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So is PC gaming about to go mainstream?
- Thread starter -COOLIO-
- Start date
Trent Strong
Banned
.
Mainstream of not ; the reluctance of Ms/Sony to release new consoles has gotten me to jump boat and join the pc-guys. And given the success of the wii, peripherals and lowercost/power consoles are the future.
All hyperbole aside I feel like the jump from 360/ps3 to a decent gaming pc has definitely felt like a leap in "generation".
All hyperbole aside I feel like the jump from 360/ps3 to a decent gaming pc has definitely felt like a leap in "generation".
-COOLIO- said:
good luck with that, theres still a lot of mainstream games that won't support it out of either laziness or stupid elitism. and try asking a simple question about it and you will unleash a massive dickstorm of pro gam0rz telling you how you can't play it with a controller.
its the main reason i've given up the PC for everything but strategy games and gone back to 360 gaming
CecilRousso
Member
It has always been mainstream in sweden. Tech problems and configuration issues are never a problem for anyone when they really really want to play a particular game. Those aspects and the "comfy couch" issue seems to be more important to hardcore console gamers.
Nabs said:
anything by dice, the stalker games, most of the valve games 'support' it but its hella janky/broken in all of them but left 4 dead and even that feels weird, anything like cryostasis etc, almost all RPGs
not all of the games by a long stretch, since the cheap console ports like transformers, split second and stuff all support the controller quite well, but there are enough prominent examples that the 360 is better as your main gaming platform if you are controller only.
infact the dice games actively stop you from using the 360 controller at all, even with things like xpadder, because they have completely broken controller 'support' that recognizes and grabs the controller but doesnt work at all, and does random insane shit like pausing when you click the right stick. they clearly didnt even bother testing it despite there being menu options for it before they released BF:BC2 or the MH beta, and i dont think they have ever patched it.
Vigilant Walrus
Member
-COOLIO- said:
You're not part of the master gaming race. It takes more than to owning a PC. Real Masters of the gaming race, also have the knowledge, the lore, and the history.
You are very, very far off the marks. Maybe you are trolling, and if you are, that's cool, if not, please search Gaf on "PC gaming dead". There you will find many explanations, to what you are saying is nonsense. It's not even nonsense. Your trying to find your way around a city, with a map of another city.
And also you have no legs.
That's your situation, in comparison to your believes about PC gaming.
VoteForPedro
Member
5 year old 11 million subscribers Wow says Hi.
mescalineeyes
Banned
-COOLIO- said:
probably the only statement with any sort of significance pertaining the uptake in popularity of PC gaming in the OP.
no offense.
Segata Sanshiro
Member
God, I hate saying this, but ghst is right. Ashkeloth's points largely aren't true, but they are widely held misconceptions and they do a great deal of harm to the PC's potential for growth in certain areas of gaming.
Even on a hardcore gaming forum, where ostensibly people should be a little more educated about the subject than the average person, misconceptions like the Big Comfy Couch and shit need to constantly be corrected. That's the real problem.
Even on a hardcore gaming forum, where ostensibly people should be a little more educated about the subject than the average person, misconceptions like the Big Comfy Couch and shit need to constantly be corrected. That's the real problem.
Only point in that whole post that holds any water is the severe lack of split screen local play on most PC titles. It's been a nagging issue with PCs for as long as I've gamed on them. It's just part of the culture. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, but it is marginalized to the point where I'm surprised when they include the feature at all on non console ports.
Hell though, 2 out of the 3 consoles deemphasized it this gen as well.
Hell though, 2 out of the 3 consoles deemphasized it this gen as well.
1. Keyboard and mouse are not compatible with "comfy couch". "Comfy couches" don't have flat areas to put a mouse and keyboard on - and they certainly don't require that you sit up.
2. Yes, technically it's easy to connect a PC to a TV. Practically, a PC is very rarely located less than 3 feet away from a TV.
Most PC games have terrible support for gamepads. Mass Effect, a game that was released first on a console, even removed support for it entirely.
Completely irrelevant as long as no one makes games in those genres.
2. Yes, technically it's easy to connect a PC to a TV. Practically, a PC is very rarely located less than 3 feet away from a TV.
Htown said:
Most PC games have terrible support for gamepads. Mass Effect, a game that was released first on a console, even removed support for it entirely.
Htown said:
Completely irrelevant as long as no one makes games in those genres.
Ninja-Matic
Banned
-COOLIO- said:
Stopped reading here.
Sorry, sport, no gaming platform is the "master race".
That being said I think PC gaming is on the downturn.
I've been PC gaming since the Atari 2800 days (tape drives FTW!) and this generation just about everyone I know has shifted to consoles. They have GREAT visuals (Gears and Uncharted mkay?) And great titles.
Aside from RTS and some MMOs - there's not much left for the PC gamer that can't be found on a console.
Consoles are cheaper - games work without looking at "requirements", etc.
I still PC game with friends - but we all moved to consoles for a more UNIFIED gaming experience.
jim-jam bongs
Member
I keep my 360 next to the toilet so it would take a 20m HDMI cable to hook it up to my TV. Clearly this is a mark against consoles.Prisen said:
Minsc
Gold Member
Segata Sanshiro said:
Isn't that contradictory though?
You said yourself you've always been about having fun when gaming, and if it weren't for the DS you'd be in trouble these days. Even Sega has been enjoying supporting the iPhone lately to some degree. I guess it is expected though, especially here, intolerance brings security.
jim-jam bongs
Member
That *whoosh* was so loud I thought a plane was passing overhead.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
-COOLIO- said:
You don't need to respond with "Don't get offended" to everyone who thinks you're wrong.
1) Its *more* intimidating than before. Yes, people are more used to using computers day to day, but the actual 'computery' bit is becoming more and more abstracted from the end user. They just see a fancy touch screen or some icons. People don't need to understand what is going on inside that funny box. And you still need to for games.
2) Laptops are more prevalent than desktops, which means low power for anything that needs grunt or a decent GPU.
3) They are still cumbersome. Yes they can attach to your HDTV, but that massive tower will still be a challenge to get past the wife/girlfriend. I don't need something to be mac mini small, but VCR size would be a start.
4) There isn't enough focus on games for off-the-shelf computers. Look at the 'I need a PC' thread - its all about self-build precisely because the standard computers you buy from Dell or PC World etc are shitboxes. And nobody cares because they run windows 7 and their internet browser just fine - see point 1
2) Laptops are more prevalent than desktops, which means low power for anything that needs grunt or a decent GPU.
3) They are still cumbersome. Yes they can attach to your HDTV, but that massive tower will still be a challenge to get past the wife/girlfriend. I don't need something to be mac mini small, but VCR size would be a start.
4) There isn't enough focus on games for off-the-shelf computers. Look at the 'I need a PC' thread - its all about self-build precisely because the standard computers you buy from Dell or PC World etc are shitboxes. And nobody cares because they run windows 7 and their internet browser just fine - see point 1
Segata Sanshiro
Member
Minsc said:Isn't that contradictory though?
I guess it is expected though, especially here, intolerance brings security.
This is a pretty massive post, and I was entirely serious in all of my points, so I'll respond. For each point, I'll try to give both a casual and core gaming perspective as they're both parts of the market.
Different opinion on matters ≠ wrong. But whatever, that's what discussion's for, right?
You're bringing up the casual perspective here. Some core gamers might say that Steam and Valve are the face of PC gaming. I just said Microsoft because they're the only ones who actually put any money into trying to make PC gaming a recognizable brand, what with the whole Games for Windows Live thing they did a few years back (which ultimately fell flat).
At the end of the day, though marketing can significantly change peoples perspective of certain things.
From a core perspective, yeah. You want people that are playing the game you want as much as you want, which are at the same level of skill as you are, and probably also have friends that own the games you want to play along with their own systems or PCs. I never claimed online wasn't a massive part of gaming today. Just that, with the more casual audiences who don't know others with systems and their own copies of the game, or perhaps do not have the skill and are put off because of the competitive environment of online gaming, and just want to play with their immediate family and friends, PCs can never provide the experience that they want.
I know. I covered that in my post, but honestly, how many homes do you see that actually use that as standard? Also, with the input system of keyboard and mouse, it is really hard to actually create a comfortable setup on a couch. Also the limitation of game resolutions on any HDTVs 720p or below usually make it not worth the cost to either graphics or screen space, to most people.
You've got me on this one. Yes. The Xbox 360 controller will work with most games on the PC now, and alleviates any issues someone might have with the control scheme. Of course, with Strategy games, and RPGs, usually there are not enough buttons on a controller to map all of the games functions that you require. Of course, not many casual gamers play Strategy games and RPGs (outside of MMOs), and I sort of expect core gamers to be used to using a keyboard and mouse.
Once again, you come from the casual perspective. There is a disconnect between Macs and PCs. Socially, people brand things with images. Macs have been branded with the image of non-nerdy, easy to use PCs thanks to Apples aggressive marketing strategy to label them as such, so people find that to be socially acceptable to walk around with a Mac. Facebook is a socially acceptable thing to talk about. Farmville is a socially acceptable thing to play. Now, try and play something like Civ 5 or Starcraft 2 in that space. You might attract a few other core gamers who are interested, but you're not going to get anyone else interested.
You seem to be labeling broad usage of PCs as mainstream, and if you are, then you're right. Millions of people everyday use the internet to watch youtube videos, play flash games, and update their Facebooks and Twitters, but this is a forum for gaming discussion, so that's the angle I'm viewing it from.
Prebuilt computers cost a lot more than personally made computers, and most core PC gamers I know of prefer to build their own. They also buy off Steam, and are only interested in certain sorts of games. Also, Digital Download services are great until you realize a lot of the world has bandwidth caps in place.
Mention Steam to a casual gamer. You'll get a confused response at best, and insulted at the worst. My point is that these people who play Mafia Wars and Farmville want to play Mafia Wars and Farmville. It's not a market that can be tapped into that easily at all since it seems only once every few years people get bored of certain facebook games and discover a new one.
Yeah. To casual gamers, this doesn't apply at all. To core gamers who want to play with the best graphics available to them at 30+FPS and a high resolution on the newest releases it most certainly does.
Yes. A lot of game types don't work on consoles as well as on PC, but they'll still get released occasionally. I have Sacred 2 for my Xbox 360. There are countless FPS' available despite the PC being the better platform for them. Dragon Age is an example of a successful western RPG on consoles.
Now, outside of Capcom with Devil May Cry 4 and Street Fighter IV, when was the last time you saw a Fighting or Action game released for PC outside of emulation? Also there's that whole thing about no Super Street Fighter IV for PC.
A lot of PC experiences are ported to consoles, but console experiences are less often ported to PC. Perhaps this is because of this whole bullshit "PC Gaming Master Race" and "Dumbed down console games" stuff that has always been with PC gamers, but at the end of the day, it limits the market genre wise. to only Traditional RPGs, Action RPGs, MMOs, Strategy Games, and Shooters.
And yet, because the PC is an uncontrollable environment, it is harder to tackle than console based piracy. On the 360, microsoft can monitor the serial numbers assigned to games and then ban multiple instances of the same number. They also have people who pirate connecting to Xbox Live and flagging themselves. on Wii and PS3, there have been multiple firmware updates that stop you from playing newer games and going online until you accept them, that contain anti-piracy measures. There's also the possibiltiy of a hardware update if it's that necesarry. The DS though... you're pretty much right on. Nintendo's only real option to stop that is to go after the companies behind the piracy devices, but at this point, by the time they've stopped one, another several have popped up in its place. Of course, the 3DS will be out soonish, so that might not really be a huge point.
Korea's been pumping out shitty microtransaction MMOs and playing Starcraft for years. Point me to 5 korean games that's good and not an MMO and I'll take it back.
I am saying those Devs are misguided. With the casual market, it is all about the brand names. You have Mafia Wars, Farmville, Popcap, and various other companies that have complete control over that space. Unless you can create a game that is so addicting and well made that it becomes what is practically a cultural phenomenon, you'll never enter that super huge cash pool that is the casual gaming market. Also, as I mentioned earlier in this post, Casual gamers tend to stick with one series or company for several years on end before the trends change and they move onto another game, so the market is not exactly open.
Mairu said:
Different opinion on matters ≠ wrong. But whatever, that's what discussion's for, right?
Mairu said:
You're bringing up the casual perspective here. Some core gamers might say that Steam and Valve are the face of PC gaming. I just said Microsoft because they're the only ones who actually put any money into trying to make PC gaming a recognizable brand, what with the whole Games for Windows Live thing they did a few years back (which ultimately fell flat).
At the end of the day, though marketing can significantly change peoples perspective of certain things.
Mairu said:
From a core perspective, yeah. You want people that are playing the game you want as much as you want, which are at the same level of skill as you are, and probably also have friends that own the games you want to play along with their own systems or PCs. I never claimed online wasn't a massive part of gaming today. Just that, with the more casual audiences who don't know others with systems and their own copies of the game, or perhaps do not have the skill and are put off because of the competitive environment of online gaming, and just want to play with their immediate family and friends, PCs can never provide the experience that they want.
Mairu said:
I know. I covered that in my post, but honestly, how many homes do you see that actually use that as standard? Also, with the input system of keyboard and mouse, it is really hard to actually create a comfortable setup on a couch. Also the limitation of game resolutions on any HDTVs 720p or below usually make it not worth the cost to either graphics or screen space, to most people.
Mairu said:
You've got me on this one. Yes. The Xbox 360 controller will work with most games on the PC now, and alleviates any issues someone might have with the control scheme. Of course, with Strategy games, and RPGs, usually there are not enough buttons on a controller to map all of the games functions that you require. Of course, not many casual gamers play Strategy games and RPGs (outside of MMOs), and I sort of expect core gamers to be used to using a keyboard and mouse.
Mairu said:
Once again, you come from the casual perspective. There is a disconnect between Macs and PCs. Socially, people brand things with images. Macs have been branded with the image of non-nerdy, easy to use PCs thanks to Apples aggressive marketing strategy to label them as such, so people find that to be socially acceptable to walk around with a Mac. Facebook is a socially acceptable thing to talk about. Farmville is a socially acceptable thing to play. Now, try and play something like Civ 5 or Starcraft 2 in that space. You might attract a few other core gamers who are interested, but you're not going to get anyone else interested.
You seem to be labeling broad usage of PCs as mainstream, and if you are, then you're right. Millions of people everyday use the internet to watch youtube videos, play flash games, and update their Facebooks and Twitters, but this is a forum for gaming discussion, so that's the angle I'm viewing it from.
Mairu said:
Prebuilt computers cost a lot more than personally made computers, and most core PC gamers I know of prefer to build their own. They also buy off Steam, and are only interested in certain sorts of games. Also, Digital Download services are great until you realize a lot of the world has bandwidth caps in place.
Mention Steam to a casual gamer. You'll get a confused response at best, and insulted at the worst. My point is that these people who play Mafia Wars and Farmville want to play Mafia Wars and Farmville. It's not a market that can be tapped into that easily at all since it seems only once every few years people get bored of certain facebook games and discover a new one.
Mairu said:
Yeah. To casual gamers, this doesn't apply at all. To core gamers who want to play with the best graphics available to them at 30+FPS and a high resolution on the newest releases it most certainly does.
Mairu said:
Yes. A lot of game types don't work on consoles as well as on PC, but they'll still get released occasionally. I have Sacred 2 for my Xbox 360. There are countless FPS' available despite the PC being the better platform for them. Dragon Age is an example of a successful western RPG on consoles.
Now, outside of Capcom with Devil May Cry 4 and Street Fighter IV, when was the last time you saw a Fighting or Action game released for PC outside of emulation? Also there's that whole thing about no Super Street Fighter IV for PC.
A lot of PC experiences are ported to consoles, but console experiences are less often ported to PC. Perhaps this is because of this whole bullshit "PC Gaming Master Race" and "Dumbed down console games" stuff that has always been with PC gamers, but at the end of the day, it limits the market genre wise. to only Traditional RPGs, Action RPGs, MMOs, Strategy Games, and Shooters.
Mairu said:
And yet, because the PC is an uncontrollable environment, it is harder to tackle than console based piracy. On the 360, microsoft can monitor the serial numbers assigned to games and then ban multiple instances of the same number. They also have people who pirate connecting to Xbox Live and flagging themselves. on Wii and PS3, there have been multiple firmware updates that stop you from playing newer games and going online until you accept them, that contain anti-piracy measures. There's also the possibiltiy of a hardware update if it's that necesarry. The DS though... you're pretty much right on. Nintendo's only real option to stop that is to go after the companies behind the piracy devices, but at this point, by the time they've stopped one, another several have popped up in its place. Of course, the 3DS will be out soonish, so that might not really be a huge point.
Mairu said:
Korea's been pumping out shitty microtransaction MMOs and playing Starcraft for years. Point me to 5 korean games that's good and not an MMO and I'll take it back.
Mairu said:
I am saying those Devs are misguided. With the casual market, it is all about the brand names. You have Mafia Wars, Farmville, Popcap, and various other companies that have complete control over that space. Unless you can create a game that is so addicting and well made that it becomes what is practically a cultural phenomenon, you'll never enter that super huge cash pool that is the casual gaming market. Also, as I mentioned earlier in this post, Casual gamers tend to stick with one series or company for several years on end before the trends change and they move onto another game, so the market is not exactly open.
sixteen-bit
Member
pc gaming is mainstream
H_Prestige
Banned
Social gaming is and will continue to be huge for people playing on their desktops/laptops. And in the future these will be replaced by tablets and smartphones for the majority of people, which I don't think you can call PCs. But consoles aren't going anywhere. They are only getting more popular.
Ninja-Matic said:
PC is the master race for graphic whores. No ifs and buts about it.
And this is something I don't get -- "Aside from RTS and some MMOs - there's not much left for the PC gamer that can't be found on a console." why is this a negative? Having the games also on a different platform doesn't harm my enjoyment of the game and usually even gives the devs more money!
The_Technomancer said:
Came here to post this... yeah, when the CD-ROM started getting big, and Myst came out, it was a huuuuge deal back in my middle school. Lots of people were buying their first ever computer - 386 and 486s, this was right before the whole "Internet age" really started to take off. And then after that, DOOM was ridiculously massive.
Before then, most people I know who owned computers were people who had a job tangentially relating to computing somehow (graphic design, publishing, etc), but the CD-ROM and multimedia is really the time period where PCs became something the average family purchased.
No, I recently built a gaming pc...kinda regret it though.
it had one mainstream title release and everyone jumped on the bandwagon. i personally didn't even think starcraft 2 was all that great. I just don't think that it has enough positives to outweigh what consoles are doing. I tried setting up my pc in my living room and thought about using it as my new "console", but it just isn't the same. The screen isn't optimized for that type of setting. Now that games like Halo Reach are out i'm wondering why i even bothered with building the pc. it's already turned into my dedicated RTS machine, but i can't be bothered to play much else on it.
it had one mainstream title release and everyone jumped on the bandwagon. i personally didn't even think starcraft 2 was all that great. I just don't think that it has enough positives to outweigh what consoles are doing. I tried setting up my pc in my living room and thought about using it as my new "console", but it just isn't the same. The screen isn't optimized for that type of setting. Now that games like Halo Reach are out i'm wondering why i even bothered with building the pc. it's already turned into my dedicated RTS machine, but i can't be bothered to play much else on it.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
REV 09 said:
It never makes sense to build a PC just to play one game. It never will. Wait until your regular desktop PC dies or becomes totally useless, and then replace that with a gaming PC. That way instead of spending whatever you spent, you just spend the marginal cost of making a gaming machine versus making the machine you were going to get.
The other stuff, about finding games to play on it; of course YMMV. If you're looking for a way to salvage a bad purchase, try some of the multiplatform games on PC. Played BioShock 1 yet? Why not play it on PC. Played Mass Effect 1 yet? Why not play it on PC. Never mind getting the superior versions, they'll also be cheaper, even now.
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