reggieandTFE
Member
ymmv said:
Umm no. Poles are perfectly great at being anti-semitic all on their own.
-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
Racist violence is growing in Europe
- Thread starter Kabouter
- Start date
- Status
Umm no. Poles are perfectly great at being anti-semitic all on their own.
Vigilant Walrus said:
I assume your European, or if not, this is a question to EuroGAF:
Walrus here mentions completely failed integration of recent immigration into European countries. My question is two fold: 1) Is this perception accurate? and 2) Is this a failure of the society and culture of the European Countries or of the Muslim culture or any part in between?
Fio said:
Fixed.
Manos: The Hans of Fate said:
I just want to add, Polish weddings are great. I was at my first one last year in Poland and it was all dancing/food/vodka for 2 days straight. Its something out of this world. Polish weddings are where it is at.
As for Antisemitism in Poland, during my visits to see my family there, there has never been any talk of such things. My family comes from the South Eastern part of Poland, if that makes any difference. You may just see general young adult angst as usual in any country.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Hyperbole. Never useful in these threads.JoeBoy101 said:
It depends very much on the group of immigrants. The Netherlands for instance has completely failed to integrate for instance Moroccan and Somalian immigrants. It has succeeded partially in integrating for instance Turkish and Surinamese immigrants. And it has mostly succeeded in integrating people from Indonesia.JoeBoy101 said:
As for who is to blame for the failure, it is very much caused by factors on both sides. Particularly Islamic immigrants have proved tricky to integrate, as you have indicated as well, and this is in part due to their culture being incompatible to a greater degree than other immigrants groups. But it is also due in no small part to the Dutch government not planning for the long-term integration of the labour migrants when they came here. Of course there are more factors on both sides, but I do feel those are the two most important.
And of course this is just for the Netherlands, I couldn't give you specifics on other European countries, but I would imagine there being parallels.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
JoeBoy101 said:
1) Both yes and no. Depends heavily on country of origin. Turks usually integrate easily, while Somalis.. let's just say a dishearteningly high percentage prefers to chew khat and do fuckshit nothing rather than integrate into society. Pakistanis are somewhere inbetween. Obviously it depends on what the person in question is like too, so I'm just making a wide generalization. But yeah, integration hasn't been the success story we would've liked it to be.
2) Both, really. Some people just don't want to integrate, and form their own cultural ghettos, while others are never given the chance to get integrated due to xenophobia, failed integration projects etc.
Edit: This is for Norway, but the situation is similar in Sweden, and probably most western European countries.
JoeBoy101 said:
You can't just generalize like that. There is a lot of people well integrated while others aren't.
But if you had to generalize I will say yes, the majority is not integrated and it's the fault of both sides.
Edit: Can't forget to say this is for Spain, and we also got communities not integrated from Easter Europe. So it happens inside the EU as well.
JoeBoy101 said:
1) It's not so much recent immigration, but the immigration policy implemented decades ago. It was liberal to say at least. Whereas traditional immigration countries like the US have of course some restrictions and tresholds Europe let everyone in. Leading to point
2)It's impossible to blame one side for this imho. You have immigrants here, that have no intention to integrate in the slightest. This supports xenophobia, which kinda gives immigrants the right to be even more seclusive. its a downward spiral.
We have to set standards for integration and do the best we can to work with the people that are already here. We also have to speak up against racism everywhere we encounter it.
JoeBoy101 said:
Bullshit. As a South American, single, male college student it is pretty much impossible to get an US tourist visa. The only thing the American embassy can think is 'omg, he's going to stay here for the jobs!!', while I just pack my things, take a flight and some hours later I'm in Europe.
Kabouter said:
Oh, please. Spare me the tired old 'we are being discriminated against' excuse why muslims fail in *every* single western country, while on the other hand the Indian and Chinese children of immigrants have no problems at all. All immigrant/non-immigrant children in the Netherlands get the same opportunities. In fact, even muslim girls usually do well at school, but for some reason muslim boys fare a lot worse: a high percentage of them fail to leave school with a diploma despite the best efforts of schools and teachers, so they have a hard time finding jobs and many of them dabble in petty crimes, burglaries, etc. It doesn't really help that their general work attitude so often stinks.
LQX
Member
Well with the way most Europeans get on and criticize you would think think they have lived in candy land all this time and America is some savage wasteland that all decided to leave. Sadly things like this reminds us that's not that case and all countries have there share of problems.GCX said:
Fritz said:
This sounds like the major issue in that, and again not as familiar with European immigration and laws so this is not chest-beating on my part, as heavily broken as the US immigration policy and structure has been, we've been dealing with it on a fairly regular basis over the past 20 years while the recent upswing in European immigration has been fairly recent over the past 20-30 years?
In Finland much of the hate toward immigrants comes from the thought that they'd be here to steal our social securities. There's actually little truth behind it since unemployed immigrant do get more money than a "regular" unemployed citizen from the state.
But yeah, I weep anytime anyone says something like "Finland belongs to Finnish! We've fought for this nation and built it and etc etc". Usually it's the older generations who still have some connections to WW2. But it's just wrong.
But yeah, I weep anytime anyone says something like "Finland belongs to Finnish! We've fought for this nation and built it and etc etc". Usually it's the older generations who still have some connections to WW2. But it's just wrong.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
avatar299 said:
Well yeah. I don't really know how or why it all worked out in the US, but not in Europe. But it's no point trying to argue that integration in Europe hasn't failed partially due to nationalism, xenophobia and failed integration programs.
xbhaskarx said:
That's the man. I think he even openly admitted to being a fascist. Lazio's had loads of trouble with fascist elements in and around the club.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paolo_Di_Canio#Fascist_Politics
Baron Doggystyle von Woof
Member
Kabouter said:
This is true. In the Netherlands its mostly the Morrocan immigrants. For example the Turks, Iranians and Iraqi people are nice. I read something about Turks starting lots of businesses.
Dreams-Visions
Member
oh myxbhaskarx said:
iamaustrian
Member
aren't there hundrets of (legal) ultraracist groups in the USA?
gaining thousands of new members every year?
I saw shit in the states that wouldn't even be possible(allowed) here.
gaining thousands of new members every year?
I saw shit in the states that wouldn't even be possible(allowed) here.
anonnumber6
Banned
Combichristoffersen said:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/europe/4544008.stm
Admitted to being a fascist but not a racist. Though Italian football has always incidents like these, even a club like Inter Milan has fans that taunt black players. It's probably due to Italy in general not being as opposed to fascism compared to other European countries due to it's history.
Though the worst case of racism in football I have ever seen is against Eto'o when Barca played Real Zaragoza
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQv4aIXaGQ4
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
xbhaskarx said:
anonnumber6 said:
Yeah, but considering the history of Italian fascism, I find it highly unlikely that he doesn't harbour certain racist views :lol
XiaNaphryz
LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
You'd be surprised what you hear in the stands during college basketball games in the US.Hari Seldon said:
Dreams-Visions
Member
pretty much.Combichristoffersen said:
KKK is still active in the USA, isn't it?iamaustrian said:
Just because you have progressive states, doesn't change the fact that there are southern states that are behind any European standards.
The problem with immigrants is also that they often don't give a shit and don't even try fitting into society, instantly taking "dey hate me" attire.
Personally, I am not racist but source of the hate towards Romanians here is obvious. I know some that fit well, but most of them just go on and instead of trying anything resort to stealing, cheating people out of their money by selling fake stuff, beating people up just because.
Thus, most of people hate them. Which in turn causes stealing and violence. And so on, and so on.
Some people give it a try, but most just don't give a shit. It's not only our fault, both sites of the conflict are guilty.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
Europe has never had the benefit of a Civil Rights movement to really make the populace more educated or empathetic about race relations.
Free society and whatnot.harSon said:
We can't really force people to be reasonable.
Active is one thing. Significant is another entirely. Not to mention we have groups like the Southern Poverty Law Center that, for all intents and purposes, negates them.CassSept said:
Also, for all the shit the South gets, it's not an issue unless you get out to the sticks, and that's really the same for anywhere in this country (or the world, really). Even then, it's largely a case of ignorance rather than hostility.
- Status