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Rottenwatch: THE THING (Dir. A Crazy Swede, Mary Elizabeth Winstead)

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Some day-after thoughts, now that I've had time to mull it over; I was really just relaying the experience of seeing it last night. Stuff has been bugging me more and more as I thought it over today.

The big problem I have is the Thing itself.
In Carpenter's version, it was a very patient creature, only striking out in the dark, a lone target, or when caught. That feeds the perception that it's a very intelligent creature, or at least, not impulsive. Even at the very end, it's knocking off guys in the shadows, one at a time, quietly.

That Thing is not this Thing, which unravels a bunch of tentacles and yawning mouths if you so much at sneeze in its direction, clumsily lurching down hallways. Why did it reveal itself in the chopper? That made no sense at all. It should have just hopped off with the rest, safe in knowing they didn't know which one of them it was. Unlike Carpenter's film, the Thing here is pretty crappy at absorbing and imitating people; it gets caught nearly every time, and some victims just run away (Kate). Why did it grab the first guy? The only point in imitating someone is so you can, um imitate them. That doesn't work if you are seen absorbing the target. The Carpenter version knew this.

The film would have been better served had they not found it that first night it broke out, but maybe - just maybe - it found someone.

Another touch in Carpenter's is how the Thing would give itself an out. When it was caught absorbing the dogs, some of it immediately escapes through the roof. It tied to do the same thing again with the head crab. Here, self-preservation didn't seem to be a priority.

It all adds up to make it seem like a brainless, impulsive creature, not the formidable opponent the '82 crew found themselves up against.

My other problem is the people themselves.

Carpenter's film had a dozen players, but they were all identifiable, likable characters. That film took its time establishing who everyone was, what their roles were, how they related to one another. Many scenes broke them off into pairs or small groups so we could get to know them better, before the carnage began.

Here, the crew was mostly bearded, anonymous fodder. I didn't even recognize half the guys that got killed, much less care about them. I was particularly disappointed that
the few Americans got special treatment deaths or screen time; the Norwegians were really just there to be monster chow. It was good to have a female lead, but the film was cowardly in its selection of who survived to the end.

And don't get me started on the functioning spaceship. Just flat-out stupid, and undercuts so much of the implied backstory. Dumb, dumb, dumb.
 
Ridley327 said:
In most cases, a horror film's budget is low enough so that it doesn't need to do amazing numbers to be ridiculously profitable. I strongly suspect that this film does not feature a small budget.

Wikipedia says $38 million.
 
I just assumed that in the prequel, it still hadn't adapted its tactics completely. Maybe after seeing that humans weren't pushovers, it decided to be a lot more sneaky about the way it worked.
 
THE-Pink-Dagger said:
It's terrible you mean. I don't understand why this bombs so badly, guess people are sick of horror movies (but hell horror movies never made big bucks anyway).

Or more likely people staying away from a shitty remake(or prequel) that disservices the original?
 
Saw it yesterday morning with a friend and loved it. We both consider Carpenter's version to be in our top 5 movies of all time and we both came out enjoying the movie. Sure, there were some plot point fails and some questions that we talked about for a good 2 hours after (we always do that after a film though), but it was, I thought, a damn good complimentary piece to Carpenters film and in no way tainted it. I thought they did a great job staying faithful.


I recommend!
 
GhaleonEB said:
Some day-after thoughts, now that I've had time to mull it over; I was really just relaying the experience of seeing it last night. Stuff has been bugging me more and more as I thought it over today.

The big problem I have is the Thing itself.
In Carpenter's version, it was a very patient creature, only striking out in the dark, a lone target, or when caught. That feeds the perception that it's a very intelligent creature, or at least, not impulsive. Even at the very end, it's knocking off guys in the shadows, one at a time, quietly.

That Thing is not this Thing, which unravels a bunch of tentacles and yawning mouths if you so much at sneeze in its direction, clumsily lurching down hallways. Why did it reveal itself in the chopper? That made no sense at all. It should have just hopped off with the rest, safe in knowing they didn't know which one of them it was. Unlike Carpenter's film, the Thing here is pretty crappy at absorbing and imitating people; it gets caught nearly every time, and some victims just run away (Kate). Why did it grab the first guy? The only point in imitating someone is so you can, um imitate them. That doesn't work if you are seen absorbing the target. The Carpenter version knew this.

The film would have been better served had they not found it that first night it broke out, but maybe - just maybe - it found someone.

Another touch in Carpenter's is how the Thing would give itself an out. When it was caught absorbing the dogs, some of it immediately escapes through the roof. It tied to do the same thing again with the head crab. Here, self-preservation didn't seem to be a priority.

It all adds up to make it seem like a brainless, impulsive creature, not the formidable opponent the '82 crew found themselves up against.

My other problem is the people themselves.

Carpenter's film had a dozen players, but they were all identifiable, likable characters. That film took its time establishing who everyone was, what their roles were, how they related to one another. Many scenes broke them off into pairs or small groups so we could get to know them better, before the carnage began.

Here, the crew was mostly bearded, anonymous fodder. I didn't even recognize half the guys that got killed, much less care about them. I was particularly disappointed that
the few Americans got special treatment deaths or screen time; the Norwegians were really just there to be monster chow. It was good to have a female lead, but the film was cowardly in its selection of who survived to the end.

And don't get me started on the functioning spaceship. Just flat-out stupid, and undercuts so much of the implied backstory. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

Or,

the thing learned the hardway that it had to be cautious, thoughtful and subtle about when and where to attack people because doing it the blutway proved to be far more difficult than it should have been. given that its an alien species, it may not have realized exactly how crafty people could be at first.

Plus it was frozen for who knows how many years so it was bound to be a little rusty to start off.
 
Oh, and to add....
One of the long discussions my friend and I had was about the spaceship. He immediately commented on how the spaceship didn't really mold too well with the thing itself. I agreed, but then we talked about the 82 version. Why did the spaceship crash to begin with? My long theory was always that the thing isn't the original owner of the spaceship. I feel like that theory is probably more prominent because of the addition of the "pod room" in this version. My view was that an alien species was going around collecting samples from other planets and stumbled upon the planet of the thing. There it proved to be more than this alien could handle and replicated/killed them all and caused the crash right around the time they were over Earth. It's smart, sure, but I always thought the thing was more feral clever then just super intelligent. And I agree that at after escaping from the ice, it went with it's first basic instinct which was to grab a life form native to it's surroundings and imitate it to survive. Not knowing really what it was grabbing or how intelligent this thing (a human) was. It was acting on it's basic knowledge. Now once it learned more about humans and how they worked/think/etc, it was able to create tactics to better blend/kill more.
 
Saw this today and just feel 'meh' about it. It's not offensive, but it's nothing to write home about either. It just feels so inconsequential. Granted, as a prequel it has to lead into the the '82 flick, but it makes no worthwhile additions to the lore.

Having seen John Carpenter's The Thing for the first time about a week ago, I still adore that one.
 
Ok, so I watched this tonight. I liked it. Quite a bit, actually. While a prequel feels so pointless, the film itself was really enjoyable for me. Really liked Winstead in this, the Ripley is strong in her. The Thing itself really freaked me out in a few scenes,
especially the fucking Head-Merge scene. That was actually really creepy. May have been the best bit with the Thing in this film. I mentioned to my friend that it was the most terrifyingly homoerotic scene I've ever seen
. The use of CGI didn't actually bug me too much. Creature still manages to unnerve me. I also thought the cast was decent. Surprisingly, Lars quickly became my favourite character asides from our designated protagonist,
which makes his fate even more depressing, but I like to think that him hunting the Dog-Thing throughout the night is what forced it to be far more clever and sneaky when dealing with the American camp.

Plus, they did a good job of nailing a bleak tone as well as some nice nods towards the Carpenter original.

Sander was the most unbelievable character though, just cause how so obviously douchey he was.

While it's not a popular idea, I'd be game for a sequel with Winstead's character, assuming she didn't freeze to death out in the Antarctic. But since the American team never found her frozen corpse, perhaps she survived. 'The Things' anyone? There's a lot of potential there.

So all in all, a decent film and I think a worthy enough movie to stand along the 82 film. Is it as good? No, but it is plenty enjoyable.
 
I liked the movie, it had its shortcomings but overall I feel like it wasn't enough to hold the movie down.

I really enjoyed how up until the interrogation of teeth sequence the movie almost mirrored the first one so I could see how people might be confused that this is remake.

Some of the sequences made me cringe, head-melding sequence and the one dude who had a face hugger on him while everyone just watched in particular.

I thought they showed the Thing too much though after that and it lost a lot of its scariness. Especially on the spaceship I thought it looked really lame.

One thing I was interested in seeing is how they got infected. The first girl in particular when she tried to kill off Wheaton was weird, when did she get infected? Was it off screen? As I recall, she was just watching them dissect it and started getting ill. Or the dude in the chopper.

The sequence with the Norwegian vs the Americans was super tense and I felt bad for the dude when all was said and done. I really disliked those two Americans after that. It's like they told you they had to lock you both up until they came up with a way to see if they were real or no and what do you do? Break out, knock Lars unconcious and then kill someone else? Yeah, good way to paint yourself guilty.

There's hope for Wheaton though, since the other guy told her there was a Russian base a few miles off.

Interested in watching it again but I can wait for the DVD/bluray.
 
CPR_defibrillator_fail.gif


Commented posted on 4gifs.

This is how they teach medical students how it's pointless defibrillating a guy's stomach.

All the years and I never noticed he was trying to defib in the wrong place!
 
Didn't really dig this. There wasn't any breathing room in the movie to build tension. The whole central concept of who is an alien and who is human is lost thanks to the movie going all ADD every 5 minutes and throwing some screaming CG monstrosity at you.

Oh well, Carpenter's brilliant movie will be around forever and holds up just fine.
 
Compared to modern day horror films, The Thing is pretty great. Compared to the JC original, it's not that great.

It's decent. Certainly not disappointed I watched it.
 
GhaleonEB said:
The big problem I have is the Thing itself.
In Carpenter's version, it was a very patient creature, only striking out in the dark, a lone target, or when caught. That feeds the perception that it's a very intelligent creature, or at least, not impulsive. Even at the very end, it's knocking off guys in the shadows, one at a time, quietly.

That Thing is not this Thing, which unravels a bunch of tentacles and yawning mouths if you so much at sneeze in its direction, clumsily lurching down hallways. Why did it reveal itself in the chopper? That made no sense at all. It should have just hopped off with the rest, safe in knowing they didn't know which one of them it was. Unlike Carpenter's film, the Thing here is pretty crappy at absorbing and imitating people; it gets caught nearly every time, and some victims just run away (Kate). Why did it grab the first guy? The only point in imitating someone is so you can, um imitate them. That doesn't work if you are seen absorbing the target. The Carpenter version knew this.

The film would have been better served had they not found it that first night it broke out, but maybe - just maybe - it found someone.

Another touch in Carpenter's is how the Thing would give itself an out. When it was caught absorbing the dogs, some of it immediately escapes through the roof. It tied to do the same thing again with the head crab. Here, self-preservation didn't seem to be a priority.

It all adds up to make it seem like a brainless, impulsive creature, not the formidable opponent the '82 crew found themselves up against.
In my experience the people making dumb movies in the 80s took plot and characterization more seriously, and that's why their product is superior.

I love The Thing (82.) Probably my favorite horror movie. It's an exquisitely dumb movie. Gooey alien monster eats people in Antarctica. Absolutely silly. However, the characters, even though most of them are nothing but chum, are well realized through what little dialog they get. The lines are delivered well, and the characters feel real. The monster has a stupid power, but the story treats the stupid power with respect. The scenarios for a shape changing, person eating monster are about as realistic as can be expected for such an unrealistic thing.

That's why the old "turn off your brain" excuse doesn't fly with me. It used to be that a dumb movie didn't require turning your brain off. The experience can be simultaneously stupid and cunning. Modern horror writing doesn't feature a lot of respect for the material.
 
Just got back from seeing this, I really liked it. Some of the CG felt a bit off at times, but visually it was great.
The test scene was particularly good for me. It was an imperfect test, so instead of figuring which is It, it just served to pit two groups against each other, what a great twist on it.

At the end it showed the frozen man in the chair. I had always thought he was strapped down and electrocuted, but I never even saw someone die on a chair. What happened there?
 
Draft said:
In my experience the people making dumb movies in the 80s took plot and characterization more seriously, and that's why their product is superior.

I love The Thing (82.) Probably my favorite horror movie. It's an exquisitely dumb movie. Gooey alien monster eats people in Antarctica. Absolutely silly. However, the characters, even though most of them are nothing but chum, are well realized through what little dialog they get. The lines are delivered well, and the characters feel real. The monster has a stupid power, but the story treats the stupid power with respect. The scenarios for a shape changing, person eating monster are about as realistic as can be expected for such an unrealistic thing.

That's why the old "turn off your brain" excuse doesn't fly with me. It used to be that a dumb movie didn't require turning your brain off. The experience can be simultaneously stupid and cunning. Modern horror writing doesn't feature a lot of respect for the material.

I don't know if I agree with your first point, one of the biggest complaints about 80s movies as a whole was poor characterization. One-liners really came to prominence then which are the easiest shortcut to making a character likable.

But I think all horror movies with big casts benefit from a rewatch. The first time you watch any horror movie you have the scares, grotesqueries, and the impending doom filling your head. You maybe appreciate the main character in the film, the one that makes it to the end, but everyone else kind of seems like kill fodder.

What happens on the rewatch is you know where the film is going so you start focusing on the other characters and you start noticing what the actors are doing. Just by the virtue of being other people they seem more defined. Sometimes bad acting can even endear you to a character or at least make them memorable. And the more you watch these large casts and learn about them, the more they seem like old friends. So the great horror movies (and ensemble films in general) become what are essentially hangouts. The Thing is so fun to revisit now because we get to see MacReady, Childs, and even Blair and Norris again.

I haven't seen this new film yet, but what will make me want to own it is that hangout factor. Which I won't even know until I see it for a second or even third time. Knowing where these characters are headed makes you look at them in a new light.

My favorite horror film, Dawn of the Dead, is a hangout film. It does that right for me. I want to see Flyboy and Peter and Fran and Roger again. I hate when some of their fates come to pass. And it's also why I feel the Dawn Remake is such a failure, on my rewatch I cared even less about most of those characters. Another horror hangout film is The Mist. I've rewatched that film so many times now. I just love seeing that cast again.
 
An-Det said:
Just got back from seeing this, I really liked it. Some of the CG felt a bit off at times, but visually it was great.
The test scene was particularly good for me. It was an imperfect test, so instead of figuring which is It, it just served to pit two groups against each other, what a great twist on it.

At the end it showed the frozen man in the chair. I had always thought he was strapped down and electrocuted, but I never even saw someone die on a chair. What happened there?
In the original film, that guy is there in the chair. When they showed him here, it felt like there was a scene deleted.
 
ChoklitReign said:
^ You have to admit that scene looks very poor by today's SFX standards. The opening belly and the hands coming off look so rubbery.
It might look unnatural, but it looks like it's actually there and solid. That's the part that CGI fails at so badly.
 
Oh fuck, I completely forgot to mention, but did anybody else notice what I'm 90% sure was a borrowed Icarus 1 distress beacon being used at the beginning of the film when they're tracking The Thing's ship?
 
Ridley327 said:
In most cases, a horror film's budget is low enough so that it doesn't need to do amazing numbers to be ridiculously profitable. I strongly suspect that this film does not feature a small budget.

It didn't. Though I don't know anyone who knows a budget I'd suspect that it's well north of $60m perhaps even reaching $75m+.

Universal brought Morgan Creek on at the last moment to co-finance the film. They wouldn't have done that if A) they were confident in the film or B) the budget was small thus making the film's losses easier to bare.
 
I liked the film a lot more than I thought, but agree with most of the complaints presented.

Just gonna spoiler all of it...

I can suspend my belief enough to see how The Thing is sloppy in the prequel, learns from The Swedes ("Norwegians, Mac"), and is more cautious when attempting survival in the US base- but the way GhaleonEB (I apologize if I'm getting my posters confused) broke it down, it really makes The Thing seem completely primal and not intelligent at all in the prequel.

Then again, after being frozen for 100,000 years, maybe it was just afraid, panicked (are we to believe this is the first time this particular organism has seen a 'human'? Possibly) and killing any chance it had? We learn in Carpenter's that it will survive any way it can... and the more aggressive route really doesn't work that well against humans and their weapons?

Or maybe it's just us making excuses for poor writing? :p

Regardless, the two films really work pretty well as a whole, I feel.

For me, the two best Thing effects were: the first time we see a glimpse of it under the cabin/building (the lighting made it work) and the mouth-sucking mini-Thing on ole' red beard. That last one was especially disturbing- especially when you see his left eye start hemorrhaging.
I also loved this version's take on the first autopsy. Seeing the imitation process of the human starting inside it was great... and horrifying.

I just think the majority of the CG effects in this film (like the practical effects in Carpenter's) would have been a lot more effective with better (err, more minimal) lighting.

The helicopter crash survival was dumb.
I also didn't like the overall score. Carpenter's The Thing had such a low-key, somber soundtrack (well, the quick homage to The Thing From Another World's score when they find the hole in the ice was a nice touch :D). This one just had this more bombastic, generic score. There were a few little keys here and there from the Morricone/Carpenter soundtrack, but not nearly enough. The 'Humanity' song at the very end was perfect, put up goosebumps, and reminded me just how much of a perfectly bleak song it is. Love it.
Watch Carpenter's version. The song that plays when the team is standing around the corpse from the Norwegian camp in the med bay was fucking fantastic. Same with the song that's played when Doc & MacReady are investigating the Nord base.

There is room for another The Thing, I feel. The Russian Base is mentioned as the closest base- but would Kate have any idea where it is? She had only been at the Nord camp for, what, a day? Two? The camp was also torched- but maybe she went back and salvaged a map? Could the Russians have heard the distress call that Windows makes in the Carpenter version?
It could happen, but it would have to be a strong script. Hell, why not just give Johnny Carpenter an actual budget for a change (don't think he's had one of those since In the Mouth of Madness), get Rob Bottin back on effects, and do it up right! :D

oh, and...

Maddness said:
Oh, and to add....
One of the long discussions my friend and I had was about the spaceship. He immediately commented on how the spaceship didn't really mold too well with the thing itself. I agreed, but then we talked about the 82 version. Why did the spaceship crash to begin with? My long theory was always that the thing isn't the original owner of the spaceship. I feel like that theory is probably more prominent because of the addition of the "pod room" in this version. My view was that an alien species was going around collecting samples from other planets and stumbled upon the planet of the thing. There it proved to be more than this alien could handle and replicated/killed them all and caused the crash right around the time they were over Earth. It's smart, sure, but I always thought the thing was more feral clever then just super intelligent. And I agree that at after escaping from the ice, it went with it's first basic instinct which was to grab a life form native to it's surroundings and imitate it to survive. Not knowing really what it was grabbing or how intelligent this thing (a human) was. It was acting on it's basic knowledge. Now once it learned more about humans and how they worked/think/etc, it was able to create tactics to better blend/kill more.

BINGO! Thought the same exact thing,
ala the first Alien film; xenomorphs overcoming the Space Jockeys

but then that's all ruined when you watch Carpenter's The Thing...
and starts rebuilding a spaceship under Blair's cabin with various parts around the base.

Oh well, good thought though. :)
 
Pretty disappointed with this movie, the 29-year-old original has more believable effects.

Really the best thing to come out of this would be if Ridley Scott watched this and made certain that Prometheus favors practical effects over CGI (although it may be too late for that).
 
My favorite moment was
when the two faced monster comes into the store room though the double doors and the guy was just trapped there with only a kitchen knife. Such an unstoppable monster, the feeling of helplessness would be beyond overwhelming. You see it turn that corner and it spots you, you know there is zero chance of surviving. Unless of course someone sneaks up behind it with a flame thrower like in the movie.

Oh and just a little note, the two faced monster is suppose to be the splitfaced monster from the 82 film. Splitfaced, not two faced. Guess they just wanted to change it up a little.
 
My first annoyance with this new version of The Thing is that it doesn't have the courage to call itself a remake. I understand the thought process of not wanting to roast a sacred cow but I told myself I wasn't going to be annoyed that John Carpenter's film was getting remade since it was itself a remake. The title is exactly the same, about 90% of the movie plays out like it's predecessor. If it wasn't for the last scene in the movie this would be completely accepted as a remake. Somehow if you brand your film a prequel it sets a lower bar and that is the only way this film can succeed.

The Thing 2011 feels more like a part of the Alien franchise than I rebirth of what everyone loves about The Thing. The film relies HEAVILY on the alien which wouldn't be so bad (who doesn't want more monster) if it didn't fail at the two elements that made The Thing great.

#1 - The Effects - If the alien and transformation scenes are going to be spotlighted this much it better damn sure work. While for CGI it is probably high level, there is no point where it even comes near the level of the previous film. It just looks like a video game, which is a weird complaint since I love video games. If I was playing Resident Evil or Dead Space and those creatures showed up I would think it was badass. When I'm watching a film and an obviously computer generated creature appears any sense of connection to realism I have with the film is shattered.

#2 - The Atmosphere - The need to have the alien eat up a good chunk of the screen time also ruins the tension and paranoia of John Carpenter's version. There is one extended scene where the crew starts to turn on each other and you see glimpses of what made the 80's Thing so great but for the most part the paranoia is replaced with the crew members running away from or fighting the alien.

This would have made for a great Alien 5, a movie that could have borrowed from The Thing instead of making an inferior replication of itself. Someone get me a blood sample and a wire, I know I've found an impostor.
 
Speedymanic said:
Maybe that's the scene, I only mentioned it as I saw this on their FB page...

No extra scene after the end of the credits, just what was playing at the beginning showing
Lars chasing after the dog/Thing in the helicopter
.
 
MetalAlien said:
Interview about how the Thing lost most of it's practical effects and pacing.
http://www.bloody-disgusting.com/news/26758
Alternate ending. I'll tag for the sake of it:

"I was very clear with Kate's fate in the draft. I understand that what I gave them doesn't help in terms of growing a franchise. But there's no way that she could survive. I had it written so that they chase after Sander [on the way to the ship at the end of the film]. They're in a snowcat but he isn't. But then you start to see his tracks they they're following to the ship get longer and longer and more alien. And you realize that he transformed into something that can go very fast on the ice. That's what the smart creature would do. So they get there and Carter checks the one flame unit they have and finds that it's almost completely out of fuel.

So they decide to take all of the fuel from the Snowcat and put it into the flame unit. Because it's better to kill this thing [than to be able to get away]. So at the end where she makes a decision that she thinks Carter is The Thing [and she needs to kill him], we realize that she is burning her fuel. She's burning her way home. And the last scene is her looking at the burning snowcat, with no other way of getting anywhere. And just the emotions of the past two days, she starts to cry and then just heads into the wind and starts walking. She is screwed. So that doesn't happen [in the final film], but then again, that may be what audiences want".

That is a great way to end it, and it's just depressing that this was gutted to what we got in the film. It sounds like the final version of the film bears little resemblance to what was written, and even shot. Fucking hell. :\
 
Insane Metal said:
I believe you. I want to watch this movie and to like it a lot. I hope it is as good as I'm expecting it to be :(

Just don't expect it to be as good as the original and look to have some fun with a film that tries to pay respect to the original and you'll have a good time.
 
The Culture Vulture said:
The Thing 2011 feels more like a part of the Alien franchise than I rebirth of what everyone loves about The Thing. The film relies HEAVILY on the alien which wouldn't be so bad (who doesn't want more monster) if it didn't fail at the two elements that made The Thing great.

Exactly what I was thinking.

I like aliens films, but that's not what the original was. It was about the suspense of who was assimilated and the connection that this gave you with the characters. I really didn't give a shit about anyone in the new one. I loveddddd MacReady from the first film, and everyone else was cool too and I actually knew all their names by the end of the film. That's what made the original great.
 
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