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NRA, Democrats and White House for regulation on bump stocks, GOP on the fence
- Thread starter Tovarisc
- Start date
Of course its Obama's fault not the fact that you can legally buy 30 firearms and bump stocks over a course of a year.
I suspect the NRA makes virtually no money on bump stocks, why would they care. Also it takes minutes to mod a gun to fully auto. I like the Canadian approach of the 5 round mag limit. Sure you can make your own mag but anything that makes mass murder more difficult is a good thing.
One Eyed Willy
Member
Same
ChainedMaster
Banned
But it has it's place in the military. Otherwise they wouldn't be waste money adding it on every rifle they have.
Random Painted HIghway
Member
Dont let the gop Congress off the hook with an atf regulation. Put them on the record on this and force them to shoot down other democratic amendments.
Lobbying money.
Considering 40% of Americans say they have a gun or live in a household with one, it should give you some idea as to how the NRA does not speak for everyone, but still manages to get their way due to the influence of money.
Okie doke?
Do you even know what a bolt action is? If so you should understand why your criteria is too broad.
Of course they should be banned and it might actually happen just so the NRA can say it did something. I know it will never come to pass, but I'd also like to see assault rifles banned. What legitimate excuse do people have to own one other than being cool to fire at the range, when the potential for mass harm is great since open carry is pretty much everywhere in the US now. You don't need them to hunt or personal protection.
Version 3.0
Member
Yeah. It's foolproof. They can truthfully say "no law-abiding citizen has ever committed a crime using our weapons", and it's true, because as soon as the citizen commits a crime, he's by definition no longer law-abiding.
But that completely ignores the fact that almost anyone who wants to do something like this has very few barriers in place to acquiring the means to do so, and there are very few effective measures in place to raise any red flags when he does so.
ChainedMaster
Banned
Also, we can't stop at bump stocks. Binary triggers should also be banned. They to can fire at a similar rate as automatics.
NullPointer
Member
I know, right? Fucking NRA
It does have it's place, there's just not a lot of situations where it's really applicable.
You don't want to shot on burst mode because you'll just decrease your ammo quicker and be less accurate.
My point is that the military has no need for bump stocks since they have burst mode (which fires 3 bullets per trigger pull instead of using the recoil of the gun to fire another round, which is what a bump stock does).
Duxxy3
Member
Yes I do. And there are plenty of bolt action rifles that don't take large capacity magazines.
eyeball_kid
Member
So if the piece of shit in Vegas didn't have bump stocks on his semi-autos, it would've been an acceptable level of murder for the NRA? Maybe 20 dead and 250 injured instead?
That would be the NRA-ILA. They are the Institute for Legislative Action. They run on donations to combat legislation against the second amendment. In short, that means there are people donating a lot of money to the NRA-ILA. When you know the majority of NRA members are for better gun control, yet it keeps failing tells you a small percentage is donating out the asshole...or even non NRA members.
Probably, but we need to correct that now. The majority of people never even heard of a bump stock. Now, everyone knows. That includes psychos planning things and people that can potentially snap. Lets try to get rid of them while we can.
Earthstrike
Member
Funny how the response isn't "But criminals will use bump stocks anyways!"
RoadHazard
Gold Member
What in the actual fuck. These fucking people.
"Unfortunately people want to talk about gun control after 60 people were helplessly murdered by a guy with legal guns. Gun control will do nothing, even though it has done loads in other countries."
What utter bags of rancid shit.
Because they can mobilize them.
It's not the money that's the issue, it's that they can apply pressure.
I would THINK that existing bump-fire stocks will be headed for the NFA registry and regulated like machine guns based on what the NRA is calling for. That would effectively ban them and make them very hard to get without tracking down every owner and seizing their legally purchased property. This has been done before with the Streetsweeper and Striker shotguns. Basically the ATF tracked down all the owners and gave them a chance to either register the guns as Class III destructive devices, or turn them in. Now the Striker and Streetsweeper are off the streets in only in the hands of collectors. As for accessories, this has also been done with lightning links or auto sears that convert a gun to full-auto. They didn't ban them per se, they just heavily regulated them.
I mean, you can literally either 3D print one or make one with a few screws and a piece of metal. I've seen people make AK pistols (which don't have a stock) bump-fire just by making the grip slide back and forth and screwing a finger rest into the side of it. Aimed bump-fire is even possible without any modifications at all, just practice.
I mean, you can literally either 3D print one or make one with a few screws and a piece of metal. I've seen people make AK pistols (which don't have a stock) bump-fire just by making the grip slide back and forth and screwing a finger rest into the side of it. Aimed bump-fire is even possible without any modifications at all, just practice.
Yup.
He's taking the piss at this point (pun very intended)
HerbertBirdsfoot
Member
They turn out and vote. Every time. The core NRA vote is a consistent and solid voting bloc in this country. The grassroots organization and voting is what gives the NRA power. Its not just money.
ForsakenLotus
Member
I'll never understand the thought process of gun nuts. Obviously a constitutional right doesn't mean a right can't be reasonably limited (though I don't think the second amendment gives universal gun ownership rights, but that's a different topic).
And you cannot argue that things like limiting high ammo magazines, high powered/automatic weapons, etc. and universal background checks and more responsible gun ownerships laws is infringing on the second amendment. What these crazy people care about is their ability to purchase and use overly dangerous weapons regardless of how much more dangerous it makes the country.
It's absolutely infuriating. This country man.
And you cannot argue that things like limiting high ammo magazines, high powered/automatic weapons, etc. and universal background checks and more responsible gun ownerships laws is infringing on the second amendment. What these crazy people care about is their ability to purchase and use overly dangerous weapons regardless of how much more dangerous it makes the country.
It's absolutely infuriating. This country man.
The NFA is a vague law that needs to be reworked completely.
The result is that the ATF makes completely arbitrary rulings on what is legal, like banning shoestrings, or approving the sig brace before overturning that ruling and making it a federal crime to allow the sig brace to touch your shoulder(which is enforceable how?). Then on the other hand they allow these gimmicky bumpfire stocks to stay legal for a decade? It makes no sense at all.
The SBR rules in particular are completely nonsensical, leading to a situation where you can own a perfectly legal collection of parts and still end up in prison because of 'constructive intent' nonsense. You should not be able to go to prison because the government thinks you might do something illegal with perfectly legal items.
rokkerkory
Member
NRA kinda supporting this to avoid bigger legislation
A consistent note in all news stories is that people are suddenly buying these after they've been sitting on shelves collecting dust.
NRA is willing to do it because there's no money in it for the manufacturers.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Is the NRA writing policy? Fuck what they're "willing" to talk about.
Sounds like we're leading from behind.
Sounds like we're leading from behind.
HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
The country is literally telling him what they want.
Furthermore, you have people on here saying the same shit. "More regulation doesn't matter, psychos will still find a way, etc". Despite the proof it does work is there for anyone with a pair of eyes to see. Fucking pathetic.
ElectricKaibutsu
Member
This bump stock thing is so stupid. This will do nothing to prevent mass shootings in the future. They're just passing legislation on this to pretend they are doing something.
Dreams-Visions
Member
And you know this is through clinched teeth.
QuantumZebra
Member
Earthstrike
Member
Right, that makes my argument even stronger. This is a situation where criminals would actually have easier access to them relative to guns. It's easier to acquire a bump stock than a gun even if we had regulations. (You can't 3d print a decent gun, unless that 3d gun project made strides recently)
So the argument isn't used here. The reason? Politics, GOP can't have trump make another deal with democrats. It would harm the party insanely, the party that the NRA needs.
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
💰💰💰
That's not quite accurate. The M4 is fully automatic, but it's not the standard issued rifle. The M16a4 has a three round burst, and no fully automatic setting. Full auto was removed with the M16a2 back in the early 80's.
The AR-15 platform can be set up like an M16 or an M4, but from the factory they're all semi-automatic. The burst mode is illegal.
That doesn't affect your point, though. Not every soldier is issued an M4 because automatic fire from a US military perspective is about short-term area denial and suppression, not killing hordes of the enemy.
Also, for the record, I support the bump stock ban as well as a larger gun control discussion.
Temeculan3000
Member
Yes this is lip service.
Yes they want to ban them to show they willing to do something. And later they can say "hey we did something"
Yes they will say that banning bump stocks is enough.
We should still ban them though.
Yes they want to ban them to show they willing to do something. And later they can say "hey we did something"
Yes they will say that banning bump stocks is enough.
We should still ban them though.
Actually, the M-4 is replacing the M-16 as the standard issue riffle. I was in the Air Force from 05 to this past June and on both of my deployments to Iraq and Agfhanistan, we were issued M-4's instead of M-16A's as the Air Force was phasing out the M16 to replace it with the M4.
The Marines and Army switched around 2015.
I did not know that! I know that some of my friends that were in the Army talked about wishing they'd been given M4's, but this was in 2011-2014. I'm a little out of date. Thanks for the info.
Fast Forward
Member
Rran
Member
Because it gets them votes, sadly. I remember talking to a coworker a couple months before the election, and she mentioned not wanting to support Democrats because they want to take away our right to defend ourselves. But, she continued, that there should totally be some degree of gun control, because guns--the quantity and magnitude of many firearms being sold--have become a problem (so, you know, sensible gun control legislation... the kind that Democrats are always campaigning for).
I just... I mean, I was really quite shocked that there are people out there that actually believe this shit. I honestly can't think of a single Democrat that's campaigned on banning all firearms.
V
Vilix
Unconfirmed Member
Agreed. If you want to fire a fully automatic weapon obtain a Class 3 license or rent one at a gun range.