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Project CARS (crowdsourcing) racing sim by Slightly Mad Studios (fully funded 3.75M)

Alex Riveiro

Member
Jan 15, 2014
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320
iRacing setting the gold standard in ice skating simulators!

This is 2 weeks from release and apparently the latest 'day one' build. Are you telling us porkies? :/

EDIT: I just realized I totally misread this sentence. The latest day one build is a week old. So I'm guessing it's the build this guy used for the video. But I don't know what exactly is he doing in the Lotus race.

The AI does go wide in the first corners of the first lap of a race, but that's pretty much it. They certainly do not crash against each other in the straights in Spa, and even at 100% they make mistakes at the back of the pack (but they are quick and tidy at the front).

The pit exit in Spa has always been problematic though, I haven't checked it with the Lotus (the Formula A just does a reaaaally sharp turn that looks a bit unnatural).
 

Azzawon

Member
May 19, 2014
1,746
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Scunthorpe, UK
No, instead every post will be made by Maldonado.

 

Azzawon

Member
May 19, 2014
1,746
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0
Scunthorpe, UK
I've almost asked this a few times from 'insiders' but have resisted until now. Aw... what the hell: based on the latest build, what review score do you think pCARS will meta?

I'm no reviewer, but I think the sheer amount of content alone will give this game a decent score. There's a few features in it which will feel like a breath of fresh air for a broader target market, too (visual effects customisation, tuning, full weekend simulation etc.) as you'd maybe only expect to find some of these things in a proper sim. Obviously graphics wise it looks great too.

From my perspective I think
/hope
it will score between 8s and 9s, as this has been something I've watched come together for a few years now and SMS deserve to reap the rewards.
 

Scaramanger

Member
Oct 20, 2013
630
0
395
UK
I've almost asked this a few times from 'insiders' but have resisted until now. Aw... what the hell: based on the latest build, what review score do you think pCARS will meta?

I have absolutely no idea TBH! Conventional wisdom is that sim racers rate poorly but on the other hand pretty graphics get a plus (tons of people seem to buy driving games for 'shiny' only!).

I guess I can summarise: -

iRacing players - its too easy the cars have tyres that can sometimes grip therefore its not hardcore enough.

Graphics whores - water droplets, Driveclub, 2D tree, Driveclub, add infinitum

Forza/GT players - some cars are really tough to drive.

People like me - despite a few minor issues its as close to perfect a racing game as i've seen for a long time. Eclectic car and track selection, great physics, great graphics/sound
 

Megasoum

Banned
Aug 27, 2009
20,141
0
0
Montréal
Cue in the PCARS defense force about day 1 update and almost quite not definite final code. I will only judge the game on release, but I feel like I cant trust the hype and praise due to the conflict of interest from the people who want this to succeed no matter what due to their donations and the constant denial of any issue as nothing more than not the final golden code.

Sigh...

I'm sure there's people like that (well... by looking at WMD I know there is lol) but for what it's worth, I haven't seen any of those here on GAF. I don't care about the ROI... I paid 65$ 4 years ago to basically pre-order the game... If I make a couple of bucks back then great but I'm not actually expecting getting anything significant... This is a non factor for me.

As far as our opinion goes, some of us have been playing hundreds of hours of the game over the last 4 years. We saw it go from something kinda terrible and extremely rough to something that is genuinly great. It's not perfect by any means but I still think it's one of the best sim to come out in YEARS. At the end of the day that's MY opinion.... It's as valid as that other guy's opinion.
 

Mascot

Member
Aug 9, 2009
13,181
4
940
UK
I have absolutely no idea TBH! Conventional wisdom is that sim racers rate poorly but on the other hand pretty graphics get a plus (tons of people seem to by driving games for 'shiny' only!).

I can see it losing a few points because of the 'meagre' (lol) number of cars compared to Forza/GT.

I hope it gets reviewed by suitable people and not by those who obviously have no clue about (and even less interest in) driving games or sims in general.
 

danowat

Banned
Aug 30, 2014
13,908
554
665
what review score do you think pCARS will meta?

I reckon this isn't a very mainstream title, and as such it wouldn't surprise me, on the consoles at least, to be lower than 70, but I reckon there will be some segregation between the PS4 and XO versions so.

PS4: 74

XO: 71

that's not to say that it deserves the scores, I reckon it could be widely misrepresented in the mainstream media.
 

JamboGT

Member
Jan 10, 2013
1,551
0
0
I will treat reviews of this like I treat the reviews of all racing games.

by ignoring them till i try it for myself. The majority of games reviewers seem unable to play racing games.

(there are a few I can listen to, but even then many times with sims/driving games it is a personal feeling with the handling.)
 

Spookie

Member
Oct 17, 2009
6,504
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0
35
Wirral, UK
Maybe this dude can detect things that VVV Alan can't because he carefully. treats. every. single. word. as. a. separate. sentence, thus freeing up brain power to observe things that mere mortals cannot.

People have a genuine hard on for Project CARS in some sim racing circles. It's hard to parse the hyperbolic horse shit from genuine things to be conserned about. I normaly wouldn't post it, but the crashes on turn one of Spa got me frowning.

Still I hate anything above Formula 3000 so it might not effect me. :D
 

Foshy

Member
May 6, 2012
6,478
0
620
Zurich, Switzerland
I will treat reviews of this like I treat the reviews of all racing games.

by ignoring them till i try it for myself. The majority of games reviewers seem unable to play racing games.

(there are a few I can listen to, but even then man times with sims/driving games it is a personal feeling with the handling.)
Yeah, I completely agree.
 

David Ricardo

Member
Sep 25, 2008
1,361
939
1,105
Gijon, Spain
I am looking at the limited edition content and I'm a bit confused. There are 5 exclusive cars, but are this cars impossible to unlock in the standard version or is it like in driveclub where the limited edition cars were just exclusive paintjobs for cars that could be unlocked just by playing the standard version of the game?
 

Alex Riveiro

Member
Jan 15, 2014
377
0
320
People have a genuine hard on for Project CARS in some sim racing circles. It's hard to parse the hyperbolic horse shit from genuine things to be conserned about. I normaly wouldn't post it, but the crashes on turn one of Spa got me frowning.

Still I hate anything above Formula 3000 so it might not effect me. :D

If by Turn 1 you mean Eau Rouge, you need to be careful if you start at the back of the pack. It's not so much crashes (which rarely happen, and I have doubts the video was recorded with 100% AI), but cars going wide to avoid colisions, so it's easy to bump into the cars ahead if you are reckless.
 

cackhyena

Member
Aug 7, 2010
13,467
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www.jeffreykoch.net
I just wanna know how the XB1 version runs. Certain sounds like that guy talks about means jack shit to me. I don't know what a lot of these cars sound like irl, and I don't care. If the sound isn't off by some weird measure, it'll be fine. AI...eh, I don't play racing games often, but I don't see anything truly out of the ordinary. Anything he's shown has been worse than all the footage (a hell of a lot) I've seen that VVV has put out. It looks good enough and I hope it handles well enough on controller...XB1 controller. All I need to know otherwise is if there are bad frame drops or something. Kinda worried with the lack of XB1 anything.
 

Scaramanger

Member
Oct 20, 2013
630
0
395
UK
Sigh...

I'm sure there's people like that (well... by looking at WMD I know there is lol) but for what it's worth, I haven't seen any of those here on GAF. I don't care about the ROI... I paid 65$ 4 years ago to basically pre-order the game... If I make a couple of bucks back then great but I'm not actually expecting getting anything significant... This is a non factor for me.

As far as our opinion goes, some of us have been playing hundreds of hours of the game over the last 4 years. We saw it go from something kinda terrible and extremely rough to something that is genuinly great. It's not perfect by any means but I still think it's one of the best sim to come out in YEARS. At the end of the day that's MY opinion.... It's as valid as that other guy's opinion.

Exactly, well said. Any ROI I will make has already been ploughed back in to multiple copies of the game (PC LE edition - want the book, and PS4 where my pals will soon to be going to race).

I love it, its as close to my perfect racing game that I have seen in literally years. I don't care if it gets a 1/10 meteoritic average that opinion won't change
 

soundscream

Member
Aug 23, 2009
17,217
14
735
I just wanna know how the XB1 version runs. Certain sounds like that guy talks about means jack shit to me. I don't know what a lot of these cars sound like irl, and I don't care. If the sound isn't off by some weird measure, it'll be fine. AI...eh, I don't play racing games often, but I don't see anything truly out of the ordinary. Anything he's shown has been worse than all the footage (a hell of a lot) I've seen that VVV has put out. It looks good enough and I hope it handles well enough on controller...XB1 controller. All I need to know otherwise is if there are bad frame drops or something. Kinda worried with the lack of XB1 anything.

Brandi Namco is streaming the XB1 version in 30min
 

Alex Riveiro

Member
Jan 15, 2014
377
0
320
Exactly, well said. Any ROI I will make has already been ploughed back in to multiple copies of the game (PC LE edition - want the book, and PS4 where my pals will soon to be going to race).

I love it, its as close to my perfect racing game that I have seen in literally years. I don't care if it gets a 1/10 meteoritic average that opinion won't change

I'm in the same boat tbh. It's the only game where I actually feel like I can disable the assists and eventually learn to keep the car under control, as well as understand why I did spin out (I remember trying the Formula 1 in rFactor 2 quite some time ago, and the damn thing would spin even with the slightest turn).
 

Scaramanger

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Oct 20, 2013
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UK
It's the only game where I actually feel like I can disable the assists and eventually learn to keep the car under control, as well as understand why I did spin out (I remember trying the Formula 1 in rFactor 2 quite some time ago, and the damn thing would spin even with the slightest turn).

Its very good at that IMO.

On another point that keeps getting discussed, with the AI I find that they can be slow to get away at the start, especially with big fields so you have to wary of piling into the back of the car in front if you start near the back. But mostly I find them good as long as you race like a racing driver. If you put your car where you would in real life then generally they are great and will avoid you but keep you under pressure and take you when they can. If your weaving about all over the place in a totally unpredictable way then they will hit you, simple! They are running the same physics as the player car, if you can't stop in 6 yards neither can they!

I've had some really great, tense races against the AI. 15 laps of swapping places with one AI (renault clio's at donning ton) being a particular highlight!
 

fresquito

Member
Apr 22, 2005
9,269
0
0
lfoclub.com
There's no denying that Project CARS still needs work in certain areas, AI being one of them. The issue here is mostly related to some combos not working perfectly fine (some turns being difficult for the AI in some cars). Then there're some genuine problems that arise from damaged cars. When there're too many the Ai can get a bit crazy at times trying to overtake them.

That said, people make a bit too much fuss about it. 100% videos I've seen from people criticising the AI would've be banned from my clan if they ran like that online. They drive like dicks, then complain about the Ai being this or that.

From my experience, if you treat the AI like you'd treat a human racer, you will have a good experience. Yes, you will have to deal with some oddities here and there, but so you will have to bear the same burden when you play online too.

Then again, tell me about driving games with good AI.
 

Lego Boss

Member
Aug 15, 2013
2,468
13
460
I reckon this isn't a very mainstream title, and as such it wouldn't surprise me, on the consoles at least, to be lower than 70, but I reckon there will be some segregation between the PS4 and XO versions so.

PS4: 74

XO: 71

that's not to say that it deserves the scores, I reckon it could be widely misrepresented in the mainstream media.

I reckon UK press (EG, EDGE, GAMES TM) will back this. New IP by an indie studio on the big consoles, ambitious and pretty good (hopefully) at the things it portends to do, I reckon it might be charting low 80s.

If it's as good as VVV make it out to be then I'll go mid-80s.

Come on, everyone, let's try to be positive, if for nothing else than it's basically taking on console manufacturers (first party productions) at their own game.
 

cutmeamango

Banned
Apr 11, 2011
4,447
0
0
Then again, tell me about driving games with good AI.

Proper AI behavior is already hard.
Then you reduce the race to 3/5 laps with the expectation of having the player be capable to win. When even sim racers (and hey, some real racers too, not that there isn't an overlap) don't even have a "proper driving etiquette", that only amounts to most/all AIs being considered shit.

If events took 20-30 laps, and you had a reasonable expectation of 'performance' (Bottas getting 5th place starting at 8th in the grid), then you could have AI that 'races', and players that wouldn't try to butt their position at every corner with similar performing cars.
 

JamboGT

Member
Jan 10, 2013
1,551
0
0
AI is really tough, doing NASCAR we had 43 cars running within tenths at 150 to 200 mph most of the time, getting that was amazing and then anything on top was better.

Not really a fan of how FM 5 AI interact with the player, never mind how erratic they could be. Shift 2... I don't think I played that game enough to get an appreciation of the AI to be honest. They seemed to be pretty erratic as well.
 

sourc3d

Member
Feb 20, 2012
100
0
0
A lot of that guys crticisms about the AI in the video stem from the fact that they go offline, cut corners, hit trackside objects, and most if not all of this stems from the AI making genuine mistakes or avoiding other AI, not from being dumb. I think too many people have become accustomed to GT/Forzas processional AI cars, or Driveclubs Banzaii AI.

The only thing I've really seen them mess up with is large grid rolling starts, but that was on an old build. In general racing they are some of the best opponents outside of multiplayer, they can feel the pressure just as much as you can during a race and can be forced into a mistake.

Honestly until you drive it you cannot underestimate how human the AI can feel during races.
 

danowat

Banned
Aug 30, 2014
13,908
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Not going to be able to watch much of the stream, I am hoping to hear some of you guys impressions of it from the stream.
 

Azzawon

Member
May 19, 2014
1,746
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0
Scunthorpe, UK
Not going to be able to watch much of the stream, I am hoping to hear some of you guys impressions of it from the stream.

Hard to tell how the game performs on XB1 from the stream but it looks pretty smooth. A lot of people asking questions about what isn't in the game rather than what is haha!
 

fresquito

Member
Apr 22, 2005
9,269
0
0
lfoclub.com
Honestly until you drive it you cannot underestimate how human the AI can feel during races.
I spent most of my time with this game doing MP. We're a clan that puts all its effort in doing clean races. We don't have not one single member without basic racing manners. yet we have to deal with all kinds of crashing reviews. Racing, by nature, is a bit crazy. People are used to F1, but racing is so much more in your face than F1 is. I'm all for clean racing, but having a perfectly clean AI is unrelastic.

That said, the AI in this game is both ugly and marvellous. It all depends on the lap you're doing. First lap and half second? Yeah, it can get pretty ugly when there're 15 cars 100 meters. But like you said, when you're one on one, they feel pretty natural to me (except for some odd braking points). But you can't seriously expect to advance 8 cars before the first turn without having any consequence. It's unrealsitic.

I've just read about the LFS comparision. The other day I popped that old bitch because my internet was down and, good God, it has aged. I used to think LFS had the best FFB, and a great car feeling. Well, I can say without a shred of doubt that Project CARS is the new standard for me. The cars feel a lot more dead than I could remember. There's a kind of disconnect between you and the car. I used to think you'd feel everything, but you don't. And many of the things that you actually feel are somehow baked. They don't feel as progressive and organic as they do in Project CARS. Only thing I like better about LFS' FFB is that the cars feel like they have more weight. In Project CARS you don't really feel like you're driving a heavy machine. I don't know what you should feel, but going with my experience with street cars, I'd say LFS does this better. Everything else, Project CARS is so much better.

I literally couldn't believe myself when I went back to LFS that I would be so underwhelmed by the FFB.