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Rottenwatch: WATCHMEN

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Woot, I have an advanced screening for tomorrow night. I'm only about 1/7th done with the novel, and I'm contemplating screwing this Psych exam and reading instead. Hmm..
 
DanielPlainview said:
The penis was beautiful if that makes a difference.
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the penis is evil

zardoz-head.jpg
 
Gary Whitta said:
Is the IMAX version the full movie or is it edited for time?
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All releases are cut down to 155 minutes.


Oh and one's who missed it in the previous page:
New website: http://6minutestomidnight.com/

Dunno if i should see it or not since I'm avoiding new clips.

EDIT: YEP! AVOIDING IT

Visit 6MinutesToMidnight.com and enter your name to experience a 10-minute long interactive trailer for Watchmen. You will enter the world of Watchmen, interact with one of the characters, and unlock exclusive content from the film.

The interactive experience is narrated by Rorschach (unfortunately, not Jackie Earle Haley, but a competent sound-alike) who takes you through an interactive inkblot game.

Solving Rorschach's puzzles by telling him what you see in their constant morphing shapes unlocks a video of each of the main characters in the film.

In the end, if you guess all of the inkblots correctly before time runs out, you're taken to the “winner” screen where you can download an exclusive image and video of each of the main characters.

Don’t expect any new big revelations by way of new footage and images, but, regardless, it's a pretty fun experience.
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DrForester's Journal.

March 2, 2009.

Saw screener for Watchmen tonight. Lots of old retirees in line, normal crowd for screeners. No clue what they're walking into.

Theater barely filled by curtain time. Showing up 4 hours early, totally unnecessary. Must investigate rumors that gofobo.com screwed up the pass givaways.

now on the thoughts....

Movie was good, seemed to exaggerate some of the violence, just because they could (And probably to remind people that yes, this is the guy who directed 300). Jeffrey Dean Morgan (Comedian) and Jackie Earle Haley (Rorschach) stole the show, both were amazing. Some might not like the
baleman
voice for Rorschach, but for his character it fits perfectly. Everyone else in the cast was good, even Ozzy (though I would defiantly say he was the weakest of the cast).

Things I liked:

The music was great, great use of many of the songs. Pacing was alright, thought I wonder how I would have liked the film had I not read the comic before. Fight scenes were well done, and more often than not, I did NOT notice the slow cam. Visuals were done well.

No squid (YAY!) but I didn't really enjoy the new take on it much either with it being a frame up on Manhattan, sure it more realistic ( :lol ), but still came off a bit silly.

Making sure Walter was in background scenes alot, especially when it was really subtle (few time sit was just thrown in your face)

Things I Didn't Like

Some of the little changes. Rorschach's origin story being tweaked so he himself kills the kidnapper by putting the butcher knife into his skull, rather than setting the place on fire and giving the guy an option to hack off his hand (maybe they were just avoiding having people compare it to SAW). Also didn't like that Dr. Manhattan didn't give the "Nothing ever ends" line to Veidt at the end (though it is included). Other changes to the end also like Nite Owl seeing Jon kill Rorschach, and then going to beat up Ozzy. Didn't buy him accepting Veidt's plan a s much as I did in the comic.

8/10 for me. Very well done adaptation. Thought a few changes were made for no apparent reasons, some made for totally obvious ones. look forward to directors cut.
 
Can someone explain the meaning of Manhattan's "nothing ever ends" line? It never made sense to me, especially in the context of when he said it.
 
Blader5489 said:
Can someone explain the meaning of Manhattan's "nothing ever ends" line? It never made sense to me, especially in the context of when he said it.
Click to expand...

I always took it to mean that everything Veidt did was only a temporary solution. Eventually mankind would go back to killing itself again. He could see the future again at that point (I always thought anyways)
 
Blader5489 said:
Can someone explain the meaning of Manhattan's "nothing ever ends" line? It never made sense to me, especially in the context of when he said it.
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It means what you think it means. "Nothing ever ends".

Exact qoute:
Adrian Veidt: I did the right thing, didn't I? It all worked out in the end.
Dr. Manhattan: 'In the end'? Nothing ends, Adrian. Nothing ever ends.

My that, Manhattan means that whatever they do, the humans will keep on fighting till the bitter end. No squid can change things. Even the existence of Manhattan itself didn't stop Russians from invading Afghanistan and planning to enter Pakistan. It'll be a "peaceful" world for a decade or two until they start fighting each other again.

That and there's Rorschach's Journal in "good hands".
 
DrForester said:
Things I Didn't Like

Also didn't like that Dr. Manhattan didn't give the "Nothing ever ends" line to Veidt at the end (though it is included). .
.
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:[ ! that's one of my favorite lines in anything, ever. It's pretty much at the top of the list of things I'd get tattooed on me if I ever were into tattoos.
 
SpeedingUptoStop said:
:[ ! that's one of my favorite lines in anything, ever. It's pretty much at the top of the list of things I'd get tattooed on me if I ever were into tattoos.
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shagg_187 said:
The hell? I know you said "It is included" but damn, that line should be included one way or another!
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Here's how it went..

Laurie says it to Dan at the end when they are finished with Laurie's mom. They're taking about how they can continue, and Laurie says the line, and says it's something Jon used to say to her.
 
Blader5489 said:
Can someone explain the meaning of Manhattan's "nothing ever ends" line? It never made sense to me, especially in the context of when he said it.
Click to expand...
None of it is permanent. In Veidt's mind, things have a beginning, middle, end. Manhattan sees it all. There is no such thing. He sees all of time, as a whole. Nothing ever ends, this situation will arise again and again, no matter what they did. Veidt thinks he won. Manhattan knows there was never anything to win to begin with it. Sooner or later, we all get what's coming. Veidt delayed human destruction with human destruction. How did that end anything, in the grand scheme of time? We will all die, eventually. Perhaps arise again. Nothing ever ends.
 
DrForester said:
I always took it to mean that everything Veidt did was only a temporary solution. Eventually mankind would go back to killing itself again. He could see the future again at that point (I always thought anyways)
Click to expand...

That's what I always thought it meant, but the actual phrase "nothing ever ends" never made sense to me, especially since ti could imply
Vedit's peace would never end
. I always thought it'd make more sense if he said something like, "everything comes to an end" or something like that.
 
DrForester said:
Here's how it went..

Laurie says it to Dan at the end when they are finished with Laurie's mom. They're taking about how they can continue, and Laurie says the line, and says it's something Jon used to say to her.
Click to expand...
Wow man, so a rather definitive scene doesn't even exist at all? :-/ This is probably the biggest disappointment for me, yea. I'll still see it, but damn.
 
DrForester said:
I always took it to mean that everything Veidt did was only a temporary solution. Eventually mankind would go back to killing itself again. He could see the future again at that point (I always thought anyways)
Click to expand...

Well, the thing about Manhattan's power is that he simultaneously experiences his entire life; I don't think that he can see what will happen to other people unless he interacts with them in the future in some way. Since he leaves the Earth for good at the end, my guess is that he couldn't see specifically what would happen to Earth; rather, I think that he meant his response to specifically refer to Adrian's assertion about "the end". He meant that time exists as a whole, not a linear experience, so Adrian's "end" is just another part of the whole, not some significant change in the entirety of time. Even if man never fought again and the world remained peaceful forever, Adrian's plan doesn't signify anything when weighed against the entirety of time.
 
DrForester said:
Here's how it went..

Laurie says it to Dan at the end when they are finished with Laurie's mom. They're taking about how they can continue, and Laurie says the line, and says it's something Jon used to say to her.
Click to expand...

Hmmm... very well then, but still! Manhattan should've said it :(

Oh well, you can't ask for everything :)
 
On the subject of Manhattan's "nothing ever ends" line (from the book), I took it in an even broader sense--I think he's stating a lot more than just the fact that humanity's behavior isn't going to change in the end. To a man who lives in the past, present, & future all at once there is no time, & without time, there is no end. In his enlightened or godlike state, I imagine Manhattan has a perception of time similar to the Buddhists, Hindus, or Taoists: no beginning, no end, no creation, no final judgment, time has no substance, we only attach substance & words to "past" & "present" items & situations to create time.

EDIT: Yeah, snowman said pretty much the same thing while I was typing this.
 
Charlatanized said:
On the subject of Manhattan's "nothing ever ends" line (from the book), I took it in an even broader sense--I think he's stating a lot more than just the fact that humanity's behavior isn't going to change in the end. To a man who lives in the past, present, & future all at once there is no time, & without time, there is no end. In his enlightened or godlike state, I imagine Manhattan has a perception of time similar to the Buddhists, Hindus, or Taoists: no beginning, no end, no creation, no final judgment, time has no substance, we only attach substance & words to "past" & "present" items & situations to create time.
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Bingo. just, such an epic line. Completely knocks "the smartest man in the world" off his block, in 3 simple words.
 
SpeedingUptoStop said:
Bingo. just, such an epic line. Completely knocks "the smartest man in the world" off his block, in 3 simple words.
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Damn, I hate you all :(
I'm sad now! DAMN YOU SNYDER FOR REMOVING 3 SECONDS OF MIND-BLOWING DIALOGUE AND ADDING 10 SECONDS OF EXTRA SHIT OF THE SAME DIALOGUE BUT TO SOMEONE ELSE!

:(

Bye all!

*cries*
 
I do understand Snyder's reasoning behind moving that line (he wanted that idea to be presented right at the very end of the film) but yeah it sucks that Manhattan doesn't get to say it.
 
shagg_187 said:
Damn, I hate you all :(
I'm sad now! DAMN YOU SNYDER FOR REMOVING 3 SECONDS OF MIND-BLOWING DIALOGUE AND ADDING 10 SECONDS OF EXTRA SHIT OF THE SAME DIALOGUE BUT TO SOMEONE ELSE!

:(

Bye all!

*cries*
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Like, the whole scene is epic sex, but that's the line you bust the nut over, mayne. knowwhati'msayin?
 
I haven't seen the movie yet, but now that the handling of that line & the line itself have been discussed here, it's going to annoy me when I see how it's done in the movie. But at least now I have an even greater appreciation of the line, & it'll always be in the same place in the book, said by the same character.
 
Honestly, most of the Cream of the Crop reviews seem to make complaints that have more to do with the actual plot itself, rather than anything to do with the movie itself or Snyder's direction. It seems like their actual problem lies with aspects of the graphic novel itself, rather than the film.

I'm really looking forward to the Director's Cut, though; if the theatrical version was cut for time rather than for quality, I have the feeling that this is one case where the director's original vision will probably be quite a bit better and more comprehensive. Watchmen, as a novel, is a slow-burning one; I imagine that the theatrical cut feels quite brisk, which is why I hope that giving it an extra forty or fifty minutes would make it feel like it's moving at a correct pace.
 
Fans of the book are going to be pissed.
The ending is completely changed, Dan (Nite Owl II) has a "Nooooooo!!!" line and Adrian Veidt's awesome villainy was subdued. He didn't even have a "Don't interrupt, that's rude" line. Also though Manhattan getting framed makes sense in the short-term to dumb the movie down for mainstream audiences, it really removes from the complex grand scheme Ozymandias has in the book that leaves you understanding why Nite Owl II or Manhattan wouldn't go against it.

Other than the end though, it was an awesome movie with tons of subtle things that fans of the book are going to love to notice. Though some much more subtle, all the gay references are still there too.
 
It's pretty ridiculous that people complain about penises. Unless one happens to hit the camera lense, then christy with cheese... what immaturity.

But whatever, I could care less what the general populace thinks. Fuck em.
 
Big Icarus said:
Wow. I don't even think the movie looks good, but that was the most condescending review of anything I've ever read. He may as well have titled it "Comics are for imbeciles, and Alan Moore is a cretinous hack; oh, and I didn't care for Watchmen much".

I guess the comic genre can still only aspire to be as unfunny and trite as the comics the New Yorker prints. In fact that unrelated panel sitting in the middle of the review shits all over anything Moore's written.
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I just read this review.

“Watchmen,” like “V for Vendetta,” harbors ambitions of political satire, and, to be fair, it should meet the needs of any leering nineteen-year-old who believes that America is ruled by the military-industrial complex, and whose deepest fear—deeper even than that of meeting a woman who requests intelligent conversation—is that the Warren Commission may have been right all along.
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DURRRR. WOMENS AND BOOBIES SCARE ME.

Jesus christ.
 
[Watchmen Review] Does a Flawless Adaptation Make a Masterpiece?

watchmenfinal33small.jpg


I’ll admit it. I’ve never heard of Watchmen until Zack Snyder was attached to direct during the summer of 2006. Since I hadn’t read the graphic novel the hype started when I saw the trailer before The Dark Knight. I knew it was something special and after reading the graphic novel during the past couple months my hype increased tenfold. After the lawsuit fiasco got resolved it finally sunk in, I would actually be seeing this very soon. Only watching the trailers and select TV spots, the day finally arrived. From the first frame of Watchmen, as lush yellow completely engulfs the screen while the company logos pop in, eventually fading into that iconic pin, we just hope Snyder doesn’t screw this up. Don’t worry, he doesn’t.

One may be hesitant about the slow motion Snyder is known for, as it is used pretty heavily in the opening scene. He eventually gets it out of his system as it tampers down the rest of the film and becomes quite seamless and effective. The brutality of the film is apparent from the beginning with the Comedian’s death. We feel every punch and it hurts. As the Comedian is thrown out of the window, the camera follows his fall to the pavement, focusing on his pin. As he hits the ground and the blood flows down the sidewalk we hear Dylan sing “The Times They Are a-Changin” and we are met with one of the best introductions seen in a long time. The Minutemen of the 1940’s are introduced in a series of pseudo “still shots” that change as the camera slowly moves around. It captures the essence of this doomed alternate world pitch perfectly.

After the introduction the story continues with Rorschach, played brilliantly by Jackie Earle Haley (Little Children). As he reads his journal he walks the audience through the story, which can be quite confusing for someone who has no previous knowledge of Watchmen. His performance is downright chilling as he becomes a dark hero. In my screening people were cheering for him during some painfully vicious victories towards the end of the film. His performance isn’t the only one to applaud. Jeffrey Dean Morgan (P.S. I Love You) who portrays the Comedian, mostly in flashbacks, is downright sadistic as a murdering psychopath with a certain charm. Billy Crudup (Dedication) also delivers an enchanting performance as the powerful Dr. Manhattan. He effortlessly echoes his vast knowledge, along with the lack of human compassion, in one of the best performances of the film. Malin Akerman (27 Dresses) as Laurie Jupiter aka the Silk Spectre II doesn’t quite deliver in a somewhat cold and calculated performance. It also takes a little while to warm up to Patrick Wilson (Lakeview Terrace) as Dan Dreiberg aka Nite Owl II, but once you spend sometime with the character, he is ultimately laudable. The rest of the cast deliver fine performances, nothing particularly special.

watchmenfinal26small.jpg


It’s no surprise that my favorite sections of the graphic novel are the same with the film. The movie takes a little while to get going but once we are met with Rorschach’s and Dr. Manhattan’s back story it is kicked into full gear and doesn’t let down until the end. The most beautiful part of the film is how perfectly Snyder was able to capture the graphic novel. Scene after scene I had flashbacks of my fingers turning the pages and in turn, seeing exactly what I wanted on screen. Unfortunately this is also one of the few downfalls of the film. Snyder traps these characters like Dave Gibbons trapped them into the frames of the graphic novel. Each scene moves with such rapid pace that it’s hard to get a full grasp of what is exactly happening. Each conversation is only on screen long enough as absolutely necessary before jumping to the next sequence. Knowing the story beforehand definitely had a hand in my enjoyment of the film. Since I knew was going to occur I could keep up with the pace. For a 2 hour and 42 minute film it surprisingly flies by with ease, giving the audience the big picture, as well as intricate details. With that said, I’m still very eager to see the 3 and half hour director’s cut. I was also slightly confused at some of Snyder’s musical choices. Leonard Cohen’s “Hallelujah” plays during Nite Owl and Silk Spectre’s intimate scene, making a complete joke of it. Simon & Garfunkel’s “The Sound of Silence” lives in the background during the Comedian’s funeral. While I love these songs, none of them seem to quite seamlessly intertwine with the film.

The film is disturbingly violent as well. Bones break, pregnant women get shot, rape is attempted, exploded guts hang from a ceiling, a butcher knife repeatedly hacks someone’s head, dogs get murdered, and limbs get sawed off. While it may be a bit much it fits with the film. The violence handed out by Rorschach is the most gratifying and deserved. The prison and the child murderer sequence deliver like no other. Some of the other incidences will have you wondering if it was necessary. Matched with the morbid brutality are scenes of breathtaking fascination. Dr. Manhattan and Silk Spectre II’s conversation about humans that takes place on Mars is one of the magical moments of the film. I won’t say much about the end, but just because there is no squid doesn’t mean it isn’t hauntingly beautiful.

Snyder has created an immensely enjoyable piece of entertainment that won’t disappoint fans, but may leave some new viewers in the dust. His adaptation is nearly perfect, but overall it doesn’t say much more than what it set out to do. The images of the graphic novel are all there, and the themes, for the most part, have effectively translated. This is like no comic book/graphic novel adaptation you have ever seen, mostly due to the fact how close Snyder has stayed to the source. It is a unique piece of cinema that will likely divide audiences. Some may think it’s overblown and forgettable, but while it likely won’t change superhero movies, it is a marvelously challenging story that deserves all the attention it has received.

8.5 out of 10
 
Rlan said:
Ryan Scott:

"Watchmen is one of the greatest movies ever made."

SOLD!
Click to expand...

That definitely turned my head. I was disappointed to read his post, that even after the ending Snyder also removed
any lingering shots of the aftermath
.
 
I read the Alex Tse script, so a question for people who watched the film:

Veidt dies in the end
?

Huge let down if true;
 
I just saw the film and enjoyed it overall.

About the ending
The Manhattan ending wasn't as bad as expected. It was almost okay but then I thought they should have shown other big cities nuked, as he does talk about LA and HK.

The rest of the film felt right, not enough Rorschach scenes ( how he makes his mask... ), no visual symmetry during what was supposed to be his chapter, but then there was no chapter. They nailed the manhattan part. The strangelove war room was cute but felt out of place. I expected to see Peter Sellers raise his hand. Bit too much of slow mo, but that was expected.

Didn't like the
"nothing ever ends" scene, it didn't fit at all.
 
DreamMachine said:
for those that have seen the movie, should I see it virgin or should I read the book?
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PLEASE read the book if possible. You will cum with excitement when you see comic book come to life. Ofcourse, if you can't read the book in a week then just go and see the movie :)

hyonoid said:
I read the Alex Tse script, so a question for people who watched the film:

Veidt dies in the end
?

Huge let down if true;
Click to expand...

You read David Hayter's script, not Alex Tse's script. If you are indeed positive you read Alex's script, don't hesitate in sending the link over to my inbox!

That said, I'm not sure whether Alex changed the scene you are worried about but that particular scene is NOT present in the movie or in the final draft of the script. Roberto Orci and Alex Kurtzman (The Island, Transformers) devoted four weeks to an uncredited last-minute polish of the screenplay. Zack Snyder himself made loads of changes to the script.

In short,
Ozy lives.
 
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