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SNES/Genesis Sound Chip Reproduction

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Barkley's Justice

Member
Had a question about classic game console hardware sound chips, specifically SNES & Genesis.

In this video, homeboy says he is playing classic SNES tunes via MIDI but on a Genesis sound chip (the Yamaha YM2612):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMZJ6oQayAU

He writes,

Could you imagine the SNES most famous game music playing on the Sega Genesis soundcard ? Yes we found a way to do this!

As a big fan of MIDI and FM Chips, here we have some great game tunes playing on a dump (.SF2) of the Yamaha YM2612 chip. The sound produced here, actually the MIDI messages, is the EXACT [emphasis added] way as the Sega Genesis would process and perform.
Click to expand...

He says "exact[ly]" like the Genesis. And while the science of using the same chip as the Genesis to reproduce the music is "sound" (see what I did thar?), to my ear it just does not sound EXACTLY like the Genesis.

Anyone know anything about this stuff? Is this truly what the Genesis would reproduce? Or is his method of reproduction not 1:1?
 
.sf2 indicates that it's a soundfont, meaning it's audio samples sampled from the chip, and not synthesis, so it's not going to be fully accurate.

There are plugins and software that are software synthesizers that can much accurately emulate the chip, or emulate very similar Yamaha chips.
 
Barkley's Justice said:
Had a question about classic game console hardware sound chips, specifically SNES & Genesis.

In this video, homeboy says he is playing classic SNES tunes via MIDI but on a Genesis sound chip (the Yamaha YM2612):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMZJ6oQayAU

He writes,



He says "exact[ly]" like the Genesis. And while the science of using the same chip as the Genesis to reproduce the music is "sound" (see what I did thar?), to my ear it just does not sound EXACTLY like the Genesis.

Anyone know anything about this stuff? Is this truly what the Genesis would reproduce? Or is his method of reproduction not 1:1?
Click to expand...

I'd have to compare them coming through the same speakers/headphones. But yeah I kinda agree, The dkc stuff was really close but didn't quite sound the same.
 
F-Zero sounds fantastic.

SMW theme...not so much. The levels on each sound are way off. LOL at the way he slops through the Yoshi's Island theme.
 
baggagelizard said:
.sf2 indicates that it's a soundfont, meaning it's audio samples sampled from the chip, and not synthesis, so it's not going to be fully accurate.

There are plugins and software that are software synthesizers that can much accurately emulate the chip, or emulate very similar Yamaha chips.
Click to expand...

Yup.

Completely false to say this is "the EXACT way as the Sega Genesis would process and perform" like the video claims.
 
baggagelizard said:
.sf2 indicates that it's a soundfont, meaning it's audio samples sampled from the chip, and not synthesis, so it's not going to be fully accurate.
Click to expand...

Speaking as a total amateur here, I was under the impression that what he's claiming is impossible. If the SNES used sampled sounds to recreate instruments, you can't transfer that identically to the Yamaha synth chip on the Genesis which was incapable of using samples.
 
There are going to be some quirks. For example the 6th channel on the Genesis sound chip could double as a PCM channel for sample playback purposes, so...not FM stricktly speaking. Also, as part of its backcompat with the Sega Master System, the Genesis also has a PSG chip that has 3 tone channels and a noise channel. The only thing that sounds like a Genesis, is a Genesis (and maybe the System 16 board off of which the Genesis was based).
 
the best bet for recreating Genesis/Megadrive music on a computer is probably to use a tracker, similar to famitracker, but based on the Genesis/Megadrive. I think a few exist, but are incomplete or kinda buggy.
 
How did musicians actually write music for the Genesis/Mega Drive? Was there a particular Yamaha keyboard they used? Or did any MIDI keyboard suffice?

What was the Genesis dev kit like? Was it a PC? Or did they have an augmented Genesis/MD console that was hooked up to a MIDI keyboard? Was there a graphical user interface or was it more like a tracker?
 
But, But, But, it doesnt sound like MegaDrive music though im not hearing any of those well know 'instruments' that the MegaDrive sound chip is known for.

Sounds almost to clean and clear and basically too high quality for a MegaDrive sound chip!??
 
The Genesis sound circuit sounded more muffled than the pure sound from the chips. You can hear big differences from modded and even different versions of the same HW. Emulated it sounds even cleaner.

The sound the Genesis makes is quite simple to reproduce. You have the Master System sound chip (2 pulse waves and 1 noise usually, very similar to the NES) and the YM2612 that had 6 FM channels with 4 operators each where the sixth channel can act as a DAC playing samples (usually percussion). I'm not familiar with the details beyond that, but some have replaced it entirely with a YM3438.

Crystal clear audio mod comparison. 0:04 and 1:03
Sega Genesis models comparison. (0:11-0:58-1:46-2:33)
Comparison of many models playing the same track.
Time Trax briefing on a modded console and emulated. The drums are pure FM and every single one is played on the same channel ^_^
 
Some sound good and some don't cut it, the SFII one is great but we already know the Genesis version is superior in some ways (like the soundtrack and gameplay)
 
Ocaso said:
Speaking as a total amateur here, I was under the impression that what he's claiming is impossible. If the SNES used sampled sounds to recreate instruments, you can't transfer that identically to the Yamaha synth chip on the Genesis which was incapable of using samples.
Click to expand...
You'd basically substitute a specific synth instrument for each sample instrument. Obviously the end result wouldn't be 1:1 with the SNES, since you'd have to somehow pipe all eight channels into the one DAC channel and get it to play all of them at the same time to even approach that level. Still, in the end, they're both audio chips being told to start/stop certain notes at specific times, just one uses FM synthesis for its instruments, and the other uses a set of samples akin to music modules.
 
Genesis always sounded like different variation of static ( which is what sound is really but that's beyond the point)

Even more so the drums. Like every genesis game sound studio own a set of hit sticks.
 
Barkley's Justice said:
Wow, I had no idea the different variations of the models sounded differently.
Click to expand...
Some models had really shittacular motherboard circuitry. This affected signal quality to/from the soundchip. It's fixable (CCA mod), but you have to know electronics and be handy with a soldering iron (or know someone who is).
 
Barkley's Justice said:
Wow, I had no idea the different variations of the models sounded differently.
Click to expand...

I recently heard from a friend that some Model 1s doesn't sound as good as earlier Model 1s and instead sound more like the Model 2. Anyone know if that's true? Because I don't have a Mega Drive, but I've always been thinking that if I'm going to get one I'm getting the Model 1 since it has better sound. But apparently that's not always the case?
 
synt4x said:
I recently heard from a friend that some Model 1s doesn't sound as good as earlier Model 1s and instead sound more like the Model 2. Anyone know if that's true? Because I don't have a Mega Drive, but I've always been thinking that if I'm going to get one I'm getting the Model 1 since it has better sound. But apparently that's not always the case?
Click to expand...

Best thing to look for is the "high definition graphics" around the back of the card slot on model 1s. This is not a guarantee but most of these are the original higher quality motherboard. The other benefit to the model one is getting stereo out if you're using an rgb scart cable without audio leads.

Models that don't have this are fair to poor as you go from model 2 to model 3.

Basically look for one of the early high definition models if you don't want to mod it.
 
synt4x said:
I recently heard from a friend that some Model 1s doesn't sound as good as earlier Model 1s and instead sound more like the Model 2. Anyone know if that's true? Because I don't have a Mega Drive, but I've always been thinking that if I'm going to get one I'm getting the Model 1 since it has better sound. But apparently that's not always the case?
Click to expand...
You can google around to find tons of information about what revisions sound best and how to spot them. There were even ways of looking at the mobo through the grills on the bottom to identify them :P
pixlexic said:
Genesis always sounded like different variation of static ( which is what sound is really but that's beyond the point)

Even more so the drums. Like every genesis game sound studio own a set of hit sticks.
Click to expand...
The sampling, while technically quite capable, wasn't very good when samples had to be kept small. In Sonic 3 there's a big jump between tracks that didn't rely on samples (Hydrocity) and those that did (Credits). Darn shame because the songs that heavily use samples are otherwise really good and I think those are the leftover MJ (-ish, he didn't work alone) tracks.

FM often sounds too dull and muted with low modulation, but too sharp and screeching at higher. I really appreciate when composers get it right because I know how hard it is and they can't just reverb it to death.
 
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