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Physics: Tug of War
- Thread starter acidviper
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The Viewtiful One
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I remember once reading in a physics book that the winner of a tug-of-war is not the team that pulls the hardest, but the team that pushes the hardest against the ground. Something about forces in a system have t be balanced. Not sure if thats any help though...
MrSardonic
The nerdiest nerd of all the nerds in nerdland
there is a common-sense reason - he's meant to be the "anchor" that secures your position while the rest of the team try to get a bit more distance. Once they have pulled the other team forward, the anchor repositions himself to secure the advances made. in a tug of war you use your legs and push against the ground at an angle. if he were at the front, his own team would be destabilising the anchor position everytime they pulled.
acidviper said:
I tried finding an actual description of the physics online, but I failed.
Hmm. I'd say that there are two key things, neither organizational per se:
1.) Push toward the ground. I can't recall why, other than it leverages them awkwardly. You get the benefit of free grounding with all of that downward force and they have to life upward, which loosens their footing.
2.) Sudden jerking motions are where the benefits of force-by-increased-accelleration really help. Timed heaves back are key. My physics teacher would always reiterate how much more powerful a single jerk was to do a task than a prolonged (much more exerting) constant pull.
3.) I'd organize it by weight from heaviest in the back to lightest in front.
BlueTsunami
there is joy in sucking dick
Pushing down on the ground sounds like the logical thing to do but I think we would all be surprised at the amount of people who don't do this and just try to use their back and arm strength. Which is obviously what you shouldn't do.
BlueTsunami
there is joy in sucking dick
Zaptruder said:
I believe its because, the action of pulling the rope while pushing towards the ground makes you push the ground at an angle. You end up leaning back which gives you more leverage. I'm sure theres a more complicated and in depth explanation to it though.
Its a net force question. If I could draw a free body diagram there would be an arrow pointing down Fgravity=mass*acceleration. In this case my mass times the force of gravity. I push down and backwards diagonally and the reaction force pushes up and backwards at a diagonal. If I add the arrows tip-to-tip it creates a net force straight backwards.
But the question is, do all these net forces add up regardless of the order of people, or does the tension in the rope make a difference.
But the question is, do all these net forces add up regardless of the order of people, or does the tension in the rope make a difference.
BlueTsunami
there is joy in sucking dick
acidviper said:
I'm thinking the strength of each person should be taken into account. You would then put the weakest in front and build up with each person (strenght wise) until you reach the strongest. So IMO the order of people does matter and it should be Weakest>Moderate>Strongest
Not sure why but I feel that putting them out of order or putting the strongest in front messes up the maximum net force you could reach when everyone is set the way I explained above.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
Juice said:
That's exactly right. Last tug of war I was in must have been in eighth grade, but we organized it such that we pulled on heave and held at ho. So after a few "HEAVE-HO" cycles, it was an easy win.
Edit: As long as the rope is in tnesion, where the strongest guy is should not matter. A force is a force is a force.
In theory, the arrangement of people ought to make no difference from a physics point of view. Since all of the forces are being carried along the rope, which is one-dimensional, they should sum the same no matter where they are being applied.
With that being said, there is probably some small "real-world" advantage to putting your strongest (not heaviest) person at the anchor position:
1) The most powerful muscles in the body are your legs, so the farther you can tilt back, the more force you can exert along the axis of the rope...and the anchorperson can tilt back the farthest.
2) The other reason is the ability to convert your strength into force on the rope. Friction holds your hand to the rope, and if you exceed the maximum sticking force (a function of the coefficient of static friction), your hand will slip along the rope. The anchorperson, though, is usually holding either a knotted end or can wrap the rope around his/her hand to be able to apply a direct force along the rope unconstrained by friction.
With that being said, there is probably some small "real-world" advantage to putting your strongest (not heaviest) person at the anchor position:
1) The most powerful muscles in the body are your legs, so the farther you can tilt back, the more force you can exert along the axis of the rope...and the anchorperson can tilt back the farthest.
2) The other reason is the ability to convert your strength into force on the rope. Friction holds your hand to the rope, and if you exceed the maximum sticking force (a function of the coefficient of static friction), your hand will slip along the rope. The anchorperson, though, is usually holding either a knotted end or can wrap the rope around his/her hand to be able to apply a direct force along the rope unconstrained by friction.
Also, as a rope is not a rigid body, doesn't the anchorperson keep the rope taut so that everyone's individual pulls get better translated to pulling the other half? If the strongest were in front, there's the case that the people in the back end up pulling the front guy's slack.
WHOAguitarninja
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Hitokage said:
Once they pull and it's taught it should make no difference. Unless they're so weak that they can't pull it to a near linear orientation then all the forces, as jinx said, will still be pulling parallel to the rope. I think jinx pretty much got it right that the benefit is having the strongest person able to wrap their hand around the end get a much stronger frictional force so that he won't let go. I can't forsee anything else really making much difference.
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