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[jmdajr]

HDMI 1.2's specs include sending up to 7.1 channels of uncompressed digital audio over the connection. The Xbox 360 will not do this, it can only send over a lossy encoded Dolby digital or DTS bitstream.

So yes, it IS gimped.

I'm done with this thread, there are too many people acting like they know it all who really don't that are either calling me out as the misinformed one for speaking the actual truth or people like the above poster who just didn't read the thread and contributed more ignorance to the thread. awesomecontribution.jpg and all that.

well thats not the connections fault. It's the 360 software that doesn't decode the newer codecs.
WHo is to say it wont in the future.

 

[Stinkles]

HDMI 1.2's specs include sending up to 7.1 channels of uncompressed digital audio over the connection. The Xbox 360 will not do this, it can only send over a lossy encoded Dolby digital or DTS bitstream.

So yes, it IS gimped.

I'm done with this thread, there are too many people acting like they know it all who really don't that are either calling me out as the misinformed one for speaking the actual truth or people like the quoted poster who just didn't read the thread and contributed more ignorance to the thread. awesomecontribution.jpg and all that.

 

[tanod]

or does my tv simply not pass through 5.1?

99% of TVs do not pass 5.1 HDMI audio through to the optical output of the TV. I say 99% because I can't be absolutely sure there isn't a TV model somewhere out there that does it but I've never heard of one either.

 

[Stinkles]

99% of TVs do not pass 5.1 HDMI audio through to the optical output of the TV. I say 99% because I can't be absolutely sure there isn't a TV model somewhere out there that does it but I've never heard of one either.

There are a couple of breakout box plasmas that do, I believe.

 

[polyh3dron]

well thats not the connections fault. It's the 360 software that doesn't decode the newer codecs.
WHo is to say it wont in the future.

Actually, The 360 will decode a Dolby TrueHD codec (one of the "newer codecs" in question) and then transcode it to output a 1.5mbps DTS 5.1 track.

EDIT: But the 360 will not output uncompressed 5.1 PCM audio over the HDMI port after decoding this codec. This is part of the specs of HDMI 1.2 as well as 1.1 IIRC. Therefore the HDMI connection on the 360 is gimped.

OK I'm really done now.

 

[TekunoRobby]

I wish I could disable audio out via HDMI. For now I'll just be content in disabling audio-out on my TV.

 

[jmdajr]

Actually, The 360 will decode a Dolby TrueHD codec (one of the "newer codecs" in question) and then transcode it to output a 1.5mbps DTS 5.1 track.

yup it sure can! Same with dolby digital plus.

But it can't properly decode them the way they are meant to be.

 

[gohepcat]

Misinformation thread. 360 has 5.1 over HDMI.

Seriously people calm down.
Your TV is not passing the digital 5.1 signal through.

It's your TV not your 360. Same is true for any HDMI source

 

[duk]

thread title change requested

 

[Xisiqomelir]

well thats not the connections fault. It's the 360 software that doesn't decode the newer codecs.
WHo is to say it wont in the future.

The 360's audio hardware?

 

[gkryhewy]

I did read it. I was comparing Xbox 360's comparatively inferior audio capabilities to that of the PS3.

Way to read the thread.

What a useless contribution. Ebay your elite and buy a PS3, because you obviously need and want 7.1, OP! lollerskates!

It's ridiculous that they don't at least include the dongle with the non-elite systems. IIRC, a 3rd party component cable set (I think MadCatz) has a narrower form factor, which allows it to fit next to an HDMI cable without having a notch cut out of it.

 

[BeEatNU]

no audio over HDMI. Use optical out from 360 direct to amp.

yes it sucks

audio does go over hdmi, I use it for my TV.

 

[jmdajr]

The 360's audio hardware?

I dont think the 360 has built in audio hardware than can decode dolby digital plus, or truHD.
It has to be be done in software.

 

[mrklaw]

so it does pass audio, but only the same audio that the optical connection would also pass.

it doesn't pass LPCM or any of the bitstream advanced codecs




BTW, there are lots of HDMI 1.1 receivers out there that support LPCM 5.1 over HDMI. My Denon 2307 for example. Not all, some are just switches, but still plenty.

You only need 1.3 for passing the advanced codecs in bitstream, for decoding by the receiver. And you need the receiver to support the decoding too.

 

[jmdajr]

so it does pass audio, but only the same audio that the optical connection would also pass.

it doesn't pass LPCM or any of the bitstream advanced codecs

BTW, there are lots of HDMI 1.1 receivers out there that support LPCM 5.1 over HDMI. My Denon 2307 for example. Not all, some are just switches, but still plenty.

You only need 1.3 for passing the advanced codecs in bitstream, for decoding by the receiver. And you need the receiver to support the decoding too.

correct sir.

 

[Z_Y]

HDMI 1.2's specs include sending up to 7.1 channels of uncompressed digital audio over the connection. The Xbox 360 will not do this, it can only send over a lossy encoded Dolby digital or DTS bitstream.

So yes, it IS gimped.

I'm done with this thread, there are too many people acting like they know it all who really don't that are either calling me out as the misinformed one for speaking the actual truth or people like the quoted poster who just didn't read the thread and contributed more ignorance to the thread. awesomecontribution.jpg and all that.

For some reason...I don't believe you.


edit: AHA! I knew it!

 

[VPhys]

This has been known about since day one: If you want 5.1 optical, then you need the adapter.

Ok, I need this shit explained in Lehman's terms.


I have a Samsung 46" 1080p lcd tv. (i.e. the TV wasn't cheap) The TV has an optical OUT.


I want to send the HDMI cable from my XBox directly into the TV.


Can I then run an optical cable from the TV to my receiver to get 5.1 sound? I don't care about 7.1 or DolbyHD or any of the super advanced audio codecs. DD or DTS is fine. Will this be possible?

 

[jeremy_ricci]

Off topic (but maybe slightly on topic?)

Is there anyway for me to get my PS3 (and 360 for that matter) to pass audio through both the HDMI and Opical cables?

I can't figure it out. And right now I have my optical coming from my HDTV (which as you know, will only put out a stereo signal, since no TV's have 5.1 decoders build in, afaik).

 

[newsguy]

Ok, I need this shit explained in Lehman's terms.


I have a Samsung 46" 1080p lcd tv. (i.e. the TV wasn't cheap) The TV has an optical OUT.


I want to send the HDMI cable from my XBox directly into the TV.


Can I then run an optical cable from the TV to my receiver to get 5.1 sound?

IF your tv can pass it through properly then, yes you can. My Samsung (50" 1080p) does NOT do this, I only get stereo this way.

Also, there is a thread on here somewhere that explains a very simple way of going with the original optical cable for sound and still having space for the HDMI cable.
Something along these lines (VERY EASY, even your cousin Bilo can do it)

 

[ElNino]

Ok, I need this shit explained in Lehman's terms.


I have a Samsung 46" 1080p lcd tv. (i.e. the TV wasn't cheap) The TV has an optical OUT.


I want to send the HDMI cable from my XBox directly into the TV.


Can I then run an optical cable from the TV to my receiver to get 5.1 sound? I don't care about 7.1 or DolbyHD or any of the super advanced audio codecs. DD or DTS is fine. Will this be possible?

You will most likely not be able to pass through a 5.1 signal via the optical out, only stereo. As far as I know this is not a technical issue but more political (ie. Copy Protection).

 

[dallow_bg]

all HDMI recievers (and TVs BTW) do this. It was in the draft spec. There is no such thing as an HDMI input that can't accept audio. Likewise any device that passes thru HDMI will pass through the audio also.


I believe it will pass stereo PCM over HDMI. However the port is only 1.2. 1.3 is needed for 5.1 LPCM over HDMI. It will pass both DTS (and DTS-ES) as well as DoblyD and DolbyD-EX through HDMI. Those were both in the HDMI spec from the start.

As many have pointed out already, you are very misinformed.

There are plenty of HDMI receivers and DO NOT accept audio via HDMI.

And all you need for 5.1-7.1 LPCM is HDMI 1.1.

 

[borghe]

While the receivers you guys pointed out support LPCM 5.1 just fine over 1.2, I never said ALL receivers with <1.3 support couldn't handle multichannel LPCM audio. Just most of the older ones that are already in homes, which is true. Most early implementations of audio over HDMI were to pass the same signal out toslink as HDMI. Not all, but most.

There are plenty of HDMI receivers and DO NOT accept audio via HDMI.

please show me one. I mean hell, even the $180 Sony at Best Buy has 2 HDMI inputs supporting audio. the entire point of the HDMI spec is that it's supported audio from day one. why would anyone implement it without audio? The entire potential worry about LPCM over HDMI <1.3 was that CE manufacturers weren't entirely sure it contained enough bandwidth for 5.1 uncompressed channels. Many went ahead and still implemented it, but there are definitely older receivers and devices that can't handle it. Unlike audio which every audio-capable HDMI device can receive over the cable.

 

[falz]

Just a note, if you're looking into getting a different receiver, check out the Onkyo TX-SR605 (2 hdmi input) or TX-SR705 (3 hdmi input). Both are HDMI 1.3a compliant so they can decode whatever, basically do everything, and can be had for under $600 for the 705 (have to find a special), and should be at least 5+year future proof, as long as the amount of HDMI inputs suffices (there are higher up models in this product range as well, more hdmi and more $$ in those)

--falz

 

[falz]

There are plenty of HDMI receivers and DO NOT accept audio via HDMI.

No. There are probably plenty that can't decode certain codecs and potentially not give audio under certain situations, but HDMI implies audio. If not, they would be DVI.

 

[dallow_bg]

please show me one. I mean hell, even the $180 Sony at Best Buy has 2 HDMI inputs supporting audio.

Which Sony?

I hope you don't mean the DG510, as that one has 2 HDMI and doesn't pass audio.

Much like this Onkyo.

http://www.shoponkyo.com/detail.cfm?productid=TX-SR505S&modelid=56&group_id=1&detail=1&ext_war=1

Special Features

HDMI Pass Through (2in/1out , 1080P compatible) — A separate audio connection is necessary

There are LOTS of models that are HDMI switchers and not repeaters.

 

[BlueTsunami]

Whats funny is that you actually need a fucken dongle just to use an Optical out in conjunction with the HDMI. Thats hilarious

 

[borghe]

There are LOTS of models that are HDMI switchers and not repeaters.

I never said every receiver passes audio. I said every receiver ACCEPTS audio. It's right there in my quote in your post. Every receiver will at minimum accept LPCM 2.0 and at least DD encoded audio over HDMI and decode it.

 

[Mindlog]

You must spill the blood of a virgin lamb across the holy IR port in order to enable HDMI.

True story.

 

[dallow_bg]

I never said every receiver passes audio. I said every receiver ACCEPTS audio. It's right there in my quote in your post. Every receiver will at minimum accept LPCM 2.0 and at least DD encoded audio over HDMI and decode it.

Now you're just nitpicking.

A receiver that accepts 2.0 PCM but can't even play it is pretty much, no audio.
I don't know how you can call that 'supporting audio' if it can't even play the audio.

 

[falz]

Now you're just nitpicking.

A receiver that accepts 2.0 PCM but can't even play it is pretty much, no audio.
I don't know how you can call that 'supporting audio' if it can't even play the audio.

The receiver you pointed out accepts audio, but it cannot pass it to the TV, or whatever is hooked up to its HDMI output. Hence, all HDMI supports audio, it's all just codec dependant.

There are plenty of HDMI receivers and DO NOT accept audio via HDMI.

 

[BlueTsunami]

What would be the point of an Audio Receiver that accepts HDMI but doesn't accept audio being passed through? :lol If its just acting as a pure Video Component switch, then you may as well buy a stand alone switcher and get a better Audio Receiver.

 

[dallow_bg]

The receiver you pointed out accepts audio, but it cannot pass it to the TV, or whatever is hooked up to its HDMI output. Hence, all HDMI supports audio, it's all just codec dependant.

What? Why would you need to pass the audio to the TV?
It's a receiver, it should pass it to the speakers.

But it doesn't. Not even basic 2.0 PCM.

What would be the point of an Audio Receiver that accepts HDMI but doesn't accept audio being passed through? If its just acting as a pure Video Component switch, then you may as well buy a stand alone switcher and get a better Audio Receiver.

That's how many were when HDMI receivers were still brand spankin' new.
In fact, some still are.

Also, it helps keep clutter down away from the TV end.

 

[watership]

Could this be the most FUD/Misinformation thread ever?

360 HAS NO SOUND OVER HDMI! BROKEN.

Good Christ.

 

[newsguy]

Whats funny is that you actually need a fucken dongle just to use an Optical out in conjunction with the HDMI. Thats hilarious

I will repost for all of the cheap ass gamers who NEED to see this. DO NOT BUY THE DONGLE.

 

[Raistlin]

the misinformation in this thread is crazy..........

to reiterate, the 360 HDMI DOES 5.1 just fine. The only thing the 360 HDMI port DOESN'T do are the advanced audio formats over HDMI that require 1.3 (Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD, DTS-MA, PCM 5.1, etc).

If you need separate HDMI/optical audio runs, you need the dongle that breaks out optical audio. Otherwise you can only pass digital audio through HDMI.

The irony.



Multichannel PCM is NOT an HDMI 1.3 feature, it was part of the original spec (1.0). So yeah, the 360's HDMI IS gimped ... just not in the way the OP stated. Technically, its a MoBo design issue ... regardless, you can't pass basic lossless audio.

The OP's problem is that his TV will not pass DD through its digital out ... a problem that is pretty common unfortunately.

 

[Raistlin]

Actually, The 360 will decode a Dolby TrueHD codec (one of the "newer codecs" in question) and then transcode it to output a 1.5mbps DTS 5.1 track.

EDIT: But the 360 will not output uncompressed 5.1 PCM audio over the HDMI port after decoding this codec. This is part of the specs of HDMI 1.2 as well as 1.1 IIRC. Therefore the HDMI connection on the 360 is gimped.

OK I'm really done now.

Correct ... though to make things better ... it was actually in the 1.0 spec

HDMI 1.0

Released December 2002.

* Single-cable digital audio/video connection with a maximum bitrate of 4.9 Gbit/s. Supports up to 165 Mpixel/s video (1080p60 Hz or UXGA) and 8-channel/192 kHz/24-bit audio.

 

[Raistlin]

please show me one. I mean hell, even the $180 Sony at Best Buy has 2 HDMI inputs supporting audio.

There were tons of receivers that did nothing with HDMI but offer switching. They did no audio or video processing of any sort with it.

 

[dallow_bg]

There were tons of receivers that did nothing with HDMI but offer switching. They did no audio or video processing of any sort with it.

Thank you.
I even provided links!

And it's funnier because the Sony receiver he's talking about DOESN'T do audio over HDMI.

 

[vilmer_]

I will repost for all of the cheap ass gamers who NEED to see this. DO NOT BUY THE DONGLE.

Is there a digital audio input hidden in there? It would save me some Christmas cash instead of forking out for the 360 HDMI cable

 

[Brashnir]

Is there a digital audio input hidden in there? It would save me some Christmas cash instead of forking out for the 360 HDMI cable

Hidden? It's plain as day. The problem is that the casing covers the HDMI port. Remove the casing, no more problem.

 

[dallow_bg]

Hidden? It's plain as day. The problem is that the casing covers the HDMI port. Remove the casing, no more problem.

Wow, I can't believe that.

 

[vilmer_]

Hidden? It's plain as day. The problem is that the casing covers the HDMI port. Remove the casing, no more problem.

Well, I cracked open an old cable and there's no optical input

 

[newsguy]

Well, I cracked open an old cable and there's no optical input

What are you opening? Every 360 comes with a cable which consists of:

Component cables (red, green, blue)
Composite cable (yellow)
RCA cables (red, white)
Optical input

 

[Kleegamefan]

to reiterate, the 360 HDMI DOES 5.1 just fine. The only thing the 360 HDMI port DOESN'T do are the advanced audio formats over HDMI that require 1.3 (Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD, DTS-MA, PCM 5.1, etc).

Oh is that all?

 

[vilmer_]

What are you opening? Every 360 comes with a cable which consists of:

Component cables
Composite cables
RCA cables
Optical input

It's the ol' RCA cables. I didn't realize people were talking about cracking open their component cables lol! Well, I think I still have a couple of days left on my return @ best buy, maybe I'll just return the component cable and pay the difference on the HDMI cable :/

 

[Freshmaker]

please show me one. I mean hell, even the $180 Sony at Best Buy has 2 HDMI inputs supporting audio. the entire point of the HDMI spec is that it's supported audio from day one. why would anyone implement it without audio? The entire potential worry about LPCM over HDMI <1.3 was that CE manufacturers weren't entirely sure it contained enough bandwidth for 5.1 uncompressed channels. Many went ahead and still implemented it, but there are definitely older receivers and devices that can't handle it. Unlike audio which every audio-capable HDMI device can receive over the cable.

I have a Sony STR-DG510, and it won't process HDMI audio through the HDMI port. The manual specifically states that I have to use the optical cable in conjunction with the HDMi cable to get sound.

 

[dallow_bg]

I have a Sony STR-DG510, and it won't process HDMI audio through the HDMI port. The manual specifically states that I have to use the optical cable in conjunction with the HDMi cable to get sound.

And there you have it.

 

[manngc]

I will repost for all of the cheap ass gamers who NEED to see this. DO NOT BUY THE DONGLE.

Image of how to save $50 by not buying an overpriced dongle.

Thanks for posting that. That will save a lot of new 360 owners money by using the optical cable and a cheap HDMI cable and not MS's overpriced products.

 

[newsguy]

Thanks for posting that. That will save a lot of new 360 owners money by using the optical cable and a cheap HDMI cable and not MS's overpriced products.

Well thank DJ_Tet, he's the one who created the original topic.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=194995

He used a dremel but it's probably easier to just pop the casing right off. I can't overstate how simple this solution is, it will save you $50 and it takes 5 seconds.

 

[Giant Robot]

And there you have it.

this thread is confusing as hell and tons of misinformation flying around or just a crappy thread title.

But i've got my Xbox 360 hooked up via HDMI to my Pioneer Elite 84 VSX-TSi and getting Dolby Digital 5.1 audio.