El Sabroso
Member
from both games, played betas and only end purchasing Splatoon, Destiny didn't have anything that kept me interested in, so Splatoon wins for me
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Splatoon vs Destiny, A discussion about content
- Thread starter oni-link
- Start date
Eh while the content release method of Splatoon keeps you interested, it's worth remembering everything so far has already been on the disk. Granted, they are going to continue supporting it with free dlc.
Destiny, to my knowledge, didn't have content locked away on disk, yet charged for the expansions. Though even without buying them you get access to much of the new weapons and armour which is cool and means players aren't left behind.
I don't think you can really compare the games either, different scope, number of platforms to develop for and all that.
Destiny, to my knowledge, didn't have content locked away on disk, yet charged for the expansions. Though even without buying them you get access to much of the new weapons and armour which is cool and means players aren't left behind.
I don't think you can really compare the games either, different scope, number of platforms to develop for and all that.
Forget time locked maps. We've seen GTA5 release without multiplayer entirely, and similarly for the upcoming MGS5, it's releasing without MGO. I'm pretty sure people can handle a steady stream of free content.
Those examples are quite different than Splatoon. In both of those cases, the missing features are truly more of an add-on to the core game. It'd be like if they were released with missing parts of the story.
Led_Zeppelin
Member
And where is wrong in that? Also there is no evidence because no other publisher does something like Nintendo did with Splatoon. I don't see Activision locking out Zombies mode on BOP3 or putting the mode in some sort of rotation with traditional MP modes or lock out maps or guns behind a schedule. I think there hasn't been a case like Splatoon outside of F2P games. Also what Valve game are you talking about?
GTA V and MGS V aren't traditional MP shooters. Both games have online but it isn't the core of the game, specially not MGS V. Also the entire mode were/are "to be released" in both cases not "more modes to come and maps and guns and now you can only play this the way we want you to play it". It would be more appropriate to say that MGSV will release with the last 10 missions being locked on the disk but will be released according to the following schedule.
I don't really think of this as a fair assessment of time-released content. The unlocking of content in games is traditionally controlled by playing or grinding but nintendo is releasing it themselves based on a timeline.
Why is one more valid than the other? They have their pros and cons. Time-releasing content keeps the community alive, but it gives less incentive for hardcore players to grind all the time. Some might prefer one way or the other but Nintendo didn't do it for evil purposes or to shaft anyone. There are valid reasons that they went that route and it is working for them.
I can see why it wouldn't work for all players but personally, I'm over the grindy nature of so many games. I welcome something slightly different. I think it works great for Splatoon. I don't have to grind to get a lot of weapons so I can play whenever I want to rather than feeling like I have to 'work' to attain certain content.
The Last Wizard
Member
I disagree with both games, both can be fun but a lot was done wrong. Funnily enough both have vocal communities.
Supermanisdead
Member
I don't like how Nintendo is baby-ing users with the Splatoon content. People can handle more than 2 maps every 4 hours, they can handle more than 5 maps at launch, they can handle voice chat, they can handle all the weapons at once. The slow trickle release made me uninterested in buying it day 1, but the 2 map rotation and lack of easy loadout switching makes me uninterested in ever really playing it.
I think Splatoon's content was deliberately locked to generate hype with each unlock and fake free dlc. I got less of a problem with a competitive game doing that since it was interesting to discover the game in a guided way along with the community.
I didn't play Destiny, but the comparisons to Diablo 3 and the grindy nature of the game make me think that it could be very disappointing if the game has a very limited amount of content and charges for meaningful updates.
I didn't play Destiny, but the comparisons to Diablo 3 and the grindy nature of the game make me think that it could be very disappointing if the game has a very limited amount of content and charges for meaningful updates.
Mushroomer25
Member
I think there's plenty of similarities to be drawn in how they dealt out content, but the style of game also makes a huge difference here.
Splatoon's basic game mode is clearly designed to be replayed, over and over again. It's a sport mode, multiplayer gameplay designed to be played on repeat with new connotations every time.
Destiny didn't have that. It had a series of very samey-feeling campaign missions that required a grind, in a context where the grind felt out of place. People don't mind playing the same two Splatoon maps for hours on end, for the same reason people playing League or Dota don't complain about a lack of map variety.
There's also scale & reputation to consider. People like Nintendo - they give them a pass on some stuff, simply because they spent years building up trust with their audience. Activision did no such thing, and arguably burned through Bungie's good will before the game even released. Splatoon was also a smaller game, released on a struggling console, with an innovative art & play style. Meanwhile, Destiny was the most hyped game of 2015 - and one of the most generic videogames ever made. Splatoon's easy to love. Destiny is easy to hate.
Splatoon's basic game mode is clearly designed to be replayed, over and over again. It's a sport mode, multiplayer gameplay designed to be played on repeat with new connotations every time.
Destiny didn't have that. It had a series of very samey-feeling campaign missions that required a grind, in a context where the grind felt out of place. People don't mind playing the same two Splatoon maps for hours on end, for the same reason people playing League or Dota don't complain about a lack of map variety.
There's also scale & reputation to consider. People like Nintendo - they give them a pass on some stuff, simply because they spent years building up trust with their audience. Activision did no such thing, and arguably burned through Bungie's good will before the game even released. Splatoon was also a smaller game, released on a struggling console, with an innovative art & play style. Meanwhile, Destiny was the most hyped game of 2015 - and one of the most generic videogames ever made. Splatoon's easy to love. Destiny is easy to hate.
Interceptor
Banned
Ironically Splatoon gave me the most complete feeling of a game this year.
family_guy
Member
Destiny felt like a $60 year long beta test. It seems the real game releases this fall. I refuse to give them more of my money though.
Kor of Memory
Member
Destiny has/had a healthy amount of content, the problem was both the developers and the consumers hyped it up to the point that they set the bar too high for anything reasonable.
Acerac
Banned
Splatoon's content drip has kept my interest going strong for the game since release. Logging on and seeing that a new map or weapon has been added is always so neat. If it were paid for DLC I'm sure there'd be a lot more fanfare, but as is it's just a pleasant little surprise when I'm playing a game I already enjoy.
I don't think it has much to do with how the games roll out their content. Rather, I think it's because Splatoon was a hit with a demographic that by and large doesn't enjoy shooters. People like me that didn't like how it rolled out its content just didn't buy it.
Meanwhile, Destiny has sold way more copies and is played by an audience that by and large does enjoy shooters. They had other things they could play and enjoy, and compared it to those things. But they still bought Destiny, and if they didn't like it, well, they made sure to tell others to save their money. Even if it's not even half the player base, it's still way more people then Splatoon could ever manage if people didn't like that one.
Then there's how they largely rely on different styles of play (one's competitive, while the other is largely a co-op affair with RPG systems in place).
I honestly think that if Destiny tried to pull the content roll-out that Splatoon did, it would get seriously panned by fans and critics alike. Splatoon got away with it because it was something very different from other games of its ilk.
Meanwhile, Destiny has sold way more copies and is played by an audience that by and large does enjoy shooters. They had other things they could play and enjoy, and compared it to those things. But they still bought Destiny, and if they didn't like it, well, they made sure to tell others to save their money. Even if it's not even half the player base, it's still way more people then Splatoon could ever manage if people didn't like that one.
Then there's how they largely rely on different styles of play (one's competitive, while the other is largely a co-op affair with RPG systems in place).
I honestly think that if Destiny tried to pull the content roll-out that Splatoon did, it would get seriously panned by fans and critics alike. Splatoon got away with it because it was something very different from other games of its ilk.
They're also essentially introducing a new genre to Japan. All the more competitive and hardcore features people want are not of the highest priority and may even detract from the experience. I think all the people who has played such games all their lives and are complaining about not having more of the same features are kind of missing the point. Has there been a more successful team-based shooter in Japan?
I see. Destiny seems like a pretty good game, but I feel like I gain by waiting for it to become a better, more complete experience.
I've bought Diablo 3 on launch, and I play it to this date. The game was seriously flawed when it released, and it became better with time. It is much more enjoyable on its current state, it even has servers in Brazil now. If I only waited I could have avoided a lot of frustration.
In Splatoon's case, the feeling I have is that I can have fun now, and later too when they add more content. As another user said, fewer people complain about lack of content on competitive games like Dota or Rocket League.
nobodyshero
Banned
But The Witcher (and destiny, to a lesser extent) gave you a full game, and then gave you time released content to keep the community alive. That's the ideal solution. I'm all for Nintendo releasing more content post launch, no one is nay saying that. But literally taking content out of the main game and then drip feeding it to the players? Any other publisher would have been put over the fire for that. It isn't innovative, it's just weird.
Kor of Memory
Member
That would probably depend more on your personality than the game itself. Are you a glass half full or half empty kind of guy?
I've played Destiny since the beta and while the current product is amazing compared to its launch, I still enjoyed myself at the time.
Just remember that people upset are 10x more likely to complain about something than a happy person is to compliment.
Destiny is actually very fun and successful, despite whatever the popular opinion around here may be.
SaganIsGOAT
Junior Member
Oh great, another thread for gaffers to express their powerful opinions on why they hate destiny so.
Zxrophantom
Member
I think price is a big part of why one is praised and one is not. When you have to pay for content at a premium you will have a set expectation on that content. When it does not deliver you often are much more harsh in judging that content and the DLC model as a whole. When things are free you are not as judgmental and are often more grateful of having free support of the game.
Destiny has been charging a premium for content that has wavered from barely worth it to not really worth it for a good amount of people. While splatoon no one will complain releasing free stuff. Even if one or two of those things you will never use. If you get to the root of it, building good will first is the key to keeping your community happy. I don't think destiny has done the best job at that. At best they are one or two steps behind the curve only correcting themselves after the community is already upset and complaining.
Destiny has been charging a premium for content that has wavered from barely worth it to not really worth it for a good amount of people. While splatoon no one will complain releasing free stuff. Even if one or two of those things you will never use. If you get to the root of it, building good will first is the key to keeping your community happy. I don't think destiny has done the best job at that. At best they are one or two steps behind the curve only correcting themselves after the community is already upset and complaining.
nobodyshero
Banned
I feel like a lot of this is just because of public perception though. There's zero reason to feel that way about Destiny over Splatoon. Like, what are you waiting for? A complete experience in what sense, what needs to happen?
Kor of Memory
Member
But on the flip side, the content for Splatoon was all locked on disc and not readily available to us from the beginning.
Meanwhile, Bungie has given us free content (on top of paid content) that all users can enjoy. Even if you only bought Vanilla Destiny.
Honestly, this whole thing is way too "Apples and Oranges" here.
The scenarios for these two games is way to different to compare anything to. Different marketing, genres, release dates, DLC methods, pricing models.
What are we really comparing here?
In the part of my post you didn't quote I mentioned my experience with Diablo 3. On launch it had serious difficulty and class balance issues, server problems, the loot system and items themselves were much worse. Now it has additional game modes, the loot system was fixed and they got rid of the auction house (now you can actually find your own loot), the classes are better balanced, the items much more exciting. It would have been great to have this experience on my first playthrough, and many of my friends gave up on the game before it improved.
But maybe Destiny is different. I don't know.
PAULINK
I microwave steaks.
I got tired of playing splatoon at launch because there was not enough maps to keep me interested, not to mention the stupid map rotation system. It's a fun game but it's insulting that they thought holding back content would keep me interested, quite the opposite.
I'll get back to it when they stop releasing maps.
I'll get back to it when they stop releasing maps.
nobodyshero
Banned
The difference is, Splatoons free content isn't above and beyond, it's to bring it to a point where it's considered a complete game. The only reason people accepted Splatoon on day one is because they knew that content was coming. And I don't think anyone expects Splatoon to never release paid DLC
To Far Away Times
Member
Splatoon is mechanically one of the best multiplayer FPS/TPS games ever. Add to that the free weekly updates since May/June and the game actually has a lot of content now as well.
Splatoon has already earned its place among the great FPS/TPS games, and much like Mirror's Edge, this is one of those games that many will feel was underscored in reviews.
Destiny is a paint by numbers DLC selling device with a 10 year plan and several sequels lined up before anyone had any idea if any of it was actually good.
Splatoon has already earned its place among the great FPS/TPS games, and much like Mirror's Edge, this is one of those games that many will feel was underscored in reviews.
Destiny is a paint by numbers DLC selling device with a 10 year plan and several sequels lined up before anyone had any idea if any of it was actually good.
nobodyshero
Banned
The Diablo point wasn't relevant to the question I was asking. This response still isn't relevant to the question I asked ;P
As I didn't play Destiny I can only extrapolate with the information I got pertaining to a game that I perceive was on a similar condition.
edit: Your questions were "Like, what are you waiting for? A complete experience in what sense, what needs to happen?". I meant to respond: Based on costumer reaction to Destiny at its launch state, I would wait for an overall better and less frustrating experience, like it happened with D3.
Leatherface
Member
As the owner of both games which I bought on day 1. I will say Destiny is a great game in it's own right but the grind focus really turned me off after awhile. It's exactly what burned me out on every MMO I've ever played, now it's in shooter form. To make matters worse there is the issue of taking advantage of the fan base, through obnoxiously priced DLC content. Last but not least Destiny was hyped beyond belief. People had high expectations and rightly so because Halo. Why wouldn't we? The game delivered was nowhere near what was promised or expected.
Splatoon on the other hand was an underdog. It was a game that had some excitement around it because Nintendo was finally giving us a new IP, but no one truly knew what to expect out of it. The game releases and at first people are a little put off by some aspects. There was no pass given. Our pitch forks were ready. Things like the map rotation, amount of multiplayer maps, single player campaign length, motion controls etc., all of that was bitched about immediately (by myself included). But that opinion mostly changed once we all dug in and experienced the magic of what the game actually had to offer. Splatoon is literally the absolute best shooter I've played in like a decade. Many people feel exactly the same as I do, because once it all "clicks", you realize just how deep and amazing it truly is. As a gamer it is hard not to love a title that brings something new to the table and just blows the doors off all expectations. The way Nintendo is delivering content works for this game. You can tell that they want this to feel like it's always changing and evolving. Splatoon is so focused on short blasts of gameplay on small isolated maps, I think it was a great move to give people a chance to get their feet wet a little initially and then start increasing the challenge at a controlled rate with more complex stages and weapon categories. It's been consistent since launch and honestly it really does keep things interesting. Splatfests are icing on the cake. Also, let's be honest here, after Mario Kart, which arguably had the best DLC value of all time, do you think Nintendo would give us anything less for Splatoon if a paid DLC comes down the pipe? In the meantime a huge FREE patch is about to drop with a ton of great content. With Destiny it is very obvious in it's pricing that the primary focus is generating that revenue stream over providing content it's fan base really wants, which is the exact opposite approach Nintendo is taking.
Splatoon on the other hand was an underdog. It was a game that had some excitement around it because Nintendo was finally giving us a new IP, but no one truly knew what to expect out of it. The game releases and at first people are a little put off by some aspects. There was no pass given. Our pitch forks were ready. Things like the map rotation, amount of multiplayer maps, single player campaign length, motion controls etc., all of that was bitched about immediately (by myself included). But that opinion mostly changed once we all dug in and experienced the magic of what the game actually had to offer. Splatoon is literally the absolute best shooter I've played in like a decade. Many people feel exactly the same as I do, because once it all "clicks", you realize just how deep and amazing it truly is. As a gamer it is hard not to love a title that brings something new to the table and just blows the doors off all expectations. The way Nintendo is delivering content works for this game. You can tell that they want this to feel like it's always changing and evolving. Splatoon is so focused on short blasts of gameplay on small isolated maps, I think it was a great move to give people a chance to get their feet wet a little initially and then start increasing the challenge at a controlled rate with more complex stages and weapon categories. It's been consistent since launch and honestly it really does keep things interesting. Splatfests are icing on the cake. Also, let's be honest here, after Mario Kart, which arguably had the best DLC value of all time, do you think Nintendo would give us anything less for Splatoon if a paid DLC comes down the pipe? In the meantime a huge FREE patch is about to drop with a ton of great content. With Destiny it is very obvious in it's pricing that the primary focus is generating that revenue stream over providing content it's fan base really wants, which is the exact opposite approach Nintendo is taking.
Just_myles
Member
This is true for me. I play a lot of splatoon with my 6 year old and I'm surprised we are not being charged for updates. I'm totally shocked. I expected to have to pay something. I mean for SMSB 4 I have to pay for skins and little editions like that and I sort of expected that from a major release like splatoon. Good on them for doing this. However, in the event they try to switch over, this could definitely alienate a lot of players(not me since I enjoy the game and expect this to happen.)
I mean...you WILL, just not yet.
I bet we get another big Splatoon expansion in november and it will be the first thing that costs money.
Kor of Memory
Member
How is the primary focus generating revenue here? I see this brought up all the time and I don't understand it. A game with micro-transactions typically has the primary focus of revenue.
Also, you're speaking as if Nintendo has already laid out it's DLC plans for Splatoon, but we don't actually know anything about it.
You're comparing a game released 10 months ago that has had several content updates to a game release 2 months ago that has unlocked several on-disc components.
Again, apples and oranges here.
PKMNTrainer
Member
If I pay for the disc, I expect to be able to use the content on that disc. The fact that Splatoon had content on disc that I could not access until it was handed to me was a little frustrating. It's a bunch of smoke and mirrors to make the player feel like they are getting more free content when in reality you already paid for it. I don't think I like that.
Imagine if every two weeks or so we got another on disc Smash Bros map or custom move.
Imagine if every two weeks or so we got another on disc Smash Bros map or custom move.
I disagree entirely now I think the approach nintendo did for splatoon is terrible by locking content on a disc and releasing it over time is outrageous and how they seem to get a pass by most people really shows the bias.
Destiny had a lack of content but it has quite a bit more content than Splatoon has in total. Both are not ideal but I think destiny handled content makes more sense.
I really think your overlooking alot in favor of splatoon when it launched with so little content and the content they are releasing is already on the disc.
Splatoon maybe a better game to you but they don't deserve to be praised for this, they deserve to be criticized for it.
I'd actually have all the custom moves for each character?
Kor of Memory
Member
Thus is the curse of Smash Brothers. Whatever the new fancy gimmick is, is likely going to be worthless, annoying, and not used by a majority of the playerbase.
I realize this has only happened twice now, but I still think it's a trend that we'll see repeat itself as long as Sakurai is in charge.
Leatherface
Member
You are missing the point. Obviously a game with micro-transactions is looking for additional revenue, but it should never be at the expense of delivering worthwhile content. People are pissed about Destiny for a reason.
Scientist Supreme!
Banned
Oh man do I love the "Nintendo gets a pass" narrative.
Kor of Memory
Member
I'm sorry, I still don't understand/get your point.
Are you saying Bungie intentionally gave us lackluster DLC in an effort to get a quick cash-grab?
Leatherface
Member
I'm not overlooking anything. trust me, if I feel slighted I will lay it down. I am not a one console Nintendo groupie, I just happen to feel like this is not a big deal with this particular title. Splatoon was worth every penny on day 1, the trickled out content I think worked in this games favor and I'm glad they did it. It's as simple as that really. Destiny's approach was for different reasons completely. If Nintendo used the Destiny patented approach, they content would not have been added to the disc and trickled out for $$.
Yeah, pretty much. Maybe not the intention of Bungie themselves, but the publisher for sure.
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
You still are grinding to unlock better outfits with more active perks, as well as other models of the available weapons.
What Nintendo is doing with Splatoon is controlling the drip feed of maps and modes, which you don't grind for in other shooters, because they're all made available from the start.
Ingueferroque
Banned
The launch content for Destiny is not 'less' than that of Splatoon, and unless Destiny really kicks you in the balls or you dislike shooters, you will get enough time/value out of it to get your $60's worth. Don't forget that despite the single player or coop campaign stuff, Destiny also has a pretty fleshed out PVP component.
Nintendo hasn't released paid DLC yet for Splatoon, but at the same time I believe most of the content that has been released so far has been on the disk regardless.
As Smash has shown, Nintendo does not shy away from asking money for DLC (characters, skins, maps, music, ...). So why act like they won't with Splatoon? Of course they will.
PotionBleue
Member
The cat (Judd) gives you money if you get a series of victories during a rotation, 2 hours would make it harder for beginner (and thus broke) players to obtain the maximum reward (1,400 coins).
Splatoon's 2.0.0 software update is ~610 MB large so it definitely includes new content, unlike previous updates (1.X.0) which were only bug fixes / balancing adjustments.
Leatherface
Member
You also don't grind for maps and modes in Splatoon. Weapons/gear unlocked does not give you a clear advantage over a good player either. You do not grind to win in Splatoon.
Yeah, that's kind of bonkers. Nintendo does not get free passes.
the irony of those types of posts is that they generally occur in threads where Nintendo is getting anything but a free pass
like when Splatoon's content roll out was first announced
apieceofstrange
Member
Splatoon is one of the most fun games I've played this gen and I don't really mind the timed release of content, but man they really need to increase the number of maps in the rotation. Sometimes you can end up playing the same map 5-6 times in a row, which can get tiring. I think at this point there should be at least 4 maps per mode.
As much as I enjoy Splatoon, and believe it to have some fun gameplay and great mechanics. Destiny was much better value, and was a far better social experience.
Like I have to turn my PS4 on to chat with my friends on Splatoon. Really Nintendo? Lack of partying up, no ranked mode for friends, very thin single player content (but mostly fun), shitty ass stick controls and settings, not being able to switch equipment in the lobby, lack of modes, and so on? Get the fuck out of here. Another great game that sufferers from Nintendo being Ninten'doh.
I got the game last week and already feel like I've seen all it has to offer. I've probably put in like 15hrs and got to level 20 without much hassle.
Like I have to turn my PS4 on to chat with my friends on Splatoon. Really Nintendo? Lack of partying up, no ranked mode for friends, very thin single player content (but mostly fun), shitty ass stick controls and settings, not being able to switch equipment in the lobby, lack of modes, and so on? Get the fuck out of here. Another great game that sufferers from Nintendo being Ninten'doh.
I got the game last week and already feel like I've seen all it has to offer. I've probably put in like 15hrs and got to level 20 without much hassle.
Seventy_X_Seven
Member
As mentioned, Bungie/Activision did give quite a bit too Destiny players for free. New crucible arenas, new patrol events, a new social space, new legendary armor and weapons, and even the raised level cap is obtainable by non-DLC owners.
What's really a shame is that right now in its current state there is so much to do in Destiny, but at launch it was definitely lacking. Worse yet is the highlight of Destiny in my opinion are the really well designed boss battles that throw interesting twists into how to take down the big baddie (absolutely love many of the Prison of Elders battles), but at launch there was literally nothing like that until the first raid a week later. Everything else was just a big bullet sponge. Not a huge shame because Destiny is still a big hit, but I can't help but imagine how much bigger it could of been if it released in its current state (probably not too big a difference since you'd still have to progress through the meh beginning stuff to get to the interesting end game stuff).
What's really a shame is that right now in its current state there is so much to do in Destiny, but at launch it was definitely lacking. Worse yet is the highlight of Destiny in my opinion are the really well designed boss battles that throw interesting twists into how to take down the big baddie (absolutely love many of the Prison of Elders battles), but at launch there was literally nothing like that until the first raid a week later. Everything else was just a big bullet sponge. Not a huge shame because Destiny is still a big hit, but I can't help but imagine how much bigger it could of been if it released in its current state (probably not too big a difference since you'd still have to progress through the meh beginning stuff to get to the interesting end game stuff).