one makes better games than Nintendo and no one makes better operating systems than Apple.Rabbitwork said:
Hari Seldon said:
Fanboy delusions. :loleggandI said:
Nintendo sell more handheld games than Apple, too.Green Biker Dude said:
ShockingAlberto
Member
I don't think this is Nintendo necessarily trying to get a piece of Apple's pie and more Nintendo trying to keep Apple from taking some (more?) of theirs.
Not really, just imagine the 'power' of a company like Nintendo - Disney - Apple holdings. Release amazing movies based on popular Nintendo properties, even better games based on Disney properties and Nintendo/Disney games/apps on Apple devices. The money train would never stop running ever.DeBurgo said:
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Jokeropia said:
That's pretty disputable.
Nintendo sold about 200 million software units in the last year (actually 151 million according to their release, but 170 million before that and I'll round up to prove a point).
The App Store sold/gave away 3 billion apps in that exact same time frame. You're saying that less than 6% of app downloads were game purchases?
There are all sorts of ways you can quantify it (Apple's games are mainly cheap and none are as expensive as even the cheapest DS games, Apple has no real first party software, tons of App store games suck), but I just don't think your statement as said is true.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Chorazin said:
Exactly.
The app store devices have about a 40 attach rate right now (~100 million devices, ~4 billion apps downloaded). Yes, it's on 99 cent and 1.99 and free stuff. Yes, not all of it is games. Yes, many of the games suck. Yes, it has no d-pad. Yes, Nintendo is doing amazing.
But everyone out there buying an app store device is using the app store, and no matter what percentage of that you think is game revenues, clearly people are aware that you can play on them. I think the argument that the app store device install base isn't checking out games is probably pretty silly at this point.
KingJ2002
Member
Stumpokapow said:
how is it silly? apps are driving the iPhone platform... not gaming itself and it's developers around the world giving apple the revenue as well as the clout to tout thousands of apps. Nintendo is a gaming company and apple's gaming experience isn't that fun and is more of a bulletpoint on the iPhone rather than the main event... when we see 39.99 - 49.99 full gaming experiences that rival the DS then yes... be concerned nintendo... but so far there best gaming experiences are DS / PSP hand-me-downs and "lite" versions.
Stumpokapow said:
create an advertising model for the store so your title get's more publicity... by purchase history allow gamers to see other games that they might like which would include games usually buried... there's many ways to remedy that issue.
Stumpokapow said:
hmm... maybe i should rephrase it so you can see what i mean
1. offer over-the-air game purchases for instant and more impulsive purchases with also cuts out the middle man (retailers).
2. creating a open developer community for smaller titles that can be sold at 1 or more... giving nintendo a way for smaller developers to create on their platform and create different experiences
3. creating a better online experience for the games... this is self explanatory... it only helps replay value
4. adding media and social networking to their devices (facebook, last.fm, pandora, etc, etc)... allow people to talk about the games they're playing on the networks they spend their entire day on
there is nothing wrong with creating a product based on a successful formula... this is the reason why Nintendo sees apple as a threat to their market share in the first place.
I know DS obliterated iPhone OS in terms of game revenue last year, but if you have any numbers for amount of paid game downloads on iPhone OS I would be interested.Stumpokapow said:
My point is that Nintendo is the biggest player in the handheld games market just like they are in the console market.
badcrumble
Member
This is really about the 3DS more than it's about the DS. The advantage of the iPhone/iPod Touch/iPad platform is that it doesn't really rely on hardware generations; it's closer to the PC in that respect (albeit clearly a very different environment in just about every other way). When the 3DS comes out, Nintendo will be building up a new platform based on launch titles, marketing, and backwards compatibility. The iPhone doesn't rival the DS when it comes to gaming, but it'll also never have to deal with the somewhat more vulnerable moments of a product launch, and it'll be a while before the 3DS catches up with the entire iDevice marketshare, if ever. That said, it's a poor comparison to compare their marketshares directly because it's hardly one single 'market.'Jokeropia said:
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Farmville doesn't just happen though, you have to invest millions, probably 100's of millions to get that type of userbase, and that is for a free game. To persuade people to shell out $200 for a device before they can even try your social network game is gonna be very difficult, and apple have shown no real desire to invest 100's of millions in their own custom apps, preferring to own the marketplace instead. Because their is no exclusivity, the iphones won't have dedicated games - if a game ends up being successful it will be ported to every cell phone, web browser, computer, handheld that is capable of running it and selling it at a competitive price point. Apple can't compete on quality of software, but Nintendo can't compete on volume and price of software. The biggest threat to Nintendo is if the success of the iphone devalues the value of games in people's eyes, especially the 'casual' games that have been raking in the profit for them recently. Brain Training retailing at $1.99 is not gonna work for them.Ninja Scooter said:
http://www.petesouza.com/detail.html?gallery=The Road to Kabul&sortNumber=38&skipno=0&siteno=19
Nintendo = cat? Nevermind that the lion is blind.
And yes, I've been waiting for an excuse to post that picture. Site wouldn't let me hotlink it or copy it though.
Nintendo = cat? Nevermind that the lion is blind.
And yes, I've been waiting for an excuse to post that picture. Site wouldn't let me hotlink it or copy it though.
Black-Wind
Member
Zombie Lion?Chrono said:http://www.petesouza.com/detail.html?gallery=The Road to Kabul&sortNumber=38&skipno=0&siteno=19
Nintendo = cat? Nevermind that the lion is blind.
And yes, I've been waiting for an excuse to post that picture. Site wouldn't let me hotlink it or copy it though.
WTF is wrong with that Lion's eyes?
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Thanks for ruining my afternoon. What a depressing picture. Don't hit next picture by the way.Chrono said:http://www.petesouza.com/detail.html?gallery=The Road to Kabul&sortNumber=38&skipno=0&siteno=19
Nintendo = cat? Nevermind that the lion is blind.
And yes, I've been waiting for an excuse to post that picture. Site wouldn't let me hotlink it or copy it though.
What I've always found most interesting about this potential future battle is how both Nintendo and Apple are fighting for these new customers that they originally courted from almost exact opposite directions.
Apple made the iPhone/iPod open to developers and that made a general purpose device into one used extensively for gaming by the broader audience.
Nintendo made a dedicated gaming console (as always) but delivered software and an interface that appealed to a similar audience who had not previously spent much time gaming.
The two existing devices are pretty far apart in terms of their overall vision, but they both appeal to a large audience who hadn't necessarily done much gaming before.
Apple made the iPhone/iPod open to developers and that made a general purpose device into one used extensively for gaming by the broader audience.
Nintendo made a dedicated gaming console (as always) but delivered software and an interface that appealed to a similar audience who had not previously spent much time gaming.
The two existing devices are pretty far apart in terms of their overall vision, but they both appeal to a large audience who hadn't necessarily done much gaming before.
Trailblaster
Banned
Talamius said:
A Sony and Google partnership with Andriod apps on a PSP2 and/or PSphone is more likely to happen before you see a nintendo , Google team-up.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Black-Wind said:
Taliban's make him blind.
What a sad picture...
If this article is to be believed then it seems Nintendo is more worried that consumers won't be buying their portable hardware since they would prefer to carry around an iPhone/iPod Touch.
As far as portable video games are concerned, it's not even close. iPhone games for the most part are crappy flash like games that you can find a dime a dozen on the internet. There are very few games that can even begin to compete with ones developed for DS or PSP. Space Invaders Infinity Gene and geoDefense 1+2 are the only games I've felt were worth the actual purchase.
As far as portable video games are concerned, it's not even close. iPhone games for the most part are crappy flash like games that you can find a dime a dozen on the internet. There are very few games that can even begin to compete with ones developed for DS or PSP. Space Invaders Infinity Gene and geoDefense 1+2 are the only games I've felt were worth the actual purchase.
Bay Maximus
Banned
Awwwww, sniddely snaps!!
Now we just need some Iphone 3D goodness to fuel the flames of war.
Now we just need some Iphone 3D goodness to fuel the flames of war.
Honestly, it is kind of true. Sony is in a horrible position at the moment.
Their joint venture with Ericsson prohibits them from taking on the iPhone. Sony Ericsson is easily the most useless company in the world and is not capable of making a device that could challenge Apple.
Not to mention, Sony doesn't have an established software platform (operating system) for mobile devices, nor are they capable of creating one (as much as they would like to, but given their track record with software...they really should have bought Palm).
Sony is quickly going to become an also-ran in yet another market that they should have been able to be competitive in.
I'd love for them to prove me wrong though, I've always been a Sony fan, sadly it's just been painful to watch their constant blunders throughout the last decade.
Apple v. Nintendo? Gotta side with Apple. I don't see Nintendo coming anywhere close to creating a device as slick and as capable as the iPhone/Touch.
Their joint venture with Ericsson prohibits them from taking on the iPhone. Sony Ericsson is easily the most useless company in the world and is not capable of making a device that could challenge Apple.
Not to mention, Sony doesn't have an established software platform (operating system) for mobile devices, nor are they capable of creating one (as much as they would like to, but given their track record with software...they really should have bought Palm).
Sony is quickly going to become an also-ran in yet another market that they should have been able to be competitive in.
I'd love for them to prove me wrong though, I've always been a Sony fan, sadly it's just been painful to watch their constant blunders throughout the last decade.
Apple v. Nintendo? Gotta side with Apple. I don't see Nintendo coming anywhere close to creating a device as slick and as capable as the iPhone/Touch.
cooljeanius
Member
I like both of them though. Don't make me have to choose!
John Rabbit
Banned
none of the examples you listed are applicable any longer. just because a company has in the past been inventive with new technologies and hardware does not mean everything they do is actually progressive. nintendo has made it their SOP to make incremental improvements to an existing technology until the market reaches saturation or their hand is forced. super mario galaxy is a well-reviewed game, nothing more. it has not brought about a revolution in game design, nor has it changed the face of what the mass market buys. people already bought mario games en masse before galaxy and they'll continue to do so.Jokeropia said:
again, the history of a company does not grant it a free pass for innovation. apple has not produced a genuinely NEW piece of technology since the original iphone, and even then it had been rumored for at least a year prior that they were working on such a device. the public was already prepared for its arrival. it didn't surprise anyone (other than the cost).Jokeropia said:
also subjective. i find apple's approach to OS design utterly limiting. what is simple to fix or customize on windows or linux-based platforms takes user-created workarounds or simply isn't possible with apple operating systems. the average person doesn't care because they've been sold on the concept that owning a $3000 laptop made of parts that should be half that cost and encased in brushed aluminum is cool.Jokeropia said:
I'm going to take a guess here that you are not an Apple fan and have not been using their computers for a longer time. People I know are sold on the software that Apple produces and not the hardware, the latter is just icing on the cake.Rabbitwork said:
I'm also not sure what you mean by piece of technology. They have clearly been creating new tech constantly unless you mean introduce a whole new device.
Just to be sure, when Timesonline says this:
Can we assume Iwata actually said that? I'm always very wary when it comes to what Nintendo is said to have said/done and what they've actually said or done. The sources are often unreliable, and many wrong assumptions are often made.
Has anyone got a clue?
Can we assume Iwata actually said that? I'm always very wary when it comes to what Nintendo is said to have said/done and what they've actually said or done. The sources are often unreliable, and many wrong assumptions are often made.
Has anyone got a clue?
Starchasing
Member
Stumpokapow said:
What worries Nintendo the most is the TIME spent in other devices.
Something of an interesting thought I had here, if Apple and Nintendo do go rounds with one another, won't they risk creating a scenario where one could rise and the other fall badly? If this is an arms race to make sure that they stay out of each others pie, then they'll need to make sure that they have the "it" item, strategy, or marketing for whatever ideas they come up with next. It just seems like whoever runs out of -really- good ideas or get caught unprepared by one first will wind up being crippled.
I don't see it being Apple though since they have more in the bank and other revenue lobbies to ensure that things keep chugging along far into the future. Nintendo however has always been a small company that continues itself purely off the money they have stored up.
I don't see it being Apple though since they have more in the bank and other revenue lobbies to ensure that things keep chugging along far into the future. Nintendo however has always been a small company that continues itself purely off the money they have stored up.
(Also, please go easy on me, it's the first time that I've really gotten interested enough in a GAF thread like this to put out my two cents. 
)
)