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Poor Vita performance dragging down Sony's entire gaming unit

michaelius said:
Vita launched with Uncharted (3rd strongest IP Sony has) 2 lower tier IPs Sony has - HSG, Wipeout and 2 completly new IPs in form of Little Deviants and Reality fighters.

In next months they followed with Unit 13, Resistance and Gravity Daze.

And they will release also Sly , Smash clone and LBP all in first year on market.
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they really needed to show that they had everyone actually on board for it. even if it meant little ol' sucker punch doing the work for sly or some vita game instead of naughty dog doing the work for a vita game. why care about a handheld none of the bigger teams believe in?

although i think it says more about those teams than it does the vita, that games aren't coming out from their studios for the machine
 
michaelius said:
Vita launched with Uncharted (3rd strongest IP Sony has) 2 lower tier IPs Sony has - HSG, Wipeout and 2 completly new IPs in form of Little Deviants and Reality fighters.

In next months they followed with Unit 13, Resistance and Gravity Daze.

And they will release also Sly , Smash clone and LBP all in first year on market.
Click to expand...

Maybe this just proves that Sony's IPs simply aren't strong enough to sell a system?

As I've said a bunch of times in this very topic, Sony relies far too much on third parties to sell their systems, and they need to start developing franchises that can stand the test of time while also proving to have system-selling power.
 
Green Slime said:
Maybe this just proves that Sony's IPs simply aren't strong enough to sell a system?

As I've said a bunch of times in this very topic, Sony relies far too much on third parties to sell their systems, and they need to start developing franchises that can stand the test of time while also proving to have system-selling power.
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They're in the process of that, the other guy just summed up all the 1st party games they have for the Vita. You just shouldnt expect Sony to build the 2nd Mario or Monsta Hunta out of the blue, its trial and error at this stage.
 
Celine said:
Show me a VB advertisement that marketed the thing as a portable gaming machine.
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Someone posted a magazine scan ad for the VB. It had a guy at the top of a mountain playing the virtual boy. I think that's considered portable advertising.

edit: found it

oojSK.jpg
 
TurkishEmperor said:
They're in the process of that, the other guy just summed up all the 1st party games they have for the Vita. You just shouldnt expect Sony to build the 2nd Mario or Monsta Hunta out of the blue, its trial and error at this stage.
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No, they aren't. Part of the problem is that a lot of Sony's franchises and products feel very much "reactionary" to the market. It's almost like they feel the need to have a response to every single thing that becomes popular, instead of striking out to find the next big thing.

I really believe that what Sony should do is dump every single franchise they have, save for Uncharted, Ratchet, Gran Turismo, & God of War, and start from scratch coming up with fresh new IPs, some for mature audiences, and some for the younger audience, and attempt to use better marketing to ensure that these new franchises resonate with the market. All the effort in the world will not get Killzone or Resistance to be the next Halo or Gears of War.

The interesting thing is the sheer amount of talent Sony has at their disposal. If they manage to better utilize said talent moving forward, they can really do a lot to strengthen their first party status.
 
michaelius said:
Vita launched with Uncharted (3rd strongest IP Sony has) 2 lower tier IPs Sony has - HSG, Wipeout and 2 completly new IPs in form of Little Deviants and Reality fighters.

In next months they followed with Unit 13, Resistance and Gravity Daze.

And they will release also Sly , Smash clone and LBP all in first year on market.
Click to expand...

But they not strong handhold IP, a big film like game like Uncharted dont work well on a tiny pick up and play you get in handhold games.

Sony only strong handhold IP is LocoRoco and PATAPON That I can think off, and where is LocoRoco vita?
 
Dalthien said:
Yeah - they moved on to other stuff - ha ha... And if things revert back to a historically predominantly one-handheld marketplace - then a big part of the contraction will just be from the PSP anomaly being removed.

You have to realize just how much bigger the DS/PSP market was than any previous handheld market though. It wasn't a case of nice, steady growth from one gen to the next. It was a massive, earthquake-rendering explosion in total numbers. Those kinds of explosive booms have a funny tendency of then falling back to earth somewhat.
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You also have to consider how many people bought PSP's because of how easy they were to hack. No external purchases needed, just download a hacked firmware and you can run emulators and PSP games.

PSP was a system that appealed to tech-heads more than the DS did. If the PSV ever got hacked and it became widely known, you would see a surge in PSV sales.
 
michaelius said:
Vita launched with Uncharted (3rd strongest IP Sony has) 2 lower tier IPs Sony has - HSG, Wipeout and 2 completly new IPs in form of Little Deviants and Reality fighters.

In next months they followed with Unit 13, Resistance and Gravity Daze.

And they will release also Sly , Smash clone and LBP all in first year on market.
Click to expand...
Also, I really think Uncharted should have had multiplayer. 2 and 3 did, why not the Vita version.
 
shinra-bansho said:
Curious to see whether they're retaining the mid-20s to mid-40s females as a significant portion of sales.
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I don't think they've tried yet, there was no point chasing that market until the hardware was profitable. Wait for Layton/Training/Touch Generations software.
 
Robert at Zeboyd Games said:
Since late 2010, XSeed Games has released 4 different Ys games (one of which was released on 2 platforms). They also have some Vita releases coming soon. It would be very surprising if the Ys Vita game didn't come out here.

The reason we haven't gotten the rest of the Trails in the Sky games is because they're more difficult to localize than your average RPG due to the huge scripts that need to be translated. Ys doesn't have that problem.
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I thought the reason we didn't get the rest of the Legend of Heroes games is because the first Trails game didn't sell as well as expected.

I agree that Ys may be a different beast than the Legend of Heroes series, but you just don't localize as a company just because you did that on PSP. You also check if the platform, Vita in this case, is a viable platform to localize games for. I think we can agree that right now Vita isn't the most attractive platform.

Also, since Falcom may be expanding their games to non-Sony platforms who knows what'll happen with Ys? Maybe 3DS gets its own version, which may be far more attractive to localize instead of a Vita version.
 
I think it's good that Vita has struggled. With all the focus on specs I'm seeing for next gen consoles I serves as a lesson for MS and Sony. They can't just say "Here's big powerful machine, now buy it" More work has to be put into it. I know they are different markets but I think it applies.
 
7threst said:
Also, since Falcom may be expanding their games to non-Sony platforms who knows what'll happen with Ys? Maybe 3DS gets its own version, which may be far more attractive to localize instead of a Vita version.
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I suspect Ys and LoH will appear on 3DS soon enough, given that Falcom seems to have realized that Vita is a failed prospect.

The best part? Porting over their PSP games with some added bells and whistles to 3DS will likely be very beneficial to them in the West.
 
clemenx said:
I think it's good that Vita has struggled. With all the focus on specs I'm seeing for next gen consoles I serves as a lesson for MS and Sony. They can't just say "Here's big powerful machine, now buy it" More work has to be put into it. I know they are different markets but I think it applies.
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The thing is they didn't just say "Here's a powerful machine, buy it". The Vita had an amazing launch lineup, probably the best I've ever seen. There haven't been too many releases since, but the 3DS had the same problem. Vita needs a pricecut, but it was easier for Nintendo since I think they were already profiting at $250.
 
Green Slime said:
I suspect Ys and LoH will appear on 3DS soon enough, given that Falcom seems to have realized that Vita is a failed prospect.

The best part? Porting over their PSP games with some added bells and whistles to 3DS will likely be very beneficial to them in the West.
Click to expand...

If the other LoH games can make it to the west I'm willing to sacrifice the Vita.
 
whitehawk said:
The thing is they didn't just say "Here's a powerful machine, buy it". The Vita had an amazing launch lineup, probably the best I've ever seen. There haven't been too many releases since, but the 3DS had the same problem. Vita needs a pricecut, but it was easier for Nintendo since I think they were already profiting at $250.
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The problem with that launch lineup was three-fold:

1.) The Vita lineup was EXTREMELY front-loaded. Nothing was spread out, so it resulted in an extremely competitive launch, so overall titles sold less than they would have given some breathing room.

2.) The Vita, unlike the 3DS, had no system seller at launch or announced. Months before the 3DS launched, we knew that Mario Kart, Super Mario 3D, and an Ocarina of Time port / remake were in the works, and likely to release before the end of 2011. Plus, we had other big titles, like Animal Crossing and Paper Mario, announced and in the works for down the road.

3.) Vita's lineup dried up really fast after the launch, given point #1, but there was still a lot of content out at and around launch. Sony, however, failed to market any of it well, and even failed to market the Vita decently. How can you sell a system and it's games when consumers are unaware of their existence?
 
whitehawk said:
The thing is they didn't just say "Here's a powerful machine, buy it". The Vita had an amazing launch lineup, probably the best I've ever seen. There haven't been too many releases since, but the 3DS had the same problem. Vita needs a pricecut, but it was easier for Nintendo since I think they were already profiting at $250.
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And Nintendo also had a better spread of software, where you knew that a Mario Kart and other typical Nintendo evergreens would come out eventually. Both 3DS and Vita show that not only a good launch line-up is important, but also to make sure a steady stream of quality software is coming in the first year or so.

slaughterking said:
If the other LoH games can make it the west I'm willing to sacrifice the Vita.
Click to expand...

Took the words right out of my mouth haha!
 
I don't know, at this point you'd probably need something of a VERY high caliber to make sales explode, like say, FF VII remake or something entirely new that is made from the ground up for Vita and will get the hype machine going... Otherwise it's gonna be even tougher to keep it all up!
 
whitehawk said:
The thing is they didn't just say "Here's a powerful machine, buy it". The Vita had an amazing launch lineup, probably the best I've ever seen. There haven't been too many releases since, but the 3DS had the same problem. Vita needs a pricecut, but it was easier for Nintendo since I think they were already profiting at $250.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure if this is a price issue. At least in Europe we get really amazing deals all the time.
When I bought my Vita I got the WiFi Model instead of the regular 250€ for 230€ including a 8GB memory card and Uncharted and a 15€ coupon for an additional game.
If you buy a Vita now, you get the 3G version for 200€ including Fifa and this deal got even a TV ad and not the lame #gamechanger one :D
I don't think that's too expensive. People are probably just waiting for more games.
After the great launch lineup there were only very few interesting new releases and not much coming until later this year.
 
whitehawk said:
The thing is they didn't just say "Here's a powerful machine, buy it". The Vita had an amazing launch lineup, probably the best I've ever seen. There haven't been too many releases since, but the 3DS had the same problem. Vita needs a pricecut, but it was easier for Nintendo since I think they were already profiting at $250.
Click to expand...

Cutting the price by $50 won't do anything. It needs attractive software, but sadly there doesn't seem to be much on the horizon from either third or first parties. We should be seeing games that have been in the works for 18+ months, ready to launch Holiday 2012, but we've got almost nothing. There just isn't any interest from developers or publishers in the platform. Slashing the price won't change that. You can already get the machine for far less than the launch RRP yet people are not biting.

The Vita after 6 months is where the GameCube was after 3 years in terms of mindshare. Nobody cares.
 
Celine said:
Show me a VB advertisement that marketed the thing as a portable gaming machine.
Click to expand...

I guess you weren't around back then? Yeah, it was a PORTABLE gaming machine. You could set it up wherever you wanted and play, without being tethered to a TV. It was the VirtualBOY.

But think whatever you want, or maybe what some Nintendo fansite written by someone who grew up playing Gamecube says. I have nothing to prove to some random message board person that apparently must think it was a console.
 
Green Slime said:
The problem with that launch lineup was three-fold:

1.) The Vita lineup was EXTREMELY front-loaded. Nothing was spread out, so it resulted in an extremely competitive launch, so overall titles sold less than they would have given some breathing room.
Click to expand...

Yes

2.) The Vita, unlike the 3DS, had no system seller at launch or announced. Months before the 3DS launched, we knew that Mario Kart, Super Mario 3D, and an Ocarina of Time port / remake were in the works, and likely to release before the end of 2011. Plus, we had other big titles, like Animal Crossing and Paper Mario, announced and in the works for down the road.
Click to expand...

Yes probably Sony wanted to avoid stigma of company which annouces games and then you have to wait years for them but still - no annoucement for GoW and GT is stupid.

3.) Vita's lineup dried up really fast after the launch, given point #1, but there was still a lot of content out at and around launch. Sony, however, failed to market any of it well, and even failed to market the Vita decently. How can you sell a system and it's games when consumers are unaware of their existence?
Click to expand...

End of year lineup looks decent.
 
Ushojax said:
Cutting the price by $50 won't do anything. It needs attractive software, but sadly there doesn't seem to be much on the horizon from either third or first parties. We should be seeing games that have been in the works for 18+ months, ready to launch Holiday 2012, but we've got almost nothing. There just isn't any interest from developers or publishers in the platform. Slashing the price won't change that. You can already get the machine for far less than the launch RRP yet people are not biting.

The Vita after 6 months is where the GameCube was after 3 years in terms of mindshare. Nobody cares.
Click to expand...
I think Sony knows this too so they're just riding it out and getting sales while they can before moving on. They've done nothing to suggest they're putting much support behind it at all.
 
Green Slime said:
No, they aren't. Part of the problem is that a lot of Sony's franchises and products feel very much "reactionary" to the market. It's almost like they feel the need to have a response to every single thing that becomes popular, instead of striking out to find the next big thing.
Click to expand...

What?! Please tell me how games like Parappa, Amplitude, War of the Monsters, Uncharted, God of War, Gravity Rush, etc are "reactionary" to the market?

Oh wait they're knocking Smash Brothers so they're reactionary right? Never mind everything else.
 
michaelius said:
End of year lineup looks decent.
Click to expand...

The problem with that is that the 3DS's end of year lineup looks better, the 3DS XL and Wii U will be getting a LOT of marketing, and Sony has still yet to find a way to market the Vita well.

If they fix that last problem, it honestly won't be so bad for them, since the games they already have are so strong and the decent lineup will be helpful.

ShinUltramanJ said:
What?! Please tell me how games like Parappa, Amplitude, War of the Monsters, Uncharted, God of War, Gravity Rush, etc are "reactionary" to the market?

Oh wait they're knocking Smash Brothers so they're reactionary right? Never mind everything else.
Click to expand...

1.) A lot of those games didn't sell well.

2.) Uncharted was a reaction to Gears of War, God of War was a reaction to Devil May Cry. I'm not saying they're clones, but they definitely borrowed from said popular games at the height of their popularity and hype.
 
Nothing in the launch lineup smelled particularly fresh. It was a large list of franchise sequels that didn't gain anything from going portable, certainly nothing that would sell people on a fairly expensive new system.
 
herod said:
Nothing in the launch lineup smelled particularly fresh. It was a large list of franchise sequels that didn't gain anything from going portable, certainly nothing that would sell people on a fairly expensive new system.
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Compared to the 3DS' craptacular lineup it was pretty damn impressive. Certainly sold me on the system.
 
ShinUltramanJ said:
What?! Please tell me how games like Parappa, Amplitude, War of the Monsters, Uncharted, God of War, Gravity Rush, etc are "reactionary" to the market?

Oh wait they're knocking Smash Brothers so they're reactionary right? Never mind everything else.
Click to expand...

Sure, Sony has made lots of original games and still do. But stuff like Uncharted, God of War, Killzone, Sports Champions, Playstation All-Stars, The Getaway, LBP Karting, etc are pretty clear reactions to games like Tomb Raider, DMC, Halo, Wii Sports, Smash, GTA, Mario Kart and so on.

julls said:
Compared to the 3DS' craptacular lineup it was pretty damn impressive. Certainly sold me on the system.
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Clearly it wasn't impressive enough as hardly anybody bought the console. I did and own 4 games, 3 of which are from launch. I don't think I'll buy another one for some time. It's a shame because the hardware is great but the golden rule is 'software sells hardware'. Sony still hasn't learned that lesson, even after Nintendo got a beatdown from the market when they forgot the rule for the 3DS launch.
 
julls said:
Eh? I'm comparing them at their respective launches. Even comparing Vita at launch to what was out on the 3DS at the time it was better. IMO, of course.
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That's great for you, but going by their current situation, it would seem that most people disagree.
 
julls said:
I was responding to you claiming the launch lineup was subpar, actually. Its launch lineup was good. The followup has been a disaster.
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If the launch lineup was so good, why didn't it sell better at launch? Why couldn't it even match 3DS launch sales?
 
Green Slime said:
That's great for you, but going by their current situation, it would seem that most people disagree.
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Won't disagree there - while I think the launch was strong, they've dropped the ball horribly. It's infuriating. I thought it had OK sales though, when it came out?

I've gone from being a supporter of the system to thinking it'll be abandoned after a year or two.
 
Green Slime said:
If the launch lineup was so good, why didn't it sell better at launch? Why couldn't it even match 3DS launch sales?
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I don't know how much the launch software of the 3DS sold but buying a Nintendo handheld is completely different from buying a Sony one.

People know there will be a Mario game, there'll be Mario Kart and Zelda, and that Nintendo uses their best people to produce handheld software. Sony usually makes their b-studios develop games for handhelds and you're not exactly sure what you're going to get.
 
julls said:
Won't disagree there - while I think the launch was strong, they've dropped the ball horribly. It's infuriating. I thought it had OK sales though, when it came out?
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Launch sales are almost always good for any platform, since the hardcore gamers and tech enthusiasts jump in early. Still, even given that, it couldn't match 3DS launch sales in any territory.
 
julls said:
Won't disagree there - while I think the launch was strong, they've dropped the ball horribly. It's infuriating. I thought it had OK sales though, when it came out?
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In the UK: Vita shifted "around one quarter" of the 185,000 PSPs sold during the older handheld's first week on sale back in September 2005.

The PSP blasted out of the gate though.

"Launch week UK Vita sales came in at 'just over half' the 89,000 3DS units sold by Nintendo during its first week of availability in March 2011"

Not too good. I didn't follow other territories.
 
Green Slime said:
Launch sales are almost always good for any platform, since the hardcore gamers and tech enthusiasts jump in early. Still, even given that, it couldn't match 3DS launch sales in any territory.
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Ah, shame. So much potential. I still agree with another poster here who claimed SCEA are just ignoring the system at this point.

For the record, I only mentioned the 3DS launch because they did so much to turn the system around after a slow opening and Sony,despite a nice varied launch lineup have seemingly done nothing.
 
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