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[Pompadour]

I do agree that practice would be shitty and I'm not trying to call you out, but is there an example of any game that has ever not outlined what would be included in the season pass before putting it up for sale?

I feel like there's a lot of season passes that do so. Didn't Fallout 4's season pass do exactly that? And even if they give you names of DLC, they don't necessarily tell you how large or expansive this content is. There's a big difference in value (I know value is subjective) between Automatron and Far Harbor for example.

To be fair, I think the outrage over Season Passes is overblown. People should just be smart consumers or show some restraint in their purchases. But in the scenario I outlined I can see how forking over cash for content not yet detailed can be problematic. But still, if people would just wait and read reviews they could assess if the value of the content is worth the price of the season pass.

SFV, for all the shit it gets, did it right. It tells you what's included on the PS Store. Of course, that doesn't stop people from apparently buying something without reading the paragraph of text on the store page explaining what the pass contains.

How long have season passes been around at this point? I feel people are being intentionally obtuse if they don't know by now what a "season pass" includes. Everyone who's moderately involved in gaming as a hobby should know by now that a season pass doesn't mean all DLC and crying "but it's called a SEASON pass!" is no longer an excuse.

 

[flkraven]

As I've said in a previous thread, Rainbow Six Siege is the gold standard for how games should approach season passes (especially fps).

-The game is a full priced product (ie. $60):
-Characters are unlocked through progression (just like every other FPS/fighting game), but that progression comes in the form of in game currency (renown)
-You get renown fairly quickly, and I had all of the operators 'on the disk' in about a week.
-You get every single DLC map & game mode for the entire life of the product

If you purchase the Season pass you get:
-An additional 8 operators
-The ability to play the operators 1 week earlier than those that don't own the DLC
-a few extra skins and a mild renown boost

However, those that don't own the DLC can still purchase every single additional operator with in game currency that is earned by playing. These operators are fairly expensive (like 10-15x more than standard operators), but it isn't impossible to purchase your most desired operators fairly quickly. None of the DLC operators are game-breakingly essential though. I've had the game just over a month and I have 3 of the 6 available operators unlocked and have no desire to get the others.

Likewise, most skins can be purchased with renown too with the exception of some which require real money currency to acquire. Nothing is pay to win. Nothing is essential. You can spend tons of money or none at all and everyone is on a level playing field.

So basically, this:

Season passes should come in free updates after the games release

 

[BHK3]

Pw3 has a bad pass because its ported content from previous games and its bikini costumes for bad characters.

Unless youre witcher and driveclub, I can't think of any good passes. They are sorta meant to rip you off, that's the nature of dlc, publishers are not your friends.

 

[grap3fruitman]

How would you compensate the cost to make that content?

I didn't realize the games were given out for free.
How about continuing sales of the title? Isn't this what Titanfall 2 is doing?

 

[Pompadour]

I didn't realize the games were given out for free.

So you're suggesting that games with DLC should sell for more than $59.99 to cover the cost of future free DLC.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

Season passes should come in free updates after the games release

Yeah, if only it were that easy (and free) to make additional content for a game.

The entitlement I see something, man.

More people would buy the game. It doesn't disappear from store shelves.

Well considering that season passes/DLC is aimed at improving user retention rather than acquiring new users, what you say doesn't really add up.

 

[KingBroly]

This is the golden standard for Season Passes.

I think Hyrule Warriors' Season Pass was better, but Legends threw in a new one and kinda soured me on it cuz it's too confusing. I'm just going to wait for an NX port, which I think will happen. If it doesn't, oh well, I still think the original season pass provided enough content to justify its' price.

Mario Kart 8's Season Pass included 16 tracks, 6 new racers and some kart parts. If you bought the SP you got 8 colors for Shy Guy and Yoshi. The game also added amiibo costumes for Miis AND 200cc (which, while cool, is clearly experimental).


Street Fighter 5's Season Pass at $30 is an example of NOT how to do DLC. They released not only a $25 bundle for PS4 for CPT stuff which isn't nearly enough to warrant the price, but it's got less content for more money on PC. They also released additional swimsuits and costumes and stages ON TOP OF the existing season pass and CPT bundle while still not having a product near worth the $60 price tag, even with all of that DLC.

 

[Spman2099]

Season passes should come in free updates after the games release

So... no more updates? Gotcha.

 

[Pompadour]

Street Fighter 5's Season Pass at $30 is an example of NOT how to do DLC. They released not only a $25 bundle for PS4 for CPT stuff which isn't nearly enough to warrant the price, but it's got less content for more money on PC. They also released additional swimsuits and costumes and stages ON TOP OF the existing season pass and CPT bundle while still not having a product near worth the $60 price tag, even with all of that DLC.

You cite SFV's Season Pass as an example not how to do one and then immediately talk about everything but the Season Pass itself.

Not including the Guile stage as a bonus, the Season Pass gets you $60 worth of content for $30. Now, you can argue whether characters should be $6 and costumes should be $4 but the value of the Season Pass compared to the DLC itself is very good.

I think you came here in looking to shit on SFV and you had to contort your argument in an odd way to fit the premise of this thread.

 

[cHinzo]

Borderlands 2 had one of the best season passes. So much content.

 

[MikeyB]

If a season pass is paying for content in advance at a discounted price, then I believe the bare minimum of selling a season's pass should be providing a schedule and list of products that are included in the package. Like Driveclub.

Anything less leaves the consumer at risk.

I've lucked out in the past (Borderlands 2), but it is a stupid gamble.

The demand for free content is unreasonable. Content subsidised by selling other DLC is okay (Overwatch and GTA: online), but if the subsidy depends on whales, it makes the entire thing slimy (Overwatch).

 

[dh4niel]

Actually telling customers exactly what content will be included in the season pass would help.

 

[Corpekata]

So... no more updates? Gotcha.

I mean, this is plainly not true for a lot of games.

Not to say that I totally agree with that person, but there's loads of ways to add new content besides season passes, especially in multiplayer titles.

Compare Overwatch's success to all the other multiplayer games that have season passes this year, for instance. Overwatch is a mega-hit and has added characters, levels, etc with many more to come without purchasers needing to spend a dime. Sure, it has cosmetic microtransactions but so do most of the other MP focused games with season passes. Meanwhile Dice is struggling to keep a game with Star Wars in its name afloat.

 

[KingBroly]

You cite SFV's Season Pass as an example not how to do one and then immediately talk about everything but the Season Pass itself.

Not including the Guile stage as a bonus, the Season Pass gets you $60 worth of content for $30. Now, you can argue whether characters should be $6 and costumes should be $4 but the value of the Season Pass compared to the DLC itself is very good.

I think you came here in looking to shit on SFV and you had to contort your argument in an odd way to fit the premise of this thread.

No, I came in here to praise to Hyrule Warriors because it's often overlooked by Mario Kart 8's season pass, despite offering a plethora of content for the price, and IMO, more content than what MK8 offers (although HW's SP costs $8 more).

My point about SF5's season pass is that how much it doesn't include despite being called the "2016 season pass." What it provides is meager and the fact that other content is offered on top of it confuses people every time it's revealed, as people constantly ask 'is it in the Season Pass?'

 

[Airbar]

Season passes should come in free updates after the games release

Mind boggling how so many people think this is insane. It's the way fucking PC games worked before Bethesda had the idea to monetize horse armor.
I get that coming from consoles the notion of a dev supporting and adding content to a game FREE might seem alien but it has been that way on PC since the internet was a thing.

 

[BennyBlanco]

I believe Mario Kart 8's DLC was done wonderfully well.

2 DLC Packs with enough content to fill an extra half of the game for $12!

This is the gold standard as far as I'm concerned.

 

[SmokedMeat]

You cite SFV's Season Pass as an example not how to do one and then immediately talk about everything but the Season Pass itself.

Not including the Guile stage as a bonus, the Season Pass gets you $60 worth of content for $30. Now, you can argue whether characters should be $6 and costumes should be $4 but the value of the Season Pass compared to the DLC itself is very good.

I think you came here in looking to shit on SFV and you had to contort your argument in an odd way to fit the premise of this thread.

Street Fighter V's season pass is hardly a good value. On top of that it's not really even a season pass as the bulk of released content has to be purchased separately.

And this is on top of a game that released in a content starved state.

 

[Aters]

KT's waifu costumes really don't work well with One Piece's art style.

 

[KJRS_1993]

Mind boggling how so many people think this is insane. It's the way fucking PC games worked before Bethesda had the idea to monetize horse armor.

Since when? That's definitely not my experience from when I was younger. This comes across as slightly revisionist. (it definitely wasn't a standard thing at least).

I especially remember Baldur's Gate, Command and Conquer and Total Annihilation having their own expansion packs that you had to buy, and they're all from the mid 90's.

 

[Vespa]

Bought both MK8 and Driveclub's season passes, it can't be stated enough how good the value is for those two. From a consumer point of view it's how it should be done with clear communication on what you're getting.

 

[Pompadour]

My point about SF5's season pass is that how much it doesn't include despite being called the "2016 season pass." What it provides is meager and the fact that other content is offered on top of it confuses people every time it's revealed, as people constantly ask 'is it in the Season Pass?'

And my point, from my post at the top of the page, is those people need to read.

I'm all for calling Season Passes something else as the name doesn't mean anything but, by this point, people should know it's just a term for a chunk of DLC. People who ask "is it in the Season Pass" but won't read the description on the store page surprise me. People who go ahead and buy it without knowing what's in it baffle me.

 

[SocksAndShoes]

Mind boggling how so many people think this is insane. It's the way fucking PC games worked before Bethesda had the idea to monetize horse armor.
I get that coming from consoles the notion of a dev supporting and adding content to a game FREE might seem alien but it has been that way on PC since the internet was a thing.

This is 100% objectively wrong.

 

[KingBroly]

And my point, from my post at the top of the page, is those people need to read.

I'm all for calling Season Passes something else as the name doesn't mean anything but, by this point, people should know it's just a term for a chunk of DLC. People who ask "is it in the Season Pass" but won't read the description on the store page surprise me. People who go ahead and buy it without knowing what's in it baffle me.

When you buy a season pass, you expect to get whatever content comes out between the first promised DLC and last DLC because it's in that time frame. Not only that, if something comes out between those 2 points and isn't included in their Season Pass purchase, it makes the purchase look worse and perceived to be of less value.

 

[Mushroomer25]

Season passes should come in free updates after the games release

It kind of defeats the whole purpose, no? The economy of a season pass is giving the dev extra revenue to make content that otherwise wouldn't be in the final game. Free updates are always cool, and can even boost sales of the base game - but you're always going to need a revenue stream to keep up support. That either means charging directly for the content, or implementing microtransactions.

 

[kunonabi]

MK8 and Hyrule Warriors are still the best implementations as far as I'm concerned. Hyrule Warriors is packed enough in it's base form and the season pass adds so much more for such a small price.

 

[Famassu]

Season passes should come in free updates after the games release

From some publishers for some games, sure. Sony gets tons of money from PS+, Valve & CD Projekt get a big share from every game sold through Steam & GOG etc., so you can make an argument that they have enough cashflow even without a season passes to offer at least SOME post-release content for free (not necessarily all of it). Some games like GTA sell so well that out of good will it's cool if the publishers/devs throw some free content.

But no, I don't think it's right to demand this to be a universal practice for every game ever. This idea that no game should ever charge any money for post-release content is just pathetic entitlement from gamers.

 

[Neoxon]

When you buy a season pass, you expect to get whatever content comes out between the first promised DLC and last DLC because it's in that time frame. Not only that, if something comes out between those 2 points and isn't included in their Season Pass purchase, it makes the purchase look worse and perceived to be of less value.

That's what happens when you don't read the description of what you're buying. For what was explicitly described, SFV's 2016 Season Pass is a pretty solid deal (& that's not factoring in the Air Force Base stage & the Season 1 characters' colors that were added to the Season Pass after the fact). It's not the best deal by any means (that crown still belongs to Mario Kart 8), but you get quite a bit of content for the price.

Then again, I'm not surprised that you were the one who brought it up. If you have a complaint with the pricing of the characters/stages/colors/costumes/etc., that's another story. But $60+ worth of content for $30 isn't a bad deal by any means.

 

[Son Of Sparda]

I thought this was a thread about DriveClub...

But I did mention it in the OP...

 

[RiccochetJ]

This is 100% objectively wrong.

Yep. I mean, sure there would be small things like some new maps and things like that, but big things that changed the core game would be wrapped in expansion packs.

At least that's how I remembered it with games like Baldur's Gate.

 

[Shadowheart]

All's Quiet on East Blue!
The Decent and Dutiful World Government
Whitebeard vs. the Sun Pirates
Heroes of the Coliseum
The Surgeon of Life or Death
World Government Mega-Showdown
Pirate Mega-Showdown
Sky Island Treasure Hunt Survival

That's just a list of names. What are those? Extra characters, modes, levels? What does the Pass contain exactly?

 

[shiftplusone]

Mind boggling how so many people think this is insane. It's the way fucking PC games worked before Bethesda had the idea to monetize horse armor.
I get that coming from consoles the notion of a dev supporting and adding content to a game FREE might seem alien but it has been that way on PC since the internet was a thing.

yeah who else remembers when beyond the dark portal and Lord of Destruction and Yuri's Revenge and opposing force and throne of baal were free for PC gamers


console gamers came in and fucked everything up so hard that an alternate timeline was created. Add on content that was released free, retroactively went back and became boxed retail releases that you had to pay for

 

[Son Of Sparda]

A season pass full of costumes seems like a terrible season pass to me. If I ended up buying one which was mostly just a bunch of skins I'd be super pissed.

I must be misunderstanding this because $12 for costumes and a few quests is a rip-off and it's the reason developers and publishers can get away with content for a high price because people will still buy it...and think it's value.

My god, that's terrible. Gobsmacked.

At first I thought the image you posted was all the characters that came with the SP. That's a pretty good value!

But it's just skins. lol, no thanks.

Let's forget about the missions and new island that comes with Season Pass for a second, you guys honestly think 12 bucks for 30 costumes is a lot when Capcom is charging 4 bucks for each one in SFV?

This is like what, $0.39 a costume? That's a tenth of what Capcom is charging right now!

That's just a list of names. What are those? Extra characters, modes, levels? What does the Pass contain exactly?

One of them is a new fun Island (level) that challenges you to fight up to more than 10k enemies! This is really great for when you have broken your character's limit.

Others are missions inside the Dream Log that happen on different islands.

 

[Pompadour]

When you buy a season pass, you expect to get whatever content comes out between the first promised DLC and last DLC because it's in that time frame. Not only that, if something comes out between those 2 points and isn't included in their Season Pass purchase, it makes the purchase look worse and perceived to be of less value.

Well, one should modify their expectations because it doesn't match reality. I can "expect" DLC to be free but it's not the publishers fault when that fantasy doesn't come to fruition.

I feel like I'm seeing the most idiotic strawmen being fashioned who put no effort into researching what they're buying and we have to protect these imaginary brain dead consumers from wasting all their money.

The fact that anyone in this thread is arguing about what a season pass SHOULD entail means we all know it's not a guarantee of anything. So who exactly are we trying to protect from the concept of season passes?

 

[Paltheos]

Season passes should come in free updates after the games release

Absolutely not. If the developer's making new content, they should be able to charge for it. Of course.

What I don't like is holding back content and then charging it for later - I don't think any of us like that. New content though? Come on, how is this even a question?

 

[The Dear Leader]

The Witcher 3's Expansion Pass, $25 for dozens of hours of quality gaming some of which are in an entirely new land mass, probably a hundred or more quest between the two, can't beat that.

 

[bananafactory]

This is how you do a season pass.

Yup.

Driveclub the GOAT model for season pass

 

[MiTYH]

Hyrule Warriors has 2 season passes and they're both fucking amazing.

I came here to say this. For those who want details:

Master Wind Waker Pack
- 16 new My Fairy costume pieces
- The “Master” Wind Waker map for Adventure Mode with one new adventure battle scenario

Link’s Awakening
- 16 new My Fairy costume pieces
- A new map for Adventure Mode with two new challenge battle scenarios
- A new playable character
- A new weapon for Linkle

Phantom Hourglass & Sprit Tracks
- 15 new My Fairy costume pieces
- A new map for Adventure Mode with one new adventure battle and two new challenge battle scenarios
- A new playable character
- A new weapon for Toon Link

A Link Between Worlds
- 15 new My Fairy Costumes
- A new map for Adventure Mode with one new adventure battle and two new challenge battle scenarios
- Two new playable characters

Keeping in mind each new Adventure map is literally tens of hours, minimum, to just complete it, let alone get everything there is to offer.

 

[Neoxon]

Season passes should come in free updates after the games release

As awesome as it sounds, that's a sure-fire way to lose money unless the developers have a pool of cash to offset the risk. Even in Overwatch's case, they had the paid loot boxes to offset the lack of revenue from significant DLC.

I came here to say this. For those who want details:

Keeping in mind each new Adventure map is literally tens of hours, minimum, to just complete it, let alone get everything there is to offer.

While I will agree that it's a fantastic deal for 3DS players, the Wii U version is apparently screwed out of the stages (correct me if I'm wrong).

 

[DrunkShogun]

Witcher and souls are the best at this. Splatoon I've heard is good but never played it so can't vouch. The only dlc that disappointed was bioshock infinite but that was my first and only season pass that I purchased based on anticipation.

 

[Linkyn]

Witcher and souls are the best at this. Splatoon I've heard is good but never played it so can't vouch. The only dlc that disappointed was bioshock infinite but that was my first and only season pass that I purchased based on anticipation.

Splatoon's post-release content was completely free, so technically, it didn't have a season pass.

 

[kimifan141]

Season passes should be announced at least after 3-6 months after a game release, putting it right at pre order times, really gives away how much content was cut and decided for dlc .

 

[Z3M0G]

to offer almost 30 costumes for that price, it's an insane dial.

Ugh...

Ok good, there are missions too.

 

[Stitch]

Rocket League just updated and the Devs gave me new cars and a new arena for free. I hope they don't starve now because I didn't pay for it.

 

[Lone_Prodigy]

Rocket League just updated and the Devs gave me new cars and a new arena for free. I hope they don't starve now because I didn't pay for it.

Rocket League has paid DLC.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

witcher 3 season pass
dishonored season pass (don't like the city trials though but knife of dunwall and brigmore witches made it good)
bioshock infinite (don't like clash in the clouds, but burial at sea 1 and 2 were worth it)

i'm a fan of extending already solid games with substantial single player content, fluffing up the season pass "value" with costumes and trite extra modes is not the way to go.



well, i'd have to think the closure was related to the way driveclub was handled -- game was delayed, then when it launched the online was garbage, and the ps+ version was delayed too, launching like 10 months after with little fanfare since excitement had died down

if anything the season pass and the updates after the terrible launch proved that evolution were willing to put in all the efforts to make things right, but sony decided it was too little too late

Dishonored never has a season pass but it's dlc was fantastic

 

[jem0208]

I disagree. If the devs are working on contents after the initial launch then they should be able to charge for them.

Halo 5?

 

[Famassu]

Rocket League just updated and the Devs gave me new cars and a new arena for free. I hope they don't starve now because I didn't pay for it.

Rocket League 1) is from a small team, 2) a relatively simple game to create new content for and 3) has been extraordinarily successful with a hugely active playerbase + 4) it also has DLC that isn't free, so it's pretty clear how they can & why they offer some free content.

 

[Alpha Phoenix]

Well it used to be that way, before games got more expensive and time-consuming to make.

Fixed that for you.

 

[hampig]

Different models work for different games, it's as simple as that.

 

[robot]

I can't believe Mario Kart 8 DLC ended after those 2 packs. They could've just redone every Kart track from the previous games and I would've purchased all of it.