Pureauthor
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Smash Bros Brawl Dojo Official Update Thread: Goodbye, Cherry-don
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Well, I suppose you've got a point, but those are the three earliest games. They were just figuring out what worked back then. With Dreamland they failed, and Dreamland 2 and Adventure were almost like beta tests, building blocks for later goodness.Tiktaalik said:
As far as I'm concerned, the main problem was that Kirby's abilities weren't interesting enough or diverse enough yet, but they needed to be so they could compensate for the easy platforming. Things were looking like this:
Dreamland 1 - Fly and spit stars. Boring.
Dreamland 2 - Fly, spit stars, absorb 7-8 powers with one move each, ride three animals.
Adventure - Fly, spit stars, absorb 8-10 powers with one move each.
Then...
Super Star - Fly, spit stars, spawn CPU (or co-op) helpers, absorb 19 powers with (for the most part) at least five moves each.
(Besides the fact that it was also a lot longer, more complex, etc.)
Minds were blown, in that SMB-->SMB3/SMW or Metroid-->Super Metroid kind of way. And just like SMB3/SMW/Super Metroid, it's so many years later and the 2D followups never truly surpassed those games.
Pureauthor
Member
Jiggy37 said:
The first Kirby game I played was on an airplane with those built-in console thingies in the seat.
I think I got halfway through the game before the plane even took off.
Kirby always seemed like a 'My first platformer' franchise to me.
Holy Order Sol said:
LOL. I can think of at least 1 person I know who's going to probably love this.
Any way, I'm personally am happy that DeDeDe is in. After Kirby being by himself for 2 games, it's nice to see that he and the other 2 major personalities from the series are present. I only hope this translates over to other camps (Ridley from Metroid! Another char from F-Zero! Eggplant Wizard from Kid Icarus! et al), too.
At this point, I can just only wonder what DDD's final will be. Summon Fatty Whale? :lol :lol
It really was until Super Star in 1996. And then after Super Star it took on that status again until Amazing Mirror in 2004. Kind of sad. :/Pureauthor said:
In any case, as far as the good games go, I think of them more as an action series than platformers. Platforming's really easy when you can fly, so whether the games are entertaining to me is mostly contingent upon the powers being fun to use.
On another note, trying to cram this Dedede sprite into the confines of a 90x120 avatar is fun. >_> If I can't figure this out, then Zeed, I'm awaiting your cropped version so I can plagiarize the ideas behind it.
It's also a plus one to the villain's team. Now we've got Bowser, Wario, Dedede, Ganondorf, and Mewtwo (probably). That should make the Subspace Emissary more interesting.TreIII said:
My avatar is off the rotation for now, but I've already prepared my cropped version of Dedede for when I switch back:Jiggy37 said:
Iam Canadian
and have the worst user name EVER
Pureauthor said:
Well, the first game was developed with the express purpose of being a game that anybody could beat.
But after you beat the game, you get a code to unlock Extra Mode, which cranks the difficulty up about a dozen notches or so. Suddenly, the "my first platformer" feel of the game gives way to a more "holy crap, I got a game over in the first level" kind of feel. The enemies become merciless in Extra Mode.
Later Kirby games did a better job of balancing the difficulty and none are really as easy as Dream Land was. Super Star is probably around the level of Super Mario World in difficulty, for instance, and it could be argued that it even gets harder by the end.
I think, though, that the main reason Kirby games are so easy isn't so much because of the level and enemy designs, but the simple fact that Kirby has a lot of health and that healing items are abundant. The enemies are actually pretty versatile and have some attacks that would be downright frightening in a game where you can only take two or three hits before dying. But in Kirby, you don't really notice because you can usually just push through without worrying about damage too much.
Iam Canadian
and have the worst user name EVER
TreIII said:
As I said earlier, I believe it will be this.
WastingPenguins
Member
Bufbaf said:
Ignore it, dude. That pic you posted was nothing. Zeed just loves to rail on people.
Holy Order Sol
Member
Iam Canadian said:As I said earlier, I believe it will be this.
WTF
Looks like an eyeball popped out of his asshole and shot some kind of black shit.
I'm hoping Dark Matter will be a boss, so I don't expect him to factor in as Dedede's final smash. Not sure what that'll end up being, though. Maybe some kind of super hammer, but that might be too uncreative for these wacky Smash Bros. types and their Wario Ware and PictoChat stages.
Some good points here. Whenever a Kirby game has an extra mode where I can only take about three hits, I usually fail pretty hard at it. >_> Not sure whether that's just because I'm too used to playing the normal mode like it's some kind of sloppy speedrun, but whatever the case, it's never "easy."Iam Canadian said:
Jiggy37 said:
I agree. Whenever I think Kirby, I think little pink puffball rampaging through levels causing cutesy creatures to explode into little stars. They're like slower versions of Treasure's games or something.
Kirby's a pretty bloodthirsty guy, if you think about it. Especially when you consider the times when Kirby beat the shit out of poor Dedede for no reason.
Don't worry, Dedede, you'll be able to get your revenge in Brawl.
Iam Canadian
and have the worst user name EVER
Holy Order Sol said:
It's Dedede under Dark Matter possession.
He gains the ability to float around freely. The eyeball in his stomach (which is Dark Matter) shoots black orbs of dark evilness. The eye can also turn into a jaw with teeth and Dedede will then charge at the enemy, which tends to inflict heavy damage.
Oh WastingPenguins, are you still sore about the motorcycle? Get over it already! :lolWastingPenguins said:
worldrunover
Member
You know, looking at the lineup, it's actually pretty huge as it is.
The updates just make it sort of creep up on you.
Wow, 23 already, and no Falcon or Luigi yet (two definites, we'd all assume). So that matches the total for Melee... how many more do you think there will be? 30 overall?
SuperAngelo64
Banned
But without Zeed railing on people how else would we make sure the furries know they're not welcome?!
On a side note. I honestly wouldn't mind if Krystal was in the game as a staff fighter. She's not a character I want in, but I wouldn't mind.
On a side note. I honestly wouldn't mind if Krystal was in the game as a staff fighter. She's not a character I want in, but I wouldn't mind.
I'm assuming Captain Falcon is a definite returner. The same goes with Jigglypuff, despite me thinking there are tons of other better Pokemon to play as. Jigglypuff had decent moves in Melee that actually matched the character well, and Jiggly has been in SSB ever since the original.
Luigi seems a definite as well. I hope they give him better moves, though. Give him the Poltergust from Luigi's Mansion, etc. Separate him more from just being a random character.
So how many characters are we expecting in this game? There's even some characters like Mr. Game and Watch (which I pray to God comes back) or Sheik that we aren't sure are coming back. And then there's still a whole couple months of new challengers to show up...
35?
Luigi seems a definite as well. I hope they give him better moves, though. Give him the Poltergust from Luigi's Mansion, etc. Separate him more from just being a random character.
So how many characters are we expecting in this game? There's even some characters like Mr. Game and Watch (which I pray to God comes back) or Sheik that we aren't sure are coming back. And then there's still a whole couple months of new challengers to show up...
35?
As far as Krystal goes, it's not that I really hate her. But I do hate the thought that she might make it into Brawl when Lyn, Micaiah, Sami, Marin, Malon, Ling, Daisy, Lip, Mona, Ashley, Dixie Kong, Jill, etc. didn't. All of them are either more major characters than Krystal or they're minor characters from a series currently in higher standing than Star Fox. :/
And I'm naming all female characters because I think that's the only real defense I could offer for Krystal, if I wanted--which I don't, but still. Star Fox doesn't need three characters unless other series are expanded first.
Ganondorf's about as much of a lock as locks get, Jigglypuff and Marth are probably returning. At least one character out of Falco, Young Link, and Mewtwo should be back. Then factor in a third third-party character.
That gets us to 33 even assuming the only newcomers we haven't seen yet are that AC character, DS character, and one third-party character.
And I'm naming all female characters because I think that's the only real defense I could offer for Krystal, if I wanted--which I don't, but still. Star Fox doesn't need three characters unless other series are expanded first.
Pretty much. I remember hanging out in the Dyna Blade area where there were like ten powers freely available, grabbing a Suplex, and being able to kill a good 15 minutes just tossing, stomping, suplexing, and lariat-ing some cute yellow birds and those flying orange things into oblivion. Good times.Scribble said:
You can also pencil in an Animal Crossing character who would use that symbol, possibly a Nintendo DS character, and Mr. Game and Watch to use up symbol #13.worldrunover said:
Ganondorf's about as much of a lock as locks get, Jigglypuff and Marth are probably returning. At least one character out of Falco, Young Link, and Mewtwo should be back. Then factor in a third third-party character.
That gets us to 33 even assuming the only newcomers we haven't seen yet are that AC character, DS character, and one third-party character.
I thought this is pretty obvious logic but, No series will have less representitives in Brawl, than they had in Melee. I am 99% sure of this.
This means we still need at LEAST 2 Pokemon (Probably Jiggly and Mewtwo)
At LEAST 2 more Mario characters (Luigi and if Dr.Mario gets cut it's Bowser Jr./Waluigi/someone else)
At LEAST 2 more Zelda characters (Ganondorf and Young/WW Link/Someone else)
At LEAST 1 F-Zero character (Captain Falcon)
Game & Watch
At LEAST 1 more Star Fox character (Falco/someone else)
At LEAST 1 more Fire Emblem chatracter (Marth/Roy/someone else)
This makes, I repeat, at least 33 characters, and this is thinking the worst.
It's also pretty much proven that we'll have at LEAST one more new series, and considering EITHER this new series OR Animal Crossing has a new character, this makes it 34.
34 characters and I'm being absolutely pessimistic.
This means we still need at LEAST 2 Pokemon (Probably Jiggly and Mewtwo)
At LEAST 2 more Mario characters (Luigi and if Dr.Mario gets cut it's Bowser Jr./Waluigi/someone else)
At LEAST 2 more Zelda characters (Ganondorf and Young/WW Link/Someone else)
At LEAST 1 F-Zero character (Captain Falcon)
Game & Watch
At LEAST 1 more Star Fox character (Falco/someone else)
At LEAST 1 more Fire Emblem chatracter (Marth/Roy/someone else)
This makes, I repeat, at least 33 characters, and this is thinking the worst.
It's also pretty much proven that we'll have at LEAST one more new series, and considering EITHER this new series OR Animal Crossing has a new character, this makes it 34.
34 characters and I'm being absolutely pessimistic.
I agree with this somewhat. I think the clones have, by and large, been replaced with unique characters. Pichu is out in favor of Pokemon Trainer, Falco will be out in favor of you-know-who, Roy is out in favor of Ike (Marth is returning), etc. etc.WildArms said:
Dedede, Bowser, Wario, Mewtwo and Ganondorf seems like a respectable number, and all of them are iconic. That's not even counting the Subspace Emissary villains.ohamsie said:
Just thinking about this, and if you add up the people that were in the other game(melee) that would be an additional 10+ playable charactors!worldrunover said:
We really could see around 50 damn playable charactors in this iteration. Melee more then doubled the amount from Smash1.
Thinking about that makes my damn head want to explode.
Zeed said:
Exactly (or you can argue that Falco's moves will be changed)
Either way, like I said, this is the minimum. It doesn't even take into account the possibility of a second mother character (Ness?) Or a second F-Zero character, second (third?) Metroid character, third Star Fox character, second Wario character etc.
Seriously, 34 minimum. People need to stop worrying.
WastingPenguins
Member
Maybe it's because I come from some other, much smaller forums, with higher standards for being part of their communities, but really Zeed. This is a videogame forum where we're posting about Smash Brothers. When someone posts furry fan-art of Nintendo characters, the most anyone should do is laugh and move on.
Being a prolific poster doesn't give you the right to be an ass to people for no reason. You have the knack for taking something as silly as a Smash Bros. discussion and sucking the fun right out of it.
Being a prolific poster doesn't give you the right to be an ass to people for no reason. You have the knack for taking something as silly as a Smash Bros. discussion and sucking the fun right out of it.
Falco better not be out in favor of Krystal. 
But yeah, it's definitely safe to make "pessimistic" roster size claims when you're factoring in almost entirely veterans. There are only two newcomers considered in this outlook, pretty interesting. I'd add Mr. Game and Watch and call a 35 minimum, though.
I support this whole post and wish I'd thought to think of it this way.WildArms said:
But yeah, it's definitely safe to make "pessimistic" roster size claims when you're factoring in almost entirely veterans. There are only two newcomers considered in this outlook, pretty interesting. I'd add Mr. Game and Watch and call a 35 minimum, though.
I support this whole post and wish I'd thought to think of it this way.
But yeah, it's definitely safe to make "pessimistic" roster size claims when you're factoring in almost entirely veterans. There are only two newcomers considered in this outlook, pretty interesting. I'd add Mr. Game and Watch and call a 35 minimum, though
I included him
I just had to make that post because I couldn't understand how anyone would think there would be less than 34 characters. Some people even think this is it it's all revealed :lol (not on this forum thank god)
Yeah Game and Watch is almost sure to return as Franchise Number 13. I really wonder what Number 19 is going to be. Golden Sun makes absolute sense and would be both fantastic and unique, but I think Pikmin has a better chance - assuming 19 isn't a third party.WildArms said:I included him
I just had to make that post because I couldn't understand how anyone woul dthink there would be less than 34 characters. Some people even think this is it it's all revealed :lol (not on this forum thank god)
Well all the avatars in my rotation have a consistent theme, but it's locked down for now anyway.Firestorm said:
I'm the one whose posts include statistics. Besides, there are only 17 avatars in my rotation. That's not so bad, is it?Firestorm said:
Yeah, once Pokemon Trainer hit and we got three movesets for a "single" character, I think things changed quite a bit. I'll be shocked if we don't hit a minimum 37.Firestorm said:
Yeah, I'm 99% sure (again :lol) that it's Game & Watch, but I don't want to make speculation anyway. Even if it isn't Game & Watch, it'll just be another character, so the number stands.
As for Number 19... I really want Bomberman in, but I'm losing hope everyday.
Iam Canadian
and have the worst user name EVER
Firestorm said:
Oh, it's not that hard. Just think of it this way:
Zeed: All of his avatars are those Smash sprites.
Jiggy: A mixture of video game females and screenshots from Brawl.
Me: Random mugshots from Revenge of Meta Knight, pictures of Lucas and Meta Knight, and Earthbound screenshots.
I've probably got the most random assortment of the lot.
BuddhaRockstar
Member
Looking at that post with all the characters profile pics... I just can't believe how hard it's going to be to pick who to use for that first match! To be honest, I think the people who are going to have the most fun that first day are the ones who haven't been following the game's progress, or reading the Dojo updates, in a way, there won't really be a lot of surprises for us, but think about how much fun they'll have finding out Snake can choke characters, or when they first hop on that motorcycle with Wario...
I'm think I'm going to have to hit myself in the back of the day before the game comes out and hope for amnesia
I'm think I'm going to have to hit myself in the back of the day before the game comes out and hope for amnesia
I still expect Bomberman, personally (albeit not as franchise 19). There's just so much history with Nintendo and Hudson, even carrying over to today with Hudson's incredible VC support.WildArms said:
Pretty much.Iam Canadian said:
Also, Firestorm, I just removed Knuckle Joe, Nephenee, and that one blown-up Chrono Trigger sprite of spoiler-character-here. Now you only have to memorize 14 avatars.
worldrunover
Member
On a side note, how come Toad isn't even considered here? I mean hell, he was a co-star in SMB2, has been in every Mario Kart, Tennis, etc... shouldn't he be a logical choice from the Mario series?
And yet, he is never mentioned...
And yet, he is never mentioned...
BuddhaRockstar said:Looking at that post with all the characters profile pics... I just can't believe how hard it's going to be to pick who to use for that first match! To be honest, I think the people who are going to have the most fun that first day are the ones who haven't been following the game's progress, or reading the Dojo updates, in a way, there won't really be a lot of surprises for us, but think about how much fun they'll have finding out Snake can choke characters, or when they first hop on that motorcycle with Wario...
I'm think I'm going to have to hit myself in the back of the day before the game comes out and hope for amnesia
Knowledge is power.
In this case, the power to enjoy the game more on the first day. "Saving it" hardly matters when the game is bigger than the earth.
worldrunover said:On a side note, how come Toad isn't even considered here? I mean hell, he was a co-star in SMB2, has been in every Mario Kart, Tennis, etc... shouldn't he be a logical choice from the Mario series?
And yet, he is never mentioned...
He is in one of Peach's moves.
Iam Canadian
and have the worst user name EVER
BuddhaRockstar said:Looking at that post with all the characters profile pics... I just can't believe how hard it's going to be to pick who to use for that first match! To be honest, I think the people who are going to have the most fun that first day are the ones who haven't been following the game's progress, or reading the Dojo updates, in a way, there won't really be a lot of surprises for us, but think about how much fun they'll have finding out Snake can choke characters, or when they first hop on that motorcycle with Wario...
I'm think I'm going to have to hit myself in the back of the day before the game comes out and hope for amnesia
That's a good point. We really are spoiling a lot of surprises for ourselves. I mean, I spoiled the original Smash for myself (Nintendo Power) but I went into Melee more or less blind and I was blown away.
Still, I like doing it this way. As surprising as discovering everything on launch day is, I enjoy learning a little bit at a time, wildly speculating as I go. Besides, I'm sure Sakurai will leave some things as a surprise.
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