Mejilan said:
You're wrong, Azih. As long as Arafat, and more importantly, his out of control Fatah movement is in control, Palestine will never become a true country or democracy.
I agree with you, but it is also true that Palestine will never become a true country or democracy while it is being occupied. Both of these things are obvious. My contention is that not only does the occupation prevent Palestine becoming a real country, it also prevents the emergence of a democratic Palestenian leader opposing Arafat.
Look, Palestine never progressed to the point of being a democracy, as such Palestine is not ruled by the politics of the Parliment, but the politics of the street. And on the street the only real power is the power of the gun. And the PLO has the guns and the terrorist/resistance organistations like Hamas has the guns and the IDF has the guns.
Who has the power and control of the resources in Palestine? It's not the Palestenian people. The vast majority of the power is in the hands of the most potent, well equipped and organised millitary forces in history.. the IDF. A whole lot of the resouces in palestine are controlled by settlers. What remains is controlled by the PLO and the terrorists/resistance. In a situation like this what the hell are the Palestenian people supposed to do?
Yesterday there was a story about a Palestenian family that refused to let I believe the Al-Aqsa Brigade (or Hamas) use thier land to fire rocket shells at a settlement. All they got for their refusal was one of their sons shot in the head.
In a situation where the last few dregs of infrastructure is controlled by the corrupt PLO, and the guns are in the hands of everybody *but* them (settlers, IDF, PLO, terrorists/resistance) the Palestenians
cannot do anything.
And as a pre-emptive strike against the idiots who respond with 'they should get guns and take control', these are *ordinary palestenians* where the hell are they going to get guns from? You need to have a lot of smuggling expertise for any Palestenian to get a gun in Palestine (it is after all an OCCUPIED country), and all that expertise is in the hands of the terrorists/resistance who are not interested in arming competitors to thier influence. And even if a contingent of Palestenians were able to arm themselves as a political orgainsation opposing the PLO, they'd become just another armed faction in a land overrun by them and they'd be an extremely ill-equipped, inexperienced, weak one to boot.
And that all ignores the fact that the root of the evil in the eyes of the Palestenian isn't the corrupt PLO or the vicous Hamas, it's the
settler. Any Palestenian that manages to get a gun will have top most in his/her mind the insane religious maniancs who run and put up tiny outposts and shacks on Palestenian territory, shoot at any Palestenian who dares approach them until the IDF arrives to defend their hold at which point they pour cement and annex the land.
As long as you have Hamas institutions in direct control of hospitals, schools, mosques, the media, and even government agencies, Palestine will never become a true country or democracy.
I'm going to reverse the Spiderman philosophy here to explain that. To take responsibility you have to have power. The ordinary Palestenian doesn't have any (for reasons I've outline above), while Hamas does. And in a situation where the power resides with the IDF and the settler, that will remain true.
What shackles Palestine to her dismal fate isn't an "occupying force"
Dude, why the quotes? I do not understand at all why you put the words occupying force in quotes. Israeli citizens and Israeli armed forces are in control of land which they acquired though millitary engagment. That's the TEXTBOOK definition of occupation. Whether it is occupied for expansionistic purposes, religious purposes, or defensive purposes is something that can be debated but it remains an occupation (with ALL the negative connotations of the word intact).
but an evil and selfish government rife with corruption, religious bigotry, overzealous and unreasoning hatreds, and who's brainwashing politics serve only to perpetuate the status quo.
and none of that excuses the settlements. Evil and selfish the PLO may be, but they are not responsible for the existence and expansion (and hell the creation of brand new) settlements that has been going on for THIRTY-SEVEN YEARS. You cannot pin the settlements on Arafat. And the settlements are an obstacle to peace.
It's a pity. Those are the self same reasons that Israel is still there. I bitterly regret that my leaders lack the conviction to just go in and wipe out the FARCE of a government structure that currently exists in Palestine. Sadly, Israel cannot, against the current world view, go in and "take care of business" to do what needs to be done, akin to what America did with Iraq, for better or for worse.
The difference between America/Iraq and Israel/Palestine is that American has not been occupying Iraq since 1967. Israeli millitary action is viewed with a whole lot more suspicion and outrage because it is the action of a long standing occupying force in an occupied territory. And you know what the crazy thing is? Any Palestenian government Israel would install would have
less credibility than the PLO does. Hard to believe but you know it's true.
I think we'd all be amazed just how quickly Israel would enact measures for a true and lasting peace (as we've been able to do with Egypt, Jordan for the most part) if there was a government that could honestly be negotiated with.
That true analogy in this situation is Lebanon, Ehud Barak created a quiet and peaceful border with Lebanon by WITHDRAWING. You don't need to negotiate a withdrawal, you just WITHDRAW. Barak's execution was stupid, he should have withdrawn with a whole lot of pomp and circumstance and not just have the army leave in the night. But that is the model that needs to be followed. Too bad the settler extremists won't let Israel do that eh?.
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