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[hamchan]

They actually presented it to journalists for the most part, journalists who failed to show any kind of brain activity if questions like "is this an accessory or a new system" really were raised with the plain english of the presentation, the clarity of the video demonstrations, and the promise of a system unveil from a month (or however long) ago.

It's more than just journalists that watch e3 you know ><.

I also question the "clarity of the video demonstrations" part. Seriously, watch the Wii reveal trailer again. 3 minutes long and the most obvious moment it was a new console instead of a new controller was a bit near the end with the Zelda tech demo.

 

[Cromat]

It was a really vague presentation, without the traditional unveiling of the console box itself (remember Iwata waving the Revolution in 2005?). The name didn't make things better since it seems to be yet another Wii peripheral and not a brand new system.

For example:

http://www.france24.com/en/20110608-e3-nintendo-microsoft-ubisoft-xbox-wii-video-games

On Tuesday, Nintendo unveiled the Wii U, a portable game console with a high-resolution touch screen, that is something of a cross between an iPad, a Sony PlayStation Portable and Nintendo's existing DS hand-held game consoles.

A portable game console huh?

 

[Ushojax]

It's more than just journalists that watch e3 you know ><.

I also question the "clarity of the video demonstrations" part. Seriously, watch the Wii reveal trailer again. 3 minutes long and the most obvious moment it was a new console instead of a new controller was a bit near the end with the Zelda tech demo.

Did people just forget about that investor briefing memo that said 'THERE WILL BE A SUCCESSOR SYSTEM TO THE WII AT E3'? How the fuck could it have been a portable console when the fucking thing is displaying on a TV?

 

[Jocchan]

3 minutes long and the most obvious moment it was a new console instead of a new controller was a bit near the end with the Zelda tech demo.

And that was only clear to those enough in the know to understand the Wii can't push that level of visuals. Which sounds silly, but not everyone has a clear concept of a machine's limitations.

Did people just forget about that investor briefing memo that said 'THERE WILL BE A SUCCESSOR SYSTEM TO THE WII AT E3'? How the fuck could it have been a portable console when the fucking thing is displaying on a TV?

Short memory, not paying attention. Unfortunately this shit happens.
It's the whole reason why marketing needs to be as clear and comprehensive as possible, even just poor wording or a misplaced comma can disrupt the message entirely.

 

[Caramello]

Did we? 10 months before the release of the Wii was February 06. We had seen a teaser video for the controller, the outer casing of the console, some mutterings about a Metroid Prime 2 demo, some vague mention of the Virtual Console and Iwata pretending they were making a new Smash Bros. We had no idea what the launch titles were, we hadn't seen any of their franchise games, we had no idea how powerful it was or what the price was.

Honestly some people have terrible memories.

I wouldn't call the VC details that we knew "vague" but yeah I agree with you otherwise.. Besides, I strongly feel that the console won't come out until after E3 next year (probably only by a couple of weeks) so it only strengthens the point you raise.

As has been said already, this was a like a public showing of the TGS 2005 Wii Remote tech demo's. It was less than almost everybody was expecting though but in hindsight it shouldn't have been shocking.

 

[NinjaTehFish]

I dont get it.

"Our console is hi-def, it uses all modern graphic techniques and our online will be capable of matching the competitions online services and features....and heres our fuck crazy new idea for a controller."

That basically sums up what we got.

The only valid complaints relate to the games shown (or lack thereof) and the lack of info on the gritty technical details.

A year from release.

wth

 

[Alexios]

I also question the "clarity of the video demonstrations" part. Seriously, watch the Wii reveal trailer again. 3 minutes long and the most obvious moment it was a new console instead of a new controller was a bit near the end with the Zelda tech demo.

So Reggie saying "welcome to the world of Wii U. It's a system we will all enjoy together, but also one that's tailor made for you and bla bla bla bla bla" all that speech wasn't clear enough? What about when he said "this is the new controller FOR WII U" before playing the video that obviously demonstrates the controller just as he just said it would? What about when he told people this is an early example of what Wii U can do graphically (or however he worded it) before showing the demo with the bird?

I mean shit, again, it's not a commercial, it's mostly for the press, and yes, other people are there too but surely most of them are like us here on GAF, not random soccer mom who loved Wii Fit and decided to attend... Would she even be able to get in the presentation rooms if she did go?!

 

[Krev]

I think Nintendo's approach for this E3 was entirely wrong.

Wii U is very interesting, but Nintendo evidently botched the reveal significantly. Rather than showing off something they weren't ready to talk about, they should have delayed the Wii price drop to their press conference and focused on all the games they'll be bringing out this year. Rhythm Heaven, Mario Party 9, Fortune Street, Kirby, all should have had trailers...hell, so could Skyward Sword should have had one too. Then a Xenoblade and The Last Story announcement to silence the hardcore they supposedly want to court. After the Wii stuff and 3DS games (same 3DS stuff as at this conference), they could have then pulled out the Wii U console and teased a Spaceworld event later in the year where people would see games (read: Pikmin 3) playable on the console.
They actually wouldn't look too bad vs. the other conferences if they took this route. Solid, if unspectacular.

 

[hamchan]

So Reggie saying "welcome to the world of Wii U. It's a system we will all enjoy together, but also one that's tailor made for you and bla bla bla bla bla" all that speech wasn't clear enough? What about when he said "this is the new controller FOR WII U" before playing the video that obviously demonstrates the controller just as he just said it would? What about when he told people this is an early example of what Wii U can do graphically (or however he worded it) before showing the demo with the bird?

Yes, these first two are pretty unclear, even just typed up like that.

 

[Gravijah]

Bottom-left corner is my guess.
Seriously, they need a completely different branding for the games.

In all seriousness, putting it on the left side would work. And no white branding, they should use something that stands out like red.

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

Even as a fairly knowledgeable GAFer I still questioned exactly what it was for 75% of the conference.

It was the worst console reveal I've ever seen and it felt premature.

 

[Alexios]

Yes, these first two are pretty unclear, even just typed up like that.

Lol. I guess I should be happy with my IQ after all.

Anyway, now nobody here is confused any more we can discuss the important bits instead of soccer mom's confusion over a product she couldn't buy even if she loved it.

 

[Vyrance]

Yea I thought it was an accessory at first. You pretty much had to keep your eye out for the new console (looks close to a Wii anyway) to find it.

 

[Wolves Evolve]

People are still saying the conference was clear.

Iwata said himself today it wasn't.

Okay.

 

[hamchan]

It's funny because Nintendo actually had a freaking great reveal with the 3DS just a year ago!

Lol.

Yep, lol @ Nintendo for making such a bad presentation.

 

[Dynamite Shikoku]

It's funny that even after nintendo themselves admit that they didn't explain it properly, nintentards are still defending the conference.

 

[SolarPowered]

I was definitely confused at first until I saw the console sitting under the TV. It should have been obvious to anyone that it was a new console, but they did a horrible job of highlighting how it was an improvement which lead people to look at the controller as nothing more than an addition to the previous hardware.

Nintendo has become too obsessed with their controllers in my opinion...

The audience isn't the problem. The audience is never never never never the problem, ever. Ever. Nintendo are selling a product to an audience. If they can't communicate to the audience about the new product, it is by DEFINITION Nintendo's problem. An audience can't be dumb. Audiences can be assumed to be dumb by dumb companies. We have dumb media that makes people dumb, and lowest common denominators, and stupid people who are individuals.

There's no such thing as a dumb audience. Just bad presentations.

This

Nintendo really did a horrible job because of how rigid and unbending they can be. People wanted to see something truly revolutionary, but they just got a controller that could easily pass for another Wii accessory. They got a name that is way too connected to hardware that was not special at all(besides the controller and the glaring weakness of the hardware). We even had to settle for four or five clear shots of the console and a single video of the thing in someone's hand. We got no information on how they plan to improve on their network services which is by far the weakest of all their areas at the moment.

They did a great job of communicating the potential of the controller, but they did a horrible job of showing us how they improved the experience as a whole(or plan to improve on it) and they NEEDED to do this if they ever want a healthy online ecosystem that buys DLC and third party software at a steady pace...

Wii U was the worst console reveal that I can think of. Nintendo avoided showing the actual console, didn't mention tech specs, didn't show any games.

The reveal trailer definitely made it seem like just a new Wii controller/peripheral. Go back and watch it, all they mention over and over again was "New Controller" and they demoed it being used in Wii Sports, Wii Fit, with Wiimotes, with Miis, along with the same Wii logo, etc.

It is completely Nintendo's fault for sending mixed messages.

Yep, it seems like the console was an afterthought compared to the controller. One should never forget that different controllers can be used to play a game, but a console will always be the central component in the living room for anyone who works in this industry. The controller does not provide the visuals, the OS, or the network services and it will not run games for the foreseeable future.

 

[IrishNinja]

Actually, weren't his exact words that you'd hear about online 'by the end of the week'? Geoff assumed the roundtable, but I don't think Reggie explicitly stated that. There's still time!

heh...i think you're right, so uh, i guess we'll see!
although in reggie's mind, i bet ubi showing a competent online in ghost recon = BOX CHECKED
i also kinda felt bad for the ubi dudes; all the real questions logically got "that's not ours to say."

 

[Caramello]

I think Nintendo's approach for this E3 was entirely wrong.

Wii U is very interesting, but Nintendo evidently botched the reveal significantly. Rather than showing off something they weren't ready to talk about, they should have delayed the Wii price drop to their press conference and focused on all the games they'll be bringing out this year. Rhythm Heaven, Mario Party 9, Fortune Street, Kirby, all should have had trailers...hell, so could Skyward Sword. Then a Xenoblade and The Last Story announcement to silence the hardcore they supposedly want to court. After the Wii stuff and 3DS games (same 3DS stuff as at this conference), they could have then pulled out the Wii U console and teased a Spaceworld event later in the year where people would see games (read: Pikmin 3) playable on the console.
They actually wouldn't look too bad vs. the other conferences if they took this route. Solid, if unspectacular.

A global company doesn't lower prices on a whim and they certainly don't "delay" a price drop for a conference. There are many business departments, a lot of mathematical modelling and a lot of other things like strategy and outlook that go into a decision to lower the price of a system.

I think the focus was good, getting the idea of the controller into people's minds and showcasing their strong 3DS software but they failed in how they presented what they did.

 

[Nirolak]

Well considering just awhile back Nintendo talked about the fact they are going to be working with an outside source on the online and we are over a year away I doubt there is enough of an online system to talk about right now.

Wouldn't the publishers doing everything themselves be considered allowing outside sources to make their online network?

 

[Sadist]

Did we? 10 months before the release of the Wii was February 06. We had seen a teaser video for the controller, the outer casing of the console, some mutterings about a Metroid Prime 2 demo, some vague mention of the Virtual Console and Iwata pretending they were making a new Smash Bros. We had no idea what the launch titles were, we hadn't seen any of their franchise games, we had no idea how powerful it was or what the price was.

Honestly some people have terrible memories.

Exactly.

The first real details started around April '06 back in the Revolution days. Red Steel was the first title shown and untill E3 we didn't know jack. After the press conference we knew a lot more. The only difference with Wii back then and Wii U now is that we know the name, the controller, several third party titles and Sakurai is in the know this time about a new Smash Bros. (Hehe)

I'm not expecting any details btw for the Wii U this year. Maybe a blurb for a new third party announcement, nothing more. Guess we'll have to wait for the inevitable Nintendo World 2012 in Japan.

 

[Portugeezer]

Hey I'm looking for an IGN article which gives examples of how the Wii U could be used, I can't remember the name though but they go through core Nintendo franchises.

Any links pleasE?


Anyway, I agree, they could have done a better job explaining.

 

[Jocchan]

In all seriousness, putting it on the left side would work. And no white branding, they should use something that stands out like red.

Full white band on top, logo in the middle. And with some more focus on the U part, or whatever they put if they change it (they won't), instead of just putting it smaller in a corner of the logo, which leaves all the focus on Wii (wrong, wrong, wrong logo design).

It's funny that even after nintendo themselves admit that they didn't explain it properly, nintentards are still defending the conference.

Classy.

 

[JJConrad]

I wonder how much of this came from the power of suggestion. I had no problem understanding their message, but I also stopped dividing my attention with neogaf after the Zelda segment. Who went into the conference expecting a new console and legitimately thought it was just a new controller without first reading that suggestion on the internet?

 

[gerg]

People are still saying the conference was clear.

Iwata said himself today it wasn't.

Okay.

I don't think that the conference was the clearest it could have been, but I think that treating the whole reveal as some kind of travesty (as your earlier posts suggest) is also inaccurate. I especially disagree about the choice of "Wii U" as a name - while I voiced concerns that joining the console to the Wii brand might hold its success back (with the 18-35 male demographic, for example), the Wii brand is also incredibly strong, and it would be a waste not to use it in regards to the casual audience. I'd also say that "Cafe" is an incredibly vapid name.

At the end of the day, while it was true that Nintendo created a load of FUD with its conference, this is FUD that will most surely dissipate in the year between now and when the console actually launches.

 

[trudderham]

OK, so I just wasted 10 minutes going through the Wii U launch trailer. There's not a single reference to a new console. Only a new controller:

 

[antonz]

Wouldn't the publishers doing everything themselves be considered allowing outside sources to make their online network?

I dont think it equals up to Iwata saying they might just outright buy who they work with.

Unless Nintendo plans to buy one of the major 3rd party publishers. I certainly wonder what the hell is going on with their next gen online plans but considering the time frame and how anal Nintendo is about secrecy im not ready to say they are fucking it up again

 

[peakish]

I watched the presentation live on their E3 site and expected a completely new console. Even so I was completely confused about what they were presenting, as were the people in an IRC channel I frequent. Something absolutely failed about their presentation and I can't believe people n this thread are blaming the audience.

They say they're presenting a new console. They show a video with a brief glimpse in the background of a console looking very similar to an ordinary Wii (I didn't catch the difference until I went back to the video later), and a TV playing a Mario game that looks similar to a Wii game. Then a player picks up a controller and the game is transferred to that screen. Then they show a lot of examples of what can be done with the screen, using games that look like Wii games.

Don't come and say that that's not confusing. For all I knew the controller was the new console, with a built-in CPU+GPU and syncing to the ordinary Wii like an accessory. At least I was relieved when they showed the tech demo and games reel but I still didn't know that there was a base unit other than the Wii that it hooked up to.

In the end after reading up on the system I'm pretty psyched about it but the reveal was poorly communicated and I won't accept being called a moron for not understanding what they showed at first I'm glad that Iwata realises this.

 

[Maiar_m]

None of that actually matters, IMHO. No matter how you put it, first impressions are worth nothing after E3. The console is only going to be released in about a year from now, they have pleeenty of time to explain and market it properly. E3 was just a peek at what's to come. It seems some have minsunderstood Ninty's speech, and that's too bad, but there's no "blowing it" and no real damage done. (And I also blame it on the audience: I understood, so why couldn't you. It's obnoxious, but that's how things work)

The core gamers will stay alert and keep themsleves informed. Pricing and games will be what'll decide them. The casuals will be fed what the press will tell them, and will be seduced by stuff like WiiU Fit, WiiU Poney etc..., pricing and casual-oriented marketing (which is much easier than gamer-adapted communication considering the product's past).

I don' t think it was poorly explained, I just believe people keep expecting too much from E3. Nintendo now have everyone's attention, and can drop infos here and then with much effect. If they had shown it all and said it all in LA, it would have been a full year of waiting and nothing more. It might not be the best choice, but it makes sense.

 

[[Nintex]]

OK, so I just wasted 10 minutes going through the Wii U launch trailer. There's not a single reference to a new console. Only a new controller:

Call me crazy but I think they held back the 'New Console' video showing the features of the system itself to not make third parties look unprepared since they already had Pikmin 3 playable on the thing or something like that.

 

[gerg]

Full white band on top, logo in the middle. And with some more focus on the U part, or whatever they put if they change it (they won't), instead of just putting it smaller in a corner of the logo, which leaves all the focus on Wii (wrong, wrong, wrong logo design).

I really think that some people are overstating this. People will realise that the Wii U is a new console, in the same way that customers aren't actually stupid enough to think that the 3DS is just a revision of the DS. (Well, some may be, but they won't represent millions of other consumers who can rub two brain cells together.)

And, I'd also say that there may be merit in emphasising the "Wii" part of the "Wii U" logo that much, because it allows that everything that brand means for the casual audience can stand prominently among the console's image. The core audience will come with the games - I think that attracting casual gamers is that much more difficult.

 

[Gravijah]

It's funny that even after nintendo themselves admit that they didn't explain it properly, nintentards are still defending the conference.

Hey now, that word is not very nice.

 

[NinjaTehFish]

Nintendo reiterated again and again that its HD. Apart from being coy on the specifics, they showed several times during the conference footage of that nature, that was clearly unattainable on Wii.

If you see all that and are watching live/recorded footage of a gaming convention press event and are still confused, please don't procreate.

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

I really think that some people are making a mountain out of a molehill with this. People will realise that the Wii U is a new console, in the same way that customers aren't actually stupid enough to think that the 3DS is just a revision of the DS. (Well, some may be, but they won't represent millions of other consumers who can rub two brain cells together.

I think this is a bit unfair, because in the UK at the moment the 3DS is not being presented well in retail. I was in Tesco the other day and the 3DS console and games were just shoved in the DS section, with no hint it's the "next gen" version of the handheld and no signs/adverts etc.

To the average consumer that must be pretty confusing.

 

[Boken]

The console is ugly anyway.

 

[Celine]

It was a really vague presentation, without the traditional unveiling of the console box itself (remember Iwata waving the Revolution in 2005?). The name didn't make things better since it seems to be yet another Wii peripheral and not a brand new system.

For example:

http://www.france24.com/en/20110608-e3-nintendo-microsoft-ubisoft-xbox-wii-video-games



A portable game console huh?

Iwata: *le sigh*

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Given that we're all relatively informed here, I didn't think there would be much confusion about this being their new console. That being said, no HW specs, promotional pictures showing 4 Wiimotes, vague online details, vague multiple controller details, vague optical media details, and the name... what did they expect?

This was too early for an unveil, and it seems exceedingly obvious now that the new console announcement was only done so soon to appease shareholders. But even that backfired with the slapdash presentation. TGS should be much better. The hw probably isn't even final at this point (has any system ever been final over a year from release?)

 

[Gravijah]

Nintendo reiterated again and again that its HD. Apart from being coy on the specifics, they showed several times during the conference footage of that nature, that was clearly unattainable on Wii.

If you see all that and are watching live/recorded footage of a gaming convention press event and are still confused, please don't procreate.

I don't really think the average person knows what makes something HD HD.

 

[Maiar_m]

I think this is a bit unfair, because in the UK at the moment the 3DS is not being presented well in retail. I was in Tesco the other day and the 3DS console and games were just shoved in the DS section, with no hint it's the "next gen" version of the handheld and no signs/adverts etc.

To the average consumer that must be pretty confusing.

Well, that's Tesco *wink wink*

The most seen and arguably efficient form of advertising is TV anyway. I don't know how they have approached TV ads in the UK, but if you watch French TV and still don't get what the 3DS is about, your cradle has been rocked too close to the wall.

 

[Izayoi]

It's funny that even after nintendo themselves admit that they didn't explain it properly, nintentards are still defending the conference.

Hey now, I thought the 3DS stuff looked great.

Definitely wasn't hot on the rest of the conference, though.

 

[mrklaw]

confusing. WiiU, show controller, show 'drawing', hey thats like the UDraw accessory.

 

[NinjaTehFish]

I wanna clarify my stance.

E3 is essentially an enthusiasts event. Its not for selling this shit to soccer moms yet. Its amazing watching nerds on a gaming forum argue their ignorance for a change.

 

[neoanarch]

I think this is a bit unfair, because in the UK at the moment the 3DS is not being presented well in retail. I was in Tesco the other day and the 3DS console and games were just shoved in the DS section, with no hint it's the "next gen" version of the handheld and no signs/adverts etc.

To the average consumer that must be pretty confusing.

Nintendo needs to release a 3ds-lite sooner rather than later. I don't think emulating the Apple naming scheme is working for them either.

 

[Nirolak]

I dont think it equals up to Iwata saying they might just outright buy who they work with.

Unless Nintendo plans to buy one of the major 3rd party publishers. I certainly wonder what the hell is going on with their next gen online plans but considering the time frame and how anal Nintendo is about secrecy im not ready to say they are fucking it up again

Fair enough.

 

[majortom1981]

The funny thing is the news here in NY has been showing it right. They are stating its a new console. So why did the general media get it and not the gaming media?

PS NEogaf will NEVER like nintendo. So you cannot go by these forums. Everybody i have shown the new controller to has thought it to be interesting and cannot wait to try it. these same people have wii's in their home.

 

[Cromat]

I wanna clarify my stance.

E3 is essentially an enthusiasts event. Its not for selling this shit to soccer moms yet. Its amazing watching nerds on a gaming forum argue their ignorance for a change.

But as I pointed out before, this confusion was also seen in reports by the mainstream media.
Why can't everyone just agree that it wasn't a very good presentation? It means nothing about the system itself.

 

[snap0212]

Nintendo reiterated again and again that its HD. Apart from being coy on the specifics, they showed several times during the conference footage of that nature, that was clearly unattainable on Wii.

If you see all that and are watching live/recorded footage of a gaming convention press event and are still confused, please don't procreate.

Games on it will look nice and there will be a special controller. Okay. Why do I need this controller? Why will third-party games be better on it? Why don't they say anything about the online capabilities of the console? If it's on part with the competitions it wouldn't be bad if they just said "We threw friend codes away, we tie content to an account instead of a console".

It's not like people can simply "trust" Nintendo at this point. They knew no one likes friend codes and still use them on the 3DS, they knew no one liked that content is tied to a system instead of a user account and still do it on the 3DS. Why would anyone think that they're going to do everything better when they had the chance to show that they're willing to improve what they've had but simply decided not to for whatever reason.

 

[hamchan]

But as I pointed out before, this confusion was also seen in reports by the mainstream media.
Why can't everyone just agree that it wasn't a very good presentation? It means nothing about the system itself.

Exactly. Nintendo will most certainly clean up the confusion, they have a whole year to do it.

I'm taking issue with the people that are blaming the confusion on the audience instead of Nintendo's crappy presentation.

 

[Faddy]

Nintendo's ineptness could actually be a good opportunity to tweak the brand. They haven't established the name of the console in the public's mind in kind of a similar way to Revolution.

When they actually announce the hardware, with specs etc, a subtle redesign with a new name they somehow keeps Wii synergy but establishes it as a wholly new console.

Someone suggested Nintendo U earlier in the thread as a suitable name and undoubtedly Nintendo needs to build a stronger identity for their new console and I still think they have room to tweak the brand without a full backtrack against Wii U.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

I really think that some people are overstating this. People will realise that the Wii U is a new console, in the same way that customers aren't actually stupid enough to think that the 3DS is just a revision of the DS. (Well, some may be, but they won't represent millions of other consumers who can rub two brain cells together.)

And, I'd also say that there may be merit in emphasising the "Wii" part of the "Wii U" logo that much, because it allows that everything that brand means for the casual audience can stand prominently among the console's image. The core audience will come with the games - I think that attracting casual gamers is that much more difficult.

3DS in the UK is marketed exactly the same as, and alongside the DS. If I didn't frequent GAF as I do, I'd believe it was essentially the same hardware only with a 3D screen.
Entirely Nintendo's fault, not the customer.