I enjoyed 4 a lot even though it was an incredibly flawed game. The setting, themes & motifs and just the general mood of the world were really unique, imo. It's because of those elements that I put 60+ hours into that game. There's a lot that could be improved, but if Atlus manages to make another meaty (I wouldn't mind putting in 80+ hours into the next entry ) game with a world that oozes atmosphere and personality like P4's did, then they can have my money.
So I saw some video where a guy had an Izanagi at around level 90 with some top-tier skills.
This didn't make any sense.
So I researched it. Apparently, if you fuse Fool personas together, you get the next one down in rank. So as I understand it, they got the best Fool personas, then fused them down over and over until they had an Izanagi with really good skills.
But it seems like there's more. They also had to fuse on certain days so that skills could change. This has always seemed random as hell when I did it, but somehow there's a science to it.
But it seems like there's more. They also used the Magician Arcana Chance cards to change certain skills. Not sure exactly how this worked, but apparently you have to do it 7 times or something in order to get an Izanagi with God Hand.
This seems pretty ridiculous. You don't even get a card shuffle after every battle. And you don't get an Arcana Chance after every card shuffle. And you only get Magician a small percentage of the time in Arcana Chance. And there's always the possibility of getting the reversed Magician.
Seems like it would take hours and hours and hours with lots of resetting to get anywhere near the results you want. And then you still have to level Izanagi up to the 90s.
I had zero desire to NG+ either of those games when all was said and done. I didn't even play the Answer in P3FES for a while. I can see how P4 would be a pain in the ass though. As there is a whole other thread about it, that games takes around 3 hours until it even really lets you play.
I played them both for the first time back-to-back fairly recently (last fall/winter) and I really, really liked them both. However in my heart I prefer P3 to P4. *potential spoilers ahead*
Story- P3 had a more gripping story for me. P4 had a great mystery story that was very interesting and charming, but 3's felt much more emotional and resonated more with me. I think this was because of I liked the tone of P3 more. It had plenty of lighthearted moments like P4, but it had this pervading sense of somberness and hopelessness that I just found more appealing. It really hit home when
Shinji died
and the ending
when the MC dies just left me more depressed than I ever thought a video game capable. This was even worse in the Answer.
The game made me think about its themes of life and death more seriously than a video game ever had. And I personally related more to the stressful, busy, urban and often depressing life of a SEES member more than the carefree 'normal' high school life of the Investigation Team. Which brings me to my next point.
Characters-Again, I liked both casts. A lot. But I found myself gravitating to P3's SEES members more. They had conflict, fights and even animosity toward each other. They were strangers at first, but they did grow close. It felt more realistic and it conveyed dorm life well. Investigation Team were more buddy-buddy and had less of the more serious issues to deal with. They were more carefree and perhaps acted more their age, but I related more to SEES who had to grow up and mature really fast. They had more heartbreak to deal with and the characters were cooler IMO. P4 annoyed me a lot more often. Yukiko seemed like a prissy spoiled brat a lot, Chie was overly obsessed with Yukiko and just seemed really geeky about it at times, and Naoto was a straight-up unfriendly bitch for a long while. I liked them all in the end, but those characters in particular (especially Yukiko and Naoto) took a while to grow on me. Loved Kanji though.
Social Links-Kinda a toss up. Many of P3's were more memorable. Some were absolutely heartbreaking (Sun, Aeon) and I liked the dating options better. But in P4 you could SL with all your party members and gain bonuses in combat for them, so I felt closer with the team in P4. P3P you could date the guys though. But both were fun, so I dunno
Gameplay-P4. It's way more polished and refined. The SL system was more in depth and the dungeons were more diverse. Many of the refinements were implemented in P3P.
Music- P3 wins. P4 had a lot of catchy tracks, but the aforementioned somber themes of P3 produced nicer, more memorable and emotional music for me. I love so many tracks. And it had this funky, hip J-Rap and Hip-hop. oh yeah.
Edit: One more thing I liked more about P3. The silly costumes you could put on your characters. Even more so in P3P. I rarely LOL while playing a game, but some of the characters' reactions were hilarious. Like Shinji in a butler costume.
I bought 3 before 4 but just couldnt get into it. Something didnt click for whatever reason. Hated the fact that there was no real variation with the dungeons and the lack of party control. Also there was so much to do and manage that it was kind of overwhelming (was playing without a walkthrough).
Anyway I played 4 and somehow everything fell into place. It kind of taught me how to play a "Persona" game if that makes any sense. After that I was able to go back and finish 3. So for me, 4 is the better game, no question about it! But the ending of 3 is really really special. One of my favourite endings, second only to Xenosaga 3.
P3 has by far the superior story, but the gameplay refinements made in P4 make playing P3 pretty painful if you are trying to go backwards and play P4 before P3. I played P3 before P4 so the problems with P3's dungeon-crawling are kind of a remote memory for me compared to it's compelling story. The story of P4 is just so flat by comparison.
P3 has by far the superior story, but the gameplay refinements made in P4 make playing P3 pretty painful if you are trying to go backwards and play P4 before P3. I played P3 before P4 so the problems with P3's dungeon-crawling are kind of a remote memory for me compared to it's compelling story. The story of P4 is just so flat by comparison.
Both are very atmospheric games. Maybe because it was the first SMT game I've played but P3 was incredibly atmospheric with the music and the way the graphics and school looked. Both have amazing soundtracks. I feel like P3 did a better job of portraying the school life better but P4 was better gameplay wise.
So I saw some video where a guy had an Izanagi at around level 90 with some top-tier skills.
This didn't make any sense.
So I researched it. Apparently, if you fuse Fool personas together, you get the next one down in rank. So as I understand it, they got the best Fool personas, then fused them down over and over until they had an Izanagi with really good skills.
But it seems like there's more. They also had to fuse on certain days so that skills could change. This has always seemed random as hell when I did it, but somehow there's a science to it.
But it seems like there's more. They also used the Magician Arcana Chance cards to change certain skills. Not sure exactly how this worked, but apparently you have to do it 7 times or something in order to get an Izanagi with God Hand.
This seems pretty ridiculous. You don't even get a card shuffle after every battle. And you don't get an Arcana Chance after every card shuffle. And you only get Magician a small percentage of the time in Arcana Chance. And there's always the possibility of getting the reversed Magician.
Seems like it would take hours and hours and hours with lots of resetting to get anywhere near the results you want. And then you still have to level Izanagi up to the 90s.
What...? There are two Izanagis in P4, the original Izanagi and the 'ultimate' Izanagi, which is a different persona altogether with mad stats and resistances. The latter cannot be recorded in Compendium and thus cannot be brought over to new game plus (which sucks). Most probably what you're seeing is the ultimate version, not the original one.
Just like in P3 where there are two version of Orpheus, the basic and the ultimate one.
What...? There are two Izanagis in P4, the original Izanagi and the 'ultimate' Izanagi, which is a different persona altogether with mad stats and resistances. The latter cannot be recorded in Compendium and thus cannot be brought over to new game plus (which sucks). Most probably what you're seeing is the ultimate version, not the original one.
Just like in P3 where there are two version of Orpheus, the basic and the ultimate one.
I just want to say that I'm currently playing through P3P and LOVING IT! I only played a couple of hours of Devil Survivor before and boy if this isn't infinitely better.
PS:
The game told me that Chihiro (lvl5) could get upset if she sees me hanging out with other girls... how true is this?
PS2: Is there any way to change the game's difficulty? Save editor or something? I chose Easy just to try the game and when I realized I was already 15 hours in I feel like maybe it's too easy, even though there is an even lower level. I'm not bad at JRPGs, but after 25 hours I still haven't died a single time. Can you change it in NG+?
I just want to say that I'm currently playing through P3P and LOVING IT! I only played a couple of hours of Devil Survivor before and boy if this isn't infinitely better.
PS:
The game told me that Chihiro (lvl5) could get upset if she sees me hanging out with other girls... how true is this?
I thought Persona 4 was by far the best game. Neither game had a particularly strong story but I'll give that to Persona 3. Persona 4 had predictable pacing
(one kidnaping per month)
, and while it was played off as a mystery it didn't really give you anything to go by in solving it. You just had to wait until it was revealed to you, there was never any kind of build up to the solution. Such as
Adachi being the killer, just random revelation and without any kind of hints at it, I would even say the way he acted through the game contradicted the way they portrait him after he's revealed to be the killer, during the game he's portrait a regular person but after being revealed he's the killer they portrait him as someone uncapable of controlling himself, which if that was the case just makes it hard to believe how he acted during the entire game.
With that said I found most everything else better in Persona 4, the characters actually felt like a group of real teenagers. While they still had some anime-ish tropes and all they mostly felt like real characters with realistic interactions between them. Persona 3 characters acted like a bunch of adults trapped in 8~16 year olds bodies and were basically anime-tropes inside out. I never really felt any kind of real connection between them either, they were basically just a bunch of people that lived inside the same house and hardly interacted outside of when the main story demanded it, making all the relationship between them feel very unreal. It was just very unatural and very game-anime like writing of the characters compared to the more realistic portrait of the characters in Persona 4.
The gameplay I'll give it to Persona 4, the battle system is built on top of P3 and there's really not much to add there. The level design is pretty non-existing in both games. And the pacing is really repetitive in both (2 weeks of school->2 weeks of dungeons and repeat until the end of the game).
At the end I see Persona 3 as a flawed and interesting experience and Persona 4 has a great, but ultimately flawed, game.
Fuck that shit. Seriously, fuck that shit. How about a fucking Peach Battlesuit, or some other nice armor? Fuck accessories. Everything except Blessed Hands and the end-game accessories is fucking useless.
Fuck that shit. Seriously, fuck that shit. How about a fucking Peach Battlesuit, or some other nice armor? Fuck accessories. Everything except Blessed Hands and the end-game accessories is fucking useless.
I played them both for the first time back-to-back fairly recently (last fall/winter) and I really, really liked them both. However in my heart I prefer P3 to P4. *potential spoilers ahead*
Story- P3 had a more gripping story for me. P4 had a great mystery story that was very interesting and charming, but 3's felt much more emotional and resonated more with me. I think this was because of I liked the tone of P3 more. It had plenty of lighthearted moments like P4, but it had this pervading sense of somberness and hopelessness that I just found more appealing. It really hit home when
Shinji died
and the ending
when the MC dies just left me more depressed than I ever thought a video game capable. This was even worse in the Answer.
The game made me think about its themes of life and death more seriously than a video game ever had. And I personally related more to the stressful, busy, urban and often depressing life of a SEES member more than the carefree 'normal' high school life of the Investigation Team. Which brings me to my next point.
Characters-Again, I liked both casts. A lot. But I found myself gravitating to P3's SEES members more. They had conflict, fights and even animosity toward each other. They were strangers at first, but they did grow close. It felt more realistic and it conveyed dorm life well. Investigation Team were more buddy-buddy and had less of the more serious issues to deal with. They were more carefree and perhaps acted more their age, but I related more to SEES who had to grow up and mature really fast. They had more heartbreak to deal with and the characters were cooler IMO. P4 annoyed me a lot more often. Yukiko seemed like a prissy spoiled brat a lot, Chie was overly obsessed with Yukiko and just seemed really geeky about it at times, and Naoto was a straight-up unfriendly bitch for a long while. I liked them all in the end, but those characters in particular (especially Yukiko and Naoto) took a while to grow on me. Loved Kanji though.
Social Links-Kinda a toss up. Many of P3's were more memorable. Some were absolutely heartbreaking (Sun, Aeon) and I liked the dating options better. But in P4 you could SL with all your party members and gain bonuses in combat for them, so I felt closer with the team in P4. P3P you could date the guys though. But both were fun, so I dunno
Gameplay-P4. It's way more polished and refined. The SL system was more in depth and the dungeons were more diverse. Many of the refinements were implemented in P3P.
Music- P3 wins. P4 had a lot of catchy tracks, but the aforementioned somber themes of P3 produced nicer, more memorable and emotional music for me. I love so many tracks. And it had this funky, hip J-Rap and Hip-hop. oh yeah.
Edit: One more thing I liked more about P3. The silly costumes you could put on your characters. Even more so in P3P. I rarely LOL while playing a game, but some of the characters' reactions were hilarious. Like Shinji in a butler costume.
This! I agree with most of this, especially about the story - Persona 3 shows its Persona 1&2 roots while Persona 4 has many subtle nods. I want to see more Persona 3 comparison because I loved that game so much but it's been so long that I can't really remember everything that happened. I thought Junpei's character arc was beautiful.
Puddles said:
But it seems like there's more. They also used the Magician Arcana Chance cards to change certain skills. Not sure exactly how this worked, but apparently you have to do it 7 times or something in order to get an Izanagi with God Hand.
I don't get this...Is chie some type of meme or something?
I always liked her from the start but I totally avoided all persona 4 discussion for the most part and have just started noticing this exact sentiment.
persona 4 for pretty much everything save the atmosphere...
now, if p3p was p3+fes uncut in terms of content, with p3p addition...
THAT would be a challnger for p4 supremacy..
now atlus jp bring me persona 5 or you'll force me to amrry earlier and be done with my videogamer career!
Persona 3 was incredible. It was my first foray into SMT, and after I finished with that I promptly picked up Nocturne and DDS 1 and 2 (and have since gotten each new release). The music, the combat, the social links, story, it's so fucking good.
I'm only a few hours into Persona 4 (
Chie just got her Persona
), and while it is slow to start it is great so far. If it continues as is, I can easily see it rivaling P3F for me (though tough to imagine it beating it out due to nostalgia, despite the improvements).
Well it happens with all the girls once you get to a certain rank with them. About 7 or so, but sometimes earlier. The game really punishes you for having multiple gf's at once. So be careful.
It's a fair deal more forgiving on Easy mode. My little sister played it on Easy and isn't the best role player ever, but she managed to make it through easily only having some trouble at the end. It's not a total cakewalk, but it would probably be too easy for people who are familiar with turn based RPG's. Plus you get 10 plumes of dusk which revive your party when wiped out.
Normal is what I played it on, and it is more challenging. There's more tension in Tartarus since regular encounters pose more of a threat of killing you, and those purple shadows can be scary. It was more satisfying to beat some of the bosses, too. It's a little more grindy on Normal, but more fun because you have to be more on your toes.
From what I understand, it's actually not true in P3P unlike FES and original.
Basically you can be a manwhore to your hearts content. You'll still get the warnings about cheating, but no actual penalty. Only like 1/4 of the way through P3P so Im not sure, just going by what I've heard myself.
Both games are pretty unbalanced between the main character and the rest of the party. The MC in Persona 4 could probably solo the rest of the team on his own if he got to go first and could solo any three of them even if they went first if he had the right persona setup.
I started up P3P last night and not being able to actually seeing the characters on the screen when exploring the schools or towns really bothers me. Almost to the point where I will prolly just play it on the PS2 instead.
I started up P3P last night and not being able to actually seeing the characters on the screen when exploring the schools or towns really bothers me. Almost to the point where I will prolly just play it on the PS2 instead.
Yeah I felt this way too - you get used to it after a while but it feels like a cheap web browser game at times. If it's your first time playing the game I suggest playing the FES version on the PS2. If you want to see the dialogue options that a female MC gets in P3P, you can just check them out on youtube.
Puddles said:
Both games are pretty unbalanced between the main character and the rest of the party. The MC in Persona 4 could probably solo the rest of the team on his own if he got to go first and could solo any three of them even if they went first if he had the right persona setup.
I think that this is the point - at least for Persona 3 and 4 - the MC is the Joker Arcana and has limitless potential. He's sort of like a monster trainer while the other characters are static. I'm cool with this change though, I didn't care for micro-managing my teammates in the older Persona games. Igor has a cool way of explaining this in the beginning of the games, which I also like since Igor didn't have a very deep role in the older games. I like the whole Number Zero thing.
Yeah I felt this way too - you get used to it after a while but it feels like a cheap web browser game at times. If it's your first time playing the game I suggest playing the FES version on the PS2. If you want to see the dialogue options that a female MC gets in P3P, you can just check them out on youtube.
I put around 30 hours into P3 but then never came back to it. I plan to start over and thought that I would go with P3P. But I really think I will just play FES instead. The AI partners never really bothered me but I will admit at times, their choices made me wtf.
From what I understand, it's actually not true in P3P unlike FES and original.
Basically you can be a manwhore to your hearts content. You'll still get the warnings about cheating, but no actual penalty. Only like 1/4 of the way through P3P so Im not sure, just going by what I've heard myself.
P3P doesn't modify the manwhore system in any way that I'm aware of from original P3/FES.
Simply max out one girl's S.Link before you move on to another one, and you'll never have any problems. You can get all the girls at once to S.Link rank 4 without any problems either, but once you've "gotten serious" with one girl you need to max her out before working on the next one.
Yeah, in P3P, they took out the dating consequences and encouraged you to whore around. I was a girl whore and had like 4 boyfriends and no one ever found out. No reverse Social Links. I felt so dirty though.
I think it's the same with the male MC too. I remember dating all the girls and taking them to Tartarus. And when I spoke to them it was kinda funny.
So as of this post, a quick synopsis of this thread shows that Persona 4 is favored over Persona 3. Also, more so than not, people agree that Chie Satonaka is the best character.
This! I agree with most of this, especially about the story - Persona 3 shows its Persona 1&2 roots while Persona 4 has many subtle nods. I want to see more Persona 3 comparison because I loved that game so much but it's been so long that I can't really remember everything that happened. I thought Junpei's character arc was beautiful.
Persona 3:
+Better overal story
+Better atmosphere
-Worse pacing
-Worse battles
-Worse social dynamics
One small thing I missed from Persona 3 was the item that your Persona could carry that would be released when you hit a certain level with that monster. Gave you the incentive of carrying around an leveling Persona you otherwise wouldn't have had in your party.
The Ayane social link in Persona 4 made me feel like such a fucking pedo. She's the only girl I ever friendzoned in P3 or P4. Next playthrough I'm going with the drama chick since she doesn't look 11.
I can't even get half way through FES, and not because of party control, but fucking fatigue. I want my health/items to determine when I take a break, not some retarded ambiguous status.
P4, on the other hand, I could not put down until it was done. Fantastic.
) game with a world that oozes atmosphere and personality like P4's did, then they can have my money.
