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[lowrider007]

No, you're right... pirates almost never use rar files with maximum compression set.

Practically any file I've downloaded in the form of a rar file has never really been of a considerable smaller size tbh.

And looking at the 360 games that are on most torrent sites they all seem to be full size, why don't they rar them down to a quarter of the size ?

As for game sizes, google PS3 game dump size and you'll get an idea.

Cheers I will do.

 

[Rich!]

I'm actually all for full access to the Cell and associated RAM and shit for use with PS3 linux. Would be a nice temporary computer while I'm waiting to get my new PC together. Yellow Dog Linux PS3 is nice enough as it is, but it's just too damn slow.

Obviously, things wouldnt be progressing that far for a long, long while yet.

 

[yurinka]

You see this is side of it that I think is questionable, isn't the data in some of these games duplicated and spread across the disc to make it easier for the BD drive to access the data quicker thus making the size of the games a lot larger?

I didn't know, but these would mean in the future their disk image would be smaller than their size in disk. And would load faster, since it would be loaded from HDD.

I this is true, does that mean Linux can have full access to the hardware now?

No. But it would help to have it in the future after a lot of work he still has to do. He opened the main door, but still have more to open.

 

[Psychotext]

Practically any file I've downloaded in the form of a rar file has never really been of a considerable smaller size tbh.

If you're talking about videos... they wont be as they're already compressed to start with. If you're talking about software, they very much will be.

No-one is talking about a quarter of the size, but unless they're compressed massively on the PS3 disc already, you would be able to get a chunk more compression out of them.

 

[JADS]

You see this is side of it that I think is questionable, isn't the data in some of these games duplicated and spread across the disc to make it easier for the BD drive to access the data quicker thus making the size of the games a lot larger?

And to 'OldJadedGamer', who ever downloaded a full CD ? people are mostly downloading MP3's, that isn't the same thing as downloading a full uncompressed audio CD, I doubt we're going to start seeing compressed PS3 games to download, I honestly don't see piracy becoming a big concern on the PS3 if it ever becomes possible.

Why would you download a full uncompressed audio CD when you have FLAC? Besides, I have seen a quite a few .wav files floating around on usenet.

 

[lowrider007]

If you're talking about videos... they wont be as they're already compressed to start with. If you're talking about software, they very much will be.

No-one is talking about a quarter of the size, but unless they're compressed massively on the PS3 disc already, you would be able to get a chunk more compression out of them.

And 360 iso's? why are they not compressed?, you look on practically any torrent site and they are full size?, I really doubt your going to get much of a compression ratio on them tbh if any.

Why would you download a full uncompressed audio CD when you have FLAC? Besides, I have seen a quite a few .wav files floating around on usenet.

When I said uncompressed Audio CD I meant any compressed audio format including flac, either way piracy of uncompressed audio is a grain of sound compared to mp3.

 

[Psychotext]

And 360 iso's? why are they not compressed?, you look on practically any torrent site and they are full size?, I really doubt your going to get much of a compression ratio on them tbh if any.

I've never downloaded one, but I'll happily rip one of my own discs and see the sort of compression I can get out of the files. But the answer in terms of the 360 will likely be fairly obvious... they'll already be doing a chunk of compression to get it to fit in the first place.

Edit - Actually, crap. I can't do that because it appears I'd need a modded box.

It's aside from the point anyway really. As already stated, most PS3 games come in at no-where near 25gb (again, see the dump sizes for existing games) and with modern internet connections even a 25gb file would only be a night of downloading (which is the best time to download anyway as its when most ISPs don't traffic manage your connection).

 

[klee123]

Well, I wouldn't be surprised if SCE is already in a world of shit right now. The last thing they want is the PS3 to be another PSP in terms of the software situation.

 

[lowrider007]

I've never downloaded one, but I'll happily rip one of my own discs and see the sort of compression I can get out of the files. But the answer in terms of the 360 will likely be fairly obvious... they'll already be doing a chunk of compression to get it to fit in the first place.

Edit - Actually, crap. I can't do that because it appears I'd need a modded box.

I've never downloaded one either, but it's not hard to check the file size of them on certain sites, end of the day they are being pirated at full size, or at least very close to it.

It's aside from the point anyway really. As already stated, most PS3 games come in at no-where near 25gb (again, see the dump sizes for existing games) and with modern internet connections even a 25gb file would only be a night of downloading (which is the best time to download anyway as its when most ISPs don't traffic manage your connection).

Yes I suppose your right on that account and I've checked the dump sizes, interesting stuff, still I can't feeling dubious about it all though.

 

[Haunted]

waaaiiiit wait wait.

wait a second here.


doom_bringer is back?

Spoiler

I thought just tray was his alt account.

edit: also, 10MB/s is not a "standard connection", that's pretty damn beefy. Not a lot of countries who even have the necessary infrastructure to offer that kind of service on a large scale.

dump sizes seem to be significantly lower once all the padding is removed, so it's a moot point anyway.

 

[JADS]

And 360 iso's? why are they not compressed?, you look on practically any torrent site and they are full size?, I really doubt your going to get much of a compression ratio on them tbh if any.



When I said uncompressed Audio CD I meant any compressed audio format including flac, either way piracy of uncompressed audio is a grain of sound compared to mp3.

People will still freeload PS3 games if they get the chance. They where doing it with DVD's and they will do it with PS3 games. Downloading a full size PS3 game just takes a little more time than the average download, but something as simple as that will not stop pirates. Just have a look at multiple torrents for games as GTA4 and Mass Effect. Both are around 15 GB according to steam, witch is close to the average size of a PS3 game. Yet, both of these games where pirated to hell and back.

 

[Psychotext]

edit: also, 10MB/s is not a "standard connection", that's pretty damn beefy. Not a lot of countries who even have the necessary infrastructure to offer that kind of service on a large scale.

True... but then for those countries there's always the old fashioned market stall full of discs.

 

[lowrider007]

waaaiiiit wait wait.

wait a second here.


doom_bringer is back?

Spoiler

I thought just tray was his alt account.

edit: also, 10MBit is not a "standard connection", that's pretty damn beefy. Not a lot of countries who even have the necessary infrastructure to offer that kind of service on a large scale.

And lets not be forgetting about bandwidth caps, most people I know around here are capped between 40-100gb, I can't even download all my purchased steam games until next month :-(

People will still freeload PS3 games if they get the chance. They where doing it with DVD's and they will do it with PS3 games. Downloading a full size PS3 game just takes a little more time than the average download, but something as simple as that will not stop pirates. Just have a look at multiple torrents for games as GTA4 and Mass Effect. Both are around 15 GB according to steam, witch is close to the average size of a PS3 game. Yet, both of these games where pirated to hell and back.

Oh I'm under no illusion that people wouldn't pirate them, but to what extent is all, I don't see it becoming a big concern for software developers on the PS3 platform, maybe I'll be wrong.

 

[Haunted]

And lets not be forgetting about bandwidth caps.

True.

True... but then for those countries there's always the old fashioned market stall full of discs.

Also true.

Parts of Asia and South America, where most households just don't have that kind of bandwidth, rely heavily on illegal street vendors and the like.

 

[°°ToMmY°°]

Funny how the increased sales of PS3 has coincided with the uncrackable beast being suddenly crackable. It's almost like it now worthwhile doing by someone who can benefit and has a bit of skill in the area.

the guy said he's been working on it for more than a year and a half.

 

[JADS]

And lets not be forgetting about bandwidth caps.




Oh I'm under no illusion that people wouldn't pirate them, but to what extent is all, I don't see it becoming a big concern for software developers, maybe I'll be wrong.

Lets hope that you aren't. I would hate to see the PS3 go the way of the PSP, NDS or Wii.

 

[Eccocid]

there wont be mininal piracy due to large blu ray downloads.
In countries like Turkey lets say(where i live) ppl doesnt download games they just go and buy from street vendors. Why wait for days or weeks to finish a dl where u can get the pirated copy for 3 bucks?

That would be same for ps3 i guess. They will start to sell the pirated games on streets for like 5 bucks where the original costs like 150 bucks in Turkey.

 

[AzureNightmare]

And lets not be forgetting about bandwidth caps, most people I know around here are capped between 40-100gb, I can't even download all my purchased steam games until next month :-(

Most broadband ISPs in the US don't have bandwidth limits...to my knowledge. I for certain know that I do not have a monthly bandwidth cap.

 

[Eccocid]

btw can he blackmail Sony? lol like " pay me over 9000 bucks or else i will release the hack to public!" haha would that work? Its a coporate life at the end of the day no one is innocent

 

[carlosp]

there wont be mininal piracy due to large blu ray downloads.
In countries like Turkey lets say(where i live) ppl doesnt download games they just go and buy from street vendors. Why wait for days or weeks to finish a dl where u can get the pirated copy for 3 bucks?

That would be same for ps3 i guess. They will start to sell the pirated games on streets for like 5 bucks where the original costs like 150 bucks in Turkey.

And in country like yours, what do you think how many PS3s have already be sold? 100k LTD? I dont even think so. The largest markets for the PS3 are mainland europe (UK as well of course), Japan and USA while for PS2 south america and asia were big markets as well. I dont think people in Japan or EU will completly stop buying software and hack their ps3s for the reasons i said before. Besides we are still talking about a potentiality and not about actuality. Who knows if there ever be a backup loader and how Sony will fight it.

 

[wud]

Most broadband ISPs in the US don't have bandwidth limits...to my knowledge. I for certain know that I do not have a monthly bandwidth cap.

fair use policy

 

[Psychotext]

btw can he blackmail Sony? lol like " pay me over 9000 bucks or else i will release the hack to public!" haha would that work? Its a coporate life at the end of the day no one is innocent

Sure he can, if he wants to go to jail.

What's more likely is that on reading this Sony will offer him an extremely well paid job.

 

[lowrider007]

Most broadband ISPs in the US don't have bandwidth limits...to my knowledge. I for certain know that I do not have a monthly bandwidth cap.

Really? I guess it must be different for you guys, over here in the UK loads of popular BB ISP's offer unlimited services but checking the T&C's your see that they are capped, My mum has an 'unlimited' BB package but it's capped to 40gb a month which is a disgrace I think, how unearth they can call that 'unlimited' god knows.

 

[Eccocid]

And in country like yours, what do you think how many PS3s have already be sold? 100k LTD? I dont even think so. The largest markets for the PS3 are mainland europe (UK as well of course), Japan and USA while for PS2 south america and asia were big markets as well. I dont think people in Japan or EU will completly stop buying software and hack their ps3s for the reasons i said before. Besides we are still talking about a potentiality and not about actuality. Who knows if there ever be a backup loader and how Sony will fight it.

I know that ps2 and ps1 sold very well due to high piracy in here. Yeah it may be low when compared to EU countries but again when u add all the countries like Turkey who buys consoles when they have piracy it maybe be a big market

 

[AzureNightmare]

fair use policy

Ah yes, it is the "fair use policy". thanks. You'll make it here for sure. I do know that no ISP in my area exercises it.

 

[lowrider007]

.......and how Sony will fight it.

Which is a big consideration also tbh.

 

[corrosivefrost]

PS3 runs a hypervisor? Learn something new...

 

[panda21]

If you're talking about videos... they wont be as they're already compressed to start with. If you're talking about software, they very much will be.

No-one is talking about a quarter of the size, but unless they're compressed massively on the PS3 disc already, you would be able to get a chunk more compression out of them.

not entirely sure what you mean but the actual software itself won't be anywhere near big enough to make a difference if you compress it, and textures and that kind of stuff will probably already be compressed, especially in multiplatform games.

but on the other hand the majority of ps3 games are probably more like 4/8gb, either because they are multiplatform or to help streaming from the disc, and for the very few that are 25gb its because they have lots of uncompressed data on the disc, or they repeat the data to stream better.

 

[keyrat]

Time to take the PS3 off DMZ, or not just yet?

 

[dogmaan]

Time to take the PS3 off DMZ, or not just yet?

this isn't a network exploit, so I wouldn't worry about it

 

[lowrider007]

not entirely sure what you mean but the actual software itself won't be anywhere near big enough to make a difference if you compress it, and textures and that kind of stuff will probably already be compressed, especially in multiplatform games.

but on the other hand the majority of ps3 games are probably more like 4/8gb, either because they are multiplatform or to help streaming from the disc, and for the very few that are 25gb its because they have lots of uncompressed data on the disc, or they repeat the data to stream better.

Do you think that one way that Sony could tackle the piracy rate marginally would be to ask all developers to make all their games use the full amount of the BD by repeating the data across the disc?, I can't imagine that it's hard thing to do and it would be in the publishers/developers interest to comply.

 

[Elan tedronai]

Time to take the PS3 off DMZ, or not just yet?

one of the great strengths of the ps3 is that no matter how many times you use the browser trawling through dodgy sites you know no virus is going to infect your ps3.

this is another problem with hacking as you can all sorts of SOBs writing malicious code.

 

[dogmaan]

Do you think that one way that Sony could tackle the piracy rate marginally would be to ask all developers to make all their games use the full amount of the BD by repeating the data across the disc?, I can't imagine that it's hard thing to do and it would be in the publishers/developers interest to comply.

dummy repeated data compresses easily, if "hackers" manage to crack the PS3's security fully, dummy data is only going to be a speed bump, although I agree it should be used as a deterrent anyway

Dreamcast would be a good example of that, the GD-ROM's capacity rarely stopped the availability of a cracked version of a game

 

[wsippel]

You see this is side of it that I think is questionable, isn't the data in some of these games duplicated and spread across the disc to make it easier for the BD drive to access the data quicker thus making the size of the games a lot larger?

And to 'OldJadedGamer', who ever downloaded a full CD ? people are mostly downloading MP3's, that isn't the same thing as downloading a full uncompressed audio CD, I doubt we're going to start seeing compressed PS3 games to download, I honestly don't see piracy becoming a big concern on the PS3 if it ever becomes possible.

You're a few years and more than 700 releases late:

1721
Dark_Void_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-20		xmb-darkvoid	NTSC	BLURAY	54x100

1720
World_Soccer_Winning_Eleven_2010_JPN_PS3-HR
HR	2010-01-18		hr-we2010	NTSC-J	BLURAY	39x200

1718
Army_of_Two_The_40th_Day_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-13		xmb-army40th	NTSC	BLURAY	99x50

1717
Darksiders_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-13		xmb-darksiders	NTSC	BLURAY	100x200

1716
Bayonetta_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-13		xmb-bayonetta	NTSC	BLURAY	60x200

1719
Time_Crisis_4_JPN_PS3-HR
HR	2010-01-10		hr-tc4j		NTSC-J	BLURAY	42x200

1715
Bayonetta_EUR_PS3-BHTPS3
BHTPS3	2010-01-10		b3-bay		PAL	BLURAY	60x200

1714
Saw_EUR_PS3-BHTPS3
BHTPS3	2010-01-03		b3-saw		PAL	BLURAY	11x200

1713
G-Force_EUR_PS3-BHTPS3
BHTPS3	2010-01-03		b3-gforce	PAL	BLURAY	21x200

It's also worth noting that most games are nowhere near 25GB.

 

[wud]

Ah yes, it is the "fair use policy". thanks. You'll make it here for sure. I do know that no ISP in my area exercises it.

oh no im so sorry, i forgot that no ISP operates a fair use policy!! how silly of me, your shit sarcastic response has upset me now i will never sleep tonight

 

[lowrider007]

dummy repeated data compresses easily....

I'm not talking about 'dummy data', I'm talking about repeating actual parts of the game and integrating it into the games software in way that it can't just be 'stripped' out.

 

[dogmaan]

I'm talking about 'dummy data', I'm talking about repeating actual parts of the game and integrating it into the games software in way that it can't just be 'stripped' out.

with repeated game data, i imagine you could set the TOC or FAT to point back to the original data when the copied data is called, this would effect performance and stability on a disc based copy, but not if it was an image running from the harddrive

if the repeated data was encrypted uniquely, or changed slightly, then that would make the job of cracking the image harder, and it would also make the filesize larger

 

[lowrider007]

You're a few years and more than 700 releases late:

1721
Dark_Void_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-20		xmb-darkvoid	NTSC	BLURAY	54x100

1720
World_Soccer_Winning_Eleven_2010_JPN_PS3-HR
HR	2010-01-18		hr-we2010	NTSC-J	BLURAY	39x200

1718
Army_of_Two_The_40th_Day_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-13		xmb-army40th	NTSC	BLURAY	99x50

1717
Darksiders_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-13		xmb-darksiders	NTSC	BLURAY	100x200

1716
Bayonetta_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-13		xmb-bayonetta	NTSC	BLURAY	60x200

1719
Time_Crisis_4_JPN_PS3-HR
HR	2010-01-10		hr-tc4j	NTSC-J	BLURAY	42x200

1715
Bayonetta_EUR_PS3-BHTPS3
BHTPS3	2010-01-10		b3-bay	PAL	BLURAY	60x200

1714
Saw_EUR_PS3-BHTPS3
BHTPS3	2010-01-03		b3-saw	PAL	BLURAY	11x200

1713
G-Force_EUR_PS3-BHTPS3
BHTPS3	2010-01-03		b3-gforce	PAL	BLURAY	21x200

It's also worth noting that most games are nowhere near 25GB.

I'm telling you now we are not going to see highly compressed PS3 games available to download on a large scale, it's not going to happen, otherwise we would see the same with 360 games, you don't, and if they exist they are in a very very small minority.

 

[avaya]

The level of self-entitlement amongst the the "homebrew enthusiasts" read pirates in disguise is disgusting.

I wonder if Sony will begin implementing ROM-Mark for disc based games now if they haven't already?

 

[dogmaan]

The level of self-entitlement amongst the the "homebrew enthusiasts" read pirates in disguise is disgusting.

I wonder if Sony will begin implementing ROM-Mark for disc based games now if they haven't already?

are you talking about the comments in here, or on the hackers blog?

because the conversation in here seems fine and on-topic

 

[Yoritomo]

Why is gaf so worried over the pircay implications? If the attachment rate of the 360 is any indication, piracy isn't having much of an effect or better yet there are other more important factors to software sales than whether you can pirate a game or not.

 

[avaya]

are you talking about the comments in here, or on the hackers blog?

because the conversation in here seems fine and on-topic

his blog and some of the comments here.

 

[Yoritomo]

The level of self-entitlement amongst the the "homebrew enthusiasts" read pirates in disguise is disgusting.

I wonder if Sony will begin implementing ROM-Mark for disc based games now if they haven't already?

so homebrew enthusiasts are just pirates in disguise?... nice to know.

 

[Fafalada]

dummy repeated data compresses easily

Dummy data can be easily uncompressable data-sets. Making it tricky to "remove alltogether" is a harder problem, and one most people probably wouldn't bother investing into, considering it doesn't hamper pirates at all, only their bandwith consumption.

 

[wsippel]

I'm telling you now we are not going to see highly compressed PS3 games available to download on a large scale, it's not going to happen, otherwise we would see the same with 360 games, you don't, and if they exist they are in a very very small minority.

We actually do see it with 360 games...

 

[DieH@rd]

You're a few years and more than 700 releases late:

1721
Dark_Void_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-20		xmb-darkvoid	NTSC	BLURAY	54x100

1720
World_Soccer_Winning_Eleven_2010_JPN_PS3-HR
HR	2010-01-18		hr-we2010	NTSC-J	BLURAY	39x200

1718
Army_of_Two_The_40th_Day_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-13		xmb-army40th	NTSC	BLURAY	99x50

[B]1717
Darksiders_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-13		xmb-darksiders	NTSC	BLURAY	100x200[/B]

1716
Bayonetta_USA_PS3-XMB
XMB	2010-01-13		xmb-bayonetta	NTSC	BLURAY	60x200

1719
Time_Crisis_4_JPN_PS3-HR
HR	2010-01-10		hr-tc4j		NTSC-J	BLURAY	42x200

1715
Bayonetta_EUR_PS3-BHTPS3
BHTPS3	2010-01-10		b3-bay		PAL	BLURAY	60x200

1714
Saw_EUR_PS3-BHTPS3
BHTPS3	2010-01-03		b3-saw		PAL	BLURAY	11x200

1713
G-Force_EUR_PS3-BHTPS3
BHTPS3	2010-01-03		b3-gforce	PAL	BLURAY	21x200

It's also worth noting that most games are nowhere near 25GB.

HOLY SHIT, Darksiders is 20GB on PS3? I sense a lot of high bitrate FMV's.

 

[robertsan21]

Great news, I hope this makes my PS3 play PS2games,region free DVD/BLU RAY player.


SONY NEXT TIME YOU MAKE A CONSOLE TRY AND MAKE IT RIGHT!

WHY have region restrictions, fuck that shit!

 

[lowrider007]

We actually do see it with 360 games...

But at what scale?, I've rarely ever seen them.

 

[Elan tedronai]

Why is gaf so worried over the pircay implications? If the attachment rate of the 360 is any indication, piracy isn't having much of an effect or better yet there are other more important factors to software sales than whether you can pirate a game or not.

piracy has always hindered the console or the handheld that is behind the market leader. Like the dreamcast and the psp. I remember during the dreamcast days when my mate would go 'oh man i have seen this awesome game commercial. I am going to download the game right now' He must have had truckloads of dreamcast games that were all pirated. And the sad thing was he could afford to buy them all. It was guys like him that ultimately crippled SEGA. SEGA was losing alot of money on the hardware side of things and didn't command a huge market share like sony. They relied on each and every single software sale and when dreamcast piracy reached endemic levels like the psp today that was it really in the end for SEGA

 

[Yoritomo]

But at what scale?, I've rarely ever seen them.

If it's made out of bits, it's on the internet somewhere.