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SPOILER THREAD - Man of Steel: Superman 2013
- Thread starter shira
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Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
I just saw the movie again and it is such a strange complaint. 95% of the damage is caused by Zod and his crew.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
G'mornin!
1) Wasn't angry or excited
2) That post you're quoting is a string of criticisms, not defenses.
3) The string of criticisms aren't exactly vehement, either.
That's one of my favorite lines actually. I totally understand that frustration.
legacyzero
Banned
Oh c'mon, I got a good laugh from the farm line :lol
thecouncil
Banned
I found it odd that Jenny didn't tell Perry to leave her there and try to save himself but I guess that scene needed the silence. Also don't get why that other guy was there at all. Did he love Perry too?
Messypandas
Member
The worst lines were mostly Zods. "EITHER YOU DIE OR I DO" when he then proceeded to butterfly swim up the building was cringe-worthy. Less would have been more.
She was scared, and Perry asked the guy to help him get her out. Would have been majorly prick-ish of them to abandon her, when the odds of out-running the machine were zilch anyway.
She was scared, and Perry asked the guy to help him get her out. Would have been majorly prick-ish of them to abandon her, when the odds of out-running the machine were zilch anyway.
legacyzero
Banned
It feels like they tried to ruin Clark as an identity. Hell, even Lois runs up to him (while he's in full supes attire) and yells out "Clark!"
I'm like wtf!
I'm like wtf!
I'm happy with this. I hated that in the Superman mythos that "Clark Kent" was more of an identity then who he really was. In this movie, he's Clark Kent with the "Superman" alter ego and that's something I prefer like Batman or Spider-Man.
Fairly Rational
Banned
That's an excellent point. The idea that Clark Kent is Superman's cover was popularized by the Kill Bill speech, I think. It was a sound idea but it never resonated with me because while Clark acknowledges his alien birth parents, he's always identified as a farm boy from Kansas. Clark Kent is who he is at his core.
Pejo
Gold Member
I saw this last night finally at the drive-in. Overall, i really enjoyed it. The plot and story were both really poorly executed, but the action scenes were great. Also, bearded Supes is the superior Supes. I know the die-hard fans probably hated the end but I loved it, even if it's not really the way he handles business.
thecouncil
Banned
I'm not saying he should have left her, but she should've presented the option to leave her. Though your "scared into silence" idea is a good enough explanation out of that.
legacyzero
Banned
The end didn't bother me. You gotta do what you gotta do. The series of events that lead to Zods snapping didn't really leave Supes with any other choice.
Who gets to decide what is grounds for conversation on the forum exactly? Here's a hint: If you see someone saying something that you don't want the conversation to steer towards, quoting them and replying to them only brings more attention to the post. It's not hard to ignore doing so. If you think that discussing such matters is an offense and doesn't belong in the thread feel free to contact a moderator.
I'm not the one who originally asked the question, I was responding to someone else's reply to the poster who asked the question in the first place. Again, if you think that is derailing the thread, contact a moderator.
I'm not just talking about the post I'm quoting, it's not hard to look through your post history and see how you talk to people who you disagree with.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
That idea really dates to the SIlver Age interpretation of the character. It was an old idea when Kill Bill was released, and very true for the 1960's version of Superman. It's the well from which superdickery sprung.
In his 86 reboot, John Byrne specifically reversed the notion and made Clark the identity and Superman the add-on, citing the fact the Clark grew up on Earth and would be more identied with the Clark side of himself. That's been the dominant depiction ever since.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Yeah, while I do indulge from time to time, I do try to cut the bullshit when possible.
Ignatz Mouse said:
I'm definitely NOT a fan of Byrne, or Byrne's version of Superman, but it's strange that the elements he contributed to the overall mythology of Superman that made it into the movie are elements I really didn't have much of a problem with.
Zod had the world Engine, but he was a non-stop exposition machine, for the most part. The movie often felt like a Star Wars prequel but he sounded like a Star Trek villain.
That last "I WILL FIND HIM" made for good trailers, but bad in-context. As someone else pointed out upthread, more than a few of those trailer moments didn't quite work in context. Of course, it's entirely possible that having basically MEMORIZED the trailers might have diminished those moments a little, for some people
I love the movie, but i find that beginning too disjointed and fast, like some parts were missing, towards the end this problem is less evident but is still there. Another thing that bother me, was the death of the Coronel and the Scientist, wasn't effective emotionally as it should, mostly because we didn't see them that much on screen developing the character and showing us why should we bother with them. Fix this and the saga will be very good as it should
GraveHorizon
poop meter feature creep
Saw the film last night. Several points:
1. Best movie this year that isn't Fast & Furious 6.
2. Good Superman movie with awesome fight scenes. Complete surprise.
3. Some of the dialogue was clunky, especially early on. You could practically hear the script in the actors' hands. A lot of it was stuff I know they had to say, and I agreed with the feelings implied by them, but the way they spoke was awkward and just... so written.
4. We've come so far since Spider-Man 2 and Blade 2. The parts where the actors were fighting and their bodies were CG weren't super obvious and off-putting.
5. Liked the villain. I could actually understand where he was coming from as a bad guy, in terms of his portrayal as a ruthless and militant protector of the Kryptonian race. Him being a soldier worked out fantastic with his mastery of Clark's original abilities, doing in a short period of time what Clark did over many years.
6. Liked Superman. He really felt like a good guy, and someone I would actually want to be. I even put my arms up over the steering wheel while driving home to pretend I was flying.
Yeah, I thought it was entirely appropriate, and Superman really struggled with the choice. Sometimes there just aren't any other options, and you can't just Doctor your way out of the situation with an asspull and a "who cares" explanation. I really respect what happened.
EDIT: In the scene where he was learning to fly, I suggested to my friend that they make a first-person Superman game where you fly, and he said it could be for the Oculus Rift. Someone needs to make that, where you can put your hands up to fly, and use heat vision, and totally punch enemies with body controls.
1. Best movie this year that isn't Fast & Furious 6.
2. Good Superman movie with awesome fight scenes. Complete surprise.
3. Some of the dialogue was clunky, especially early on. You could practically hear the script in the actors' hands. A lot of it was stuff I know they had to say, and I agreed with the feelings implied by them, but the way they spoke was awkward and just... so written.
4. We've come so far since Spider-Man 2 and Blade 2. The parts where the actors were fighting and their bodies were CG weren't super obvious and off-putting.
5. Liked the villain. I could actually understand where he was coming from as a bad guy, in terms of his portrayal as a ruthless and militant protector of the Kryptonian race. Him being a soldier worked out fantastic with his mastery of Clark's original abilities, doing in a short period of time what Clark did over many years.
6. Liked Superman. He really felt like a good guy, and someone I would actually want to be. I even put my arms up over the steering wheel while driving home to pretend I was flying.
Yeah, I thought it was entirely appropriate, and Superman really struggled with the choice. Sometimes there just aren't any other options, and you can't just Doctor your way out of the situation with an asspull and a "who cares" explanation. I really respect what happened.
EDIT: In the scene where he was learning to fly, I suggested to my friend that they make a first-person Superman game where you fly, and he said it could be for the Oculus Rift. Someone needs to make that, where you can put your hands up to fly, and use heat vision, and totally punch enemies with body controls.
Fairly Rational
Banned
Ah, I wasn't aware of that bit on Superdickery. I have to admit I only started reading comics in the early 90s (I was a wee lad then), so much of comic continuity pre-1990 is lost to me.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
60s Superman comics are awesome in how weird they are. Clark Kent is basically a costume for Kal-el to wear.
That was just bad...awful. Also this.
"You're a monster, Zod, and I'm going to stop you!"
Still love the movie somehow, even with all it`s flaws. It`s one of the strangest movies ever.
What do you mean? Is that line from some comic? It is not just the line itself. It is also how and when was it delivered.
Maninthemirror
Banned
He had to say all that superfast. You know, between the punches.
Maninthemirror
Banned
Re the ending I read an interview with Snyder where he basically says that killing of Zod will be the moment that will make Superman be vary of killing everyone else in the future, since he'd be the one who killed the last of his people.
I love the moment when Zod & Co get to the farm and you're terrified they might kill Clark's mom and then he comes in is basically all like 'I'll fuck you up if you even try to to hurt my mom'. Really powerful moment, I thought.
I love the moment when Zod & Co get to the farm and you're terrified they might kill Clark's mom and then he comes in is basically all like 'I'll fuck you up if you even try to to hurt my mom'. Really powerful moment, I thought.
Fairly Rational
Banned
I thought so as well. The way Clark seemed to lose his his shit screaming "You think you can threaten my mother?" (or something to that effect) was eye opening. At that point you don't think Superman has any buttons for his enemies to push, but Zod hit the mother load of raw nerves there.
Salvor.Hardin
Banned
Finally got to watch it today. I really enjoyed it, barring a few pacing issues.
I've read quite a few complaints related to the themes, flashbacks, chronology of events and comparisons to the trailer. I think all of those complaints have a common fault and a simple fix which is evident in the trailer.
In the trailer, we start off with Krypton, we see a young Clark struggling with his identity, then we see an older Clark question his place in society, and the crescendo hits when we see Clark accept his identity as Superman.
The film is similar, except that Clark accepts the Superman mantle quite early, and continues to question his place in society, resulting in oddly timed flashbacks. The viewer isn't treated to any moment nearly as strong as when Superman wears the suit in the trailer. There is no point of crystal clear realization of who he is in the movie, and there is an odd lack of struggle of him trying to reconcile between what his two fathers wanted for him. He just kind of decides things on the fly.
The trailer places a large emphasis on the scene where he emerges from the chamber as Superman. At that point, you're led to believe he's fully accepted his responsibilities. I think that scene should have held similar weight in the movie but it didn't. It was iconic imagery laid to waste.
The bulk of the flashbacks and character build up should have led to the point of him becoming Superman. That's what the trailer got right.
On a sidenote, when Zod is struggling with his newly acquired abilities for the first time, Superman has a line about how he had time and help to get used to his powers. Was that taken from the last issue of All Star Superman when Lex is going through the same effects as Zod was in that scene?
I've read quite a few complaints related to the themes, flashbacks, chronology of events and comparisons to the trailer. I think all of those complaints have a common fault and a simple fix which is evident in the trailer.
In the trailer, we start off with Krypton, we see a young Clark struggling with his identity, then we see an older Clark question his place in society, and the crescendo hits when we see Clark accept his identity as Superman.
The film is similar, except that Clark accepts the Superman mantle quite early, and continues to question his place in society, resulting in oddly timed flashbacks. The viewer isn't treated to any moment nearly as strong as when Superman wears the suit in the trailer. There is no point of crystal clear realization of who he is in the movie, and there is an odd lack of struggle of him trying to reconcile between what his two fathers wanted for him. He just kind of decides things on the fly.
The trailer places a large emphasis on the scene where he emerges from the chamber as Superman. At that point, you're led to believe he's fully accepted his responsibilities. I think that scene should have held similar weight in the movie but it didn't. It was iconic imagery laid to waste.
The bulk of the flashbacks and character build up should have led to the point of him becoming Superman. That's what the trailer got right.
On a sidenote, when Zod is struggling with his newly acquired abilities for the first time, Superman has a line about how he had time and help to get used to his powers. Was that taken from the last issue of All Star Superman when Lex is going through the same effects as Zod was in that scene?
GraveHorizon
poop meter feature creep
They also took the terraforming plot straight from the opening episodes of Justice League.
Did anyone else think Superman was going to use the gravity beam to fly straight through the center of the planet?
Did anyone else think Superman was going to use the gravity beam to fly straight through the center of the planet?
Miles Quaritch
Member
Does anyone else think we might see Project Cadmus in the sequel? A couple of friends who I went to see this were talking about it pretty much non stop after we left.
The genesis ship and all the other tech left behind seems to point towards potentially setting up Cadmus in the sequel, perhaps with Lex at the forefront of developing new tech to protect the US and its allies against Superman...
The genesis ship and all the other tech left behind seems to point towards potentially setting up Cadmus in the sequel, perhaps with Lex at the forefront of developing new tech to protect the US and its allies against Superman...
Messypandas
Member
Favourite moments?
+Zod killing Jor-El. A moment of savagery powerfully contrasted with the relief on Jor-Els face his son his safe.
+Kent dies. The drowning out of Clarks scream was a nice touch and reminded me of a similar moment with Two-Face in Tdk.
+Any time Clark walked around with them red eyes.
+Any time we got to see Faoras face up close.
+The last five minutes, especially young Clark with the cape. Were perfect.
+Zod killing Jor-El. A moment of savagery powerfully contrasted with the relief on Jor-Els face his son his safe.
+Kent dies. The drowning out of Clarks scream was a nice touch and reminded me of a similar moment with Two-Face in Tdk.
+Any time Clark walked around with them red eyes.
+Any time we got to see Faoras face up close.
+The last five minutes, especially young Clark with the cape. Were perfect.
Salvor.Hardin
Banned
Yep. The last 5 minutes really were something special.
Faora wrecking shit was also incredible. Seeing her zip around was like watching a live action Rurouni Kenshin scene.
I'd imagine CADMUS would reveal itself in Justice League or something.
Salvor.Hardin
Banned
So did anyone else think 'What the fuck is Clark wearing?' at the end when he heads to the Daily Planet? That combination wasn't working at all.
evil solrac v3.0
Member
what? you don't like Jeans and a shirt with tie?
MisterHero
Super Member
I wouldn't be surprised if they were the reason that no one from the government visited the Kents.
I'd also support the theory that
Martian Manhunter
Maninthemirror
Banned
It was a homage to christopher reeve clark kent
Doctor Decimate
Member
the movie was obviously supposed to be more grounded and serious, but some of the cheesy comic book stuff really worked for me in spite of that. i thought everything Michael Shannon was screaming was awesome.
Doctor Decimate
Member
the whole "AQUAMAN SENT THE WHALES TO SEE IF HE WAS OK" bit is definitely reaching.
This can't be for real.
WAT
I don't want them to waste a movie on Aquaman when they should do a Flash movie (to go along with WW). Introduce Aquaman in justice league, make him super badass and then do a stand alone.
Excellent point. I agree with you .. The donning of the suit scene seems to work better on 2nd viewing since you accept how that scene will play out and are no longer bringing trailer baggage with you
How so?
TheKaeptain
Banned
He has more control over his powers than Zod.
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