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[SuperLeviathan]

Handheld gaming still lends itself to different experiences than consoles, and vice versa, and I don't see Nintendo completely forsaking that concept. And if they still have teams working on games that have more of a handheld style of play, while I'm sure those titles will be available for their console as well and will be a kind of selling point, I don't see them being the kind of titles that win over console converts.

That's debatable because so many of their best selling handheld and console titles are one and the same. See Mario 3D Land/World, 3D Zelda, Smash, Mario Kart, Donkey Kong, Xenoblade, Smash etc.

Ports of old games is pointless, as proven by Mass Effect 3 and other similar games at launch, it has to be games that are going to release at the same time, even if the offerings are a bit different. Honestly if the game is very similar but with added bonuses (as silly as they are) like amiibo support for exclusive outfits or hats that can make people really interested in getting the third party game on a Nintendo console.

Isn't that where Nintendo got a barebones-y ME3 (when everyone else got the whole trilogy) and no DLC? That was designed to not sell, it's not a fair or relevant comparison at all.

For a more relevant comparison, Wind Waker HD crossed the 1 million sold mark pretty quickly, and was a popular bundle for a while.

 

[SalvaPot]

That's debatable because so many of their best selling handheld and console titles are one and the same. See Mario 3D Land/World, 3D Zelda, Smash, Mario Kart, Donkey Kong, Xenoblade, Smash etc.



Isn't that where Nintendo got a barebones-y ME3 (when everyone else got the whole trilogy) and no DLC? That was designed to not sell, it's not a fair or relevant comparison at all.

For a more relevant comparison, Wind Waker HD crossed the 1 million sold mark pretty quickly, and was a popular bundle for a while.

Your comparison is even more unfair, Wind Waker HD is not a port, its a Remaster, and a remaster of a game that a lot of people skipped at the time because of the art direction.

ME3 is a late port that was full price and as you said released at the same time as Trilogy, so of course it won't sell, that is the point I was trying to make. Late ports are usually useless if they don't bring something new or unique.

So what I am saying is that, if the NX is a console and releases on November 2016, there will be no point releasing ports of Fallout 4 or Witcher 3, since everyone who already wanted to play it already did or can find it cheaper for sure in the other consoles. BUT if the multiplatform games that everyone is expecting for on 2016 release on the NX at the same time as the PS4 and X1 versions will in someway justify the purchase for the gamers that want to play both the new Nintendo games and the multiplatform games that the other console are receiving.

Of course its kind of silly to hope this would happen, since developing 2 versions of a game can be expensive, of course making 3 versions its going to be more expensive, but we can't deny Nintendo has to do something to justify the purchase to the audience that wants only one dedicated console.

 

[FStubbs]

What? The NES was a success in large part because third parties backed it in droves. Yes, Nintendo's own games were the crown jewels in its lineup, but it would never have been the huge hit it was without the exclusive support of Konami, Capcom, and a whole slew of others. Everybody bought the NES early on because it had the most games, period. That's how these things are recommended to parents by salespeople.

As for an "environment that truly allows Nintendo to go it alone", my question for you is: What element of the Wii U made it not such a console? Was there anything holding Nintendo back from releasing more games for it, aside from the fact that they can just only pump out so many games on their own?

The bolded is EXACTLY IT. One of the main points of NX is that they have a unified architecture across handheld and console. This dramatically increases their productivity.

The NES reached the heights it did in large part due to third party support. However, the system was not designed with the idea of any third parties being on board. IIRC Yamauchi wasn't particularly enthused with the idea and given the video game landscape it's clear Nintendo intended to go it alone with the console.

They won't be getting the big AAAA games driving PS4/Xbone no matter what they do. The niche Japanese companies are all on Sony. They'll get indie support, but bottom line is the they have to be prepared to support NX alone. They were not prepared with the Wii U, which they really, really believed would be a box with heavy third party support (remember EA's "unprecedented partnership")?

 

[Mikey Jr.]

Yeah, so many third parties!

Wiiu got so many of the cross gen ps3/360 games!

/s

In all honesty, the Nintendo userbase just isn't there for 3td party multiplats. Destiny 2 on nx would probably sell like pure dogshit.

By the time nx comes out, lots of games will be sequels, and the userbase for those games are set. The nx will be scrounging for ps4 scraps.

 

[AmyS]

Are you guys forgetting one of the most interesting things from one of those recent Nintendo patents?

The Supplemental computing device.

[credit to Rösti for this]

Abstract

Supplemental computing devices that provide processing and/or storage resources to game consoles to assist these game consoles in executing a game. In some instances, a game console locally executes a copy of a game using resources of the game console. In addition, however, the game console may couple to a supplemental computing device that includes resources that the game console may also utilize to increase the speed or quality of a user's gaming experience. For instance, the supplemental computing device may couple via a physical connection (e.g., a wired connection) to the game console for processing data associated with the game and providing a result back to the console, and/or for storing game data on behalf of the game console.

Claims

1. A gaming system, comprising: a game console comprising one or more processors configured to locally execute a game and provide video output of the game to a display and audio output of the game to a speaker, the game console including a physical network interface and a wireless communication interface; and a supplemental computing device configured to detachably couple to the game console via the physical communication interface, the supplemental computing device comprising: one or more processors configured to provide, over the physical communication interface, processing resources to the game console to assist the game console in locally executing the game; and memory for receiving data associated with the game from the game console and storing the data for later access by the game console wherein the game console is further configured to couple, via the wireless communication interface, to another supplemental computing device, the another supplemental computing device including one or more processors to provide processing resources to the game console and memory for providing storage resources to the game console.

6. An apparatus comprising: a housing; an interface for coupling the apparatus with a game console; one or more processors residing within the housing; and logic residing within the housing and configured to cause the one or more processors to perform acts comprising: receiving, while the apparatus is coupled to the game console via the interface and while the game console is executing a game, a first request from the game console to process first data associated with the game; processing, at least partly in response to the first request, the first data to create a result; providing the result back to the game console; receiving, while the apparatus is coupled to the game console via the interface and while the game console is executing the game, a second request from the game console to store second data associated with the game; and storing the second data at the apparatus at least partly in response to the second request.

FIG. 1 illustrates an example environment that includes a game console locally executing a game, as well as a supplemental computing device coupled to the console for supplementing processing and storage resources of the game console. In addition, the environment includes multiple other game console and supplemental computing device combinations, such that the game consoles may utilize nearby supplemental computing devices to even further supplement the game-console resources.

FIG. 2 illustrates select components of a game console and a supplemental computing device from FIG. 1.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1150086

Build your Nintendo console's power as you go. That's the potential.

One scenario might be Nintendo wouldn't need to release an NX2 for a very, very long time. maybe not until after 2025. Who knows, but the point is, Nintendo NX games would be made for and only require the base hardware. Nintendo could make NX games that are scalable, like PC games. Hardcore gamers could add one or more supplemental computing devices to get the best graphics, higher resolution, framerate, etc.

 

[Grampa Simpson]

I just started playing xenogears for the first time. Past a certain point, hardware powaa doesn't really matter to me.

That said, they should stop caring about the big multiplatform bleeding edge graphics shooty games. The crowd that really buys into that type of game (gaf excepted) thinks that Nintendo is for babies.

Leave the being teabagged by a 12 year old to Sony and Microsoft.

 

[Bob Coffee]

Nintendo will never really get western third party support again i think, that boat has long sailed. Japanese third party support on the other hand i can see Nintendo getting a good amount of. Nintendo's collaborations with Japanese publishers may pay off with NX.

 

[//DEVIL//]

From a gamer prespictive, if the console is more powerful than the current gen ( see difference between ps4 and xbox one and apply the same difference or lil more between the ps4 and Nx ) then yeah they should. I mean why wouldn't I buy the best current gen console graphically that also Nintendo games ?

Even comes next gen when a new xbox and PlayStation announced. I know I might skip buying one of them because I know 1 year or so later a newer console will come that will be much better graphically.

but if the console is less powerful than ps4 , then Nintendo is just stupid and they need to stop making home consoles. They will go out of business

 

[AaronB]

Launching mid-gen is an extremely risky move. Both developers and customers are fairly locked into their platform(s) of choice already. Getting third parties on board would be a miracle.

I think it will only work if Nintendo finds a new Blue Ocean like they did with the Wii. Given what they've said about their plans going forward, the NX will likely be part of an ecosystem that connects with people's smart devices, the new Quality of Life initiative, and things like that.

 

[Bolivar687]

Mid-generational launches from this point on would be a mistake. Unless there is a core feature that resonates with the mass market like the Wii/DS had, the NX is destined for third place. Their best bet is to get back in the game with third parties and recover as much market share as they possibly can. Then launch the next system with PS5 and Xbox π. Hopefully this gen goes long enough so their customers won't feel burned by the refresh like some do with the Wii U.

Most of all, a mid-generational launch after NX would screw them, as this gen proved that consumers prefer the best versions of the latest releases, and will pay for new hardware to do it. Some family games do sell better on older consoles but not enough to push the hardware.

 

[Neoxon]

Nintendo will never really get western third party support again i think, that boat has long sailed. Japanese third party support on the other hand i can see Nintendo getting a good amount of. Nintendo's collaborations with Japanese publishers may pay off with NX.

This. Nintendo's future lies in making sure that Japanese third parties & indies are happy. While it wouldn't be impossible to get western third parties back, it'd take a long time & a lot of money to do so. So while Nintendo may be doomed to being forever 3rd place, they can at least be profitable by letting the NX Handheld do most of the selling.

 

[Fess]

Who will buy these ports?
It will be a WiiU situation again.
I don't think they win anything from launching mid gen, the cake is already distributed.

Uhm, look at the current first party lineup from Sony and Microsoft, MS has been better but the reality is still that PS4 and XB1 is still a long way from serving the cake the big market want, the big market is still sitting on the fence, probably happily playing last gen consoles.

If Nintendo can launch next year before the fence sitters has decided what to buy then I definitely think they can succeed even though they're late to the party. If their console is more powerful than PS4/XB1, with Zelda, Mario, Smash Bros, Mario Kart, Metroid etc, plus the best multiplat versions... Well, why would that be a WiiU situation again?

I honestly think launching mid-gen is very clever, as long as they have the right hardware, as in powerful hardware. With weak hardware they'll get slaughtered though.

 

[Tevious]

I can't see third parties being bothered to port their older games. Why bother when sales will be lower and nobody will want to pay $60 for a year or more older game? As was said before, porting PS3/X360 games to Wii U wasn't really a thing.

If Nintendo starts to launch their systems mid-gen, then they should have the best tech too. The NX would need to be basically a PlayStation 4.5. So not only would they get people on board for Nintendo exclusives, they can be the console to have the best console version of any multi-platform game for ~3 years, and they won't be directly competing with Sony's and MS's console launches.

 

[neurosyphilis]

They should do what they always do, it's worked for 100+ years

There were consoles 100 years ago ?

 

[Vagabundo]

I think Nintendo should go full Apple and release an updated model annually.

 

[Deleted member 518153]

Or how about just moving away from a hardware based to a software based platform instead?

 

[yanipheonu]

Graphical capability rarely seem to make a console the best seller. Look at the PS2 or the Wii or the DS. They weren't exactly graphical powerhouses compared to similar systems on the market at the same time. Games, features and company support matter far more.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

Graphical capability rarely seem to make a console the best seller. Look at the PS2 or the Wii or the DS. They weren't exactly graphical powerhouses compared to similar systems on the market at the same time. Games, features and company support matter far more.

But you DO know there were other factors affecting the success of those consoles. Particularly in the Wii case, if it had been more capable it would likely be even more successful.

 

[bman94]

But you DO know there were other factors affecting the success of those consoles. Particularly in the Wii case, if it had been more capable it would likely be even more successful.

I don't think if the Wii was more graphically capable that it would have been more successful. One of the reasons why it was so cheap because it didn't have the graphical capabilities as Xbox 360 and PS3 which made it a easier buy for those who didn't follow gaming seriously.

 

[Eolz]

Or how about just moving away from a hardware based to a software based platform instead?

You mean going third party?
Errr...

 

[PdotMichael]

Are you guys forgetting one of the most interesting things from one of those recent Nintendo patents?

One scenario might be Nintendo wouldn't need to release an NX2 for a very, very long time. maybe not until after 2025. Who knows, but the point is, Nintendo NX games would be made for and only require the base hardware. Nintendo could make NX games that are scalable, like PC games. Hardcore gamers could add one or more supplemental computing devices to get the best graphics, higher resolution, framerate, etc.

PC games aren't scalable in the way to think they are. But even ignoring that problem, how will fix that Nintendo's problem that they can't sell hardware in the first place?

 

[cuilan]

No.
People should stop buying their systems mid to late generation instead.

I'd only do this if consoles start having at least 10 exclusives within the launch window I'd really want to play, and not even Nintendo systems have managed that so far.

 

[Doc_Drop]

No.
People should stop buying their systems mid to late generation instead.

Just, what? I'll buy consoles whenever I please thank you. I prefer to wait to when they hit the £200 mark and have a full library of games rather than buy in the first year, get stung by prices and get stung by a lacklustre launch lineup.

Edit - After reading through I can see you somewhat clarified what you were meaning

OT - As someone who went with a new PC this generation and is looking at exclusive offerings on the XB1/PS4 with little interest I would be more than happy to invest in a new Nintendo console. However, it needs to be a simple non-gimmick system that offers enough power for modern games and has a straight forward control scheme. The online setup also needs to be in-line with its peers. It wouldn't really affect me whether it was out of step with the generation time-wise with the NX or future offerings, I can even see the benefit in a way. I have been tempted by a number of Nintendo exclusives over the years, but after and during the Wii generation Nintendo has done little to tempt me into one of their systems

 

[SmokedMeat]

Given the lifespan of Nintendo consoles, their successor to NX should actually launch alongside PS5 and the next Xbox.

Two Nintendo consoles for every Playstation and Xbox, is how things have become.

 

[rootbeerafloat]

The past 2 consoles Nintendo launched were graphically under-powered by 1 full generation.

Damn, Wii is just one GameCube duct taped to itself now?

 

[woen]

Given the lifespan of Nintendo consoles, their successor to NX should actually launch alongside PS5 and the next Xbox.

Two Nintendo consoles for every Playstation and Xbox, is how things have become.

What?

GC is with Xbox and PS2
Wii is with 360 and PS3 (with Wii U only one year before next gen)
Wii U is only 3 years but that's not a trend like you pretend it.

 

[ArkhamFantasy]

Given the lifespan of Nintendo consoles, their successor to NX should actually launch alongside PS5 and the next Xbox.

Two Nintendo consoles for every Playstation and Xbox, is how things have become.

Nah, Wii U's short lifespan is due to it's extreme lack of demand, they had no choice but to ditch it half way through its projected lifespan.

They will not make a habit out of it, they will either make successful consoles or double down on handhelds imo.

 

[RichiRamjag]

I feel like their release cycle is a big reason for the failure of the Wii u. When ps5/xb2 releases, they're gonna be in the same situation in regards to 3rd party.

 

[Dunkley]

One scenario might be Nintendo wouldn't need to release an NX2 for a very, very long time. maybe not until after 2025. Who knows, but the point is, Nintendo NX games would be made for and only require the base hardware. Nintendo could make NX games that are scalable, like PC games. Hardcore gamers could add one or more supplemental computing devices to get the best graphics, higher resolution, framerate, etc.

You know, first time I've seen the patent, been thinking for a while that the NX might be a console with a handheld component that has an own CPU/GPU that adds to the processing power of the console when attached, interesting to see that might actually be the case as well.

But that's besides your point, so as far as scalable games go, well, the N3DS already showed it was possible by having regular 3DS games feature better textures/shadows on the N3DS (case for Monster Hunter) or double the framerate (case for Terraria), so your idea might not even be too far away from what could really be.

 

[Woo-Fu]

Are you guys forgetting one of the most interesting things from one of those recent Nintendo patents?

The Supplemental computing device.

One scenario might be Nintendo wouldn't need to release an NX2 for a very, very long time. maybe not until after 2025. Who knows, but the point is, Nintendo NX games would be made for and only require the base hardware. Nintendo could make NX games that are scalable, like PC games. Hardcore gamers could add one or more supplemental computing devices to get the best graphics, higher resolution, framerate, etc.

I hope you're being sarcastic. Add-on peripherals that segment the base do not work. Hell, they don't even work when at the start of the generation they're free to consumers but cost the devs/publishers. "The power of the cloud" isn't practically different than a supplemental computing device---other than who foots the bill for it. How did that work out?

The more I look at it the less I understand why Nintendo makes their own console in today's industry. Sure, handhelds in markets where they make sense but consoles? They could sell their catalog on practically every system known to man and make a fortune doing it if they'd just get over the platform holder ego thing.

 

[KORNdoggy]

no. it basically kills their chances with me. by the time they release mid gen i'm heavily invested in the competition and have little time for anything else. they need to compete directly at launch with the other manufacturers to increase the chance of me buying day 1 and choosing their system to be my primary box. otherwise it's always going to be relegated to a not used very often "third console"

 

[2+2=5]

Sorry op but you got it totally wrong, there's really no point of another xb1-like console so late in the generation, nintendo really doesn't understand.
Unless nx has some mindblowing innovation that appeals to many people(it could be, i can't wait to see the handheld) nx will be bought mostly by the shrinking die hard nintendo fanbase imo.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

Wii U didn't get many ports despite plenty of PS3/Xbox 360 multiplats releasing. I don't see why this would suddenly change with NX.

This is what I don't get. I've seen a lot of Nintendo fans on these boards talk so casually about how NX will get this game, or that game etc, but it's based on nothing but wishful thinking. NX hardware being up to date doesn't make it a candidate for multiplatform game development by default. It didn't happen with Wii U, and it certainly won't happen with NX.

It's a really odd line of thinking.

 

[Fess]

It wouldn't really affect me whether it was out of step with the generation time-wise with the NX or future offerings, I can even see the benefit in a way.

Same here, I don't get those that think this is a bad idea. It'll arrive before everyone has jumped in on the current PS/XB and should be more powerful too unless N really tries to do a weaker console, the early PS/XB adopters will have had enough time to save up new cash so a higher price shouldn't be a problem. I'll be there day 1 for sure, with sub-30 fps almost being the norm I already think PS4/XB1 are weak enough to want new consoles, waiting 3-4 more years for that will he horrible unless Nintendo delivers something special next year.

 

[dlauv]

They should probably focus on catching up with current technology and having a gimmick that doesn't seem toy-like and obtuse. It worked for the Wii, but I think people realized that was all promise and no delivery. And all-too-lately Nintendo realized consumers realized that.

They should release a system on par with PS5 a year before the PS5 comes out. I like the idea of a console/handheld hybrid quite a lot, but doing something like a gamepad again is probably a no no. I'm thinking something like an Nvidia shield in which the controller is still usable when the screen is flipped down/retracted is a good idea, and try avoid multiplayer games that would need multiples of the screen/controller hyrbid until a large install base is formed: Four Swords, Crystal Chronicles.

 

[DSix]

One thing *could* make sense for Nintendo tho, is if the console is made on 14nm and HBM tech. It could feel like an early generation jump.

 

[PdotMichael]

This is what I don't get. I've seen a lot of Nintendo fans on these boards talk so casually about how NX will get this game, or that game etc, but it's based on nothing but wishful thinking. NX hardware being up to date doesn't make it a candidate for multiplatform game development by default. It didn't happen with Wii U, and it certainly won't happen with NX.

It's a really odd line of thinking.

Releasing a console on par with the Xbox 360 and PS3 at the time when devs were preparring new engines and software tools for the next generation was pretty dumb. And porting their old stuff just to support the WiiU for like two years wasn't worth the investment.

Nintendo must design the NX in a way that the system fits the industry working flow.

 

[FStubbs]

For what it's worth, are we absolutely certain Wii U is getting ditched next year? What if the NX launch next year is for the handheld and the console gets launched the following year?

 

[Eolz]

For what it's worth, are we absolutely certain Wii U is getting ditched next year? What if the NX launch next year is for the handheld and the console gets launched the following year?

The only thing we're certain of is that NX will be unveiled next year.
After that, it's mostly good guesses and speculation. Would make sense that both are replaced with a 3-6 months gap between handheld and console.

 

[Neoxon]

Uhm, look at the current first party lineup from Sony and Microsoft, MS has been better but the reality is still that PS4 and XB1 is still a long way from serving the cake the big market want, the big market is still sitting on the fence, probably happily playing last gen consoles.

If Nintendo can launch next year before the fence sitters has decided what to buy then I definitely think they can succeed even though they're late to the party. If their console is more powerful than PS4/XB1, with Zelda, Mario, Smash Bros, Mario Kart, Metroid etc, plus the best multiplat versions... Well, why would that be a WiiU situation again?

I honestly think launching mid-gen is very clever, as long as they have the right hardware, as in powerful hardware. With weak hardware they'll get slaughtered though.

Because....

1. Nintendo definitely won't have all of those games ready for launch. They'll likely only have a 3D Mario game & a port of Zelda U ready (maybe a port of Smash 4 as well).
2. Third parties would still be apprehensive about supporting Nintendo in any significant way since the audience has historically never been there (& haven't been there for well over a decade).
3. The fence-sitters are likely waiting to follow their friends to the competition, & are just waiting for a price drop.

There is no winning for Nintendo, at least not in the foreseeable future. The best they can do is make sure that the NX Console is profitable & slowly training their audience to like the kind of AAA games that western third parties offer while the NX Handheld pulls most of the weight. If they can get Japanese third parties & indies on board, they can at least buy some time until the typical Nintendo fan acquires a taste for western third party games in time for the third or fourth refresh of NX hardware. Until then, Nintendo's pretty much on their own. Maybe if this was the start of a new generation, Nintendo would stand a better chance of chipping more away from their reputation. But considering how long they've been digging their hole, it's gonna take a long time to get themselves out.

 

[GOOCHY]

No.
People should stop buying their systems mid to late generation instead.

They should release some games worth buying in the first year, then.

 

[Eolz]

They should release some games worth buying in the first year, then.

They did. Should we compare with the PS4, its first year exclusives and its sales?
Problem was the message and third party leaving after six months since nobody was buying the console.

I don't see why they should change their HX release schedule for every future console only due to the WiiU.

 

[Hiltz]

In what world do some people actually think Nintendo would produce a more powerful console than Xbox One and PS4? I'm sorry, but that's baffling to me.

 

[Skyzard]

Yep, they should.

New toy factor. Better hardware for less. Gives them time to make decent shit for launch.

 

[Boss Man]

They should, but they should also do a better job at staying up-to-date with their OS and services when they do it. In terms of hardware power they are fine.

 

[Sami+]

No. They'll hold everyone back with that bullshit, if third parties choose to actually make games for them. If the Wii U had sold well we might still be getting cross-gen garbage.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

No. They'll hold everyone back with that bullshit, if third parties choose to actually make games for them. If the Wii U had sold well we might still be getting cross-gen garbage.

I think the third parties will be intelligent enough to drop them like they did the Wii U.

 

[10k]

No.
People should stop buying their systems mid to late generation instead.

Yup. And I think Wii U sales sent that message. That's why the NX is coming out quicker than anticipated and me even be a bridge console till PS5/Xbox Two.

 

[SuperLeviathan]

I don't think Nintendo has made much effort to court third parties. I'm not even talking about the AAA stuff; I'm talking about that belated, digital-only Minecraft.

If Nintendo had gotten Mojang to cough up a retail release in the Wii U's first year, that would've made a huge difference.

 

[Schnozberry]

I don't think Nintendo has made much effort to court third parties. I'm not even talking about the AAA stuff; I'm talking about that belated, digital-only Minecraft.

If Nintendo had gotten Mojang to cough up a retail release in the Wii U's first year, that would've made a huge difference.

Microsoft made the deal. Notch had no interest prior to the acquisition.