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Sony vs. Nintendo vs. Microsoft First Party Output

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Also, the chart isn't even complete. As you said VR games Sony's baseball games, as well as 56-rated Predator are left off the list. There's probably some Nintendo and MS ones too. Some of the games on the list are made by third party studios but published by Nintendo/Sony/MS, so it seems that is the criteria.
That is what I thought as well, but I was told publishing the game isn't enough and that the company has to also own the IP. So the reason Ori is on the list is because it was not only published by Microsoft, but they own the IP. Meanwhile, the reason Bayonetta 3 for Nintendo and Death stranding for Sony are not on the list despite them publishing the games, is because they don't own the IP. Its little restrictions like this that invalidate the list. If we are going to include published games from third party developers, either include all of them or don't include any of them. Try to make the list as objective as possible.
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Why only include the lower rated PS omissions and not Xbox?
Youre free if you want to dig through the stats and find all the missing Nintendo and MS ones.

I'm just responding to the OP's text were he wrote MS got worse than Sony. Maybe it is true. But if it's true, at least include all the games, includung VR.
I highly doubt GTS or GT7, or even GT6, outside Forza Horizon 4 5, and 3. You're just lumping Horizon and motorsport together like they all don't sell massively, when it's only Motorsport.


  • Gran Turismo: 10,850,000 sold – #1 best-selling PS1 game
  • Gran Turismo 2: 9,370,000 sold – #3 best-selling PS1 game
  • Gran Turismo 3: A-Spec: 14,890,000 sold – #2 best-selling PS2 game
  • Gran Turismo Concept: 1,585,000 sold – #100 best-selling PS2 game
  • Gran Turismo 4: 11,760,000 sold – #3 best-selling PS2 game
  • Gran Turismo 5: Prologue: 5,350,000 sold – #7 best-selling PS3 game
  • Gran Turismo (PSP): 4,220,000 sold – #4 best-selling PSP game
  • Gran Turismo 5: 11,950,000 sold – #2 best-selling PS3 game
  • Gran Turismo 6: 5,060,000 sold – #9 best-selling PS3 game
  • Gran Turismo Sport: 1,140,000 sold – #29 best-selling PS4 game
TBF when I said "on average", I only considered each numbered GT entry. GT7 numbers are not available, and some of the numbers for games here were last updated many years ago.

The franchise sold over 90 million units as of December 2022; tallying up the ones here gives you 76.175 million. There are some lesser-known concept releases for say GT3 (like Tokyo-Geneva) and GT4, GT5 etc. not accounted for here but the numbers for the few I've come across are vary. For example, GT Concept Tokyo did 440K across Japan & SE Asia. Tokyo-Seoul did 90K in South Korea, while Tokyo-Geneva did 1 million in Europe & 30K in South East Asia (the numbers are shipped but it can be assumed all of these copies have since been sold. That's around 1.56 million for GT Concept Tokyo/Tokyo-Seoul/Tokyo-Geneva altogether.

Can't find Tourist Trophy numbers; whether it's considered a part of Gran Turismo explicitly or not I wouldn't know. No need to count it here. That source's GT Sport numbers are actually very low; Wikipedia says it's sold around 8 million units by 2019. That would be reflected in the figures provided in December 2022. So add another 6.86 million. Can't find any HD Concept sales numbers, either, but it was mainly provided as a free demo and cancelled for GT5 Prologue anyway.

So adding all those on top (just assuming Tourist Trophy did GT PSP #s, HD Concept 2/3 Tokyo-Geneva) you get 84.595 million. That's at least 5.405 million for GT7 and, again, the statement was for "over 90 million". You can also see that it generally takes a few years for GT games to reach the majority of their individual lifetime sales, and for releases that weren't badly timed (like GT6), it's generally a 10 - 11 million average for the actual main games. GT7 is probably someone around 6-7 million right now if I had to take a guess.

Forza Horizon 3 sold 2.5 million lifetime. Forza as a series (Motorsport & Horizon) reached a total of 16 million units as of April 2021. You know well as I it's almost impossible to get FH4 & FH5 sales numbers; all we have is that FH5 moved the equivalent of 1.96 million copies at $60 with its estimated peak of $118 million in revenue prior to FH5 going to Game Pass. However, the Premium Edition itself was priced at $99, so translating that to unit sales would put the number closer to 1.19 million. The 1st month of Steam brought in roughly $55 million in revenue but that isn't 100% unit sales, obviously. Also worth noting it's GameSensor's estimates; I don't know how credible they are, I mean SteamSpy vastly overestimated Elden Ring sales on PC for example so you never know.

But basically to your point. No, GT Sport has definitely outsold FH3, 4, and 5 combined. GT6 has outsold them each individually and likely 2 of the 3 (any combination) combined. GT7 has outsold each game individually and at least 2 of the 3 combined. It'll outsell all 3 combined by June this year if it hasn't reached that point already.

You seem to.

This thread has to do with first party (and published) game scores. Not sales. Yet you're still harping on sales wars.

No; the OP made the mistake of thinking the perception of MS's 1P output has to do with MC averages, because there are many other people who make the mistake of assuming MS's 1P output has a pure quality issue when they single out games like Crackdown 3 and ReCore, but ignore games like Flight Sim and FH5, or even smaller games like HiFi Rush and Pentiment.

I'm saying the ACTUAL problem with MS's 1P output is that they don't have much if any games that have huge, mainstream mass-market appeal. This somewhat ties over into another issue: they have very little in the way of games that can be called industry-leading or standard-setters in any significant area (graphics, game design, production values etc.), but that is not necessarily the same as the first argument and it's why I didn't bring it up until now.

It's the fact Microsoft doesn't have those sorts of games (either because they have declined altogether in relevance (Halo), have stagnated in growth (Gears), may be good but lack a lot of a human or person-like element at their core while also not doing much beyond the grain to stand out from competitors in their space (Forza), or are hardly associated with Microsoft & Xbox despite MS owning them (Minecraft)), why they have resorted to try buying them through publishers. And to a lesser extent developers like some of the teams they acquired in 2018.


has been asked to post in 'Grounded' mode.
Youre free if you want to dig through the stats and find all the missing Nintendo and MS ones.

I'm just responding to the OP's text were he wrote MS got worse than Sony. Maybe it is true. But if it's true, at least include all the games, includung VR.
There's at least 8 lower rated Xbox games missing and there are higher rated PS exclusives missing and lower rated PS exclusives missing so the whole thing is inaccurate
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