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[Riky]

There was no huge jump in hardware sales. Seems it sold well enough, with 2/3 being on PC (EU). No sales numbers though, sadly.

Xbox Series S and X UK sales jumped 76% on Starfield launch

The launch of Starfield and a new version of the Xbox Series S significantly boosted sales of Microsoft consoles. GfK d…

www.gamesindustry.biz

 

[Mr Moose]

Xbox Series S and X UK sales jumped 76% on Starfield launch

The launch of Starfield and a new version of the Xbox Series S significantly boosted sales of Microsoft consoles. GfK d…

www.gamesindustry.biz

Huge by % or by actual number of consoles sold? You should've used this one to make it look better:

The Xbox platforms benefitted from the release of Starfield, with sales up 136% month-on-month.

 

[BbMajor7th]

So, if I'm reading this thread correctly, Microsoft's gaming division no longer cares about game sales, console sales, critical reception, player engagement, or pretty much anything else - they want only to drive acquisition for their service platforms (not retention, wherein the real value of recurrent-spend models lies, but acquisition).

Crazily, I would have thought that Bethesda - an IP powerhouse, who's floated their entire empire on beloved, iconic franchises - might have wanted more in return for eight years of hard work than a few new subscriptions for a service they don't own, but... hey, what do I know? Maybe all that marketing spiel about Starfield being their first new IP in 25 years was really nothing of consequence. Maybe they weren't looking to create a zeitgeist-capturing, generation-defining experience that they can milk for decades like they did with Fallout and Elder Scrolls, maybe all they really wanted in their hearts was to push their parent company's abysmal performance up by a few negligible percentage points.

 

[Riky]

Huge by % or by actual number of consoles sold? You should've used this one to make it look better:

Either way it's a huge jump in console sales, due to Starfield.

 

[Mr Moose]

Either way it's a huge jump in console sales, due to Starfield.

% doesn't mean much without the hardware numbers. It sold less than PS5 which only had a 24% increase MoM. 136% is higher than 24% but the one that was 24% sold (a lot) more.

 

[Riky]

% doesn't mean much without the hardware numbers. It sold less than PS5 which only had a 24% increase MoM. 136% is higher than 24% but the one that was 24% sold (a lot) more.

It hasn't got anything to do with PS5. The fact is it had a huge uptick in sales with the launch of Starfield than the week before without Starfield. It's that simple.

 

[BbMajor7th]

Either way it's a huge jump in console sales, due to Starfield.

1. Correlation isn't causation. 2. Statistics are like lingerie: what they reveal is provocative, but what they hide is much more compelling.

That percentage hike is for one region - MS is a global business. Averaged out across all markets the numbers fall considerably. Also, though the percentages are provocative, what they hide is the actual sales numbers, which still put them behind key competitors, significantly so outside their safest market.

You mean in %, not sales. There's nothing huge about the number of consoles they sold.

Precisely. If I told you I'd increased my savings 300% in a week, it might sound impressive, but not if I then told you I only had $5 in savings last week.

 

[Mr Moose]

It hasn't got anything to do with PS5. The fact is it had a huge uptick in sales with the launch of Starfield than the week before without Starfield. It's that simple.

You mean in %, not sales. There's nothing huge about the number of consoles they sold.

 

[Riky]

You mean in %, not sales. There's nothing huge about the number of consoles they sold.

Do you know how many they sold?

 

[H-I-M]

Xbox Series S and X UK sales jumped 76% on Starfield launch

The launch of Starfield and a new version of the Xbox Series S significantly boosted sales of Microsoft consoles. GfK d…

www.gamesindustry.biz

Do you know how many they sold?

These were the estimates from install base for august 2023

PS5: 82k
NSW: 27K
XB: 26k

So for September 2023

PS5: 102K
NSW: 32K
XB: 61k

What a huge impact.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Do you know how many they sold?

Do you know how many they sold to make the % make sense?

 

[Mr Moose]

Do you know how many they sold?

61k.

 

[T-0800]

So, if I'm reading this thread correctly, Microsoft's gaming division no longer cares about game sales, console sales, critical reception, player engagement, or pretty much anything else - they want only to drive acquisition for their service platforms (not retention, wherein the real value of recurrent-spend models lies, but acquisition).

Crazily, I would have thought that Bethesda - an IP powerhouse, who's floated their entire empire on beloved, iconic franchises - might have wanted more in return for eight years of hard work than a few new subscriptions for a service they don't own, but... hey, what do I know? Maybe all that marketing spiel about Starfield being their first new IP in 25 years was really nothing of consequence. Maybe they weren't looking to create a zeitgeist-capturing, generation-defining experience that they can milk for decades like they did with Fallout and Elder Scrolls, maybe all they really wanted in their hearts was to push their parent company's abysmal performance up by a few negligible percentage points.

 

[Riky]

What a huge impact.

It is, Starfield had a big impact on hardware sales. Also the most new Gamepass subs and it went to number one in the sales charts.
That's a pretty definitive success by any metric

 

[OmegaSupreme]

Make sense. Fans were starving. It'll be interesting to see if the subs maintain.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

You think netflix gives a shit how many DVDs Stranger Things sold? All they care about is recurring payments.

Dang, easy on the truth bomb there. That cut him and hurt him there. Think they realize this after a year. What being sold is just a bonus. They more happier with the recurring payments

I am sorry, but nothing about his even addresses recurring subs.

How many people, like me, just paid for the one month and will not be paying for another sub until some next year for another month when there are a few interesting new games to play on GP? I can be the only one doing this.... unless my once-a-year one-month sub is what counts as a recurring sub.

 

[Heisenberg007]

Either way it's a huge jump in console sales, due to Starfield.

It's not really. You're only looking at specific markets and cherry-picking the stats.

We now have the official worldwide data. And hardware is down by 7%.

 

[SmokSmog]

Starfield has no legs.

 

[Bond007]

I renewed for a month to try it out for about 2hrs.
Never touched it again. Series X is back to collecting dust promptly.

 

[Heisenberg007]

Make sense. Fans were starving. It'll be interesting to see if the subs maintain.

Considering Microsoft has not shared updated Game Pass numbers in nearly 2 years now, it's mostly likely that we won't even "see" the numbers - especially considering that Game Pass missed more targets for the 3rd year in a row.

The most we'll see is a cherry-picked number at a given point in time, which would be most likely the Starfield launch day, before subs might start decreasing. At this point, Microsoft had also combined XBLG subs into Game Pass.

So we may get an artificially inflated number, something like ~35 million, while the actual data stays hidden behind smoke screens.

 

[NEbeast]

There were no game pass trials around the time the game came out, there was even a GAF topic about it.

So, not a single one of those new sign-ups because of Starfield was a trial.

Take comfort in that.

Can't anyone make a new account and try for £1? You even said you did something similar on the rental service you use.

 

[NEbeast]

Biggest subs in a day means this was the most interest ever for a game on Game Pass. Why does that mean nothing?

Because the whole point is getting people long term, is it not?

 

[JCK75]

I'm a huge fan of Skyrim and FO4 but.... space is boring and whenever I look at the game I just feel so little desire to play it.

 

[Kilau]

Everyone else seems to know, but who is John Welfare?

 

[systemr123]

When it was announced, I saw it win and saw this concept for Nintendo easily stick 20 years . But I try to keep an open mind . I’ll always be me

I liked the concept when it was announced but was on the fence if it would work out or not. Very happy to see that it did and it gets the most play time at home because the kids absolutely love the games, which are honestly great.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

This is a great post to wake up to.

Comparing insomniac, a company that owns one ip...sunset overdrive ....and has only made games for other license holders...to Zenimax who embodies multiple A class studios and a handful of the most well known IP in gaming history.

You're comparing 3 years to what Microsoft will be looking at as decades of business opportunities. Do you think insomniac pulls any money in for the next spider man movie?

...what about the fallout TV show next year For Microsoft?

Try not to be so small minded in your analysis.

Catalog gaming isn't like catalog movies.

The strength of ZeniMax's IP is largely never going to outproduce the revenue Insomniac has generated in just 3 years. Again you have to consider the costs of development and the cost of the studio. Strategically speaking, it's a no-brainer between the two right now.

I like that you ignore Resistance and Ratchet and somehow focus only on Sunset Overdrive.

Spider-Man 3 is likely to also do gangbusters with minimal investment needed, not to mention Wolverine, which if successful will likely leed to X-Men. This isn't even mentioning a likely Venom spin-off ala Miles Morales....

If the Fallout TV show is anything like the Halo TV show... it's going to have limited success.

Sony could invest in Insomniac for the rest of time with 7 billion dollars and get a better return than Zenimax. In reality they won't even need that much.

Arkane should probably be shut down after Redfall, Tango will probably see an exodus of employees, Bethesda's next game won't come out for at least 5 more years and there is no evidence that the industry just hasn't passed them by like Bioware. That really leaves id and Doom. Which honestly isn't worth THAT much, especially if it isn't on all platforms. Doom and the occasional Bethesda game isn't going to keep pace with Insomniac.

 

[adamsapple]

Can't anyone make a new account and try for £1? You even said you did something similar on the rental service you use.

They explicitly stopped doing the $1 for new accounts before Starfield came out, for game pass.

Again, there was a topic about it on GAF and all, surprised you missed it.

News - Rumor - Microsoft has apparently eliminated the $1 Xbox Game Pass trial once again, just before the release of Starfield

Today: Earlier this month:

www.neogaf.com

Any new game pass sign ups that were made on Starfield's release were genuine PC/console or Ultimate sign ups.

 

[Rien]

Everyone else seems to know, but who is John Welfare?

Father of Bennie Broke

 

[ReBurn]

1 million in over a month is a serious rate decrease.

We'll see if there is any nominal uptick through the holidays, but my guess is that the Xbox series is a dead platform after January 1.

There seems to be continued obfuscation around how well Starfield performed, but I think MOST of us measure the goals around Starfield (enough to foreclose it on PS5) to be as follows:

• Sell Xbox Series Consoles
• Sell GamePass Subscriptions
  • Retain MAU beyond 3 months

We've seen in every reported region in the world that Starfield failed to move Xbox Series passed the PS5 with no major release for even the month of September. That is enough to suggest that it didn't sell a sufficient number of units because I don't really think anyone would say the PS5 sold an exceptional number of units in September and by all reports it comfortable outsold the Xbox Series.

With Spider-Man 2, the PS5 Slim, and new accessories, the PS5 is going to have an extremely strong holiday season while the Xbox has nothing to push it this holiday. I'm stunned that Microsoft hasn't dropped the price yet, because that's the only thing left in their control to do. They should immediately drop the price by 100 dollars for the XSX and 50 dollars for the XSS. That they haven't dropped the price tells me that don't want to to eat the operating cost for selling at a loss even if it means maintaining market share. That tells me they are no longer interested in market share this generation, and that's a VERY dangerous conclusion to make this early in the cycle that will reverberate into the next cycle.

Not sure we've seen any reason to believe that GamePass subscribership would have largely advanced due to this game. Forza 5 seemingly got significantly more players though perhaps less engagement. Even if 75% of players played it on GamePass, that would still only be 8.25 million. Let's be aggressive and say half of these are new subscribers, that would mean Starfield only drove 4.125 million subscribers... that's not sufficient, particularly because there is no guarantee that they'll stay beyond 3 months, especially with nothing of note on the horizon.

The player counts for Starfield on in serious decline on Steam. Even Xbox players have moved on to other games falling behind games like Stray...

Perplexed by people who are saying this game wasn't a failure, when it clearly is.

"Based on the way I measure success Starfield is a failure."

Quelle surprise...how you measure the success of Starfield turns out to be an exercise in mental gymnastics. Personal console sales targets, game pass subscription growth and retention that you couldn't possibly quantify, Steam player count and Spider-Man.

And to think you accused me of having bad takes the other day.

 

[Kilau]

Father of Bennie Broke

lol

Seriously though, there isn't any source in the tweet so who is this person? I assume an "insider" but have no clue.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

"Based on the way I measure success Starfield is a failure."

Quelle surprise...how you measure the success of Starfield turns out to be an exercise in mental gymnastics. Personal console sales targets, game pass subscription growth and retention that you couldn't possibly quantify, Steam player count and Spider-Man.

And to think you accused me of having bad takes the other day.

Yeah, you're still at it too.

Personal console sales targets? We didn't see any nominal improvement of Xbox sales and all evidence points to a really poor outing in October.

GamePass subscription growth, based on the poor overall numbers of Starfield compared to titles like Horizon suggest minimal growth and with minimal growth you're not going to have an opportunity at significant retention, because there are few new players to retain in the first place.

Microsoft likes to obsfucate the details, so of course we don't have all the data we'd like, but with any decent analysis, you can ascertain the performance of a game like Starfield.

But as someone mentioned before the only people defending this are the defense squad.

Going to try to be better about engaging you guys, because it's clear you aren't looking for an analytical discussion on the performance of games.

 

[NickFire]

Weird that the number who played isn’t closer to the number of GP subs. What the heck are those people subbing for if they aren’t playing the biggest game the service had so far?

 

[adamsapple]

"Based on the way I measure success Starfield is a failure."

Quelle surprise...how you measure the success of Starfield turns out to be an exercise in mental gymnastics. Personal console sales targets, game pass subscription growth and retention that you couldn't possibly quantify, Steam player count and Spider-Man.

And to think you accused me of having bad takes the other day.

In reality:

 

[Porticus]

Huge win.

Basically flat revenue after such a big release.

 

[ReBurn]

In reality:

That's a shame. Because making money and beating forecasts apparently isn't on the list of success criteria unless they manage to not actually make any. Then it becomes super important.

These console warriors, man.

 

[Three]

lol

Seriously though, there isn't any source in the tweet so who is this person? I assume an "insider" but have no clue.

He was a member here who tracked sales well. He went to installbase as a mod or something. He keeps tabs on sales data rather well but isn't an insider.

 

[Unknown?]

You think netflix gives a shit how many DVDs Stranger Things sold? All they care about is recurring payments.

They care if people are engaged in content they offer or that payment will eventually stop. If most people watch only one episode of Stranger Things, it would be on the cutting block for something else.

 

[JackMcGunns]

Thankfully nice and low.

So the news lowered your blood pressure? that's not good either, are you feeling faint?

Spoiler

kidding of course lol.

 

[Taur007]

1 million in over a month is a serious rate decrease.

We'll see if there is any nominal uptick through the holidays, but my guess is that the Xbox series is a dead platform after January 1.

There seems to be continued obfuscation around how well Starfield performed, but I think MOST of us measure the goals around Starfield (enough to foreclose it on PS5) to be as follows:

• Sell Xbox Series Consoles
• Sell GamePass Subscriptions
  • Retain MAU beyond 3 months

We've seen in every reported region in the world that Starfield failed to move Xbox Series passed the PS5 with no major release for even the month of September. That is enough to suggest that it didn't sell a sufficient number of units because I don't really think anyone would say the PS5 sold an exceptional number of units in September and by all reports it comfortable outsold the Xbox Series.

With Spider-Man 2, the PS5 Slim, and new accessories, the PS5 is going to have an extremely strong holiday season while the Xbox has nothing to push it this holiday. I'm stunned that Microsoft hasn't dropped the price yet, because that's the only thing left in their control to do. They should immediately drop the price by 100 dollars for the XSX and 50 dollars for the XSS. That they haven't dropped the price tells me that don't want to to eat the operating cost for selling at a loss even if it means maintaining market share. That tells me they are no longer interested in market share this generation, and that's a VERY dangerous conclusion to make this early in the cycle that will reverberate into the next cycle.

Not sure we've seen any reason to believe that GamePass subscribership would have largely advanced due to this game. Forza 5 seemingly got significantly more players though perhaps less engagement. Even if 75% of players played it on GamePass, that would still only be 8.25 million. Let's be aggressive and say half of these are new subscribers, that would mean Starfield only drove 4.125 million subscribers... that's not sufficient, particularly because there is no guarantee that they'll stay beyond 3 months, especially with nothing of note on the horizon.

The player counts for Starfield on in serious decline on Steam. Even Xbox players have moved on to other games falling behind games like Stray...

Perplexed by people who are saying this game wasn't a failure, when it clearly is.

The series platform will still be here after January 1st, time to wake up bud and stop projecting nonsense.

 

[mejin]

They said 10M less than 3 weeks after the game was out. Over a month later, just another million?

Yeah, first thing I remembered.

Game sunk really fast.

Bet some green rats were expecting 15M by now LOL

 

[Kilau]

He was a member here who tracked sales well. He went to installbase as a mod or something. He keeps tabs on sales data rather well but isn't an insider.

So….

 

[Interfectum]

Greatest game ever

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Because the whole point is getting people long term, is it not?

You still have to get the sub first. It's a positive metric whether you like it or not.

Yeah, first thing I remembered.

Game sunk really fast.

Bet some green rats were expecting 15M by now LOL

Nice hot take, but if you just read like a couple posts down, you'd have realized this is from an earnings call at the end of the September. That means somewhere between 1m and 2m new players played the game in about a week and a half.

 

[Dr_Ifto]

So, if I'm reading this thread correctly, Microsoft's gaming division no longer cares about game sales, console sales, critical reception, player engagement, or pretty much anything else - they want only to drive acquisition for their service platforms (not retention, wherein the real value of recurrent-spend models lies, but acquisition).

Crazily, I would have thought that Bethesda - an IP powerhouse, who's floated their entire empire on beloved, iconic franchises - might have wanted more in return for eight years of hard work than a few new subscriptions for a service they don't own, but... hey, what do I know? Maybe all that marketing spiel about Starfield being their first new IP in 25 years was really nothing of consequence. Maybe they weren't looking to create a zeitgeist-capturing, generation-defining experience that they can milk for decades like they did with Fallout and Elder Scrolls, maybe all they really wanted in their hearts was to push their parent company's abysmal performance up by a few negligible percentage points.

I mean, you see Pete leave. Maybe htis is one of the reasons. Also, Activision CEO said that gamepass was not the way to go. Thing is, Microsoft is all in. Ride or die on Gamepass. Its all netflix is worried about, and it seems to be working for them.

 

[Three]

So….

Welfare uses revealed data and does calculations based on percentage changes to fill in any gaps. It's not really delusion but somebody doing the statistics.

 

[Hugare]

I was one of those

Subbed for a month to play Starfield. Ended up being disapointed by it, never finished, and I'm not paying for GP anymore.

So I'm part of the 11M and I'm also one of those who subbed, despite not having the subscription anymore.

Looking from my pov, those are shit metrics. 'Cause I played it, but didnt enjoy it and didnt pay 70 dollars for it, so MS only got my subscription fee. I'm also not subbed anymore to GP, so it would be more meaningful to know how many of those subscribers are still using GP.

Its like Netflix: many people sub when a new Stranger Things seasons comes out. Does that mean that they will stay subscribed after watching it? Nah, so this metrics sucks

 

[JackMcGunns]

PC gamers have options

Before this reveal, supposedly the explosive numbers and Starfield's success were coming from steam sales, we were told that Xbox had nothing to do with it, so it wasn't a good look for Xbox, but now that we see it's actually doing better on Xbox, it's because PC players want to play something else. It's mind boggling how much people want to deny Stafield's success or want to see it fail, it's almost irrational until I remember how irrational tribalism can be.

 

[DenchDeckard]

% doesn't mean much without the hardware numbers. It sold less than PS5 which only had a 24% increase MoM. 136% is higher than 24% but the one that was 24% sold (a lot) more.

Starfield drove hardware sales considerably though. Which I think most people are trying to say?

Catalog gaming isn't like catalog movies.

The strength of ZeniMax's IP is largely never going to outproduce the revenue Insomniac has generated in just 3 years. Again you have to consider the costs of development and the cost of the studio. Strategically speaking, it's a no-brainer between the two right now.

I like that you ignore Resistance and Ratchet and somehow focus only on Sunset Overdrive.

Spider-Man 3 is likely to also do gangbusters with minimal investment needed, not to mention Wolverine, which if successful will likely leed to X-Men. This isn't even mentioning a likely Venom spin-off ala Miles Morales....

If the Fallout TV show is anything like the Halo TV show... it's going to have limited success.

Sony could invest in Insomniac for the rest of time with 7 billion dollars and get a better return than Zenimax. In reality they won't even need that much.

Arkane should probably be shut down after Redfall, Tango will probably see an exodus of employees, Bethesda's next game won't come out for at least 5 more years and there is no evidence that the industry just hasn't passed them by like Bioware. That really leaves id and Doom. Which honestly isn't worth THAT much, especially if it isn't on all platforms. Doom and the occasional Bethesda game isn't going to keep pace with Insomniac.

Are you saying Sony doesnt spend money on games. Do you think a Marvel Spider Man game didnt have a large budget?

Also, Resistance and Ratchet are owned by Sony and were never owned by insomiac. I don't understand what you are trying to say, you are trying to win an argument saying SOny don't invest in their games and especialy their Marvel games. Or are you saying they cheap out on funding these games and ask Insomiac to re use assets? I'm sorry but I feel like you are self owning yourself with every point you have tried to make in this thread.

I will agree with something though. Insomiac are an amazing developer.

In reality:

Yeah, it's a stark difference to what a specific user base on this forum wants the world to believe. Xbox is successful, simple as. Not as big or successful as Sony but they are doing nothing but moving in the right direction overall. Console sales are moving in the wrong direction and that is a cause for concern to me, if it matters to MS I am not sure. Maybe they aren't bothered about consoles like Sony are.

 

[Porticus]

Before this reveal, supposedly the explosive numbers and Starfield's success were coming from steam sales, we were told that Xbox had nothing to do with it, so it wasn't a good look for Xbox, but now that we see it's actually doing better on Xbox, it's because PC players want to play something else. It's mind boggling how much people want to deny Stafield's success or want to see it fail, it's almost irrational until I remember how irrational tribalism can be.

This happens when a trilion dollar company buys third party publisher.

Nothing surprising.

Irrational would be if no one cared about whats happening in the industry because of MS.

 

[Kilau]

Welfare uses revealed data and does calculations based on percentage changes to fill in any gaps. It's not really delusion but somebody doing the statistics.

Mostly wondering about the game pass sub stat, was that something MS revealed? Would be interested in the methodology to figure that out if it’s not public.