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[sciplore]

Never realized so much hate SMRPG got I still love it and think highly of it when I play. Overall my list would be:

1.Mario&Luigi:Super Star Saga- Simply the best took all the best aspects of the mario games and put them in a awesome world with wonderful battles.

2.Paper mario:TYOD-Big improvement over the original I might even hook up the old gamecube in order to play it again.

3.SMRPG- for a overall rpg its great but on how it closely relate to a mario game its a bit lacking but the overall charm is there.

4.Paper mario 1- Meh it was ok but it was pretty boring.

Never played the camelot games or the ds mario.

 

[MNC]

Where's the love for SMRPG? The best Mario RPG in my opinion.

 

[Compass]

It's not just your opinion, it's gospel.

 

[hydragonwarrior]

Man, what's with u ppl? For it's time, Super Mario RPG was pretty damn unique with the battle system (timed hits), awesome music, great graphics, and a humorous storyline. And how can u guys forget the awesome that is the Axom Rangers?

 

[Insaniac]

Man a lot of love for TTYD, i better play that one. Thankfully I beat the first one on VC

 

[The Hermit]

I want to play Thousand Year Door, because of the insane praise it receives, so I decided to play PM first for storyline sake.
I though it was meh at first, but after a while I saw the genius behind the game. Enjoying it almost as much as SuperMarioRPG( 4 star spirits since I stopped playing it.)

SuperMarioRPG has bonus points for nostalgia, and I think its the very first RPG I´ve have ever played. I can´t think of any complaint about it.

Mario& Luigi surprised me for the fun and the humor it had. Simple controls at first that got really complex at the end.

The sequel on the other hand is very, very bad. I couldn't even finish the game.

So I would rank them like this:

1. SMRPG
2. Mario & Luigi/ Paper Mario
.
.
.
10. Mario & Luigi 2

 

[Blackjack]

I still don't get the hate for Mario and Luigi 2. Sure, it's not as good as the first one, but I didn't think it was awful.

 

[A Link to the Past]

I still don't get the hate for Mario and Luigi 2. Sure, it's not as good as the first one, but I didn't think it was awful.

It wasn't awful, it was pretty good. It's just that SSS set the bar high, and M&L2 missed it by quite a bit.

 

[Staccat0]

I've only played the console ones, but I'd give it up to thousand year door followed by Mario RPG. Paper mario gets third. I need to play the handlheld ones.

 

[Davey Cakes]

It wasn't awful, it was pretty good. It's just that SSS set the bar high, and M&L2 missed it by quite a bit.

I don't even see this.

How did it miss the bar? The gameplay was mostly improved.

 

[Amir0x]

1. Paper Mario: Thousand Year Door
2. Paper Mario 64
3. Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga (GBA)
4. Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time (DS)









































































32792789423847328. Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Generic Squaresoft RPG wearing a Mario Mask

 

[CreatureX3]

1. Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door (GCN)
2. Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga (GBA)
3. Super Paper Mario (Wii)
4. Paper Mario (N64)
5. Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time (DS)
6. Super Mario RPG (SNES)

 

[Mejilan]

It's pretty clear-cut for me...

Paper Mario 2 > Paper Mario 64 > M&L GBA > M&L 2 DS > SMRPG > SPM Wii

 

[Forkball]

I can't believe so many people like TTYD over Paper Mario. TTYD had some great updates to the battle system, but the lackluster environments, forgettable story, and unforgiving backtracking really took away from the game.

 

[DeathbyVolcano]

I can't believe so many people like TTYD over Paper Mario. TTYD had some great updates to the battle system, but the lackluster environments, forgettable story, and unforgiving backtracking really took away from the game.

Slightly agree, but I still fucking love it.

1.) Paper Mario-Possibly my favorite N64 if you throw out both Zelda games. I had so much fun and was just floored when I first played it. I never thought there was a dull moment, and it's really the last Nintendo game I played that retains a lot of their past charm that you really don't find anymore. Galaxy, of course, made me reconsider that.

2.) Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door-Bigger, prettier, longer, but fairly boring at parts. Incredibly creative and beautiful, containing two of my favorite chapters in any RPG-Rawk Hawk and The Mystery Train. Gets a tad boring later on and ramps wayyyyy too much in difficulty in the end,

3.) Mario and Luigi: Superstar Saga-One of my favorite GBA games. I remember first getting it when I was in...8th grade I think? And I just sat in my room and played it for HOURS. I never wanted to put it down...I think I quit around 6-7 hours in. The only reason its lower is because I have a deep love for the Paper Mario games, and nothing has been able to surpass them in terms of Mario RPG games. Awesome battle system that got fairly repetitive, but still good nonetheless. It's a great fan-service as well, briming with great little nuggets to cater to old Mario fans.

4.) Mario and Luigi: Partners in Time-I honestly don't remember much about this game, other than being insanely bored with it about two hours in. Incredibly written and produced, but it was just a flat game throughout without any cool fan-service, I thought.

5.) Super Mario RPG-Blugh. I had good times with this as a kid, but revisiting it is like liquid shit in my eyes. Horrible controls, slow and boring battle system, ugly ugly UGLY models and levels, etc. The only thing that still stands out for me is the music. Cool story as well, I guess.

6.) Super Paper Mario-I played this once and never want to play it again in my entire life. What a soulless, rushed and horrible departure from the Paper Mario series. It looked gorgeous, but that doesn't make up for the literal lack of anything propelling the plot, development, or gameplay. This was when I realized the Wii was a little iffy for me.

 

[Justin Timberlake]

1. Paper Mario TTYD
2. Paper Mario
3. Mario & Luigi
4. Super Mario RPG
5. Mario & Luigi Partners in Time
6. Super Paper Mario

 

[Talladega Knight]

1. Super Mario RPG
2. Paper Mario 2
3. Mario and Luigi: SS
4. Mario and Luigi: PIT
5. Paper Mario

 

[SonicMegaDrive]

I can't think of any other Squaresoft games with enemies that look like either of them. Besides, I play games for how fun and charming they are on their own, not for their Nintendoness.

That's the right attitude!

 

[Jiggy]

Random disclaimers:

-I don't care about timed attacks. Except for one game in this list, which I'll mention when I come to it, I can nail them every time, so to me the entire system is merely a way to draw out the animations--and my tolerance level for battle animations lasting longer than like 0.4 seconds is pretty low. I'd rather have either the strictly mental planning of most turn-based RPGs or the dexterity requirements of an action RPG, not a hybrid.

-Not a particular fan of the Mario universe. I respect it for what it's done, but all the same I could do without it. Whether a game breaks away from it or not is moot to me.

-The odds of text entertaining me or doing much of anything other than making me mash a button to get through it are very low, and my relationship to game stories is that even when I love them I still hate them. More text means a worse game to me.



8. Super Paper Mario: C+ (barely that high)
Love 2D platformers, love action RPGs, love the Wonder Boy series, but really dislike SPM because I'm not sure I've ever played an easier or slower game. All it needed was some difficulty so that I wouldn't be yawning on any of my many quests to locate a password in a corner somewhere and traveling back over six minutes of unchallenging territory to enter it in (and I didn't even have the ones in World 5 in mind when I started typing this!), or sluggishly floating around a teleport puzzle for half an hour.

7. Paper Mario: C+
I'd like it a lot more if not for its slowness in pacing, walking speed, and battle system. In general I simply fail to understand what people love about it, because other than the great badge system it felt entirely unmemorable to me.

6/5/4/3. Mario Golf Advance Tour: B-
Great music, horrible partner AI. That last point wouldn't be a detractor normally, but team play is a huge part of the game.

6/5/4/3. Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time: B-
The Bros. Items make for the only RPG on this list--or any list--where I adored timed attacks, as they were hectic enough to keep me concentrating. Nonetheless, boss HP in Partners in Time is obscenely high and made those fights a drag, and I could do without the babies.

6/5/4/3. Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door: B-
A step up from the original in every way; if only I didn't have to switch to Yoshi whenever I wanted to run, this would be at least a B. Unlike the original game, I actually remember at least a few things about PM: TTYD, such as the train chapter, the arena chapter, or the great hub town.

6/5/4/3. Super Mario RPG: B-
Superb music, but another ridiculously easy game. Also too linear, but that's pointless of me to say since every other game above is too. Fun minigames keep the game varied enough, but mostly I think it's the music that kept me going.

2. Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga: B
Better than its successor at everything other than its battle system. That's the best part, granted, but Superstar Saga isn't too far behind in that regard and is so far ahead in terms of exploration that it wins out easily.

1. Mario Tennis Power Tour: A
Best music of the list, swiftest gameplay of the list, best pacing of the list except maybe Superstar Saga (at least once past Power Tour's awful fifteen minutes of opening dialogue), most enjoyable minigames and side-tasks (not sidequests) of the list. Not the best stat customization since it's hard to beat the badge system, but still really cool. Amazing game!



Overall I'm not that great a fan of the Mario RPGs and would be happy never playing any of them again except maybe Superstar Saga and definitely Mario Tennis Power Tour, which is one of my favorite portable games. Wish I played the GBC Mario Tennis (and Mario Golf, I suppose), since some say it's even better.

I listed my numbers as I did because I feel really uncertain about the order of those middle four games. On any given day I could swap them around.

 

[Slavik81]

1. Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars
2. Paper Mario 2: TTYD
3. Paper Mario

I haven't played the others. But, man. Paper Mario was really disappointing.

Because it is, as I said, essentially Final Fantasy with Mario slapped on, and I can't stand Final Fantasy-style RPGs. In fact, I hate most RPGs. The only ones I can stand, off the top of my head, are the later Mario RPG games and the Tales games.

What? I'll admit I haven't played all the FF games, but none I've played yet are anything like it.

If the old FF games were actually anything like Super Mario RPG, I'd play more of them. My impression, though, has been that they are not.

 

[GCX]

I loved that Mystery in a train chapter in TTYD. And also loved how some of the "battles" turned into quiz games. And Luigi's stories were definitely pure genius.

I actually loved the whole game.

 

[SonicMegaDrive]

Super Mario RPG and Final Fantasy IV/VI are nothing alike. At all.

They are similar in that they are both RPGs(although SMRPG is more of an Action-RPG, really), and they both have (although different) menu-based battles.

Oh, and there's a hidden boss that uses Final Fantasy music when you fight him. Whoop-ee-dee.

If anything, it's more like Chrono Trigger than FF.

 

[Keru_Shiri]

Actually, I would like it if someone pointed out the similarities between Mario RPG and other Final Fantasies. I know we can't be talking about music, the stages themselves looked fairly Mario-esque, and the enemies where either traditional Mario enemies or off-ball creations special to RPG.

Are we talking about the story? "Cause it was about as tongue-in-cheek as any of the paper Marios, and you can't fault it for bringing it's own main villains in when almost all the Mario RPGs have done the same (X-nauts, Cackletta, Bleck).

Serious question here, if someone can make a good point, I'll concede, but I just don't see it as being that similar.

 

[Blackjack]

I think this is the only place I've ever seen anyone say anything negative about Super Mario RPG (other than maybe how ugly its gotten). :lol

 

[Ravidrath]

1. M&L: Superstar Saga
2. Paper Mario: Thousand Year Door
3. Paper Mario
4. Mario RPG
5. M&L: Partners in Time
6. Super Paper Mario

1-4 are all all actually pretty close in my book, but Superstar Saga barely rises above the rest.

I loved the story, the totally irreverent and strangely anti-authoritarian (i.e. "Whatever you do, don't <desirable thing>!") sense of humor, music, some of the battle gimmicks and allusions, etc... The constant swapping in the overworld did get old, but I usually found the puzzles you were doing all the annoying swapping for quite rewarding.

Partners in Time certainly isn't terrible, but I felt they made a lot of poor choices with their changes. Psychologically, changing attacks into consumable items was a terrible idea, even though I never felt it really impacted me anywhere other than the final battle. The script and scenario also weren't nearly as clever as the first game's, either, in large part due to the fact that the villains couldn't speak. In the end, it felt like it was unfinished... I kept expecting some sort of hilarious revelation about the nature of the Shroobs that never happened.

What I'd love to see is Alphadream do an M&L game that crossed various Mario "mythologies." Basically, bring all the various villains and settings together from the other Mario RPGs and games.... Smithy, Cackletta, the Shroobs, etc.

 

[Dash]

I'll never understand GAF's hatred of Super Mario RPG.

 

[Son of Godzilla]

And I'll never understand it's love of TTYD. The game was the fucking definition of over-bearing. And the backtracking is on a whole nother level. They could have made a new game with the amount of times you had to transgress over the same old shit in it. No, fuck that. They could have made five other games. Seven. It's absolutely ridiculous. Not to mention the asshole translation that puts it's foot down and insists on making sure you understand 200% just how cute and adorable it is. The game is by far the worst of the series. It's not even close.

 

[Talladega Knight]

Starting with Slavik81 on, I agree wholeheartedly with those posters supporting Mario RPG. I have never understood the hate either. It's one of my favorite games of all time. The story, humor, soundtrack (AMAZING), gameplay, secrets, characters, etc, etc, etc, it all adds up to an amazing experience. I love it.

 

[SonicMegaDrive]

I'll never understand GAF's hatred of Super Mario RPG.

It always starts with just one.

And then:

it becomes cool bro

 

[Earthpainting]

Why are so many people in here whining about 'SMRPG hate'? I've barely seen any of it in this topic. The simple fact of the matter is that most people in here just seem to like the Mario RPGs that came after it much more. If any game is getting hate in here, it's M&L2. While it might not be the most terrible game ever made, it too belongs at the bottom of the Mario RPG pyramid if you ask me.

Slightly agree, but I still fucking love it.

1.) Paper Mario-Possibly my favorite N64 if you throw out both Zelda games. I had so much fun and was just floored when I first played it. I never thought there was a dull moment, and it's really the last Nintendo game I played that retains a lot of their past charm that you really don't find anymore. Galaxy, of course, made me reconsider that.

2.) Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door-Bigger, prettier, longer, but fairly boring at parts. Incredibly creative and beautiful, containing two of my favorite chapters in any RPG-Rawk Hawk and The Mystery Train. Gets a tad boring later on and ramps wayyyyy too much in difficulty in the end,

This is my reasoning for putting Paper Mario ahead of PM:TYD pretty spot on. PM:TYD made so many great tweaks to the series. It was bigger, used the paper gimmick a lot more and better, the battle system got deepened, the character sub-plots evolved past 'OMFG MARIO!!1 *joins*',... All great stuff. It was a real shame to see that the game's music took a hit, the locales were less interesting to me and that the amount of backtracking got tripled.

Still, even though I'm someone that doesn't really like RPGs, the two Paper Mario entries are some of my favourite games of all time. I'd seriously love another instalment but I won't mind if it takes another console generation.

 

[AniHawk]

Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door - 9/10: My favorite in the series, but I haven't played it in a long time. I thought the humor was best here and there wasn't too much story. I liked the variation (the Bowser levels and the Peach segments), and it was a good improvement on the first. When it came out, it was one of my favorite games of the year, and it's still one of my favorite games for the console (when you through multiplatform games and ports out).

Paper Mario - 8/10: I liked this game, but I can't remember why. It's been 8 years since I played it (holy shit, EIGHT YEARS!?) and all I have to go off of are pieced together memories.

Super Mario RPG - 7.5/10: I liked this game too, and the only reason for the half-point is so I can safely place it below Paper Mario. SMRPG was actually one of my first five RPGs (the others being Final Fantasy VI, Pokemon, Grandia II, and Skies of Arcadia), so there's a bit of a nostalgia thing going on here. I don't hate it like others do, but I think better games have come along.

Super Paper Mario - 7/10: Yeah, it's not much of an RPG, which is why the reason to have all that fucking text is so god damn perplexing. It's really my number one complaint, followed by some really crappy level design for at least two of the levels that spring to mind. It was pretty unique though, especially with its 2D/3D mechanic. Nintendo needs to use that for their next Mario platformer game.

Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time - 6/10: Yeah, I don't like the Mario & Luigi games. I didn't beat this one, but I think having more characters (and thus, slightly more variety), put this above its predecessor for me. I never really dug the humor either.

Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga - 5/10: The puzzles are usually pretty basic, like the Okami team developed the overworld or something. The dialogue isn't funny, and the battle system was way too damn basic for my tastes. The game just moved at a snail's pace and just never went anywhere. I can't think of anything BAD it did. It's just totally and completely average as a game.

 

[Regulus Tera]

I'll never understand GAF's hatred of Super Mario RPG.

I don't think it is hatred as much as factual understanding that the sequels surpassed it in every single way.

Except for Amir0x, natch; he really does hate it.

 

[ZeoVGM]

The OP had the correct list. Nothing has topped Mario RPG yet. Couldn't imagine putting it in last place. (And don't worry, those questioning the hate. It's just one of those GAF things. The game is amazing.)

That being said, there's yet to be a bad Mario RPG game.

 

[Aeana]

I don't think it is hatred as much as factual understanding that the sequels surpassed it in every single way.

Except for Amir0x, natch; he really does hate it.

There's a pretty big difference between "it's not as good as the others" and "I hate this game; it's terrible." I think you'll find much more of the latter in this thread than the former.

 

[ZeoVGM]

There's a pretty big difference between "it's not as good as the others" and "I hate this game; it's terrible." I think you'll find much more of the latter in this thread than the former.

Again, it's a GAF hyperbole thing. Outside of this here website Mario RPG is a beloved game.

That's not to take away from the greatness of the others, of course. I'll say one thing for sure though: no followup to the original has managed to have as memorable of characters as Geno and Booster and the like.

 

[jjasper]

The only problem I have with Mario RPG is that it introduces a lot of characters that have nothing to do with the Mario series. I know some people like this but it has always bothered me. Still a good game not horrible by any means. I still remember how awesome I thought it was that I got to control Bowser.

 

[Yottamole]

Interesting with the SMRPG bashes here...I've only played the GBA and DS games, but when I started playing SMRPG, I thought it was pretty dull. I felt like I was the only one, since everyone else said how good the game was. Until I came to this thread. :lol

 

[ZeoVGM]

The only problem I have with Mario RPG is that it introduces a lot of characters that have nothing to do with the Mario series. I know some people like this but it has always bothered me. Still a good game not horrible by any means. I still remember how awesome I thought it was that I got to control Bowser.

I'm not sure how that's a problem. It doesn't sacrifice actual Mario characters. You're basically saying they should never introduce new characters to the Mario franchise after Super Mario World, which is silly.

 

[beelzebozo]

i have no problem whatsoever with the fact that there are characters not from the mario universe. that's fine. what hurts it is that its writing just isn't very amusing (especially when you compare it to any of the other games), the battle system is considerably weaker, and it just isn't very attractive anymore. it's certainly aged better aesthetically than many psone rpgs, but set it beside any of the other mario rpgs in question and it is the ugly duckling.

 

[Shig]

Man, what's with u ppl? For it's time, Super Mario RPG was pretty damn unique

Exactly. I liked Mario RPG back when it was one of my first RPGs and prerendered graphics had a wow factor.

But I judge games based on how I enjoy them now, and I find any other approach to be ridiculous. I don't care who invented the wheel, I care about whoever refined it into the best wheel.

The only problem I have with Mario RPG is that it introduces a lot of characters that have nothing to do with the Mario series. I know some people like this but it has always bothered me. Still a good game not horrible by any means. I still remember how awesome I thought it was that I got to control Bowser.

Uh, TTYD had Grodus and the Xnauts and Twilight Town and those little bug guys and Rawk Hawk and etc. etc. etc.

Superstar Saga took place in an entirely different locale than the Mushroom Kingdom with a huge amount of new characters (Cackletta, Fawful, Peasley, Queen Bean, the Smithys, etc.).

That's not the problem at all. It's about making new characters seem like they were part of the Mario universe all along. SMRPG didn't do that, it felt like invaders from a different universe entirely.

 

[jjasper]

I'm not sure how that's a problem. It doesn't sacrifice actual Mario characters. You're basically saying they should never introduce new characters to the Mario franchise after Super Mario World, which is silly.

It really isn't a problem. Just an annoyance and it really has no negative impact on the game itself. I just enjoy the Paper Mario series (outside of Super Paper Mario) more since it keeps most of the characters from the Mario series in the front of the game (outside of the bad dudes in TTYD)

 

[badcrumble]

The only problem I have with Mario RPG is that it introduces a lot of characters that have nothing to do with the Mario series. I know some people like this but it has always bothered me. Still a good game not horrible by any means. I still remember how awesome I thought it was that I got to control Bowser.

They have to do with the Mario series because they are in a Mario game, just the same as any other one-off character in the rest of these games.

 

[ZeoVGM]

i have no problem whatsoever with the fact that there are characters not from the mario universe. that's fine. what hurts it is that its writing just isn't very amusing (especially when you compare it to any of the other games), the battle system is considerably weaker, and it just isn't very attractive anymore. it's certainly aged better aesthetically than many psone rpgs, but set it beside any of the other mario rpgs in question and it is the ugly duckling.

If you play the newer ones then Mario RPG, sure. That type of writing was unheard of in almost any games. (I can't think of one at all, off hand.)

And the battle system, again, I think that can be said for any SNES Square RPG for the most part, even loved games like FFV. If you play FFX first, then play FFV, it will feel weaker. It may even be deeper than FFX to some, but it would absolutely be slower and more archaic.

 

[beelzebozo]

sure, absolutely. i come to praise mario rpgs, not bury them. super mario rpg is a good game, but it's been topped several times over since then in nearly every measurable way.

 

[Shig]

If you play the newer ones then Mario RPG, sure. That type of writing was unheard of in almost any games. (I can't think of one at all, off hand.)

"Good for the time" is a free pass that needs to die. Father Knows Best was a great sitcom for the time. Would you rather watch that than Arrested Development?

 

[TheExodu5]

32792789423847328. Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Generic Squaresoft RPG wearing a Mario Mask

I'm still waiting for someone to explain how SMRPG is like Final Fantasy.

 

[Princess Skittles]

I'm still waiting for someone to explain how SMRPG is like Final Fantasy.

It's just the overall feeling the game has. It's through and through a SNES-era Squaresoft game with a Mario coat of paint. It's pretty much at the very top, very bottom or completely off of people's lists, showing just how polarizing the game is compared to the rest of the games.

 

[andymcc]

this thread reaffirms the fact that i really need to play superstar saga. it's the only one of the mario RPGs i have not played.

in regards to mario rpg, i think there are several aspects that have been trounced by future titles. however, nostalgia is gonna get the best of me here. it was the first rpg I finished on my own (I played the phantasy stars and chrono trigger with my dad) and im sure a lot of it's defenders are in a similar boat. i will openly admit that ttyd is definitely a better game, i just prefer smrpg.

 

[TheExodu5]

It's just the overall feeling the game has. It's through and through a SNES-era Squaresoft game with a Mario coat of paint. It's pretty much at the very top, very bottom or completely off of people's lists, showing just how polarizing the game is compared to the rest of the games.

No one has even used a concrete example. Saying "it feels like it" just isn't good enough. I honestly can hardly see any similarities between the two games. The only similarity I can think of is that battles are turned base...but all Mario RPGs are like that. I played Partners in Time and it felt just like SMRPG, but with slightly more complex gameplay dynamics, and a worse story/setting.

Earthbound is honestly much closer to FF than SMRPG is.

 

[The Blue Jihad]

Most people were actually antipating it because of the traditional platformer aspects. If anything, it retained the RPG stuff too much.

This. I was fucking psyched for SPM. LOVED the notion of a classic 2D platformer that had a wicked cool 3D flip feature.

Then I played it and while some of it was absolutely genius...other parts were...not so genius. The pacing was all screwed up. I loathed the dialogue and plot. Some of the environments were garbage, and I particularly dreaded having to go back to the town between each chapter. I finally put the game down for good at the

Spoiler

hamster wheel prison...thing

. That bit was the final straw. I traded the game in the next day.

Eventually I'll go back and give the game a second chance. But I'm not even sure about that, since I really, really, really, reaaaaally hate the idea that I need a Pixl for normal stuff like throwing bombs or running. RUNNING. It's a 2D Mario game...and I can't run.

Also, I really don't understand the SMRPG hate. I'm playing through it on VC and it's wonderful. Solid battle system, smart approach to item/equipment, goofy humor. Good stuff.