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English

Linguists from the University of Lyon in France looked at seven widely spoken languages to see how they rank in terms of efficiency. Which mother tongue works best at imparting information? A clue: it’s not French.

Imparting information is language’s most important function – and a recent study published in Language rates just how efficient English, French, Spanish, Italian, Japanese, Mandarin-Chinese and German are at doing just that.

Three French linguists at the University of Lyon recorded 59 people, divided equally among men and half, reading five-sentence texts identical in meaning at a normal speed in their mother tongue. Then they computer-edited out the pauses and counted syllables and information per time unit and language. The goal was to draw conclusions about how fast a specific density of information could be communicated in the seven languages.

The result? Some languages are spoken faster than others. For example, Japanese speakers say eight syllables per second, whereas Mandarin Chinese get in only five. But regardless, a faster tempo in no way implied faster transmission of information.

Linguistics professor Gertraud Fenk-Oczlon of the University of Klagenfurt (Austria) said she was not surprised by the result. In 2010, using a different methodology, she conducted a similar study using 51 languages.

All researchers found that no matter how slow a language is, the complexity of syllables means that information is imparted as quickly as it is in faster languages. Thus, for example, a slow and very complex language like German manages to rate as slightly more efficient than fast-paced Japanese. And it comes in third after English, which garnered first place, and Chinese, which came in second.

To the surprise of the researchers, however, differences in efficiency were only minimal.

 

[Khalifa Jayy]

YouAreAlreadyRead.jpg

 

[genjiZERO]

I don't see how that's possible considering that English is a vague language, but ok...

 

[MWS Natural]

I'm currently learning Turkish from my gf and I'm amazed how much you have to say to communicate the simplest things.

 

[Nemo]

Some languages (like Italian) are designed with more in mind than just communication goals

 

[iamshadowlark]

I don't see how that's possible considering that English is a vague language, but ok...

English is best.

See, three words and it gives a hell of a message.

 

[genjiZERO]

English is best.

See, three words and it gives a hell of a message.

but that statement is so vague that I can interpret it in numerous ways. . . (it's also grammatically incorrect!)

 

[vas_a_morir]

Some languages (like Italian) are designed with more in mind than just communication goals

Well, let's compare Italian and English sentences.

English: Hello, It's so nice to meet you.
Italian: Hello, it's-a so nice-a to meet-a you!

Clearly, it is less efficient.

 

[Deleted member 81567]

I said
He said
They said
We said
The dog said
You said


Yo hablo
El habla
Ellos hablan
Nos hablamos
El perro habla
Tu hablas

 

[Sub_Level]

It's ironic that although English may be the most efficient, it can also be the most colorful languages because of it's expansive, descriptive vocabulary.

Of course, languages like Spanish and French are sexier.

 

[gwarm01]

It isn't the surprising if you think about it. I've always heard English and Chinese are some of the most difficult languages to learn. Because they are so complex and nuanced, a large amount of information can be given using fewer words.

 

[Smellycat]

loool

They didn't even study Arabic? It is waaaaaay more efficient than English. Just ask people who have studied it. I have heard native English speakers telling me that. I have been speaking Arabic all of my life, and English since 1st grade, and it is pretty obvious which one is more efficient.

 

[Cptkrush]

When learning French in school I always thought about how much more efficient English was. I mostly thought about it when it came to learning the different genders for certain words and the endless amounts of verb variation. Still a fun language though.

 

[Tesseract]

duh.

 

[Smellycat]

I said
He said
They said
We said
The dog said
You said


Yo hablo
El habla
Ellos hablan
Nos hablamos
El perro habla
Tu hablas

And in Arabic, all of these can be said in 1 word except for "The Dog said", that one is two words.

 

[Credo]

I guessed correctly!

 

[lo escondido]

And in Arabic, all of these can be said in 1 word except for "The Dog said", that one is two words.

In the spanish words he put you can take out the first word save for the dog


hablo
habla
hablan
hablamos
El perro habla
hablas

 

[dojokun]

Doesn't shock me because the main gripe with English isn't about how quickly it gets to the point. It's about lack of logical patterns in pronunciation and vague grammar structure, which makes it harder to learn than other languages with a more disciplined grammar and pronunciation system.

 

[Kuro Madoushi]

Wish I could read German to determine what they considered 'getting to the point'.

 

[Meadows]

And in Arabic, all of these can be said in 1 word except for "The Dog said", that one is two words.

you need to put Allahu Akbar in front of it though /libya

 

[Smellycat]

In the spanish words he put you can take out the first word save for the dog

Yeah, Spanish is kind of similar to Arabic because they both use root words/verbs. But how will I know when some says "Habla", whether he is talking about a girl or a guy without the El/Ella?

 

[GaimeGuy]

I said
He said
They said
We said
The dog said
You said


Yo hablo
El habla
Ellos hablan
Nos hablamos
El perro habla
Tu hablas

O_O

 

[Why would you do that?]

Pretty interesting. I always had a feeling English wasn't as good at doing that, especially when watching certain things subtitled, and long sentences are translated into like 3 English words.

Yo hablo
El habla
Ellos hablan
Nos hablamos
El perro habla
Tu hablas

I'm taking Spanish now. Did not know you could shorten nosotros into nos. "Nosotros" being so long was sort of a complaint I had about the language.

 

[vas_a_morir]

In the spanish words he put you can take out the first word save for the dog


hablo
habla
hablan
hablamos
El perro habla
hablas

Yeah, but it's still slightly less efficient in that particular example. But, Spanish is a more subtle and thus expressive language compared to English, in my personal opinion.

 

[gerg]

I don't see how that's possible considering that English is a vague language, but ok...

English is certainly not a vague language, especially in consideration with other languages that are much vaguer, like Japanese.

For example, in Japanese you often do not need to state the grammatical subject, or even the object. There are no real plurals (and verb forms don't change depending on the number of the subject), so extra vagueness is added there. Whereas in English you would say that you do something "on Tuesday", in Japanese you lack the same diversity of prepositions.

Ultimately, this difference in precision is noticeable simply when teaching Japanese people English. Often, what a student will say will still be entirely comprehensible, but will lack the particulars of English that "fill out" sentences and make them complete and the meaning clear.

(One asymmetry in favour of Japanese, however, is that Japanese distinguishes between the grammatical "subject" and the grammatical "topic", the latter being a concept which I don't think exists within English.)

 

[Zenith]

Isn't sign language pretty direct?

 

[lastendconductor]

Yeah, Spanish is kind of similar to Arabic because they both use root words/verbs. But how will I know when some says "Habla", whether he is talking about a girl or a guy without the El/Ella?

Context.

 

[lo escondido]

Yeah, Spanish is kind of similar to Arabic because they both use root words/verbs. But how will I know when some says "Habla", whether he is talking about a girl or a guy without the El/Ella?

Thats true but when you talking it usually is obvious. Arabic has different verb forms for he her and him?

 

[CornBurrito]

but that statement is so vague that I can interpret it in numerous ways. . . (it's also grammatically incorrect!)

You do know you can use context to help eliminate the vagueness, right?

 

[Pollux]

Yeah, Spanish is kind of similar to Arabic because they both use root words/verbs. But how will I know when some says "Habla", whether he is talking about a girl or a guy without the El/Ella?

I fucking loved that about Arabic when I took it freshman year. The root/stem thing made it so much easier.

Haven't looked at it in years though. I can still read it but my vocabulary has gone to shit.

Now I only remember basic phrases lol, and they're absolutely worthless ones too.

E.G. "adrus fee mktaba" (transliterated, don't know how to do arabic characters on an english keyboard) and i'm pretty sure that means "i study in teh library" or something like that

 

[CabbageRed]

Isn't sign language pretty direct?

Like fists? They certainly get the job done quickly but are relatively limited in scope concerning what emotions they can convey.

 

[LQX]

I don't see how that's possible considering that English is a vague language, but ok...

How so? What does that even mean?

 

[leroidys]

And in Arabic, all of these can be said in 1 word except for "The Dog said", that one is two words.

I think you're kind of missing the point. The same can be said of Japanese or Chinese, both of which were studied. The ability to say things with few words does not necessarily mean you're getting to the point.

This study is specifically measuring the amount of explicit information per second, not the amount of implied information, which is what pro-drop languages rely heavily on to make their utterances so short.

English apparently, makes a better trade off between clarity and conciseness than these languages.

Having said all that, the study is kind of lame. They edited out pauses (which can transmit information) and only used 7 languages...

Also I am surprised that English would take it as it has obligatory predicates. So, for example:

"There are three people in this room." 'There' is completely semantically empty, but must be stated.

Yeah, but it's still slightly less efficient in that particular example. But, Spanish is a more subtle and thus expressive language compared to English, in my personal opinion.

What makes a language more expressive than another? Languages do not differ in what they can express, but in what they must express.

 

[Smellycat]

Thats true but when you talking it usually is obvious. Arabic has different verb forms for he her and him?

It is not really different verb form, but you add different endings to the word and accent marks.

For example, let's use the word "went". Thahaba

He went: Thahaba The a is not a new letter, but is an accent over the b.

She went: Thahabat

I went: Thahabto The o is not a new letter, but it is an accent over the last letter t.

They went: Thahabo Again, it is not a new letter.

 

[demon]

AMERICA, FUCK YEA!

 

[lo escondido]

Pretty interesting. I always had a feeling English wasn't as good at doing that, especially when watching certain things subtitled, and long sentences are translated into like 3 English words.

I think a lot of the shortening comes about due to conjunctions. Saying John´s backpack is better than having to say la mochilla de john. Or I can´t rather than yo no puedo.

 

[Angry Grimace]

But that's a cultural thing. A lot of other cultures are far more steeped in nuance and euphemism so it just takes longer for them to say things. I remember Dave Barry had a book about a trip he took to Japan and explaining how long it took him to realize that people were telling him not to do things.

 

[gutter_trash]

American is more to the point than English

 

[lo escondido]

It is not really different verb form, but you add different endings to the word and accent marks.

For example, let's use the word "went". Thahaba

He went: Thahaba The a is not a new letter, but is an accent over the b.

She went: Thahabat

I went: Thahabto The o is not a new letter, but it is an accent over the last letter t.

They went: Thahabo Again, it is not a new letter.

Thats cool. Arabic is on my list of languages to learn before I die

 

[genjiZERO]

English is certainly not a vague language, especially in consideration with other languages that are much vaguer, like Japanese.

For example, in Japanese you often do not need to state the grammatical subject, or even the object. There are no real plurals (and verb forms don't change depending on the number of the subject), so extra vagueness is added there. Whereas in English you would say that you do something "on Tuesday", in Japanese you lack the same diversity of prepositions.

Ultimately, this difference in precision is noticeable simply when teaching Japanese people English. Often, what a student will say will still be entirely comprehensible, but will lack the particulars of English that "fill out" sentences and make them complete and the meaning clear.

(One asymmetry in favour of Japanese, however, is that Japanese distinguishes between the grammatical "subject" and the grammatical "topic", the latter being a concept which I don't think exists within English.)

but just because there are languages that are more vague than English doesn't mean that English isn't a vague language. English is more vague than the Romance Languages. In part because words have less specific meaning, but also because it has less grammatical precision (which is why, within English, if you want to be artsy you use words of Germanic origin, but if you want to be technical you use words of Latin origin).

But note I'm not saying English is a bad language, just that I don't really agree with the conclusion that "it's the best language at getting at the point". Ultimately, I'm not sure it can be empirically proved that any natural language can do that.

You do know you can use context to help eliminate the vagueness, right?

right... which helps to support my argument.... English is relatively vague.... it requires context (another layer of complexity) to make its point...

How so? What does that even mean?

Word meaning in English isn't as fixed as in some languages. Also, English is less precise grammatically in time/place/location than other languages. Sentences require more context define meaning.

 

[Dude Abides]

Wish I could read German to determine what they considered 'getting to the point'.

Wir gehen unpuntershlagenschnellereisen.

 

[weekend_warrior]

Just one more thing America is best at.

 

[leroidys]

It is not really different verb form, but you add different endings to the word and accent marks.

For example, let's use the word "went". Thahaba

He went: Thahaba The a is not a new letter, but is an accent over the b.

She went: Thahabat

I went: Thahabto The o is not a new letter, but it is an accent over the last letter t.

They went: Thahabo Again, it is not a new letter.

You realize that the Arabic form is longer than the English in every one of these right?

 

[lo escondido]

But that's a cultural thing. A lot of other cultures are far more steeped in nuance and euphemism so it just takes longer for them to say things. I remember Dave Barry had a book about a trip he took to Japan and explaining how long it took him to realize that people were telling him not to do things.

If Im reading that right I think that is more cultural. If your a polite person you can take a lot longer that a direct person but still speak the same language.

 

[lastendconductor]

Yeah, but it's still slightly less efficient in that particular example. But, Spanish is a more subtle and thus expressive language compared to English, in my personal opinion.

This is true. Most English speakers suck really bad at spanish (sorry, it's not easy, don't be deluded). They speak it like a robots, never grasping any of the subtleties the language has. I can tell right away who's an english speaker, while people from france or italy, for example, can be practically indistinguishable in expressing thoughts except for having an accent.
No surpirses here since like this study suggests, English is a lot more direct and blunt. It's two languages that work differently on a fundamental level, so it's not a matter of translating word to word and calling it a day. Kinda the same situation as with asian languages, but not so extreme.
IMO English generally lacks elegancy and detail, but I wasn't born an English speaker so my point of view is obviously skewed...

 

[Haly]

Isn't sign language pretty direct?

Yes it is, mostly because the language is designed to communicate the maximum amount of information with the minimal amount of hand motions/facial expressions.

It still takes more time to communicate simple things like "he said", however.

 

[Mercurial]

So what place did Tamarian take?

 

[lo escondido]

right... which helps to support my argument.... English is relatively vague.... it requires context (another layer of complexity) to make its point...

Every language requires context.

But I don't think linguists take sign language seriously.

Thats a really silly statement.


I think it has to do with the face that it is not spoken or written and this test was performed by having them read something.

 

[genjiZERO]

Every language requires context.

Exactly, I agree. But English requires relatively more context....

 

[kehs]

Best of Seven = Best of All