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Oculus Store update ties DRM to headset

Trojan

Member
Feb 16, 2014
3,110
1
0
Oculus needs to be careful with shit like this. They're within their right to close off their platform, but moves like this are going to shun gaming early adopters. I want all the platforms for VR to succeed, but I'm really happy I went with the Vive over Oculus after their recent track record.
 

Ikkyu

Neo Member
Jun 29, 2010
7
0
0
Personally, I don't think this is a move against the Vive, at least not exclusively. It's a move against cheaper manufacturers of VR sets coming from China.

The fact of the matter is that most of the hardware on the Oculus can be reversed engineered and built cheaply enough out of easily accessible parts, and the competition in the Chinese market is building a critical mass that will end up spilling to Western markets.

I mean, look at the number of headsets in this article, or the mentions of higher quality offerings in this other one. Headsets under or around $200 are very close, and most of what's being developed now in China already boasts its compatibility with Oculus-developed software.

The only chance that Oculus think they have is to close down the software and tie it up to their machine.
 

Jebusman

Banned
Nov 10, 2013
2,789
1
0
Canada
I guess once people figure out how Oculus is detecting the Rift connected, they're likely come up with some sort of fake/clone device that reports itself as a Rift just to pass the check.
 

collige

Banned
Nov 12, 2012
4,897
0
445
I've never really gotten this line of thinking. Facebook's entire business model is spreading that product thin & making it as ubiquitous as possible. They've never really walled off a garden like this, and their MO with acquisitions has always been about being hands off.

Face it. Oculus is making these decisions of their own volition. You're free to blame the Zucker-boogeyman, but the fault more than likely lies within.
This. This descision is really terrible, but Facebook has literally no history when it comes to shitty DRM. This is all Oculus.
 

Chairmanchuck

Member
Jun 18, 2011
14,205
0
680
Wonder if Carmack cares. He was in favor of openness back in the day.
Palmer was too...

This. This descision is really terrible, but Facebook has literally no history when it comes to shitty DRM. This is all Oculus.
The thing is how come that Oculus stance on the DRM thing changed after being bought. Following Oculus since the DK1 days there was a change after the buyout. From "We need to have it open and available for other HMD manufacturers. Its about making VR available for the masses and a closed system would work against that" to what we have now.
 

Zepp Twofist

Member
Aug 14, 2015
2,706
1
325
$10 says revive gets a DRM buster
There probably will be something like that, but then it has to move underground since it becomes essentially a crack instead of a modification. And once it is a crack, people probably won't be buying their games from Oculus before using it.
 

Bizzquik

Member
Sep 9, 2013
1,918
0
0
Kennewick, WA - USA
I'm torn.
I hate this practice.

But I also understand that Oculus has footed the bill as publisher for full-game experiences to be made like Chronos and Lucky's Tale. So I understand why they would gate this stuff.

Steam needs more complete VR games.
Really, there are so few VR offerings from either outlet that are more than just tech demos at this point.
 

Krejlooc

Banned
May 27, 2014
25,432
18
0
Personally, I don't think this is a move against the Vive, at least not exclusively. It's a move against cheaper manufacturers of VR sets coming from China.
That's even worse. You want cheap Chinese clones of you are trying to prop up a medium. The eventual emergence of cheap clones is integral to the technological adoption curve. Every transformative technology eventually gained prominence thanks to clones. Clones are how technology spreads. Hell, Palmer luckey spoke about this back in 2014, how the low end clone market is important down the line.
 

Tagyhag

Member
Aug 21, 2013
17,882
3
465
Los Angeles
I'm torn.
I hate this practice.

But I also understand that Oculus has footed the bill as publisher for full-game experiences to be made like Chronos and Lucky's Tale. So I understand why they would gate this stuff.

Steam needs more complete VR games.
Really, there are so few VR offerings from either outlet that are more than just tech demos at this point.
The thing is, it doesn't matter if you play Chronos on your Rift or Vive, if you buy it at the Oculus store, they'll get the money.

There is no financial reason to do this other than "Well if you bought a Vive you shouldn't be allowed to play any of our games!"
 

LaneDS

Member
Jun 11, 2007
9,131
0
0
Is the DRM checking for the CV1, or just Oculus products (i.e. does a DK2 still work with Home)?
 

tenchir

Member
Jun 6, 2004
3,006
0
1,280
Didn't someone from Oculus outright say not to buy anything from their store because they can't promise it won't break in the future? I think they don't condone the hack?
 

BleedOrange

Banned
Jan 19, 2015
1,636
0
0
Personally, I don't think this is a move against the Vive, at least not exclusively. It's a move against cheaper manufacturers of VR sets coming from China.

The fact of the matter is that most of the hardware on the Oculus can be reversed engineered and built cheaply enough out of easily accessible parts, and the competition in the Chinese market is building a critical mass that will end up spilling to Western markets.

I mean, look at the number of headsets in this article, or the mentions of higher quality offerings in this other one. Headsets under or around $200 are very close, and most of what's being developed now in China already boasts its compatibility with Oculus-developed software.

The only chance that Oculus think they have is to close down the software and tie it up to their machine.
I agree with this analysis. Tying down the software platform to the hardware makes sense if they want to justify the existence of the Oculus publishing arm.
 

Slayven

Member
Dec 10, 2004
121,808
7
0
USA
Palmer Luckey should stop speaking for the company, seems like all he does is piss off people now
 

SneakyStephan

Banned
Jan 23, 2011
18,401
0
0
Disgusting.

@people asking why they're doing this:

because if people are buying vives (or other headsets when those come to market) they're also shopping outside of the oculus store (most of their shopping will be outside of it)
It's just a continuation of the anti competitive splitting of the VR userbase, they are counting on their headset coming out on top eventually.

It's 'be the platformholder of VR on PC' or nothing for them.

edit : to clarify: they want to force every headset vendor to be on their store, officially, and exclusively. Like what google does with the play store. Since it's early days of vr and it's a duopoly for now they think this is as good a shot at achieving that as they'll ever get.

It's not going to happen though.
I will dance on their grave when they end up with nothing.
 

Krejlooc

Banned
May 27, 2014
25,432
18
0
But I also understand that Oculus has footed the bill as publisher for full-game experiences to be made like Chronos and Lucky's Tale. So I understand why they would gate this stuff.
That makes absolutely no sense. By artificially limiting the headsets that work with their software, they limit their market. Vive owners buying software on oculus home is still a sale. If we believe oculus that the book the cv1 is almost retail price, they aren't making money through hardware sales.
 

Mister Zimbu

Member
Jun 7, 2004
2,331
0
0
Argh, and I just got my "order processed" notification too.

It sounds like that this only applies to games bought from the Oculus Store, not Steam? That's not *as* bad, but still, fuck Oculus for this shit.

Still debating cancelling the order.
 

Chairmanchuck

Member
Jun 18, 2011
14,205
0
680
Didn't someone from Oculus outright say not to buy anything from their store because they can't promise it won't break in the future? I think they don't condone the hack?
Yeah. And this is from 5 months ago too from Palmer Luckey:

If customers buy a game from us, I don't care if they mod it to run on whatever they want. As I have said a million times (and counter to the current circlejerk), our goal is not to profit by locking people to only our hardware - if it was, why in the world would we be supporting GearVR and talking with other headset makers? The software we create through Oculus Studios (using a mix of internal and external developers) are exclusive to the Oculus platform, not the Rift itself.
Of course it doesnt state that they wont break it if someone does it, but still...
 

Zepp Twofist

Member
Aug 14, 2015
2,706
1
325
Is the DRM checking for the CV1, or just Oculus products (i.e. does a DK2 still work with Home)?
DK2 still works. People who have both DK2 and Vive can just keep the former connected to still use the injector to play games on Vive if they want to.
 

KingSnake

The Birthday Skeleton
Jan 9, 2013
26,118
2
0
I'm torn.
I hate this practice.

But I also understand that Oculus has footed the bill as publisher for full-game experiences to be made like Chronos and Lucky's Tale. So I understand why they would gate this stuff.

Steam needs more complete VR games.
Really, there are so few VR offerings from either outlet that are more than just tech demos at this point.
While Lucky's is somehow understandable because anybody can get it for free (and it's only them to blame for choosing this solution - or they could DRM just this one) the rest of the games you still need to buy from Oculus Home, so this explanation doesn't hold.

There probably will be something like that, but then it has to move underground since it becomes essentially a crack instead of a modification. And once it is a crack, people probably won't be buying their games from Oculus before using it.
Yeah, I was also thinking about that, Revive will become from a mod a crack by going around DRM.
 

LaneDS

Member
Jun 11, 2007
9,131
0
0
DK2 still works. People who have both DK2 and Vive can just keep the former connected to still use the injector to play games on Vive if they want to.
So I should sell my DK2 and bill it as an Oculus emulator for Vive owners, got it.

(Thanks, good to know they didn't close that door today too)
 

ViviOggi

Member
Feb 22, 2013
10,886
0
0
I couldn't care less for the company perspective devil's advocate spiel that's already popping up as expected. Oculus can get the fuck outta here, we don't need this shit on PC.
 

Krejlooc

Banned
May 27, 2014
25,432
18
0
@people asking why they're doing this:

because if people are buying vives (or other headsets when those come to market) they're also shopping outside of the oculus store (most of their shopping will be outside of it)
It's just a continuation of the anti competitive splitting of the VR userbase, they are counting on their headset coming out on top eventually.

It's 'own VR or PC' or nothing for them.

I wll dance on their grave when they end up with nothing.
This only affects oculus home, as it's part of the oculus home storefront drm, not the SDK. Oculus rift only games sold on other store fronts still work with revive.

Example - technolust is sold on steam and oculus home. Both versions only officially work with the rift. The Steam version can work with revive, the oculus home version cannot. But this is because steam drm doesn't check to make sure the headset is a rift.
 

Zepp Twofist

Member
Aug 14, 2015
2,706
1
325
Didn't someone from Oculus outright say not to buy anything from their store because they can't promise it won't break in the future? I think they don't condone the hack?
They did, but most people probably assumed that it was because they didn't want to be responsible if the mod accidentally broke in an update. Turns out they did it deliberately.

Still, after that whole comment I decided not to buy anything from the Oculus Store in case they did something stupid. Unfortunately that turned out to be a good decision.
 

Syril

Member
Mar 28, 2008
7,438
0
0
I get the feeling their line of thought was "if everything on the oculus store needs an oculus hooked up to work, then future customers who are less savvy about different acquisition methods will think they need an oculus to have the best selection, which will draw them more to our store where we'll get a bigger cut".
 

Krejlooc

Banned
May 27, 2014
25,432
18
0
Is the DRM checking for the CV1, or just Oculus products (i.e. does a DK2 still work with Home)?
Oculus products. You can get around this right now by plugging in a dk2 when launching your game through oculus home. If the drm detects any oculus products connected to the PC, they will pass and boot, even if you are using revive to run them on a vive or osvr headset.

This is literally only a check when starting the game, on their server side drm, to make sure an oculus headset is connected. It serves no other purpose.
 

Compsiox

Member
Jul 6, 2014
11,639
2,319
770
The kickstarter was great for the medium. Most Vive owners would probably not be that today was it not for the Oculus kickstarter.
I was kidding and I was all for Oculus even after the Vive was announced just so you know. It was the launch and things like this that turned me against them.
 

Blanquito

Member
Jul 19, 2013
2,003
0
0
That's pretty disappointing considering the reassurance from Palmer earlier.

It certainly now puts into doubt anything that he or Oculus says in the future as well.
 

JarrodL

Member
Dec 23, 2015
412
0
0
This is enough to push me towards looking into their competition who don't force layers of DRM upon their customers.

Thanks Oculus, I was debating what headset to buy when next generation kits arrive, but you've made that decision really easy for me.
 

Zepp Twofist

Member
Aug 14, 2015
2,706
1
325
I was kidding and I was all for Oculus even after the Vive was announced just so you know. It was the launch and things like this that turned me against them.
Yeah, I know (I remember the thread :p). I had pretty much the same trajectory as you when it came to my pivot from Oculus to Vive.
 

StrangeTaco

Member
Jun 17, 2014
1,069
0
0
Welp was leaning towards probably getting the Vive over the Rift, only hangup I had was the price difference. But with this news now I'm solidly in the Vive camp and I'll just save a few more months. Sorry Oculus.