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[Reilly]

It is not about passing up one game. It is about trying to prevent the industry from doing this more and more.

This online pass "issues" will disappear once gaming goes digital-only (and it's coming). To those people buying used games: Enjoy it while it lasts.

 

[B_Rik_Schitthaus]

I'll rent and play a shit ton of on line in my 2 days.

 

[Orayn]

Should I assume "digital distribution" is always being said with bitter, hateful indignation? I can't make heads or tails of peoples' references to consoles getting more DD in the future.

 

[FINALBOSS]

I'm glad this has the online code. NR deserves all the money they can get from this game. Plus, any time I've ever bought a used game from Gamestop to play for the week (and then returning it) the code in the box is almost NEVER used. I got Bulletstorm last week used, and the code inside was never even touched. Redeemed it, played the game and had a blast, then returned it.

 

[FINALBOSS]

This online pass "issues" will disappear once gaming goes digital-only (and it's coming). To those people buying used games: Enjoy it while it lasts.

I like my boxes on my shelf though. It makes me feel less lonely.

 

[sixteen-bit]

I like my boxes on my shelf though. It makes me feel less lonely.

I like shelves and physical media so much. Even though I do enjoy the conveniences of DD, I prefer getting a physical product when I spend money.

 

[-PXG-]

I stepped out of this thread but wanted to see if something was mentioned it when I was gone. It wasn't so I figured I would mention it.

Would the people who aren't ok with passes be ok with them if there were multiple passes offered for a game? Say a game comes with five passes per copy. All of the issues raised in this thread would be solved.

I think that would be the most fair solution. The sixth person would have to pay the 5 or 10 dollar fee to play online.

Everyone in this thread can attest to lending and borrowing games with friends, family members, significant others, roommates, co-workers, so on and so forth. For the sake of example, lets assume that the online pass is now a standard and every game has them. The consumer has three options: One being a measly 2 day trial with a used copy, the second making them pay a fee (again, with a used copy) in order to play online. Lastly, the third being they had to buy a new copy of the game.

Basically, not being able to share games with your friends would be pretty lousy. Yeah, the publisher's ultimate goal is to optimize profits, and not make you and your pal Joey happy. But surely there is a happy medium where everyone wins. Right?

 

[lifa-cobex]

I stepped out of this thread but wanted to see if something was mentioned it when I was gone. It wasn't so I figured I would mention it.

Would the people who aren't ok with passes be ok with them if there were multiple passes offered for a game? Say a game comes with five passes per copy. All of the issues raised in this thread would be solved.

I would be pointless to do that.

The point of these passes is to STOP re-sales.
Having five passes would mean you could resell it five times.

It would make the whole object pointless.

edit: However it would still be nice in terms of playing with you're friends

 

[JambiBum]

I would be pointless to do that.

The point of these passes is to STOP re-sales.
Having five passes would mean you could resell it five times.

It would make the whole object pointless.

edit: However it would still be nice in terms of playing with you're friends

Why would it be pointless? It isn't an infinite amount of passes. If you buy used you take the chance of all of the passes being used up. Publishers still get people to buy new. The people who want to share their games with friends and family still get to do that. If you want to sell the game at a later time just don't use all of the passes. Everybody wins in that situation.

 

[The Lamonster]

Why is this thread so popular? It's not like this is the first game to use the Online Pass model.


www.whitewhine.com

 

[Mithos]

Agreed. Its only a matter of time. It would make reselling the game almost impossible and pointless.

And it would make millions of people to stop playing games on console, and it will make millions to think twice before buying a game, and even make people buy less games sadly.

A digital-only console future would pretty much end my gaming period.

 

[plagiarize]

This has always been the case for Nintendo.
Now, a more obnoxious example would be Activision keeping the prices high on CoD. Even if they frustrate me with other things, EA and Ubisoft both bring their prices down on very reasonable schedules, even for big releases. THQ is even better about this.

uhm... no.

we are to 'blame' for dlc, and $60 games, and games holding value. prices stay high on COD because it continues to sell. we accepted all these things. if we accept online pass, then that'll be our fault too.

remember when ubisoft tried to implement the always on internet connection for single player PC games? we didn't accept that.

companies only get away with what we let them. Ubisoft and EA and THQ aren't 'good' to drop the prices on their games on a 'reasonable schedule' it is entirely driven by consumers. if any of them had a series selling like COD or NSMB they would wait as long to drop the price.

some of my favourite content this gen was DLC or DD only.

i don't care what was planned to be on the disk originally. hell i don't care what exists on the files. all i care about is if the base game i buy is worth the cost i paid for it.

let's say the horse armour was on the disk for oblivion rather than sold seperately... so what? $60 still would be great value for a game with that much content, and $5 would still be shit value for horse armour.

and further more, we didn't accept horse armour at that price. we accepted some other things like early unlocks and fifteen dollar map packs, but if we'd accepted one piece of kit for $5 then it would have become common practice.

it hasn't become common practice.

 

[alr1ght]

Why is this thread so popular? It's not like this is the first game to use the Online Pass model.


www.whitewhine.com

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000009DZT/?tag=neogaf0e-20

 

[kodt]

This online pass "issues" will disappear once gaming goes digital-only (and it's coming). To those people buying used games: Enjoy it while it lasts.

True.

In my dream world all digital games will be 100% DRM free.

OR

If they use a fairly non-intrusive system like Steam, you should have the ability to sell the game digitally which would remove the licence from your account.

www.whitewhine.com

This is a video game forum. Of course there are plenty of better things we could all be doing with our time than posting here. In the context of video games though, this is a big issue.

 

[plagiarize]

And it would make millions of people to stop playing games on console, and it will make millions to think twice before buying a game, and even make people buy less games sadly.

A digital-only console future would pretty much end my gaming period.

which is why it won't happen. say Sony and Nintendo go digital only, that leaves a market of people that want physical releases for Microsoft to get exclusive access too.

games are no different from books, or music, or movies in that regard. there will always be a market for the physical media, even if it ends up being quite a bit smaller than it currently is.

 

[lifa-cobex]

Why would it be pointless? It isn't an infinite amount of passes. If you buy used you take the chance of all of the passes being used up. Publishers still get people to buy new. The people who want to share their games with friends and family still get to do that. If you want to sell the game at a later time just don't use all of the passes. Everybody wins in that situation.

I get where you're coming from but it would make the initial point, Pointless.

They want to stop second-hand selling full stop. Having five passes would be leniant to it.
It could also help piracy with people selling the passes online.

 

[kodt]

which is why it won't happen. say Sony and Nintendo go digital only, that leaves a market of people that want physical releases for Microsoft to get exclusive access too.

games are no different from books, or music, or movies in that regard. there will always be a market for the physical media, even if it ends up being quite a bit smaller than it currently is.

IDK about that. Books are different since the physical ink and paper is used directly for reading.

Movies and Games though are still digital these days, they are just on a physical disc. In a digital only world all you have to do is copy your game or movie to a DVD or Flash Drive and boom you have a "physical" copy.

Movies are quickly moving to a digital future, with more and more people opting to use Netflix and Hulu plus. Amazon is offering streaming video. Netflix offers a streaming only plan. Cable providers are offering more and more on demand content. Brick and Mortor rental stores are hard times.

Maybe not next gen, but we movies and games will eventually be pretty much all digital.

 

[Mithos]

If they use a fairly non-intrusive system like Steam, you should have the ability to sell the game digitally which would remove the licence from your account.

If this happens, I may be onboard for the digital-console-world.

 

[thoughtspeak]

reply

over reacting much?

No not really. my passion for gaming has got to the point where it can't overcome the BS that comes with it. your own mileage may vary

none of this stuff is exclusive to this generation, and virtually all of this stuff was around going back to the NES.

Be as that may, it seem the inclusion of the internet has brought this BS in my face compared to the background noise of previous gens


console wars have existed forever.

Not to this extent

people talking vulgar awful shit has been at the arcades forever.

Depends where you used to play. Never really experienced anything but competitive banter in any arcade i ever played in. In any case, nobody in their right mind would trash talk to point of racial slurs to my face unless they were 6'8 and built like a pro wrestler amd even then id probably still lunge for them.

if you want to game socially, grab some friends. if you don't have said friends, well, you couldn't have gamed socially without said friends back then either.

I do have said friends, but online mode removes the motivation for them to come round to game..its more convenient to them and they dont quite understand why im so against it, especially with fighters. Im sorry, i just feel like a twat playing by myself and talking into headsets, especially as i like to play my music at the same time.

plenty of pointless gameplay shit tacked onto games back then. scores in games that don't keep a high score tally? hello...

having a high score list didn't effect the games overall direction. catering to the "OMG no Multi no buy" crowd does.

genres always trend in video games. platformers during the NES/SNES days? Sports games. shooters. RPGs.

Not at the expense of other genres. When was the last good beat em up? Hack and slashes are going the same way too. there are less of the type of games I like and i haven't got enough love for the hobbie to try everything new and different that comes along anymore.

Patchy unfinished games? On the PC you have such shining examples as Ultima IX. On consoles there are TONS of consoles where you could break or corrupt a game through unintentional acts.

While this is true, the release now patch later mentality means more games are being intentionally put out half assed, just to maximise profit margins. If their was a game breaking bug last gen or even before that, it was something that easily could of slips Q&A now, it doesnt even seem to exist.

And exorbitant game prices? That ABC 20/20 special someone just posted from $19.88 had a NES game at Toys R Us for.... $59.99 (yeah, I found that hilarious). Shit... games are actually among the cheapest now as they've been ANY time in history. Heck, even that $49.99 console title in 2001 has an estimated value of $62 now. Paying $50 in 1995 for a Saturn or PSX launch title is basically $72 now. And $30 on Pokemon Blue is like $40 right now.

and neogeo games were like £100 a pop. So what? the value you are getting from todays games simply dont match their prices.

The point being.. this generation didn't invent expensive games. it didn't invent inappropriate trash talk. it didn't invent useless game features. it didn't invent beating game genres to death. etc. this is shit that has existed in the industry forever. if you're getting old, it doesn't have to do with any of this stuff (36 here, btw)

I never said it did. I did say that the way things are going and presenting themselves in a way thats more in-my-face its high time i stepped off the bus entirely.

 

[plagiarize]

IDK about that. Books are different since the physical ink and paper is used directly for reading.

i don't see how they are different. there are many other things on which you can read. i mean, sure if you want to pretend that the kindle and the ipad don't exist, be my guest, but you aren't reading these words in ink and paper.

Movies and Games though are still digital these days, they are just on a physical disc. In a digital only world all you have to do is copy your game or movie to a DVD or Flash Drive and boom you have a "physical" copy.

i think you know what i meant by a physical media. if you didn't, i am talking about the content being something you can buy in a store and take home and put on your shelf, or something that has to be shipped to you in the mail. with coverart, etc.

Movies are quickly moving to a digital future, with more and more people opting to use Netflix and Hulu plus. Amazon is offering streaming video. Netflix offers a streaming only plan. Cable providers are offering more and more on demand content. Brick and Mortor rental stores are hard times.

Maybe not next gen, but we movies and games will eventually be pretty much all digital.

and that is where you are wrong. yes, there is a shift towards downloaded media, but that shift will slow and eventually an equilibrium will be found, and while the physical copies may end up being a minority they will remain an important market.

it may be a small market now, but who predicted that vinyl would outlive 8 track and cassettes and co-exist in a world with CDs and iTunes?

you can ignore the people in this very thread telling you that they choose physical media over digital downloads, but businesses won't, not all of them anyway.

 

[kodt]

i don't see how they are different. there are many other things on which you can read. i mean, sure if you want to pretend that the kindle and the ipad don't exist, be my guest, but you aren't reading these words in ink and paper.

It is different though. A person can read a book directly. But we can't read a BluRay or DVD. We need a device to do it for us and electricity to power the device. For that reason I think the physical book will always have some value.

I am not denying the existence of e-readers and reading on digital devices. I am just pointing out that physical books still have some advantages over eBooks.

i think you know what i meant by a physical media. if you didn't, i am talking about the content being something you can buy in a store and take home and put on your shelf, or something that has to be shipped to you in the mail. with coverart, etc.

I know what you mean, but how you receive the content makes no difference. The publisher is still just taking digital files and putting them on a disc, and then mailing it to you. Why not just download the digital files directly?

The only reason you like having a copy to put on your shelf is that it appeals to your sense of materialism and collecting things (pretty much all people in our society have this I am not singling you out). While there may be some cool artwork there, it really serves no useful purpose. A digital copy that you can make backups of would be no worse, and possibly better.

It is possible that in the future the only collectors editions will have physical copies, and the game might not even be in the box, just a Steam activation code.

and that is where you are wrong. yes, there is a shift towards downloaded media, but that shift will slow and eventually an equilibrium will be found, and while the physical copies may end up being a minority they will remain an important market.

Possibly, right now the physical BluRays still offer advantages over streaming. They offer a higher bitrate in both video and sound, which means a higher quality image and sound. They also won't suffer from bandwidth issues that could cause the streaming video to slow or stop. In years to come these advantages may go away and digital options may offer just as much as the physical options. When this happens, and broadband is widespread enough, physical sales will largely go away.

it may be a small market now, but who predicted that vinyl would outlive 8 track and cassettes and co-exist in a world with CDs and iTunes?

Vinyl is not a significant part of the market. It is a niche for enthusiasts now. Of course there will always be small exceptions. I am saying physical media will not be the primary way we consume music, games, or movies in the future. Some physical mediums will still exist of course.

you can ignore the people in this very thread telling you that they choose physical media over digital downloads, but businesses won't, not all of them anyway.

It only takes time. As new generations grow up using digital services more and more the demand for physical media will die out.

This thread is an example, who would have thought we would stand for one time use codes and online passes? 10 years ago people would laugh and say this would never work. But in this thread we have people saying it isn't that bad, and to stop complaining. People will let business persuade them into moving to digital if it is in the interest of the business (hint: it is).

 

[KevinCow]

This thread is an example, who would have thought we would stand for one time use codes and online passes? 10 years ago people would laugh and say this would never work. But in this thread we have people saying it isn't that bad, and to stop complaining. People will let business persuade them into moving to digital if it is in the interest of the business (hint: it is).

Publishers could ask for the heart of your firstborn in exchange for the privilege to play their glorious game and you'd have people on here spinning it into a way it's not so bad and people should stop complaining.

 

[ElRenoRaven]

Publishers could ask for the heart of your firstborn in exchange for the privilege to play their glorious game and you'd have people on here spinning it into a way it's not so bad and people should stop complaining.

Bah it's just your firstborns heart. You can have more children. ;p

 

[afternoon delight]

Yeah, okay. I pay for the internet already, I paid a year to play on the system, and now I'll just play something else while it drops to nothing on the used market.

Dear dog when will this become unacceptable?

 

[Facism]

just another game I don't need to care about, then. many more games out there to fill the void, no big deal.

 

[I NEED SCISSORS]

Then I guess i'll have to pass on online!

...

 

[MC Safety]

This online pass "issues" will disappear once gaming goes digital-only (and it's coming). To those people buying used games: Enjoy it while it lasts.

That is not going to happen.

A relatively small percentage of console owners hook their devices up to the Internet.

 

[Emitan]

Publishers could ask for the heart of your firstborn in exchange for the privilege to play their glorious game and you'd have people on here spinning it into a way it's not so bad and people should stop complaining.

You can just go play something else if it bothers you so much, you whiner.

 

[jobe13]

The only problem I have with the whole "online pass" thing is I have my Xbox in the living room and my son has his in his room. So if both of us want to play online, I either have to buy him his own copy (which I know game companies want) or pay an additional $10 on top of the game's full price. So once again, honest consumers are punished.

 

[alstein]

The only problem I have with the whole "online pass" thing is I have my Xbox in the living room and my son has his in his room. So if both of us want to play online, I either have to buy him his own copy (which I know game companies want) or pay an additional $10 on top of the game's full price. So once again, honest consumers are punished.

Why not just let him use your account? Or put your account on his 360 passworded?

Seems like it's not a problem other then some mild annoyance.

 

[Tylahedras]

Yeah, I'm not playing this game with publishers.

Spoiler

accidental pun

I accidentally bought Crysis 2 at launch forgetting it was an EA game, I should have waited. I'm going to bargain bin / ignore any game that has this as a feature. Well essentially I'll just treat it as a single player only game.

Since this is a fighting game this feature makes it worthless to me, so I'll just skip it altogether.

 

[fernoca]

Yeah, I'm not playing this game with publishers.

Spoiler

accidental pun

I accidentally bought Crysis 2 at launch forgetting it was an EA game, I should have waited. I'm going to bargain bin / ignore any game that has this as a feature. Well essentially I'll just treat it as a single player only game.

Since this is a fighting game this feature makes it worthless to me, so I'll just skip it altogether.

You do know that Crysis 2 doesn't have an online pass, right?
That code's only for a weapon skin and some other misc. bonuses. Crytek and EA agreed to not put an online pass for Crysis 2 on any platform.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

If companies really have that much of a problem with consumers buying their products used, they should try charging less for their games then, especially on unknown, unpopular titles. Not every game is worth $60 and they know it. Online passes is much worst than DLC imo. Both are optional, but lack of online play can have a much more dramatic effect on the game than DLC. I have 2 X360's and 2 PS3's, so this really sucks for me because as soon as you sue the online code on one console, you have to pay for the other one since the code has been used up.

Don't we also have to pay for extra fatalities as well?

Also anyone embracing an all digital download future are just asking for more chances to be taken advantage of by greedy companies.

 

[Messi]

Does not bother me, I buy most of my games new.

But when I have bought used ones, 80% of the time the code is not used.

 

[fernoca]

Don't we also have to pay for extra fatalities as well?

Nope.
The only announced DLC at the moment is: Kenshi and Lady in Red (Skarlett). Each will be full downloads and not unlock keys. Of course those 2 characters will include their respective special moves, fatalities, etc.

I have 2 X360's and 2 PS3's, so this really sucks for me because as soon as you sue the online code on one console, you have to pay for the other one since the code has been used up.

If you have the same account on each console, you don't need to pay anything else. In the worst case scenario, you might need to use an USB drive on your 360s with your account on each. But on PS3 is a matter of just activating the account and downloading the online pass; unless you use different accounts to play on each console.

 

[Attack You]

Why not just let him use your account? Or put your account on his 360 passworded?

Seems like it's not a problem other then some mild annoyance.

It's not ideal to share an account with two or more people when your friends are expecting to communicate with one person and end up with someone entirely different. And, they can't login with the same account at once anyway, if they wanted to play two different games.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

Nope.
The only announced DLC at the moment is: Kenshi and Lady in Red (Skarlett). Each will be full downloads and not unlock keys. Of course those 2 characters will include their respective special moves, fatalities, etc.


If you have the same account on each console, you don't need to pay anything else. In the worst case scenario, you might need to use an USB drive on your 360s with your account on each. But on PS3 is a matter of just activating the account and downloading the online pass; unless you use different accounts to play on each console.

Thanks for the info. Actually, I have different accounts on all of my systems.

 

[CadetMahoney]

Online passes mean jack shit to the person who doesn't care about multiplayer, or at least tacked-on multiplayer.

For example Dead Space 2. Multiplayer is shit. No benefit from the online pass. No online achievements. A whole spectrum of end users (achievment whores, single players) don't lose anything I would argue. The ppl who looked for multiplayer can find much better experiences in other games.

At the end of the day I don't think that put off used game buyers AT ALL.

Now a game like Mortal Kombat. . . this is different as the person buying the game is very highly likely to factor in multiplayer as a must-have feature and play competitively (at least the same as SF4). With virtually no arcades in the USA to gain high level competition you really need to have some way to play other ppl. As shit as online may be ppl will take what they can get.

Plus they really have to do something about the people who come into Gamestop on day 2 and look to save 5 bucks on the used copy. Really, 5 bucks? You wont support the developer over 5 bucks?

This will stop that $5 less thing if the person shopping realises the game doesn't have the $10 online code.

If people are buying used to get $5 savings of a new price, sorry but they're doing it wrong.

If a high street store sells a newly released game for $5 less than retail without the code and ppl still buy. . . then smh. For games which have half-assed multiplayer tacked on with no achievements I can understand if they don't give a shit and buy $5 less.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

I wouldn't be surprised if people buy used copies days after release to save a few bucks. Don't forget that Gamestop pushes used games HARD. A customer can go in intending to buy a new copy, but after being pestered about saving money, magazine subscriptions, preorders and membership cards, they walk out with a used one. This is what publishers have had a problem with in the past.

 

[MMaRsu]

Wow another game I won't buy. Fuck online passes, I want to resell my game and not for 10% of it's value.

I wouldn't be surprised if people buy used copies days after release to save a few bucks. Don't forget that Gamestop pushes used games HARD. A customer can go in intending to buy a new copy, but after being pestered about saving money, magazine subscriptions, preorders and membership cards, they walk out with a used one. This is what publishers have had a problem with in the past.

Riiiiiiiiiight. So you're telling me publishers are using this online pass system because a certain store in the US pushes used game sales? I doubt it.

And now Batman will maybe have an online pass too? FOR WHAT? It's a fucking SP game.
This shit is getting ridiculous, the industry is setting itself up for a major crash. Well deserved too.