OldJadedGamer
Banned
But does prove a point that you can't guarantee sales on previous game pedigree alone like how people are treating Vita COD right now. All we have right now from COD on Vita, is a name.
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Poor Vita performance dragging down Sony's entire gaming unit
- Thread starter SmokedMeat
- Start date
But does prove a point that you can't guarantee sales on previous game pedigree alone like how people are treating Vita COD right now. All we have right now from COD on Vita, is a name.
Vice City Stories came out at a time when PSP software started to dramatically fall downwards. CTW is 2D, came out after the DS version AND came out after PSP software was dead in the US, so it was doomed from the get go.
I agree, read my previous posts in this thread regarding my opinions on that debate.
Jaded Alyx
Member
Sure. But is it not a 'real game'? Maybe you could help by defining what you consider a 'real game' to be?
That E3 showing was the big thing for me. I was ready to buy a Vita before that press conference convinced me not to. It's one thing not to have a huge library of games right away. Most consoles and handhelds take a while to build up a respectable library. It's another thing entirely to show hardly anything at the biggest North American video game trade show of the year.
Saint Gregory
Member
It's been a long time but IIRC in the NPD thread were CTW first months sales were discussed someone posted that the game had 800,000 dowloads from a single pirate rom site. So clearly people wanted to play the game they just didn't want to pay for it.
That's still pretty irrelevant to the discussion though because they key thing that Grayman kind of touched on is typically for these console experiences on the go to be successful they need some breathing room from home console releases.
Nintendo almost always does this (NSMB2 and NSMBWiiU is about to test this theory) and it's a big reason why I think console ports have struggled on the PSP/Vita.
Maybe if the only way to play CoD this year was on Vita then I'd agree with the people who believe that it's going to be a gamechanger for the system's future.
OldJadedGamer
Banned
Also, LCS hit on PS2 so people waited on VCS to be ported and play it on the big screen instead with a controller.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
sony as a whole or SCEA? isn't gamescom a SCEE thing? I'm really to bet that SCEE will support vita better at gamescom than SCEA did. Infact I'm willing to bet SCEE will be the one who shows cod vita gameplay which is way more than what SCEA did at e3. And SCEJ gave us gravity rush and I'm sure they will support vita at vita game heaven 2/ tgs as well.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
gamescom
OldJadedGamer
Banned
Oh, we are back to playing the "wait for" game? Last time gamers played the "wait for" game they were treated to what seemed like an hour of Wonderbook rather than new games for Vita.
vcs ps2 sold considerably less than the psp version. both sold worse on the ps2.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
full games with "depth" and plays with physical controls. Not some cheap unreal engine tech demo/ mini game.
Still a bit worrisome that not a single screenshot has been revealed, outside of a logo shot.
shinra-bansho
Member
I probably should have qualified it with in Western markets. The 3DS's success appears almost entirely driven by the Japanese market right now.
Y/Y for H1, 3DS shipments are down 0.4M, 3DS+NDS shipments are down 2.5M, all dedicated handhelds combined are down 3.8M.
Mentaiko_Allergy
Member
It's a shame the vita isn't doing better, it's pretty much everything I could ask for in a handheld hardware wise (two sticks, oled screen) , it just needs some more software. Sony definitely seem like they lack focus though (wonder book bullshit, no vita heaven 2). I look forward to tgs and gamescom to see if they can secure some more software.
The doomsayers are entitled to their opinion as are the people who say vita shouldnt exists. For me, its not like they are any better alternatives. I have a iPad and had a 3ds, neither of which I enjoyed gaming on. Doomsayers may be right, but for me it was a good mistake, I enjoy the hell out of mine.
The doomsayers are entitled to their opinion as are the people who say vita shouldnt exists. For me, its not like they are any better alternatives. I have a iPad and had a 3ds, neither of which I enjoyed gaming on. Doomsayers may be right, but for me it was a good mistake, I enjoy the hell out of mine.
SatelliteOfLove
Member
That and if doomsayers would make a half an effort to not DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM from the first week's Japanese sales.
Oh, and fucking games for the damn thing. Shocking idea, I know!
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
Cod vita is slated for gamescom I believe. They will be showing it unless you believe they will just show the logo again lol. AC3 liberation will also be playable at ubisofts booth. They will also be announcing 2 new games at least one of them will beva vita game. ( probably invizmals or kill zone. I heard guerilla was working in a vita game as well maybe they will show that.).
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
I thought Microsoft said they couldn't'? I remember hearing something about that.
Sony is not to be trusted, I knew that already when I got the system at launch.
What has Microsoft to do with CoD Vita?
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
lol I was like wtf? Its weird because the actual vita floor presence was really strong.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
exclusive deal with cod for e3 or something like that which is why it'll be shown at gamescom. We haven't even seem PC/ps3/Wii footage yet and we know those are coming.
H_Prestige
Banned
Sony is truly retarded if they had to learn this the hard way. Any idiot could tell that psp 2.0 wasn't going to fly in the west. Only chance it had was in Japan, and they didn't put any effort into getting strong japanese games. They kept focusing on ps3 "lite" games and trying to sell it to ps3 western gamers.
There is zero chance CoD Vita will be playable over 3G, so I have no idea what you're even talking about here.
And quoting a random Activision press release says nothing. Nobody is going to run out and buy a Vita to play CoD SP.
GoofsterStud
Member
Vita holding back Sony.
On one hand the Vita is getting publicity now.
On one hand the Vita is getting publicity now.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
Care to make a bet?
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
Around TGS. Its probably just going to be god eater 2 or a final fantasy type 0 so meh
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Since late 2010, XSeed Games has released 4 different Ys games (one of which was released on 2 platforms). They also have some Vita releases coming soon. It would be very surprising if the Ys Vita game didn't come out here.
The reason we haven't gotten the rest of the Trails in the Sky games is because they're more difficult to localize than your average RPG due to the huge scripts that need to be translated. Ys doesn't have that problem.
I'm willing to bet that an irrelevent/insignificantly amount of people will buy a Vita for CoD.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
Give me an estimate?
We will never really know the exact answer though, so it's a meaningless bet in the end. Throwing numbers around isn't easy, so the only thing I will give you is what I said in the previous post. An irrelevent/insignificantly amount of people will buy a $250 system for a game when they can buy the superior PS3/360/PC versions for $50/$60.
metalslimer
Member
Wtf, the entirety of it's Japanese sales is completely disastous. The thing has been out for 8 months and has sold like shit the entire time.
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
Last year's 3DS H1 included launch, it's going to be automatically inflated and you can expect the same for Vita next year. Q2 to Q2 3DS is up 1.15m though, 3DS is actually the only platform up YOY for the fiscal year.
Also, perhaps you missed this the first time I posted it?
After 8 NPDs
Super Mario 64 DS: 1,062,000
Super Mario 3D Land: 2,100,000
After 7 NPDs
Mario Kart DS: 998,000
Mario Kart 7: 1,750,000
After 16 NPDs
Nintendo DS: 5,310,000 (2 holidays)
Nintendo 3DS: 5,131,000 (1 holiday)
How does Vita compare to GCN launch aligned? That might make for a good comparison.
Mammoth Jones
Member
Does anyone with a Vita really believe that with just ONE holiday season Sony is going to unleash the killer hits we've all been waiting for that turns the Vita around and shows everyone that Sony had this brilliant ace up its sleeve the whole time?
I don't. And I own a Vita. And I love the hardware. I love the games I've seen so far but I'll be damned if Sony couldn't be doing so much more by now to really compete with the Vita. But instead they want to waste resources of friggin Wonderbook....
OldJadedGamer
Banned
You're still paying over $200 cause you need a memory card to boot games. I still think that is such a shady move that I hope only the Vita has and no other system in the future does as well.
Yeah, very true. I'm still really annoyed they removed the memory card from the AC3 Liberation bundle. Such a stupid move to use their annoying proprietary format instead of just using SD like the 3DS...
PopcornMegaphone
Banned
Good question. I don't have that data, but I hope someone does. At least the GCN was a profitable system, had killer Nintendo exclusives and there were comparable systems for multiplat titles.
Sony just readjusted Vita's sales forecast down to 8m, which is still a pretty rosy figure. Given Sony's financial shape and their lack of interest during E3 it is tough for me to see how Vita can continue as a viable platform. It seems to be the wrong system at the wrong time.
Funny how when talking about the games it needs or has coming, PS Smash isn't mentioned...
shinra-bansho
Member
I took H1 rather than CYQ2 because it included the craptacular CY11Q2 3DS shipment, that followed the launch overshipment in CY11Q1. Of course Q2/Q2 will be up considering how full the channel must have been.
This H1 included a new product launch, an NDS price drop and the 3DS at a significantly lower price.
Trailing 12-month shipment numbers for all dedicated handheld show a decline from 46M to 25M. For Nintendo handhelds only from 31M to 18M.
I don't know what Mario sales being faster are supposed to show really other than that Mario still sells well to a handheld installed base. I'm not sure how it's supposed to dispel the idea that the handheld market has declined since peaking at the height of the DS.
I used to be of the camp that continued to believe that the rise of smartphones, tablets and apps wouldn't seriously impact handhelds as well. Now I think they're set to not only impact handhelds but home consoles as well.
Probably because everyone who is interested in the game is picking up the PS3 version. Oh, sounds like what's going to happen with AC3:L and CoD.
Not really - respective store-fronts are drowning in quick cash-ins, and it devolved from 99cent stuff to psychological exploits worse then Facebook games (in last few months, one game that held the top spot for quite awhile on iTunes was a god damn slot-machine simulator - ie. you can't actually win any money on it - you CAN however SPEND real money on it, and people did).Jaded Alyx said:
Not to mention there's a general reduced standard of expectations among people using these devices for some reason - a friend was selling me on mobile DeadSpace, telling me how it's a proper DS experience on a phone. I'm still sorry I spent 60cents on that.
OldJadedGamer
Banned
Multiplatform games tend to be ignored.
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
Q1 shipments tend to be the lowest of the year thanks to holiday inventories, comparing a standard one to a product launch is inhenerently going to show a significantly negative result. You avoided a flawed comparison by making an even more flawed one, congratulations.
It shows a performance increase in leading software, and relative parity for hardware. It shows a western market that's not demonstrably becoming more niche, despite not prematurely hitting the absolute heights of DS (which seems an odd standard to suddenly set out of nowhere, where'd that come from?)
Really? Tell me, what are console YOY comparisons looking like?
My problem was more with your choice of terminology. You used the word "niche" to describe handhelds, when in fact the top selling gaming system for all of 2011 was the 3DS, and for 2012 will also be the 3DS. I'm having a hard time combining the dominant gaming system with the term "niche".
But then you went even further and used the term becoming "more niche" - indicating that you also think handhelds were "niche" in the previous generation as well. Except that the top gaming system for 2010 was the DS. The top gaming system for 2009 was the DS. The top gaming system for 2008 was the DS, etc., etc., etc.
Do you see why the term "niche" might not have been the term that you were looking for, unless you were referring to the entire gaming market (handhelds and consoles) as niche?
shinra-bansho
Member
I can see your point in taking issue with the word "niche" to describe a high selling product. Perhaps it wasn't the best word.
But I remain unconvinced that expansion of the audience that I think the NDS achieved - in particular women aged between 25-45 - will be sustained and that this audience hasn't in part shifted to other platforms.
And again with specificity towards Western markets, in terms of known sell-through the PS3 and 360 are currently selling better.
----
2007 15.26
2008 19.95
2009 14.93
2010 9.51
2011 11.08
2012 7.26
There's also TTM shipments already mentioned.
Otherwise perhaps you can suggest a better comparative timeframe.
Do you expect it to hit the heights of the NDS+PSP market size?
I'm not sure if you're trying to compare a market segment which just had two product launches with one that hasn't had one for 6 or 7 years.
But I remain unconvinced that expansion of the audience that I think the NDS achieved - in particular women aged between 25-45 - will be sustained and that this audience hasn't in part shifted to other platforms.
And again with specificity towards Western markets, in terms of known sell-through the PS3 and 360 are currently selling better.
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I'm not sure how it's more flawed to take H1 than to take Q2 alone. But if you're going to be pedantic then one can take H1'10 and still see total dedicated handheld shipments down over 2M units.
2007 15.26
2008 19.95
2009 14.93
2010 9.51
2011 11.08
2012 7.26
There's also TTM shipments already mentioned.
Otherwise perhaps you can suggest a better comparative timeframe.
Are you, as the user above is, taking issue with the use of the term "niche" or are you of the firm belief that the dedicated handheld market remains unaffected by the rise of smartphones, tablets, apps and Facebook as alternative platforms.
Do you expect it to hit the heights of the NDS+PSP market size?
Presumably down, I haven't yet looked, largely due to the Wii's rapid decline. TTM for the HD consoles has been largely unchanged for the last 5 years iirc.
I'm not sure if you're trying to compare a market segment which just had two product launches with one that hasn't had one for 6 or 7 years.
My experience with Vita has been unbelievable; what a wonderful piece of hardware.
Now, you would think with all the $100s of millions of dollars that Sony poured into R&D, manufacturing and marketing the unit that they would ALSO be putting all their might into post-launch support, but no. The E3 debacle made it clear that Sony has left Vita out to fend on its own, while funneling most of its technical resources into developing PS4 and marketing resources into promoting an end-of-generation PS3.
The Vita PSN store is a disgrace: PSP compatible titles are lacking and PSX support is still non-existent. And now, to top it off, Vita exclusives are being migrated over to PS3 and still no roadmap for big blockbuster exclusives (FF? GTA? GT?) has been conveyed to the buying public.
There was so much care and attention given to creating Vita, that it now seems baffling to witness how Sony is aggressively trying to kill it off by stripping it of the support that it desperately needs to survive and even thrive over the next 2-3 years.
Now, you would think with all the $100s of millions of dollars that Sony poured into R&D, manufacturing and marketing the unit that they would ALSO be putting all their might into post-launch support, but no. The E3 debacle made it clear that Sony has left Vita out to fend on its own, while funneling most of its technical resources into developing PS4 and marketing resources into promoting an end-of-generation PS3.
The Vita PSN store is a disgrace: PSP compatible titles are lacking and PSX support is still non-existent. And now, to top it off, Vita exclusives are being migrated over to PS3 and still no roadmap for big blockbuster exclusives (FF? GTA? GT?) has been conveyed to the buying public.
There was so much care and attention given to creating Vita, that it now seems baffling to witness how Sony is aggressively trying to kill it off by stripping it of the support that it desperately needs to survive and even thrive over the next 2-3 years.