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[AmericanNinja]

Add in trophies and I will gladly pay $600 for the PSP2.

 

[Elios83]

This is pretty nice for controls, the touch pad can function as right analog stick, mouse and L2/R2 buttons.
Left stick, D-pad and the other buttons on the front.
I don't know if having a touch pad means no touch screen though, for costs reasons that's probably the case.
They should include a microphone and camera as standard features too. And please Sony, full integration of Playstation Network, PS Store, video store, music and comics store.
All games must be released both at retail and as digital downloads. Memory stick as phisical support.

 

[Regulus Tera]

People arguing for bigger portables baffle me.

Edit: And more expensive.

 

[apana]

Maybe the only way to get some of their first party developers excited about the thing was for it to have extremely powerful graphics?

 

[gofreak]

It's sad that no one else decided to use a touchpad in consoles before.

A touchpad instead of the right analog would be a great improvement for shooters, for the crowd that doesn't want the wiimote/move controller.

I've just been playing HL2 with the touchpad on my laptop. I'd never actually tried a FPS before with it.

It's fine for 'in the small' aiming. Really good, in fact. The problem is 'in the large' aiming. If I swipe my finger across the pad the aim doesn't move nearly as much as a small swipe of my mouse will. You could up sensitivity, to have larger movements for smaller swipes, but then I think it would be more difficult to control for small movements.

But a touchpad that's mapped to a screen that isn't much bigger than it? Those tradeoffs and issues could disappear.

 

[Elios83]

I've just been playing HL2 with the touchpad on my laptop. I'd never actually tried a FPS before with it.

It's fine for 'in the small' aiming. Really good, in fact. The problem is 'in the large' aiming. If I swipe my finger across the pad the aim doesn't move nearly as much as a small swipe of my mouse will. You could up sensitivity, to have larger movements for smaller swipes, but then I think it would be more difficult to control for small movements.

But a touchpad that's mapped to a screen that isn't much bigger than it? Those tradeoffs and issues could disappear.

Infact that means absolutely no issues. it's almost a 1:1 mapping XD

 

[brain_stew]

I've just been playing HL2 with the touchpad on my laptop. I'd never actually tried a FPS before with it.

It's fine for 'in the small' aiming. Really good, in fact. The problem is 'in the large' aiming. If I swipe my finger across the pad the aim doesn't move nearly as much as a small swipe of my mouse will. You could up sensitivity, to have larger movements for smaller swipes, but then I think it would be more difficult to control for small movements.

But a touchpad that's mapped to a screen that isn't much bigger than it? Those tradeoffs and issues could disappear.

You're also playing an FPS game designed around mouse input without any aima assist at all. The fact that it works at all means its a huge stepup from dual analogues which are completely useless without heavy lashings of aim assist.

Try playing HL2 by using Xpadder to make your 360 controller mimic the mouse. You'll end up incredibly frustrated, and that's while using a controller with much better analog sticks than anything you could ever fit on a PSP. A touchpad is definitely an improvement over an analog nub for aiming and camera control, its not suitable for character movement but you've got a separate nub for that. This control scheme definitely has potential imo.

 

[ElFly]

I've just been playing HL2 with the touchpad on my laptop. I'd never actually tried a FPS before with it.

It's fine for 'in the small' aiming. Really good, in fact. The problem is 'in the large' aiming. If I swipe my finger across the pad the aim doesn't move nearly as much as a small swipe of my mouse will. You could up sensitivity, to have larger movements for smaller swipes, but then I think it would be more difficult to control for small movements.

But a touchpad that's mapped to a screen that isn't much bigger than it? Those tradeoffs and issues could disappear.

I wonder if such issues could be fixed (on a gamepad) by adjusting the system's sensibility so going from the left extreme to the right extreme of the touchpad was exactly turning around 180 degrees (where the fuck is the degree symbol in this keyboard).

I remember reading that trackballs for FPSs had this advantage, which made precision turning easy for newcomers (as long as the trackball sensitivity was adjusted, which could be a problem in PC, due to differences from game to game, but it'd be trivial in a console).

Infact that means absolutely no issues. it's almost a 1:1 mapping XD

Not completely true. The 1:1 mapping to the screen means that the amount of turning you will do by going from one extreme of the touchpad to the other is limited by the FOV, which usually is around 90 degrees IIRC.

 

[Panajev2001a]

A good deal of that 'shader induced surface aliasing' is not shader-induced at all, but comes from inadequate sampling/filtering of input parameter maps - mainly normal maps & co. How about you ask those console makers for proper AF instead? ; )

You are right, but this is something that can also be taken care of in software (spending more resources on it): (LEAN Mapping) http://www.cs.umbc.edu/~olano/papers/ or mip-mapping normal maps (nVIDIA website).
Sure, that can be improved too and yes, we will promise to ask them for better resources that can help you achieve aliasing free surfaces again.

Still, it is quite clear that next-generation's target resolution will not exceed 1080p * 2 (I'm counting stereoscopic 3D) and it will not be a huge jump from what people expect out of consoles today. Also, the leap in fill-rate and performance between current console GPU's and next-generation consoles' ones will much more than make up for it.

You had a generation which wasted a lot of resources pushing for higher resolution graphics (still, many games went for 720p or less which is a shorter jump than the one from 480p to 1080p is... so it is not like all developers had to make their games 1080p minimum this generation ).
Next generation will be the one in which you will have to prove what you can do with all those shader flops put to good use .

 

[gofreak]

Infact that means absolutely no issues. it's almost a 1:1 mapping XD

Well, we don't know exactly the relationship with the screen. But it's safe to say that it'll be much tighter than that between my laptop screen and trackpad. So you should be able to have more 'travel' on camera control with your finger without sacrificing precision on smaller-range aiming.

The other thing about laptop trackpads is the slightly awkward button placement. On a configuration like that rumoured though you'd have at least one or two other fingers naturally falling on buttons on the front or shoulder so it should be a bit easier in that respect too.

Definitely more curious now. Just hope for a comfortable form factor. Thinking about this, thinking about the 'grasp' of a hand on and the whole rear touchpad idea, a slightly bigger form factor actually begins to make a bit more sense for this IMO. I had previously thought about the idea using an iPod as a reference, but something slightly bigger would probably be more comfortable with this I think.

You're also playing an FPS game designed around mouse input without any aima assist at all. The fact that it works at all means its a huge stepup from dual analogues which are completely useless without heavy lashings of aim assist.

This is true. As is, I would take my laptop trackpad over dual analog. I really never got used to the latter.

 

[thcsquad]

Perhaps, but I have my doubts about its wider application. I could be judging it prematurely - and unfairly - but it just strikes me that the way you'd have to use it would make it awkward to use for anything but broad movements. Part of what made the DS touchscreen particularly good (for me, anyway) was that it allowed things like handwriting, or drawing relatively complex shapes, or manipulating complex inventory screens, none of which seem like they would be easily doable on this type of screen.

Have you seen the video of the Microsoft version, posted in this thread? The screen is partially translucent, so you can see where your fingertips are on screen. If that is also on the PSP screen, it would make all of those things easily doable.

 

[I NEED SCISSORS]

This screams disaster waiting to happen.

People want more portability, not less. The 3DS is sticking to a similar size of the existing DS models - a PSP2 which is at least an inch bigger than PSP, which was already pretty wide, is not going to fly right.

A rear touch-pad will probably not work very well. I can't really see any practical uses for it in gaming since it will be in such an awkward position. They already suck enough on laptops and the old Blackberry models - it's unorthodox and fiddly, compounded further by being on the rear.

And the overheating just speaks for itself.

 

[thcsquad]

This screams disaster waiting to happen.

People want more portability, not less. The 3DS is sticking to a similar size of the existing DS models - a PSP2 which is at least an inch bigger than PSP, which was already pretty wide, is not going to fly right.

DSiXL/iPad say hi

A rear touch-pad will probably not work very well. I can't really see any practical uses for it in gaming since it will be in such an awkward position. They already suck enough on laptops and the old Blackberry models - it's unorthodox and fiddly, compounded further by being on the rear.

Watch the video linked many times in this thread and say that.

And the overheating just speaks for itself.

Agreed

 

[Lonely1]

So, this is bigger than the Go, bigger than the PSP-3000 or the original PSP-1000? ANyway, "Problems balancing battery life and heat output is the kind of problems i don't wanna hear.

 

[xtop]

This screams disaster waiting to happen.

People want more portability, not less. The 3DS is sticking to a similar size of the existing DS models - a PSP2 which is at least an inch bigger than PSP, which was already pretty wide, is not going to fly right.

A rear touch-pad will probably not work very well. I can't really see any practical uses for it in gaming since it will be in such an awkward position. They already suck enough on laptops and the old Blackberry models - it's unorthodox and fiddly, compounded further by being on the rear.

And the overheating just speaks for itself.

slap on another inch to the pspgo, will it even be bigger than the original psp?

i agree with you on the rear touch pad though. and overheating seems to go with the territory right now imo

 

[Cosmonaut X]

Have you seen the video of the Microsoft version, posted in this thread? The screen is partially translucent, so you can see where your fingertips are on screen. If that is also on the PSP screen, it would make all of those things easily doable.

Yup, seen it. It's not really seeing your fingers that I think would be an issue, but actually trying to write or trace shapes, or make more subtle movements with your hands in that position.

If I hold my hands out and grip a piece of card at the sides so that my fingers are all on the reverse of the card and my thumbs on the front, what I find is that, while I can lift and drop my fingers to tap the screen very easily, and I have some up/down and in/out movement, actually trying to "draw" a shape is bloody awkward, and trying to move a finger any distance means it bumps into my other fingers and I have to adjust my grip.

Perhaps multitouch would alleviate this, but as it is it seems as though it would be ideal for a control setup with fixed-position controls (that is, something like virtual keys down the side of the touchpad) but not ideal for anything that requires you to use the whole of the pad (drawing apps, DS-style camera control etc.)

 

[I NEED SCISSORS]

Watch the video linked many times in this thread and say that.

It looks about as awkward as I came to expect. About as practical for gaming as touch screen only controls.

 

[MetatronM]

This rear touchpad thing sounds simultaneously clever and terrible. I have no idea how that would turn out in terms of real world play, but all the ideas in my head seem pretty darn uncomfortable and awkward (and so does that video). Will have to see in action on a gaming device to actually form an opinion. Maybe it works better than I'm expecting.

I honestly don't know what to make of this whole device based on what we've heard so far. It definitely seems to be trying to differentiate itself significantly from the direction Nintendo is going in, wisely, but it sounds like it might be skirting awfully close to Apple/smartdevice territory, which hardly seems like much of an improvement.

Guess we'll have to see. At the very least Sony's tech is always cool and interesting. Well, usually anyway. Will be neat to see this thing finally unveiled.

 

[sixteen-bit]

looking forward to seeing the thing

 

[The Technomancer]

Back touch panel sounds interesting, I'm curious to see what they do with that even if its a bad idea. Larger/higher-res screen though...I dunno.

 

[Lonely1]

If they're having problems dealing with overheating, they have a long way to go before this thing gets released. :lol

But consumers didn't punished the 360...

 

[Cosmonaut X]

But consumers didn't punished the 360...

Consumers didn't have to hold the damn thing... :lol

 

[Vinci]

Touch panel on the back sounds utterly ridiculous from an interface standpoint, though perhaps it's simply odd rather than ridiculous. I guess we'll see.

Also, this thing is coming out way too late if they're still having design issues with overheating and battery life.

 

[M°°nblade]

again with that rear touchscreen rumor. sounds so odd. :lol

the whole reason why touchscreens can offer something compelling for games is the direct manipulation of objects that you are looking at with your fingers. it's very tactile and satisfying. putting the touch screen on the back negates that. they might as well just have an analog nub you use to control a pointer.

The backside touchscreen has far more accuracy and better range than an analog nub to control a pointer.
I don’t see the disadvantage of not being able to see my fingers. It certainly doesn’t bother when I use a PC mouse.

 

[Lonely1]

Touch panel on the back already sounds a much better solution than iPhones. The only real problem i see is unwanted inputs since we aren't used to such control scheme, but should disappear with practice. Granted, if the PSP is actually comfortable to hand, something the PSP-1000 to 3000 is not. But the PSP still needs a touch screen of OS navigation.

 

[Host Samurai]

I would buy this Day 1 only if they added the feature to plug into the PS3 to play on a big screen when you are at home with a analog controller to continue your game at home. This will give gamers the best of both worlds and a cool bonus for having a PS3.

Kind of like an iPod docking station

 

[Somnid]

Back touch is the more natural evolution of the finger touch screen. Studies of the technology actually show that it seems to be more accurate to touch targets from behind. It also does not obstruct the screen (which is probably why it's easier). It's really a great differentiating idea for the PSP2 if true.

Making it larger is absolute suicide though. The PSP was already huge, only portable in the broader "keep it in your bag" sense. This might fly in Japan but not the US. It doesn't matter how awesome the screen is if it's not going to fit in a pocket.

 

[Lonely1]

I would buy this Day 1 only if they added the feature to plug into the PS3 to play on a big screen when you are at home with a analog controller to continue your game at home. This will give gamers the best of both worlds and a cool bonus for having a PS3.

The PSP-Go already can do something like this with select games, I believe.

 

[LCfiner]

The backside touchscreen has far more accuracy and better range than an analog nub to control a pointer.
I don’t see the disadvantage of not being able to see my fingers. It certainly doesn’t bother when I use a PC mouse.

well, it depends what Sony wants to do with this touchpad. if they want to replicate the types of games you can get on a DS or iphone, putting the screen on the back is an awful, awful idea because, like i said, the concept of direct manipulation is key to that experience. putting cursor on the screen ruins a lot of the fun of touchscreen games.

But if they just want to add a more price cursor control and replicate a mouse on the console, then the rear touchpad is just fine as a solution.

even though I think that's a bad idea for games and ergonomics but, whatever, at least they'd have a direction for the thing.

 

[Host Samurai]

The PSP-Go already can do something like this with select games, I believe.

Really? it plugs into the PS3 and I can use an analog? If so I would buy one today.

I think a feature like that would be great. Think of something like an iPod docking station where you can hook your ipod up to speakers. Its sort of the same thing.

 

[Spiegel]

The PSP-Go already can do something like this with select games, I believe.

I think it's for all games. Although you can't use the second analog stick and the L2-3/R-3 buttons obviously.

You only need the PS3 to sync the controller the first time or something like that.

 

[Elios83]

Well, we don't know exactly the relationship with the screen.

We don't know about that but thinking about it, if there was true 1:1 mapping (ex if the touch pad is exactly the same size and the same position of the screen, just behind it), it would be possible to have two birds with one stone. Mouse/analog control on the back but also mimicked touch screen functionality without actually covering the screen with your finger. It would be a great idea.

 

[Wazzim]

I think it's more about the near launch games than about the device itself.

 

[Skilletor]

I would LOVE a larger handheld. I am glad to hear this news.

 

[brain_stew]

The PSP-Go already can do something like this with select games, I believe.

You can use a wireless sixaxis/DS3 via bluetooth with every game on the PSP Go and the console has TV-out functionality as well of course. No need to switch on a home console either though you do need access to a PS3 initally to sync the controller to the PSP, but that's it.

 

[Arnie]

Trying to mimic the movements required for this with my hands I just can't fathom what Sony are thinking. Will this device have analogue sticks as well? Moving my fingers behind an object as I hold it upright is incredibly awkward, or at least that's how it feels on a device such as a phone or an iPad etc.

Saying that I'm excited to see the PSP2, and will give it a fair shake of the stick at it's inevitable reveal next June, however I will probably own a 3DS by then.

 

[Lonely1]

You can use a wireless sixaxis/DS3 via bluetooth with every game on the PSP Go and the console has TV-out functionality as well of course. No need to switch on a home console either though you do need access to a PS3 initally to sync the controller to the PSP, but that's it.

Sorry. I was thinking on select extra support like in Resistance:R where you can use the right analog stick to aim.

 

[Doctor_No]

Touch panel on the back sounds utterly ridiculous from an interface standpoint, though perhaps it's simply odd rather than ridiculous. I guess we'll see.

Also, this thing is coming out way too late if they're still having design issues with overheating and battery life.

The only alternative would be a second-small-analog nub, which would be horribly inaccurate on a portable. As it stands, the current PSP nub isn't accurate enough to move, much less aim.

The second issue is that most dual-analog games operate with four-triggers (L1, L2, R1, R2), very difficult to fit four-triggers on the top of a slim portable comfortably. With a rear-touchpad operated by your index/middle finger, your thumb will have full access to four face buttons which will substitute the four-triggers (which may actually be more comfortable).

The larger screen size also fits in with the touchpad, an overall larger rear surface area will make it more accurate to control, and larger batteries can be fitted in as well.

 

[Lonely1]

The only alternative would be a second-small-analog nub, which would be horribly inaccurate on a portable. As it stands, the current PSP nub isn't accurate enough to move, much less aim.

The second issue is that most dual-analog games operate with four-triggers (L1, L2, R1, R2), very difficult to fit four-triggers on the top of a slim portable comfortably. With a rear-touchpad operated by your index/middle finger, your thumb will have full access to four face buttons which will substitute the four-triggers (which may actually be more comfortable).

The larger screen size also fits in with the touchpad, an overall larger rear surface area will make it more accurate to control, and larger batteries can be fitted in as well.

And larger price too.

 

[thcsquad]

Yup, seen it. It's not really seeing your fingers that I think would be an issue, but actually trying to write or trace shapes, or make more subtle movements with your hands in that position.

Well, I guess it's just a matter of preference. I can already tell that a device using that would be much less awkward for me than the iPhone-type touchscreen.

 

[Wazzim]

And larger price too.

I don't think anyone interested in the PSP2 expects a low launch price, it's Sony.

 

[xtop]

I don't think anyone interested in the PSP2 expects a low launch price, it's Sony.

but would an extra inch of screen real estate really cost that much more?

 

[(._.)]

I'm interested in what really matters, the games. If it has great games and isn't crazy expensive I would consider getting one a year or two after it comes out. Also it would be a shame if there wasn't a way to get your purchased PSP games over to it like the PSP GO.

 

[iceatcs]

I'll be happy if future portable gaming will have next generation battery.
Are we going stay Lithium-ion technology further? I mean it came from 90's. I know it is one of best energy-to-weight ratios and cost to make. But people will crazy if there is device will last 2 days or longer in full power or allow to further high specification devices.

Maybe start using renewable energy on the go like example, hidden mini solar on the front and motion-charge from movement will allow to reduce battery use.

 

[paskowitz]

What Sony has to realize with the PSP2 is that it has to be a "cool" device. I am sorry but any (ok most) self respecting individual does not walk onto public transport and start playing Crisis Core. The PSP2 has to be visually socially acceptable. It has has to have character.

While we all know the games have to be great, in the world of Android and iPod it can't be a one trick pony. IMO if the next PSP does not have Android, Sony is in big trouble. Why get a PSP when you can get an iPod Touch that does a lot more for less?

Sony have to market it as an entertainment device not a gaming device. Playstation as the brand not as the literal term play station.

If anyone can deliver this message it is KB.

 

[painful fart]

DOA methinks

Some deep analysis right there, will probably be quoted in the next article on Kotaku.

Add in trophies and I will gladly pay $600 for the PSP2.

:lol Sony loves you too.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

What Sony has to realize with the PSP2 is that it has to be a "cool" device. I am sorry but any (ok most) self respecting individual does not walk onto public transport and start playing Crisis Core. The PSP2 has to be visually socially acceptable. It has has to have character.

Yeah man it should be totally hip and have a name like Xbox 'cuz "X" is like extreeeeeme.

 

[thcsquad]

but would an extra inch of screen real estate really cost that much more?

A little bit, as well as the processing power needed to render at the increased resolution, and the cooling measures needed to prevent the thing from overheating. It adds up.

 

[Father_Brain]

What Sony has to realize with the PSP2 is that it has to be a "cool" device. I am sorry but any (ok most) self respecting individual does not walk onto public transport and start playing Crisis Core. The PSP2 has to be visually socially acceptable. It has has to have character.

I live in Manhattan, and I see people playing both PSP and DS on the subway all the time. Just saying.

 

[Infinite Justice]

The back touch panel sounds intriguing

the device being bigger isn't

assuming its a inch bigger than the go screen then it would be ~5 imo. This device (MyRacer Lisse H10 HD) makes it look cool but its helped greatly with that one(?)button. The PSP2 should have the direction pad/analog and buttons to add to that...or will it have them at all?.