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Opinion Hardware Sony says it’s ‘unlikely’ PS5 supplies will drastically improve this year - Microsoft expects Xbox Series X/S supply issues to continue until June

IbizaPocholo

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ibiza

Speaking during an investor call following its results (transcribed by VGC), Sony’s CFO said the company did not expect to completely resolve supply issues which have seen PS5 widely sold out since launch.

Hiroki Totoki said Sony was currently considering various solutions to help it cope with the global shortage of hardware components, including potentially altering hardware designs or sourcing secondary suppliers.

“As I said earlier, we’re aiming for more sales volume than the PS4 [during year 2]. But can we drastically increase the supply? No, that’s not likely,” he said.

“The shortage of semiconductors is one factor, but there are other factors that will impact on the production volume. So, at present, we’d like to aim at [beating] second year sales of 14.8 million, which was the second year of PS4.”

Asked specifically about the shortage of semiconductors, which is affecting all consumer electronics industries from smart phones to cars, Totoki suggested Sony had means with which it could cope.

“For example, we could find maybe a secondary resource, or by changing the design we could cope,” the exec said.

“In [the Electronics Products & Solutions business] we took a flexibility manoeuvre and in FY2021 we liked to flexibility adapt to the situation.”
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During the company’s third quarter earnings call on Tuesday, chief financial officer Amy Hood provided an outlook on Microsoft’s gaming business for the fourth quarter ending on June 30, 2021.

“In gaming, we expect revenue growth in the mid to high single digits,” she said.

“Significant demand for the Xbox Series X and S will continue to be constrained by supply.

“And on the strong prior year comparable, we expect Xbox content and services revenue to decline in the mid to high single digits.”

Hood’s comments are in line with those of Microsoft’s former head of investor relations, Mike Spencer, who said in February that supply of Xbox Series X/S consoles was likely to be constrained at least through June.

AMD, which makes the chips inside Xbox Series X/S and PS5, also said in late January that it expected supply issues through the first half of 2021.
 

Bernd Lauert

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My bro wants a Series X. He follows a Twitter bot for it. After two weeks of literally zero shipments, finally some tweets came in today.

It was sold out within 2 minutes. He didn't manage to get one.

Cobra Starship Literally My Favorite Band In 2008 GIF by mtv
 

ClanOfNone

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Nov 24, 2018
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StockX prices are slowly creeping back down after the Biden Bux infusion, I'll bite when it dips to $600 or lower.
I'm dying to play Demon's, and as a roguelike fanatic I really want to grab Returnal as well.
 
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cireza

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Holy shit, a redesigned PS5 already? what could they even do to improve production by doing this?
Obviously they want to reduce the quantity of materials that are getting difficult to get, if possible. It would not change the design nor form factor, only the inside.
 
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NahaNago

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My bro wants a Series X. He follows a Twitter bot for it. After two weeks of literally zero shipments, finally some tweets came in today.

It was sold out within 2 minutes. He didn't manage to get one.

Cobra Starship Literally My Favorite Band In 2008 GIF by mtv
I just tried to snag a ps5 off a target earlier and failed so I feel his pain.
 

GHG

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Holy shit, a redesigned PS5 already? what could they even do to improve production by doing this?

Depends on what the main cause of the bottleneck is.

At the moment it's the chips so that's not going to change but if it were to shift to some other component then there could be some flexibility in that area.

We've already seen the fact that they've used two different fans as evidence of this.
 
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Duchess

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Feel bad for all your guys that can't get a console right now.

I got very, very lucky with my PS5. A family member called me at 8:30am (I was in Tesco at the time..!) to tell me Amazon UK had just released some stock. I already had it on my wishlist list, so it was just a case of opening the app on my phone, adding it to the basket, and completing the purchase. The first tap of "Add to Basket" resulted in the app saying, "Error", and my heart went into my throat. The second attempt worked.

Here's hoping you can all get a console soon.
 

Torrent of Pork

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If it helps I can personally attest to StockX's legitimacy as a service. When you place your order they will take your money and hold it in escrow until the seller ships the product to them for verification, then it will be shipped to you while the seller gets paid.
 
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SNG32

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Honestly if you really want to get one of these consoles you can get one. Amongst the short supply I've managed to get a PS5, Series X and a 3070 laptop.
 

GrayDock

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It was pretty easy to get a PS5 at launch in Brazil during the pre-order period. I could get one from all the retailers easily, I choose mine based on the rewards of my CC two weeks after the pre-order start (but I had one pre-ordered from amazon day 1 just in case no reward was available till launch - better safe than sorry).
Nowadays? My friend is searching for one since december and no luck so far, and it look like it's going to be this way for a loooong time.
Good luck for everyone looking for 1, but it's worth the wait.
 

Markio128

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I feel like I only want a Series X just for the sake of having one. I’m going to leave what slim pickings there are to those who desperately want one and stick with my PS5 for now. Then again, would it be more sensible for me to get one when they are available in June, before the inevitable disappearance occurs again by the time some cool games are released later in the year?
 

Derktron

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Holy shit, a redesigned PS5 already? what could they even do to improve production by doing this?
My guess if they do that is to cut the cost down when it comes to cost and what I mean by that. Maybe they are trying to make it slimmer or smaller to make the cost lower and make it easier for them to make more supplies. That is my guess maybe I'm wrong.
 
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ethomaz

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At this point we know the demand is way higher than PS4 and Sony can't supply enough even at records shipments.
 

ethomaz

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It’s not an improvement, it’s a plan B second option due to supply chain issues. Not PS5 Pro. More like PS5 lite.
I believe the biggest item causing the supply issues is the APU.
So from what I understood they want to redesign (I believe shrink) the APU as fast as possible.

But for that they still needs to wait the TSMC 5nm.
 
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FeldMonster

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Holy shit, a redesigned PS5 already? what could they even do to improve production by doing this?
In theory, they could accept chips that are lower performing by some measure in order to increase yields. They could then make changes to other parts of the design to compensate. For example, for chips that fall below the specification threshold, they could claw back performance by overclocking them, and then compensate with more airflow by running the fans faster or redesigning the outer casing to be larger or use a more expensive heat sink. Everything has tradeoffs. Increasing yield seems like a logical way to do so, as they are locked into their chip designs. But it will certainly involve higher cost. Fortunately they have the resources to take action.
 

bender

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In theory, they could accept chips that are lower performing by some measure in order to increase yields. They could then make changes to other parts of the design to compensate. For example, for chips that fall below the specification threshold, they could claw back performance by overclocking them, and then compensate with more airflow by running the fans faster or redesigning the outer casing to be larger or use a more expensive heat sink. Everything has tradeoffs. Increasing yield seems like a logical way to do so, as they are locked into their chip designs. But it will certainly involve higher cost. Fortunately they have the resources to take action.

That wouldn't solve the IC component shortages that are industry wide. Most manufacturers are expecting shortfalls through mid-2022. I wouldn't expect things to return to normal until 2023.
 

Ten_Fold

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I got super lucky then since I own the series X and ps5. Anyways it does suck for people who rather just walk into the store or wait in line for a system, it’s pretty annoying to try an get one.
 

truth411

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I believe the biggest item causing the supply issues is the APU.
So from what I understood they want to redesign (I believe shrink) the APU as fast as possible.

But for that they still needs to wait the TSMC 5nm.
This can't be right. Once 5nm hit the demand for it will be through the roof. Apple is already gobbling up 5nm nodes already. My understanding is when Apple and Qualcomm move to 5nm that will free up more 7nm nodes for other buyers like AMD. For a proper redesign in 2023-2024 Sony would look to 3nm for a PS5 Pro, PS5 Slim.
 
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Humdinger

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Yeah, in my recent poll on the subject, most people thought the supply issues wouldn't resolve until next year. Looks like Sony agrees. Bummer. That's a long time to wait.
 

truth411

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So I'm bying ps5 pro model then.
In 2024 sure.
To me this means this generation is going to be a long generation. 2021 is a scrape because no one can get one, its going to be the later half of 2022 when supply meets demand. If Sony makes a PS5 Pro a couple of years later, the console generation still feels fresh since it took a couple of years to meet supply. My bet is PS6 comes out in 2028 since the first 2 years almost wont count.
 
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Andodalf

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In 2024 sure.
To me this means this generation is going to be a long generation. 2021 is a scrape because no one can get one, its going to be the later half of 2022 when supply meets demand. If Sony makes a PS5 Pro a couple of years later, the console generation still feels fresh since it took a couple of years to meet supply. My bet is PS6 comes out in 2028 since the first 2 years almost wont count.

The consoles are already getting lapped in RT perf, there's no way they last long
 

truth411

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The consoles are already getting lapped in RT perf, there's no way they last long
Doesn't matter RT isn't the be all and end all of graphics. Also if its 2023 before anyone can just walk into a store and buy a PS5 thats going to extend the generation. They will most likely make a PS5 Pro for those who want more performance and again that would extend the generation.
 

Andodalf

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Doesn't matter RT isn't the be all and end all of graphics. Also if its 2023 before anyone can just walk into a store and buy a PS5 thats going to extend the generation. They will most likely make a PS5 Pro for those who want more performance and again that would extend the generation.

Nobody wants to get lapped. If MS can make a new console on a 3nm process in 2025 that costs half as much and supports MLSS to give it a 5x+ perf advantage in RT over PS5 then they have to do something, and a "pro" that just doubles the counts ain't gunna cut it.
 

Dr Bass

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Yeah, in my recent poll on the subject, most people thought the supply issues wouldn't resolve until next year. Looks like Sony agrees. Bummer. That's a long time to wait.
Who says you can't get one? I got one from Walmart on one of the occasional drops. Was able to put it in my cart and do checkout.

Supply limitations doesn't mean "no supply." They simply are unable to meet current demand. Remember, the Wii was like that for quite some time. People are still getting record numbers of units however.
Unless 8k becomes super popular for TVs, I doubt they'll be making pro versions.

The "base" consoles are beasts as they are.
Not in terms of RT ability. There could easily be a refresh geared towards far better RT support and better frame rates in a few years.
 

bitbydeath

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In 2024 sure.
To me this means this generation is going to be a long generation. 2021 is a scrape because no one can get one, its going to be the later half of 2022 when supply meets demand. If Sony makes a PS5 Pro a couple of years later, the console generation still feels fresh since it took a couple of years to meet supply. My bet is PS6 comes out in 2028 since the first 2 years almost wont count.
Keep in mind that PS5 sales are tracking ahead of PS4.
 

Ezekiel_666x

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Not in terms of RT ability. There could easily be a refresh geared towards far better RT support and better frame rates in a few years.
We are just barely scratching the surface of what these consoles can do.

When you look at last gen, you had :

PS4 and Xbox One in 2013

PS4 Pro in 2016 (mostly to address the growing popularity of 4k TVs, their whole presentation when it was unveiled was basically how the PS4 Pro could do 4k checkerboard)

Xbox One X in 2017 (Microsoft needed to follow the same trend)


Now with this gen we have

PS5 and Xbox Series in 2020

So what would be needed for a "Pro" revision?

Faster SSD? More RAM? Faster CPU, GPU?

I doubt they would do research/development + production cost and splitting userbase just for some additional RT features. It's just not worth it. The point of a console is not to have the latest and greatest tech. By the time a PS5 Pro would come out, PC GPUs would surely still surpass them in terms of raw power. A new console requires time to plan and produce.

8k TVs would need to become very popular for them to even consider it, and even then, both next gen consoles are capable of 8k (I'm sure they could do some sort of 8k checkerboard)

Add to that that they are limited in supply right now and for the foreseeable future, I don't see them going for it.

A slim version is a given, because it serves to reduce cost.

Anyways, my 2 cents.
 
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truth411

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Nobody wants to get lapped. If MS can make a new console on a 3nm process in 2025 that costs half as much and supports MLSS to give it a 5x+ perf advantage in RT over PS5 then they have to do something, and a "pro" that just doubles the counts ain't gunna cut it.
No way MS would make another console and abandon the XSX in 5 years, there would be a revolt with there fanbase about MS releasing abunch of hardware with very little games support.
3nm is the node Sony would use for a possible PS5 Pro in 2024 (by then Apple and Qualcomm would have abandoned TSMC 3NM and move onto 2NM).

A PS5 Pro on 3nm would double the CUs to 72 and increase Clock Speeds on top of that. That would significantly improve RT performance, and could easily be 24-25Tflops in a closed boxed system. Also on 3nm would be small enough for a PS5 Slim.
 

Humdinger

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Who says you can't get one? I got one from Walmart on one of the occasional drops. Was able to put it in my cart and do checkout.

Supply limitations doesn't mean "no supply." They simply are unable to meet current demand. Remember, the Wii was like that for quite some time. People are still getting record numbers of units however.

No one. The poll was referring to ready availability -- i.e., the ability to go into a store and pick one up, or go on to amazon and buy one, without too much hassle.

I understand you can get one if you are willing to keep an eagle eye out for supply drops, then swoop in like a hawk when the time comes. I'm not motivated enough to go to that trouble. So I'm referring to more or less "normal" availability. Sounds like 2022.
 

Negotiator101

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Obviously they want to reduce the quantity of materials that are getting difficult to get, if possible. It would not change the design nor form factor, only the inside.
Basically inferior parts, at least people may be able to buy a PS5 though.
 
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I think it is safe to say the Series S is no longer having supply issues in the UK, Amazon.uk has had the S in stock for over a week now. Also noticed EU imports on the S for under the UK price.
 
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prinz_valium

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Ain't many PCs that can do all 3 either
None, unless you use some AI magic.
But it doesn't matter. Xbox Series X is the best performance per $ and that won't change until 2025

I'm so glad the new consoles released and I don't have to upgrade my PC.
I will rock my 1070 until 2024 or maybe even into 2026 if I have to. (3nm for consumer HPC should arrive in 2026

It's ridicules