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[tuxfool]

The best AA I've seen is TXAA. Crytek has a nice custom AA in Ryse.

Ryse also uses TAA.

All the major implementations of TAA are custom implementations. CryEngine has is own type as does UE4. The one used in Fallout is possibly one of the best along with the other two mentioned here.

Temporal aliasing is far more distracting and detrimental to the experience than blur so TAA all the way.

Yup. I absolutely despise temporal artifacts from aliasing. They're like flashing lights to me.

I personally like to use FXAA with sharpening filters or just SMAA; I will do more experiments to reach acceptable levels of TAA blurriness using LOD bias and luma sharpen in Fallout 4.

FXAA is awful at temporal stability. It even accentuates problems of the lack of subpixel stability.

 

[CybernatonEvolution]

Ryse also uses TAA.

All the major implementations of TAA are custom implementations. CryEngine has is own type as does UE4. The one used in Fallout is possibly one of the best along with the other two mentioned here.



Yup. I absolutely despise temporal artifacts from aliasing. They're like flashing lights to me.

I remember messing around with engine commands that control the sharpness and number of samples of TAA in UE4.

Having ini variables or in-game sliders to control TAA in upcoming games would be great.

 

[HTupolev]

Elegant solutions often are just that. "why didn't I think of that", kind of solutions. Though in games it didn't produce nice results until people started doing reprojection using motion vectors in order to eliminate ghosting.

An early example of awful temporal AA was in Halo Reach:

Reach actually did use motion vectors to disable blending for incorrect cases, but it didn't have a solid per-object motion tracking solution. Most of the time you don't really get much ghosting, although cutscene cameras are especially prone.

 

[tuxfool]

Reach actually did use motion vectors to disable blending for incorrect cases, but it didn't have a solid per-object motion tracking solution. Most of the time you don't really get much ghosting, although cutscene cameras are especially prone.

Ah, yeah. You're right. They added that between the beta and the final release.

 

[CmdBash]

TAA still has way too much blur for my tastes, smaa is still far better than any method out there.

 

[IceIpor]

From what I can infer, the reason why SMAA isn't built into games more often is because it was not developed by any major company (i.e. Not AMD or Nvidia). It was a 3rd party effort by a small group of people who have released it under a standard MIT license.
https://github.com/iryoku/smaa/blob/master/LICENSE.txt
Therefore, if a development team has issues with it, there is no tech support available for them to turn to.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

What aa was alien isolation using? I was down sampling that and it was still nearly unbearable. Did nothing for shader aliasing it seemed

 

[tuxfool]

What aa was alien isolation using? I was down sampling that and it was still nearly unbearable. Did nothing for shader aliasing it seemed

From what I understand it was SMAA T2x. At least as the highest option (but maybe it wasn't available to everyone as some people reported that option to be missing).

 

[pottuvoi]

No SMAA, which is basically MLAA without MLAA subpixel weaknesses.

Less subpixel weakness when using temporal or MSAA samples, just one pixel SMAA is quite close to MLAA with better edge detection. (The original methods, not the new that Ryse etc use that have more proper temporal pass for surfaces as well.)

What aa was alien isolation using? I was down sampling that and it was still nearly unbearable. Did nothing for shader aliasing it seemed

SMAA.
They should have used more ways to combat specular aliasing in shaders.
Also I'm not sure if they did SMAA after the lense warp effect, and thus SMAA didn't work as well as possible.

I'm a big fan of many of the recent TAA implementations and can't wait to see how the tech continues to evolve.

I am as well.
It's good to note it's not good just for direct view, but almost every 'FX' that can use more sampling but costs more.
Things like volumetrics, shadows, reflections etc can be modified in a way that gets additional quality when TAA is used. (different sample locations between frames.)

I also like the slight blur that must be used when one wants to have temporally stable image.
Although it might be good to have option for user for a classic tight gaussian or even box resolve.

 

[flipswitch]

What aa was alien isolation using? I was down sampling that and it was still nearly unbearable. Did nothing for shader aliasing it seemed

I think that's shader aliasing.


edit: just re-read what you wrote, yeah it's shader aliasing.

 

[tuxfool]

SMAA.
They should have used more ways to combat specular aliasing in shaders.
Also I'm not sure if they did SMAA after the lense warp effect, and thus SMAA didn't work as well as possible.

Intense speculars are a hard problem to fix (especially on the smooth artificial shapes). AFAIK only the TAA in UE4 has a specific mechanism targeting this problem.

 

[sirap]

SMAA and 4k does the trick for me. I can deal with slight jaggies as long as everything looks nice and crisp, and really at that resolution I have to squint really hard to notice it.

 

[Reese-015]

It is just as blurry as TAA, and it kills performance--diminishing returns basically.

SGSAA is blurry? U wot? If anything, SGSAA is the holy grail of AA and on top of that actually sharpens the whole image in a way that doesn't look artificial but adds actual detail from the higher resolution render.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

I'm really not a fan of the very brief interaction I've had with TAA; it just makes things blurry, and I personally value texture clarity over smooth edges (which is obviously just a matter of taste). I'm curious how TAA works in conjuncture with downsampling; FXAA with downsampling can be pretty nice in terms of cleaning up edges while keeping textures crisp. And now that I have a rig that can handle 1600P+ resolutions (a single 980 ti), downsampling with post-processing AA is an attractive option.

 

[KainXVIII]

SGSAA is blurry? U wot? If anything, SGSAA is the holy grail of AA and on top of that actually sharpens the whole image in a way that doesn't look artificial but adds actual detail from the higher resolution render.

Yeah, he need to check his facts, but i agree that you need beefy rig.

 

[Denton]

I think it is probably the worst AA I have ever seen. (talking about Fallout 4 implementation specifically)

I mean, yes when I am standing still, image is amazingly clean of jaggies, although blurry as hell.

When I move, image is still clear of jaggies and there is no shimmer, although even more blurry.

BUT, the transition between camera still - camera moving, is the most distracting thing ever. The immediate blur on every piece of foliage that appears everytime I move the camera...the flicker if I move the camera quickly...

utterly unacceptable. On my 55" panny plasma, playing the PC version, I could not take it.
Had to disable it and inject SMAA with reshade instead. Sure it is not as clear of jaggies, but there is ZERO BLUR and flicker, which makes it vastly improved experience for me.

I hope devs use SMAA more than TAA.

...although in Ryse, TAA was good. Clean image and the blur did not distract me like it does in Fallout.

 

[Crisium]

TAA with extra sharpening is great. You need the sharpening to remove the Vaseline.

FO4:
NoAA
TAA
TAA+Sharp

BF:
NoAA
TAA
TAA+Sharp

VIA: http://www.tweakguides.com/Fallout4_1.html

I'm going to do this in every TAA game from now on - and I heavily suggest all PC players do the same. TAA + Sharp = maybe the best low performance penalty AA.

 

[pottuvoi]

Intense speculars are a hard problem to fix (especially on the smooth artificial shapes). AFAIK only the TAA in UE4 has a specific mechanism targeting this problem.

TAA isn't specific mechanic for specular, it helps with the problem but doesn't fix it in the source of the problem and still has incorrect specular shapes when using mipmaps etc.

Closer to specific methods would be using a shader which changes the specular depending on surface roughness etc based on distance and direction. (Clean, Lean, Toksvig, curvature/geometry.. etc.)
http://blog.selfshadow.com/2011/07/22/specular-showdown/
http://advances.realtimerendering.com/s2012/Ubisoft/Rock-Solid Shading.pdf (.PDF)

 

[Durante]

I've been a believer in TAA since seeing the UE4 implementation working.

I don't generally mind some degree of blur, however I did notice that TAA wasn't working too well for VR specifically - too blurry, and minor artifacts when moving your head that you don't see on screen become obvious. (This is a shame, since with VR you need all the performance you can get)

The best possible result is achieved by combining TAA with some sharp downsampling kernel.

 

[Dr Dogg]

Depends on which implementation you're talking about every solution labelled TAA is the developer's or engine's own take. UE4's and Cryengie's are very good at eliminating temporal aliasing and at a modest performance cost but both massively benefit from higher resolution. SGSSAA is still the top dog for me as you get multiple benefits including texture clarity and a temporally stable image but in the days of deferred renderers it a(nd any other hardware based AA) have an performance cost that makes your eyes water.

The best possible result is achieved by combining TAA with some sharp downsampling kernel.

Have you looked at Ethan Carter Redux yet? TAA works really well there with resolution scale at 200%. There's so much in motion with trees and bushes flapping everywhere, even the grass swaying in the wind that going through all the AA options (even other temporal solutions on offer) UE4's TAA really shows its benefits there.

 

[mdzapeer]

Think witcher 3 has a pretty good AA solution. Its not perfect but does a very good job without blurring the image too much.

 

[Piston Hyundai]

It literally makes me sick.

 

[General Lee]

I'll take some extra blurriness TAA brings over massive pixel crawl, shimmering or whatnot you get in many games without it. With current engines MSAA just doesn't do the trick, and downsampling/SSAA is simply too expensive.

 

[The Janitor]

I've never found any post-process AA solution to be satisfactory on it's own. Sure it makes jaggies less noticeable, but there's the blur, and the fact that stuff like trees and fences still look bad.

 

[Bl@de]

No. OGSSAA and SGSSAA (with custom LOD bias) are still the best when it comes to image quality. Obviously they need lots of power so not an option for consoles. And DX11 is another problem. But when it comes to post process methods, TAA is great (like in Fallout 4). It's a good middle ground between FXAA and SMAA imo.

 

[No Love]

Lol filthy casuals. SGSSAA is by far the best AA available.

 

[mullet2000]

It really depends for me. In Fallout 4 TAA looks good but in Star Wars it looks like a blur-fest to me.

Is there a reason for that or am I crazy?

 

[dark10x]

I don't understand the dislike for a bit of blur. While I also love a good downsampled image, but that's generally not reasonable. I'd take some good TAA over any other post-process variant of MSAA. I enjoy a slightly soft image. Helps create a more filmic looking image that is devoid of shimmering.

 

[Peterthumpa]

Lol filthy casuals. SGSSAA is by far the best AA available.

Obviously the "best" in this case is a mix of performance cost vs IQ. SGSSAA is awesome but very taxing.

I don't understand the dislike for a bit of blur. While I also love a good downsampled image, but that's generally not reasonable. I'd take some good TAA over any other post-process variant of MSAA. I enjoy a slightly soft image. Helps create a more filmic looking image that is devoid of shimmering.

Couldn't said it any better.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

I don't understand the dislike for a bit of blur. While I also love a good downsampled image, but that's generally not reasonable. I'd take some good TAA over any other post-process variant of MSAA. I enjoy a slightly soft image. Helps create a more filmic looking image that is devoid of shimmering.

This is how I feel about it. Although that said I also really dislike sharpening filters so I might not have the same tastes as other people. Though I did like how TW3 looked with FXAA, additional AA from NVCP, and the light sharpening option - really cleaned up the image.

 

[Einchy]

Fallout 4 TAA looks great with a bit of sharpening.

I ended up getting that preset as well and the game looks significantly better with it on.

 

[Neo_Geo]

I thought SMAA was the best?

SMAA is really good in the performance department, but it leaves a lot of jaggies behind. I really like TAA, as it gets rid of virtually all aliasing in the frame, and it doesn't blur the picture as much as something like FXAA.

 

[Lulubop]

It is just as blurry as TAA, and it kills performance--diminishing returns basically.

What lol?

 

[ScepticMatt]

I've never found any post-process AA solution to be satisfactory on it's own.

TAA isn't only post-process AA ("blur filter"). It's temporal supersampling compared to the spatial supersampling of traditional MSAA.
In a non-moving scene the quality is equivalent to RGSSAA with the same number of samples. The hard part is avoiding ghosting and blur when the image is changing a lot between frame.

 

[diaspora]

TAA + Sharpening is probably the best as far as IQ and performance is concerned IMO.

 

[mullet2000]

I don't understand the dislike for a bit of blur. While I also love a good downsampled image, but that's generally not reasonable. I'd take some good TAA over any other post-process variant of MSAA. I enjoy a slightly soft image. Helps create a more filmic looking image that is devoid of shimmering.

It's hard to put my finger on why I dislike it, but I do. It can kind of give the impression that the picture is lower resolution than it really is? Devoid of aliasing, but lower image quality.

Games are also a different situation than films. A 'filmic' image may not necessarily be what I want if I'm frequently trying to pick out small, distant details (like players) in a game like Star Wars: Battlefront.

 

[zombipuppy]

TAA with extra sharpening is great. You need the sharpening to remove the Vaseline.

FO4:
NoAA
TAA
TAA+Sharp

BF:
NoAA
TAA
TAA+Sharp

VIA: http://www.tweakguides.com/Fallout4_1.html

I'm going to do this in every TAA game from now on - and I heavily suggest all PC players do the same. TAA + Sharp = maybe the best low performance penalty AA.

Absolutely. This person gets it, ladies and gentlemen. And an excellent source as well; the author of TweakGuides is brilliant.

TAA on its own is no better than FXAA and TXAA, in my opinion.

And I'd vouch for SMAA being nearly as good. It just produces so much shimmering in many cases that it becomes too distracting to hold first place for me.

 

[Braag]

SMAA is still superior in my opinion cause it doesn't blur and keeps everything looking crisp.
TAA seems like a very good alternative. It's much better than FXAA which makes everything extremely blurry and doesn't even get rid of aliasing all that well.

 

[Peterthumpa]

SMAA is still superior in my opinion cause it doesn't blur and keeps everything looking crisp.
TAA seems like a very good alternative. It's much better than FXAA which makes everything extremely blurry and doesn't even get rid of aliasing all that well.

SMAA isn't very good for shader aliasing, it seems. See Alien Isolation.

 

[Mr Swine]

I rather play games without any form of blurring since it's distracting, specially textures that don't look sharp :/

 

[General Lee]

SMAA isn't very good for shader aliasing, it seems. See Alien Isolation.

I don't think there's any AA solution that works to remove it. I've ran Alien: Isolation on a 27" 4K screen and it still has very noticeable aliasing to it. Dev's just have to avoid using assets and shaders that cause such problems to manifest. The aliasing in AI was some of the worst I've seen in any game.

 

[Pocky4Th3Win]

Since were talking about AA solutions, Any way to force another method for Fallout 4 without using ReShade?

 

[Denton]

I don't understand the dislike for a bit of blur. While I also love a good downsampled image, but that's generally not reasonable. I'd take some good TAA over any other post-process variant of MSAA. I enjoy a slightly soft image. Helps create a more filmic looking image that is devoid of shimmering.

I don't mind blur if it is not very noticeable. But in FO4 the blur is insane, it distracts me everytime I move the camera. Smears every single bush in the view.

 

[johancruijff]

It hurts my eyes. Going from motion to standing still makes the blurring super obvious in fallout.

That's TAA?

Brb disabling that shit

 

[EatChildren]

I refuse to use any method of AA that results in blurring of textures and overall image quality, no matter how efficient its coverage.

Basically I rarely use AA.

 

[CHC]

Best post-processing AA I've ever seen is the Filmic SMAA T2X in Black Ops III. It's really quite amazing, and they have some kind of post-sharpening going on too, so there's not much of a blur effect.

 

[Mindman]

To compensate for the blur, simple apply the SweetFX LunaSharpen to sharpen it up a bit. Works wonders in Fallout 4.

 

[Cleve]

I refuse to use any method of AA that results in blurring of textures and overall image quality, no matter how efficient its coverage.

Basically I rarely use AA.

Super sample for life. It's always nice coming back to a game a couple years later and brute forcing the IQ on new hardware.

 

[Portugeezer]

I don't like it in Fallout 4, when you move everything becomes blurry.

 

[Insane Metal]

If it's being used in SWBF, yeah, I agree. Looks really good.