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[guek]

What demos? The Bird one and the Mii games? And Zelda? The Mii ones were clearly not meant to show off its graphical capabilities, and I gather the other two were quickly thrown together on pre-alfa dev. kits.

The bird demo was so quickly put together, the onstage demo was an older and clearly inferior version of what was on the show floor. How the hell does something like that happen?

And iirc, nintendo said the zelda demo was put together in a really short time frame as well, like a few weeks or something.

 

[bgassassin]

Remember, games for this gen of consoles take 18-24 months and 25 million $ , next gen it's only logical that games will take 24-36 months and 40 million $ budgets. As well, I wouldn't be suprised to see another 10 dollar increase per game. With more DLC to boot. Fun times ahead.

No that's not logical at all. We would see those "death of consoles" articles being legitimate.

Still kinda sounds like a friend-of-a-friend story though. Couldn't it also possibly mean a new 360 revision we don't know about yet or something?

I don't see the reason to test a revision (don't know what would be revised).

 

[Saint10118]

Still kinda sounds like a friend-of-a-friend story though. Couldn't it also possibly mean a new 360 revision we don't know about yet or something?

Completely agree and like I said it reads like complete fanwank bullshit - she was pretty emphatic about it being the next console. I asked what he was playing on said machine and she said she didn't know because she only was into RPGs.

 

[eso76]

That's not quite the argument I was raising though. Crysis 1 had some pretty hefty system requirements when it first came out. Even going back to when these current consoles came out, there was a sudden jump in system requirements on PC. Of course a lot of the games coming out then were designed for multi-core processors. A single core all of a sudden just didn't cut it.

It's true that PC developers have never really got the most out of the hardware as they have to cater to all types of set-ups, but it's also true that consoles are currently holding back what could be done on the current PCs despite that.

Edit: I'll just add that Battlefield 3's system requirements aren't exactly low.

Still, Crysis was eventually released on consoles, and while i haven't played the game, i believe it's the same experience across all platforms, graphics aside.
The point though, is few developers can afford to lose a significant part of the audience by releasing games that will only run on very high end machines.

A lot of developers can't even afford to make games for a "single" platform (PC). I wouldn't say consoles are holding back PC's, it's more a case of "not pushing". Slightly different perspective, although the outcome is the same, but that's why i believe the real next gen starts when consoles are released.

Battlefield 3 might have high requirements, but console versions don't play any different and don't look too different either. In relative terms of course; but in youtube videos, when the game is stripped out of IQ, higher res textures and smoothness, all versions look a lot alike - that's not a generational leap in my book.

That's why i disagree when people say next gen is on pc.
For various reasons (mostly related to market) a lot of the time "prettier current gen" is a lot more accurate.

 

[FyreWulff]

The bird demo was so quickly put together, the onstage demo was an older and clearly inferior version of what was on the show floor. How the hell does something like that happen?

And iirc, nintendo said the zelda demo was put together in a really short time frame as well, like a few weeks or something.

The bird demo was probably an older stable build that had to be finished in time for the presentation so it wouldn't crash in the middle of it.

The one on the floor could be farther along/a more recent version because journalists would understand why if it crashed if it did.

 

[thetechkid]

Anyone many any "10 < 360" jokes yet? If not I call that.

 

[guek]

The bird demo was probably an older stable build that had to be finished in time for the presentation so it wouldn't crash in the middle of it.

The one on the floor could be farther along/a more recent version because journalists would understand why if it crashed if it did.

Are you saying the on stage demo was rendered live? Isn't it more likely that it was pre-recorded anyway?

 

[Hyuga]

I see.
Ten times more powerful than the Xbox360.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Are you saying the on stage demo was rendered live? Isn't it more likely that it was pre-recorded anyway?

I thought they said it was live?

 

[Hyuga]

I hope it has at least a GTX 580-level GPU. Or is it possible they might actually pair two weaker GPUs?

lol what?
Where are talking about consoles here.

 

[Drkirby]

I will be happy if the GPU in the next Xbox is equal to my GTX 460. As long as resultions stay at 1080p, I think it should be good for the long haul.


Also, has anyone made a joke about Microsoft trying to one up the PS9 in advance?

 

[guek]

I thought they said it was live?

Was it? I honestly can't remember. I don't recall them saying that onstage...

 

[AwShucks]

This has probably been said already but...we went from "Loop" in 2013 to "Ten" in 2012?

I don't buy it.

 

[PumpkinPie]

Umm...when is "holiday"?

 

[Nirolak]

Umm...when is "holiday"?

It generally refers to October-December.

 

[PumpkinPie]

It generally refers to October-December.

Thanks


I'll buy it for a high price!

 

[wsippel]

The bird demo was probably an older stable build that had to be finished in time for the presentation so it wouldn't crash in the middle of it.

The one on the floor could be farther along/a more recent version because journalists would understand why if it crashed if it did.

What they've shown on stage was most certainly a video. Which makes even less sense, as the showfloor demo was not only more advanced, it was also interactive and rendered twice. Just by turning off the second screen, they could have improved the quality for the stage demo even further. Without interactivity, they could have improved the geometry and texture quality by quite some margin as well (not that there were any noticable problems with either to begin with, but whatever). The whole demo was very odd and not really a good "techdemo" to wow people.

 

[Luthos]

They should just make Halo 4 a launch title for the new Xbox. Guaranteed huge install base.

 

[Raide]

They should just make Halo 4 a launch title for the new Xbox. Guaranteed huge install base.

Also do what they did for Halo Anniversary but with Halo 2&3 and launch it for Next-box.

Also release an improved HD version of the Gears Trilogy.

 

[guek]

They should just make Halo 4 a launch title for the new Xbox. Guaranteed huge install base.

I dunno. Halo is still big but I don't think it has the draw it used to. It's suffering from severe franchise fatigue imo.

 

[Wazzim]

SONTENDO am cry.

 

[TheStevo]

Halo 4 launch title then?

 

[AzureNightmare]

the quality of these xbox rumors as of late have been really amateurish. I don't expect anything to come of them.

 

[perfectchaos007]

I hope this rumored release date puts pressure on Nintendo to get some better tech into the WiiU.

 

[rpmurphy]

Completely agree and like I said it reads like complete fanwank bullshit - she was pretty emphatic about it being the next console. I asked what he was playing on said machine and she said she didn't know because she only was into RPGs.

Well, testing doesn't necessarily mean actually playing a game on it. It could be testing hardware, firmware, services, etc. Maybe it could have been just having the chance to look at it or briefly touch it, and not formal testing. Even if it may actually be true, it's still hard to tell because you never know what info might have gotten changed in the chain.

 

[CvGz]

Just my two cents but if the next gen Xbox will be released as soon as 2013, then I suspect the next hardware gen will have moderate CPU upgrades, competitive GPUs, and a healthy amount of RAM. The economy is weak and China is restricting the production of materials needed for consumer electronics to raise their profit margins. I don't think a "blow everything out of the water" hardware generation awaits us.

 

[FyreWulff]

What they've shown on stage was most certainly a video. Which makes even less sense, as the showfloor demo was not only more advanced, it was also interactive and rendered twice. Just by turning off the second screen, they could have improved the quality for the stage demo even further. Without interactivity, they could have improved the geometry and texture quality by quite some margin as well (not that there were any noticable problems with either to begin with, but whatever). The whole demo was very odd and not really a good "techdemo" to wow people.

Wouldn't have mattered if it was real time or a video, they would have had to have a stable build that was recordable in time for the presentation.

 

[pslayer666]

Also release an improved HD version of the Gears Trilogy.

So that will be the new trend next-gen? HD games redone in 'improved' HD? Will it really be worth the trouble?

 

[amstradcpc]

I don´t understand why people say it woul be more powerful if launched in 2013. These consoles ( Microsoft´s and Sony´s at least ) will launch in 28 nm. It will be years to reach 22nm good yields for AMD, ARM, and so on. Only Intel is two years ahead of everybody in fab process and will get 22nm in 2012.
Besides, launching for example a 175 watts console in 28 nm leaves margin to a shrink to 22 nm and making the console cheaper. After 22nm maybe it will be years to get smaller than that. If you wait to launch 175 watts console in 22nm you will be stuck in that process for many years.
This is the correct time to launch.

 

[BigJonsson]

They are doing it wrong

The Bad Religion song is 10 in 2010, not 10 in 2012

 

[Opus Angelorum]

Paul Thurrott isn't that popular with some folks, but he does know his stuff concerning anything Microsoft.

 

[DieH@rd]

GDDR5's current density is 2Gbits per chip. It would take 16 chips to reach 4GB.

Why dont console makers just design motherboard with one/two ram expansion slots [non user replaceable], and move all those 256MB ram chips away from the motherboard? Mobo design will instantly became much more manageable, and hopefully CPU cooling system can encompass this new heat source.

 

[Majanew]

2012, 2013...if it doesn't at least give me Samaritan graphics during gameplay, I'll be disappointed.

 

[HollovVpo1nt]

Also do what they did for Halo Anniversary but with Halo 2&3 and launch it for Next-box.

Also release an improved HD version of the Gears Trilogy.

How big of a jump are you expecting? Impoved HD version of Gears Trilogy? Gears looks amazing. So does Halo 3 btw..

 

[mclem]

x10 - Xbox 3600.

A natural followon from the Atari 2600!

 

[DeFiBkIlLeR]

2012, 2013...if it doesn't at least give me Samaritan graphics during gameplay, I'll be disappointed.

3 x Nvidia 580 performance within a small home consoles power/cooling requirements.....not a chance in hell for at least another 3-5yrs.

 

[Ryaaan14]

The 10 will fit in nicely next to my Nintendo Revolution. Hell, I'll probably even buy a Natal for it.

 

[Majanew]

3 x Nvidia 580 performance within a small home consoles power/cooling requirements.....not a chance in hell for at least another 3-5yrs.

Yeah, but Epic did say it is possible to achieve on one 580.

 

[DeFiBkIlLeR]

Yeah, but Epic did say it is possible to achieve on one 580.

Well i can run Crysis at 1080p at Max settings and 16xAA on my old Radeon 4850....at about 5fps.

So not really of any use TBH.

 

[mclem]

Completely agree and like I said it reads like complete fanwank bullshit - she was pretty emphatic about it being the next console. I asked what he was playing on said machine and she said she didn't know because she only was into RPGs.

While it's a tired complaint, I think it might be fair to state that a machine a *year* before release has no games.

I guess he could have been testing backwards compatability. But if he's in the hardware side of things, it's very unlikely he'd have any real playable content to work with - and if he's in the software side, it's quite likely he'd be working to a rough similarly-specced PC rather than actual devkits.

 

[Majanew]

Well i can run Crysis at 1080p at Max settings and 16xAA on my old Radeon 4850....at about 5fps.

So not really of any use TBH.

That's different than having a game built around a card and taking advantage of it.

 

[derFeef]

Well i can run Crysis at 1080p at Max settings and 16xAA on my old Radeon 4850....at about 5fps.

So not really of any use TBH.

Keep in mind that the 360 has a 1900(XT) equivalent for it's graphics processing. I don't believe you could run Crysis 2 in such a PC without any major problems. A closed system is a largely different thing than a desktop PC.

 

[mclem]

Even then, you can bet Xbox Ten/ Loop/ Whatever will ship with Kinect and a wireless controller as well. I don't see either company having an edge in that regard, both ship with expensive peripherials.

Shipping with Kinect? I'm not quite sure I buy that, unless it's going to be the central focus of the system. Kinect is useless to me; that's not an "EEEK, MOTION CONTROLS!" thing, I just plain don't have *room* to use it.

I don't think my situation is all that uncommon, either. Kinect's still fairly demanding, uh, *architecturally*. At the very least, a pack without Kinect *has* to exist - unless, as I indicated before, it's the entire focus of the system.

 

[thirty]

This is sounding more like a hardware revision ala pstwo or psone than anything else. Tiny form factor, revised silicon all on one chip. Not some upgraded hardware, kinect bundled and all for 129. Enough to kill both Wii and ps3 for the rest of this gen and it'll sell enough to create profit to help offset losses from launching the new box.

 

[[Nintex]]

Just my two cents but if the next gen Xbox will be released as soon as 2013, then I suspect the next hardware gen will have moderate CPU upgrades, competitive GPUs, and a healthy amount of RAM. The economy is weak and China is restricting the production of materials needed for consumer electronics to raise their profit margins. I don't think a "blow everything out of the water" hardware generation awaits us.

AMD can surely deliver the goods and the CPU will also be a nice upgrade along with more RAM. Don't forget that when the Xbox 360 launched, it had all sorts of mumbo jumbo new tech that wasn't used anywhere else. This also applies to the PS3 with the then expensive blu-ray drive and whatnot. The technology that these consoles are counting on: GPU with shaders, tesselation etc., CPU for gaming use and RAM are cheaper these days. They don't have to reinvent the wheel or break the bank since pretty much all TV's max out at 1080p.

The main focus like Thurott said is going to be integration with the other Windows 8/Metro devices, MS can take their entire community with them over Xbox Live and I expect full backwards compatibility if they go with another IBM/AMD combo and that is very likely.

A lot has happened on the hardware front since the 360 launched 6 years ago. The next Xbox will show a leap in graphics and features. MS has been selling $399 Kinect bundles during holiday 2010 so I think that proofs that there's a market for a $399 device. Maybe they'll take a hit and launch it at $299. It's true that they likely won't take a $200 hit on this new machine but I don't think that is necessary given the current state of technology.

As for games these seem (rumored/some even confirmed) to be in production as of 2009/2010:
Alan Wake 2(rumored)

MGS Vancouver FPS title(they removed the 'Fps game for Kinect' bit from their website and replaced it with: Our mission is to push the limits of proven and unexplored game development and show the world what's possible on Microsoft's game consoles)

Halo 4(might've been moved to the next Xbox, might be a Twilight Princess sort of deal)

Forza World(confirmed to be in development, rumored to be shown at E3 2011)

These are the ones I remember but I also recall Fable 4, Saints Row 4 being mentioned as next gen games earlier.

 

[kitch9]

I hope it has at least a GTX 580-level GPU. Or is it possible they might actually pair two weaker GPUs?

No change in hell, more like a die shrunk 6870ish custom affair.

Plenty for 1080p with optimised workloads.

 

[Router]

2012 seems a little early. 2013 would probably be a better fit. That being said we have no idea how far along in development they are with the console or the launch titles. It would be very interesting for them to unveil it at E3 and go "Oh yeah, its on sale in 8 weeks (or whatever) Apple style" Would they do that? Probably not.

 

[Confiture]

lol what?
Where are talking about consoles here.

The Xenos was great even when compared to PC GPUs of the time (ati x1800/x1900) when the 360 came out.
We had to wait a full year to see gpus (nvidia series 8) that used unified shaders like Xenos.

Ok it was in a different economy but still...

 

[Limanima]

Holiday 2012? Not bloody likely if they've got Halo 4 coming out for the 360 then.

And what if they release Halo 4 on the XBox T? That would be the perfect combination for them.

 

[aDDiKt24]

Heavily doubt this claim. With Halo 4 launching it adds more fuel to the fire and I could see them putting it onto both the 360 and Nextbox, but we will see in time. I dont believe it though!