Support NeoGAF

[MrPliskin]

Sony Defence Force - assemble!!!!

Very mature I'm glad to see Gamefaqs GAF is present.

Me not caring for the distribution of games for free among people who otherwise would / should have paid is obviously a cue to call me out.

One good thing about threads like these is it makes it much easier to expand my ignore list and make GAF an enjoyable experience. Thank you for that

 

[Corto]

i think we have this thread at least once a year. It always ends the same way.

Well, this time Sony seems to have raise the stakes with the banning of account and the privacy policy that enables them to check the IP address and MAC address of the system (if it gets online).

 

[subversus]

Finally

 

[gcubed]

Well, this time Sony seems to have raise the stakes with the banning of account and the privacy policy that enables them to check the IP address and MAC address of the system (if it gets online).

it'll always end the same though, game sharing will still be fine. If i was a betting man its in direct relation to the hack.

 

[-PXG-]

i think we have this thread at least once a year. It always ends the same way.

Yep. People being "disgusted" and "sickened" because of game sharing is ridiculous. How other people manage their games has no direct effect on you. There's no need for the hyperbole. Seriously. Who gives a shit? The vast majority of the PS3 user-base has no clue that such a feature exists in the first place. And the ones who do, only share their games with one, or a handful of their buddies. If this was as big of problem as some make it out to be, Sony would have put more strict DRM in place ages ago.

Oh, and the only game I've ever shared was FFVII. It was only for one person too...my roommate. I guess I'm a bad person and incredibly immoral for doing so...in spite of the fact that Sony allows it.

 

[Stumpokapow]

uhm... aside from rephrasing etc., it always has stated that (?). I don't see the news here. Doesn't affect game sharing anyway as TTP already explained.

- PSN DRM = awesome for (close/local) friends/family & getting your stuff back on a new console w/o any hassle

But compared to Apple, Valve, and Microsoft's DRM, PSN's DRM is actually the worst for "getting your stuff back on a new console w/o any hassle". All three of the other DRM systems allow for an unlimited number of consoles to use data attached to an account.

 

[gcubed]

But compared to Apple, Valve, and Microsoft's DRM, PSN's DRM is actually the worst for "getting your stuff back on a new console w/o any hassle". All three of the other DRM systems allow for an unlimited number of consoles to use data attached to an account.

well its not the worst. Singstar is the worst

 

[levious]

Sure they can. If they detect the same authorisation for a game in use concurrently (online) then the one that isn't actually logged in with the most recent reauthorisation gets deactivated.

that doesn't make sense though, when you purchase a game (outside of Final Fight I guess, and the original DRM for Warhawk) you're able to play it with whatever PSN id you have on your system. And ID's are meant to be portable aren't they? Even though it's not as simple as Live. How could they tell which was the original or proper one?

 

[RotBot]

that doesn't make sense though, when you purchase a game (outside of Final Fight I guess, and the original DRM for Warhawk) you're able to play it with whatever PSN id you have on your system. And ID's are meant to be portable aren't they? Even though it's not as simple as Live. How could they tell which was the original or proper one?

I'm pretty sure the account used to purchase the game is known to PSN when you play online even if you're playing from a different account.

 

[DonMigs85]

uhm... aside from rephrasing etc., it always has stated that (?). I don't see the news here. Doesn't affect game sharing anyway as TTP already explained.

and just for the record:
- PSN DRM = awesome for (close/local) friends/family & getting your stuff back on a new console w/o any hassle
- exploiting PSN DRM to minimize the costs for a random group of 5 people = not cool (and not really desirable even from the game sharers' position IMO)

Agree. You're outta luck if your console breaks and you can't persuade Sony to deactivate one account.

 

[SolidusDave]

But compared to Apple, Valve, and Microsoft's DRM, PSN's DRM is actually the worst for "getting your stuff back on a new console w/o any hassle". All three of the other DRM systems allow for an unlimited number of consoles to use data attached to an account.

I don't think many people burn through 5 PS3s (in each case w/o any possibility of deactivating your account(s) on it. For reference, I already deactivated my account on two YLoD'ed PS3s) and even then you can ask Sony to reset the activations. And yes, I know people have trouble with the latter, but it's neither impossible nor would they make problems if you actually had sent in several units for repair/replacement.


also, w/o hassle I meant:
I buy a new console, I log in with my account(s) (I buy stuff from 4 regions), I re-download everything, I can use everything with no restrictions (e.g. I can still use the stuff with other accounts on this PS3 etc.).
All this w/o interacting with the respective company, entering serial numbers, only being able to do it once a year and so on.


I agree that something like Apple's yearly reset of devices by the user should be added.

 

[graywolf323]

Agree. You're outta luck if your console breaks and you can't persuade Sony to deactivate one account.

honestly I wish they would copy Apple

you can reset your itunes activations if you are at the limit of 5 once a year

it's a year from the date you last reset them

edit: Valve is truly the easiest since all you have to do is download Steam, just don't be signed through more than one computer at a time (unless you have the other ones in offline mode)

 

[Unregistered007]

SONY is regaining senses too late in Generation.

 

[Corto]

I can't seem to find the software terms of usage (DRM) that stated that we could activate the software 5 times. Can someone with better googling abilities provide a link?

 

[levious]

I'm pretty sure the account used to purchase the game is known to PSN when you play online even if you're playing from a different account.

yes, but if two systems are playing the same purchased game at once, how could they be sure which one is the "right" one? I have two PS3s in my home with mine and my kids' IDs on each. I didn't buy everything on one system, even though all purchases were made under one ID.

 

[Version 3.0]

Oh really? So anytime that anyone twists or contorts something that makes it true for intended use?

Again, just because you can activate your account on 5 machines doesn't mean that you shouldn't suffer the consequences if you fuck up and give it to the wrong people. You lose your activations because you want to trade and get free shit, good, I'm glad you did. Learn your lesson.

Okay, you're a moron. We were actively encouraged to use "game sharing". It wasn't referred to as "account activation". And there's nothing wrong with it. I can loan God of War 3 to my friend, why shouldn't I be allowed to loan him Stardust as well?

 

[SolidusDave]

I can't seem to find the software terms of usage (DRM) that stated that we could activate the software 5 times. Can someone with better googling abilities provide a link?

It's in the description text of most PSN games, can vary by store though. I think it's not specifically in the ToU because Sony offers several DRM types.

 

[Psychotext]

yes, but if two systems are playing the same purchased game at once, how could they be sure which one is the "right" one? I have two PS3s in my home with mine and my kids' IDs on each. I didn't buy everything on one system, even though all purchases were made under one ID.

It's just a matter of waiting until the purchasing account is online on one machine when another (accessing the same content) is online on another.

Besides that, the original method was fairly clear. Most recent activation = the valid activation.

 

[Provider]

So I won't be able to share my account on my multiple systems?
I have 2 PS3s at home and I gave one to my nephew, that one is activated too I think.

 

[levious]

It's just a matter of waiting until the purchasing account is online on one machine when another (accessing the same content) is online on another.

Besides that, the original method was fairly clear. Most recent activation = the valid activation.

so my son and I playing a game together in the same house could get one system or ID banned? I don't buy that happening.

 

[Lafiel]

Umm. So if me and a person whom i game-shared with play a game at the same time. There's a chance of getting my account suspended? Shit. Good thing i hardly game-share anymore.

PSN DRM is such a mess, especially since they encouraged you to game-share to begin with. Now they are trying to ban you for it.:lol

 

[I NEED SCISSORS]

Very mature I'm glad to see Gamefaqs GAF is present.

Me not caring for the distribution of games for free among people who otherwise would / should have paid is obviously a cue to call me out.

One good thing about threads like these is it makes it much easier to expand my ignore list and make GAF an enjoyable experience. Thank you for that

Well hey, it's not like i'm the one white knighting absolutely every valid criticism levelled against Sony.

 

[yurinka]

Fine with me, but hopefully they'll give us the option to remotely deactivate shares. Is there any reason that they don't?

I agree. Specially in case of broken consoles, or to interchange them for future consoles like PS4 or PSP2 if they are compatible with PS3 PSN content (I bet they will).

 

[Bebpo]

At this point they can't pull a bait and switch and ban/deactivate accounts that have shared stuff unless they want to throw 100 million+ in the toilet.

First of all, the term changes probably wouldn't hold up under court since they're pretty oppressive and after the fact. But the biggest issue is that there are recorded statements by Sony officials telling people game sharing is a selling point of their system and to go ahead and do it. They can't turn around now and ban those people who did. They would lose that in court very, very badly and it'd cost $$$$$$ all so they could gain a few thousand more psn games sold? Not going to happen.

I think for the most part none of these changes that happen every couple of months are done with an ulterior motive to destroy game sharers. They probably just revise stuff to be more up to date every so often.

Also as an aside, if Sony wants to get more developers on PSN they should try:
1) learning how to market their products. XBLA game that sells 500k on XBL and then 30k on PSN doesn't do that big of difference because of the evils of game sharing or even the difference in userbase. It's because MS has integrated online shopping into the core of the Xbox experience itself. They know how to market. Meanwhile plenty of people with PS3s don't even know there is a store. Just like how Sony failed to sell their audience on Move, Sony needs to get a new head who can drive their products to their customers.

2) Not denying good games multi-platform games while approving shitty games just because they'll be exclusive. Stuff like Super Meat Boy embarrasses Sony. They really need to fire some people and reshape their guidelines for the approval process. Then again it's been awful since the days of the PS1 and tons of good games have been rejected over and over.

And yeah it'd be nice if they had a better DRM where you could revoke activations more easily. Hopefully they'll figure this out for their next system.

 

[Lard]

Simple option is don't buy stuff from PSN.

 

[shuri]

Hahaha at people freaking out :lol

 

[ohhthegore]

So I have to PS3's in my house, does this mean I won't be able to share PSN games between them because that would be pretty dumb

 

[Xenon]

Fuck me.

So, I guess you loathe rentals and borrowing games too huh? Yeah, thought so. How are those pay checks from Uncle Sony?

Uhh.. Its not the same thing, rentals are for a limited time and physical media is yours to do with what you want.

Just because Sony said it was cool(I'm still not sure this is true) doesn't change the fact that people are getting a product for free and the devs see 1/5 of what they should.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

Uhh.. Its not the same thing, rentals are for a limited time and physical media is yours to do with what you want.

Just because Sony said it was cool(I'm still not sure this is true) doesn't change the fact that people are getting a product for free and the devs see 1/5 of what they should.

It's true. Usually the quote from him hits the first page on threads like these but because you didn't know about it, here is the quote from President of SCEA Jack Tretton:

“You can send that content to four other friends for that initial investment, We want to get the game in as many hands as possible. It’s not about generating profits at each and every interaction with the consumer, I think that really offsets the argument that says, ‘Wow, that’s a really pricey system.’”

 

[Equus Bellator Apex]

Good.

Anything to keep those assholes off my lawn.

 

[Ranger X]

Everytime there is an update people are freaking out and there's nothing to see.

They tell it clearly that you still can use your content through multiple activations. Nothing to see, move on.

 

[akachan ningen]

They're being dumb if this is true. I'm sure they think they're going to make more money if people stop game sharing but there are some games that certain people will NEVER pay full price for.

 

[Cruzader]

I think everyone for gamesharing dont know what a friend/family member are.

Friend* = person you visit and mingle with. You can go over his/her crib and share your dls and play together. Then you can deactivate your account from their system without bitching to Sony since you know, aren't buying/selling your account.

*This excludes random Internet users who you chat with and don't really know who want to pay $1 or less for new games.

 

[AmericanNinja]

Good glad they are putting a stop to game sharing.

 

[Dark Octave]

I'm glad to hear about this. I wonder why it has taken Sony so long.

I'm also really happy about most of the comments here in this thread supporting this move. I honestly was expecting to hear 80% of us crying about our consumer rights being taken away or something.

 

[tirminyl]

It's true. Usually the quote from him hits the first page on threads like these but because you didn't know about it, here is the quote from President of SCEA Jack Tretton:

“You can send that content to four other friends for that initial investment, We want to get the game in as many hands as possible. It’s not about generating profits at each and every interaction with the consumer, I think that really offsets the argument that says, ‘Wow, that’s a really pricey system.’”

This quote is awesome because you can totally tell he was under the control of $599. I can't blame people...you see it everywhere you go, even at work. The documented procedures and rules say one thing but the employee, manager, officer or CEO will say "it's ok", until something breaks and they will then say you were doing it wrong and their documentation proves it. In this case Tretton says something that contradicts their rules and people hang on to it as the final authoritative word.

I share in the sense that I download some games onto friends consoles because I am at their house to play or show them something. I normally deactivate. If I don't deactivate, that means I am a repeat visitor but no one has my account password. I think Sony's method is great for these scenarios but some abuse it. I await the next agreement update and game sharing discussion.

 

[aj2good4you2]

Everytime there is an update people are freaking out and there's nothing to see.

They tell it clearly that you still can use your content through multiple activations. Nothing to see, move on.

.

At this point there isn't any reason to discuss every little change to the TOS in relation to gamesharing until we have evidence of Sony actually doing something about it.

 

[IrishNinja]

jesus, the number of corporate cheerleaders in here is sad. "yessss sony limited my options again!"

 

[Prezhulio]

don't really care that much, but i've got a couple of my psn games shared with a friend. any word on whether this is gonna retroactively jack my psn account?

edit:nm, see above.

 

[Fafalada]

But compared to Apple, Valve, and Microsoft's DRM, PSN's DRM is actually the worst for "getting your stuff back on a new console w/o any hassle".

Which normal people do like what, every 5 years?
If you use handhelds, it's not even a contest (unless you just love buying multiple copies for every machine you use in family).

 

[onken]

Good glad they are putting a stop to game sharing.

I'm glad to hear about this. I wonder why it has taken Sony so long.

I'm also really happy about most of the comments here in this thread supporting this move. I honestly was expecting to hear 80% of us crying about our consumer rights being taken away or something.

This honestly hurts my brain to read. But don't worry, I'm sure Faceless Corporation #21392 has noticed how much you care about their bottom line, when the new order arrives you will duly rewarded.

The rest of us normal human beings will lament the loss of a good feature (if they actually decide to go ahead with it, that is).

 

[Rainier]

This honestly hurts my brain to read. But don't worry, I'm sure Faceless Corporation #21392 has noticed how much you care about their bottom line, when the new order arrives you will duly rewarded.

The rest of us normal human beings will lament the loss of a good feature (if they actually decide to go ahead with it, that is).

We need a Year of the PS3 blackboard pic with a crossed off list of features that have been removed. One day Sony will cut the right one, that will finally put the PS3 back on top!

 

[DCharlie]

Just because Sony said it was cool(I'm still not sure this is true) doesn't change the fact that people are getting a product for free and the devs see 1/5 of what they should.

if you have a figure head at your company pimping it as a feature to combat the $599 price tage, they you absolutely cannot point the finger at people and say "bu bu bu that's not how we intended them to use it!!!"

And publishers KNOW this was a possibility. How about putting your games on a closed system like XBLA if it&s THAT much of a deal?

People ARE getting a product for free - that is true, but either Sony need to make an official statement retracting the statement saying they were all up about getting games into peoples hands and clarifying that they view this as piracy or.... you know... tighten up their DRM and stop them and their inane fanboys making everyone out to be filthy criminals.

We need a Year of the PS3 blackboard pic with a crossed off list of features that have been removed. One day Sony will cut the right one, that will finally put the PS3 back on top!

all Sony fanboys care so much about Sony's bottom line that they were only being ironic when cheering on the free online and the game sharing in the past as value added features. Should have been obvious i guess!

 

[SumGamer]

Okay I'm dumb, what's the different does the new TOS make apart from being more explicit?

How's Sony gonna know if the game's shared anyway? What if I were happened to be filthy rich and have 5 consoles in different places?

 

[iqubal]

I agree with the few posts who state there are way too many corporate cheerleaders on this thread.

 

[Tobiasboon]

So I have activated at the moment two PS3s at my house, one at my brothers, one at my parents and a local friend's system who I visit regularly. From the looks of the wording this isn't actually going to change anything for me at all, the license you buy explicitly states the content can be used on up to 5 activated PS3 systems as long as you don't give out your PSN account details (which I haven't, they simply reside on those activated consoles sans password).

I'm guessing they had to redefine the terms slightly for things like Love Film and that Mubi thing, maybe even some PSN+ content but the "loophole", as some people call it that allows gamesharing is still in there if you care to read. Nothing has changed in that regard. Of course giving your details out over the 'net rather than entering them in person is against the TOS and is obviously against the spirit of the service, I don't think anyone can argue against that.

 

[worldstiniestpenis]

hey so when you send your console in to sony do they deactivate it? 'cause i've had mine fixed four times now, and i'm worried about my games. i buy a lot of psn games.

 

[linsivvi]

well its not the worst. Singstar is the worst

Definitely. A pain in the ass. Though to be fair I think it has more to do with the music labels, so Sony is only partially responsible for such an atrocious DRM.

 

[ItAintEasyBeinCheesy]

This took like 2 or 3 minutes of me to scroll through and not read anything. Pick up your game Sony!

Should have been able to do it in the background.

 

[onken]

We need a Year of the PS3 blackboard pic with a crossed off list of features that have been removed. One day Sony will cut the right one, that will finally put the PS3 back on top!

Sorry all that year of the PS3/blackboard shit is just as embarrassing as the people it attempts to mock.