• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • The Politics forum has been nuked. Please do not bring political discussion to the rest of the site, or you will be removed. Thanks.

THE COALITION MOVING TO NEXT-GEN DEVELOPMENT, UNREAL ENGINE 5

Shmunter

Member
Aug 25, 2018
9,931
22,828
775
Yup, but assuming UE5 is that engine is wrong.
UE5 will work even in smartphones. Assuming they have designed it around something that's only available to one of their target platforms is bonkers.
It’s an engine, designed to be generic and scalable allowing devs to build whatever they wish. What you can do on a phone with it is does not limit what you can do on a PS5 with it.
 

DonJuanSchlong

Spice Spice Baby
Jul 15, 2020
3,429
8,691
745
Your first post in this thread is “but but engine exclusive “ ... playing the victim for your console war when nobody on gaf has claimed a 3rd party engine used for 3rd party games was exclusive to one console.

It wouldn’t even make sense.
You even included my quotation marks. Have you ever seen me, or anyone else for that matter, speak in quotes, honest question. Doesn't that tell you that I'm possibly quoting someone?

I'm literally regurgitating what others have said. There a reason I didn't say it from my perspective, but someone else's. This was beyond obvious. 90% of the reactions are laugh emojis, cause people found it funny af that some people really believed it was exclusive to ps5. Then when proven wrong, they doubled down with the "But...but, it needs to be downgraded to run on Xbox and PC". (Like how I used quotation marks again? That simply means I'm repeating what someone else said. As in, these were not words from my own mouth 👁️ 👄 👁️)
 

Md Ray

Member
Nov 12, 2016
3,177
10,362
735
India
in all honesty PC GPU or also cpu have power to spare before it become a bottleneck compared to any console. Let us also remember that there are several solutions to alleviate this problem and that by next year NVMe drives faster than the PS5 will be common in the PC world.
The speed of the SSD on PC compared to PS5 or the power of the GPU isn't the problem on PC. PCs have faster SSD and much, much powerful GPU than PS5/XSX.

Even the CPUs are faster but at NVMe speeds it requires a ridiculous amount of CPU cores for decompression work. Over 20+ cores according to nvidia. No average gamer has a PC with that many cores.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Shmunter and Rea

MonarchJT

Member
Sep 25, 2020
2,266
3,311
375
The speed of the SSD on PC compared to PS5 or the power of the GPU isn't the problem on PC. PCs have faster SSD and much, much powerful GPU than PS5/XSX.

Even the CPUs are faster but at NVMe speeds it requires a ridiculous amount of CPU cores for decompression work. Over 20+ cores according to nvidia. No average gamer has a PC with that many cores.
that Sony pr is making millions of fans believe that there will be 500TB games that without decompressors that allow them to reach exceptional transfer speeds (the infamous 22gb / s) they are impractical in other systems. Do you know that for the next gen the average game could be around 80/100gb and that the only SSD so fast inside the PS5 is 800gb ....do your math I'm sure you will understand
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: kuncol02

systemr123

Member
Apr 16, 2021
132
255
230
that Sony pr is making millions of fans believe that there will be 500TB games that without decompressors that allow them to reach exceptional transfer speeds (the infamous 22gb / s) they are impractical in other systems. Do you know that for the next gen the average game could be around 80/100gb and that the only SSD so fast inside the PS5 is 800gb ....do your math I'm sure you will understand
Not sure if you are trolling or not... It certainly seems you want to tell your own story vs the true and confirmed story. Sony PR or whoever never said there will be 500TB games lol, they actually said games could (see word could here, no promises) end up smaller than last gen because of better compression. This statement makes total sense especially now Oodle is integrated to the system as well. Then they never ever said you should expect 22gb/s of speed lol, Cerny said the theoretical maximum speed is 22gb/s and that you should expect on average 8 to 9 gb/s. Mind you, this is before Oodle was integrated. With the new integration it should be averaging close to 17gb/s.

I don't know what the comment about the average game being between 80/100gb has to do with all the other stuff but sure, if a next-gen game has a billion of high quality assets a game could end up that size. So what? Probably the game will look absolutely amazing then beyond something you can imagine at the moment. You can already see that file sizes decreased enormously when you take PS4 vs PS5 versions of games and that only used Kraken, not even Oodle. Likely most games will end up smaller this gen compared to last gen with some exceptions because of containing a billion of high quality assets.
 
  • Fire
Reactions: SLB1904

reksveks

Member
Jun 4, 2020
3,156
2,901
360
that Sony pr is making millions of fans believe that there will be 500TB games that without decompressors that allow them to reach exceptional transfer speeds (the infamous 22gb / s) they are impractical in other systems. Do you know that for the next gen the average game could be around 80/100gb and that the only SSD so fast inside the PS5 is 800gb ....do your math I'm sure you will understand
I am kinda with you that file size is the limit here, but just interested to know if we have an idea of how the average game splits in terms of size between texture, models, game code etc.
 

Md Ray

Member
Nov 12, 2016
3,177
10,362
735
India
that Sony pr is making millions of fans believe that there will be 500TB games that without decompressors that allow them to reach exceptional transfer speeds (the infamous 22gb / s) they are impractical in other systems. Do you know that for the next gen the average game could be around 80/100gb and that the only SSD so fast inside the PS5 is 800gb ....do your math I'm sure you will understand
??

You're saying stuff that's completely unrelated to my post.
 
Last edited:

onesvenus

Member
Aug 26, 2004
1,341
1,909
1,625
It’s an engine, designed to be generic and scalable allowing devs to build whatever they wish. What you can do on a phone with it is does not limit what you can do on a PS5 with it.
Exactly, it's designed to be generic, that's why it's not designed around PS5 I/O. I'm sure that it will take advantage of it but it won't require that kind of performance to work.
That's also why I'm expecting Sony first party engines to look better than the average UE5 game
 

Shmunter

Member
Aug 25, 2018
9,931
22,828
775
Exactly, it's designed to be generic, that's why it's not designed around PS5 I/O. I'm sure that it will take advantage of it but it won't require that kind of performance to work.
That's also why I'm expecting Sony first party engines to look better than the average UE5 game
It doesn’t need to be designed around a specific strength or feature at the exclusion of everything else. The engine e.g will have RT capability, doesn’t mean you are restricted to use RT hardware only. As an engine it has hooks, a Swiss army knife, a tool to fit a variety of purposes.

Outside of that, no doubt Sony studios will utilise PS5 streaming, it is for them the i/o exist the way it is. Whether it’s also a micro polygon approach is unknown. Ratchet seemingly is using it for swapping assets for world teleportation and seamless cutscene LOD changes, nothing like UE5.
 

onesvenus

Member
Aug 26, 2004
1,341
1,909
1,625
It doesn’t need to be designed around a specific strength or feature at the exclusion of everything else. The engine e.g will have RT capability, doesn’t mean you are restricted to use RT hardware only. As an engine it has hooks, a Swiss army knife, a tool to fit a variety of purposes.
What I meant is that without designing the engine around PS5 I/O I wouldn't expect that to be the best implementation we have.
The view that the engine will target PS5 I/O performance level is laughable and also a pity.
 

Greggy

Member
Nov 7, 2020
389
637
305
I'm confused. We always knew that Ninja Theory, The Coalition and Inxile were waiting for UE5 to power their next gen releases. They have publicly stated so.
What I am discovering in this thread is that a sub-cult within this forum was pushing the narrative that UE5 was going to be PS5 exclusive? Or was designed specifically around the PS5 hardware?
And even worse, some people took that seriously and bother coming out now to mock it when it was provable nonsense from day one?
 
Last edited:

S0ULZB0URNE

Member
Jan 27, 2020
3,300
4,157
620
tell me more about how a PS5 will run ue5 games better than a PC with a 3090 and a Samsung SSD meanwhile i save this post for future hint at what payed pr mean
Not sure why you continue to go off topic and mention PS5?

But

We can't compare because the PC would still support older tech.

Exclusive PS5 games will do the talking.
What has been released and future games.
 
  • LOL
Reactions: DonJuanSchlong

nemiroff

Gold Member
Feb 19, 2018
1,896
2,525
595
I'm confused. We always knew that Ninja Theory, The Coalition and Inxile were waiting for UE5 to power their next gen releases. They have publicly stated so.
What I am discovering in this thread is that a sub-cult within this forum was pushing the narrative that UE5 was going to be PS5 exclusive? Or was designed specifically around the PS5 hardware?
And even worse, some people took that seriously and bother coming out now to mock it when it was provable nonsense from day one?

Who can blame them when so much Sony moneyhatting was involved in the Epic PR. Hence also why Sweeney went into full panic mode when some of his engineers went rogue and blew up the whole orchestra with a C4 charge of truth. Sweeney's obvious smoke layering to try to undo some of the damage was some of the most pathetic and insulting stuff I've seen from him since the Epic Games store exclusivity deals. The guy is clearly both a genius and a piece of evil shit with Assburgers.

In the end it's a good thing that Unreal is a great product.
 
Last edited:

MonarchJT

Member
Sep 25, 2020
2,266
3,311
375
Who can blame them when so much Sony moneyhatting was involved in the Epic PR. Hence also why Sweeney went into full panic mode when some of his engineers went rogue and blew up the whole orchestra with a C4 charge of truth. Sweeney's obvious smoke layering to try to undo some of the damage was some of the most pathetic and insulting stuff I've seen from him since the Epic Games store exclusivity deals. The guy is clearly both a genius and a piece of evil shit with Assburgers.

In the end it's a good thing that Unreal is a great product.
this this this and this all the day long ...what Sweeney tried to do on twitter was really really embarassing and insulting at the same time. But some seems to drink the kool aid
 

Md Ray

Member
Nov 12, 2016
3,177
10,362
735
India
That's a fact. Especially when trying to push higher resolutions, the CPU becomes less and less strained, and it's the GPU that becomes pushed. That's why cpu benchmarks are done at like 720p in games.
This is about decompression, it's a whole another type of workload compared to gaming workloads on the CPU.

When you install a game, its data (geometry, textures, audio, etc) is stored in a compressed format in the storage device (HDD, NVMe SSD). Boot up the game and the data now has to get loaded into system memory, VRAM to be presented to the GPU (e.g. textures) and CPU (e.g. audio).

But before that, those data need to be decompressed from a compressed state and then converted into the GPU format (if textures) via drivers so the GPU can render them. This process of moving compressed data from a storage device to memory, then decompressing those assets isn't really an issue for modern CPUs in games built with HDD speeds (50-100 MB/s) in mind.

This becomes problematic and requires dozens of CPU cores when the data it has to transfer and decompress is in multi GB/s, for games that are built to take advantage of NVMe Gen3 and Gen4 speeds. This is what the UE5 demo was showcasing, btw. Behind the scenes, the engine is transferring & decompressing high-quality assets quickly from SSD to memory on the fly. PC is genuinely lacking in this department compared to even Xbox Series consoles, not just PS5. I'm not even making this up. See slides from game stack presentation by DirectStorage engineer and NVIDIA on this:

There are various other factors as well aside from CPU limitation.

There's a dedicated hardware-accelerated decompression unit in Series consoles, "no such solution for PC"

This whole presentation is worth watching as there's a wealth of info in it. He also brings up a lot of the same points (bottlenecks, etc) that Cerny was talking about in his Road to PS5.

"Compressed data needed, but CPU can't keep up"

As a temporary solution on PC for decompression instead of using the CPU, they seem to wanna fall back to GPU's SMs with RTX IO on Turing and Ampere. This doesn't seem like a good idea to me as this may have some effect on gaming perf because it is basically taking away resources from game rendering for decompression work. Of course, Jensen won't directly tell us or talk about the perf implications this is going to have, at least not now. And in the near future, we'll likely see something like "next-gen RTX IO" being marketed for next-gen PC GPUs with "Decompression Core" or something as dedicated hardware (basically what consoles have) offloading the work from SMs. This is not some wild concept. Remember this chart?


Anyway, asset decompression with Gen4 SSD speeds can take up to 24 cores with a conventional CPU (Threadripper) according to NVIDIA, 11-13 (Zen 2) cores according to Sony and MS, respectively. With just 8 cores inside consoles, you can see they can't just rely on the main CPU for asset decompression. This is why console manufacturers built a custom decompression block into the I/O unit inside the main SoC so the CPU can focus on what it's meant to do: processing the game physics, instructions, preparing draw calls, etc. without having to worry about decompression overhead that much.

This is what Tim was talking about:

You may hate him for whatever reason but I don't see anything wrong with what he's said here. It honestly lines up with what MS and NVIDIA are saying now almost a year later.
 
Last edited:

sainraja

Member
Aug 15, 2007
1,686
1,167
1,340
No, I'm not. People said it wouldn't run on anything besides ps5. Then the narrative switched to it not being able to run at that quality and resolution. You know, the constant change of goalposts that y'all normally do. Now that I've proven y'all wrong, y'all try and change the goalposts again on what was said. Smh I can't with y'all 😂😂😂😂.
Yes, you are. People didn't say that and I just read half of the thread you quoted and the third post that you reference in the first thread, mentions 'demo' and the poster stated it might need to be optimized for XSX (you can debate the demo thing separately but the poster acknowledged the engine as working for other consoles; which is the point.) You are trying to create a narrative here that doesn't exist.

But, why in the world are you focusing on that point so much? Just move on and make the point that you are actually trying to make. Most people know the engine is a multiple platform engine. If you can prove that one person (out of fandom) said that, what does that prove? Make the point that is relevant to this thread and discussion and stop fixating on that.
 
Last edited:

Derktron

Member
Dec 27, 2019
2,123
2,506
510
I don't understand why Sony would show off unreal 5 with the ps5 if virtually none of their big studios use the engine, unlike Microsoft.
Because maybe the other studios are not ready to show off that they are working on Unreal Engine 5? Or does not have to show off anything.
 

DonJuanSchlong

Spice Spice Baby
Jul 15, 2020
3,429
8,691
745
Yes, you are. People didn't say that and I just read half of the thread you quoted and the third post that you reference in the first thread, mentions 'demo' and the poster stated it might need to be optimized for XSX (you can debate the demo thing separately but the poster acknowledged the engine as working for other consoles; which is the point.) You are trying to create a narrative here that doesn't exist.

But, why in the world are you focusing on that point so much? Just move on and make the point that you are actually trying to make. Most people know the engine is a multiple platform engine. If you can prove that one person (out of fandom) said that, what does that prove? Make the point that is relevant to this thread and discussion and stop fixating on that.
Either your blind or retarded. I literally pointed to threads which state the demo can't be ran on anything else, or the engine. Go back and read through to understand why I'm laughing at you right now.
 
  • Empathy
Reactions: Darius87

DonJuanSchlong

Spice Spice Baby
Jul 15, 2020
3,429
8,691
745
Dang it's not that serious.
Why do the warriors shrug things off? All of you guys said i was wrong about this being said. I pointed it out several times, then you guys move the goalposts again. How many moves do you guys have before you realize you are wrong each time? I've give you guys the evidence, take what you want from it. But don't ask for receipts just to look like a fucking idiot when I present them.
 
  • Empathy
Reactions: Darius87

IntentionalPun

Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Aug 28, 2019
7,835
14,536
640
It’s an engine, designed to be generic and scalable allowing devs to build whatever they wish. What you can do on a phone with it is does not limit what you can do on a PS5 with it.
The engine has a huge focus on scalability though; not just from "I can make a game for this, and another game on that" but the same game running on next-gen consoles running on phones.

Not really disagreeing with you per say, but that got lost in the claim that the demo could only run on PS5.
 

sainraja

Member
Aug 15, 2007
1,686
1,167
1,340
Either your blind or retarded. I literally pointed to threads which state the demo can't be ran on anything else, or the engine. Go back and read through to understand why I'm laughing at you right now.
Ah, naming calling. That's nice. And I did check those threads out which is exactly why I said what I said. Regardless, why is that one point so important for that you can't move on? Most people understand Unreal is a multi-platform engine.
 

sainraja

Member
Aug 15, 2007
1,686
1,167
1,340
Why do the warriors shrug things off? All of you guys said i was wrong about this being said. I pointed it out several times, then you guys move the goalposts again. How many moves do you guys have before you realize you are wrong each time? I've give you guys the evidence, take what you want from it. But don't ask for receipts just to look like a fucking idiot when I present them.
You haven't presented the evidence. If you have quotes, please do share them since you are being a stickler on this point; why don't you quote the ones you seem to be so fixated on, the ones whose opinion is the only one that matters to you? Asking people to go dig up quotes that only you are putting so much importance on.....it is on you to share those. Not us to find it for you.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: S0ULZB0URNE

Shmunter

Member
Aug 25, 2018
9,931
22,828
775
The engine has a huge focus on scalability though; not just from "I can make a game for this, and another game on that" but the same game running on next-gen consoles running on phones.

Not really disagreeing with you per say, but that got lost in the claim that the demo could only run on PS5.
Things can be cross platform when the power and hardware is within a certain window, not top to bottom the same game. The engine is scalable allowing for it to be deployed on all manner of hardware, doesn’t mean a game targeting a high end spec can just work on a calculator. That makes no logical sense due to basic physics.
 
Last edited:

S0ULZB0URNE

Member
Jan 27, 2020
3,300
4,157
620
Why do the warriors shrug things off? All of you guys said i was wrong about this being said. I pointed it out several times, then you guys move the goalposts again. How many moves do you guys have before you realize you are wrong each time? I've give you guys the evidence, take what you want from it. But don't ask for receipts just to look like a fucking idiot when I present them.
You are the one who is wrong though :unsure:
 

Shmunter

Member
Aug 25, 2018
9,931
22,828
775
You are the one who is wrong though :unsure:
It’s the most basic thing, assuming the demo was hammering the PS5 I/o to achieve the result, anything else from there is downhill. If it was underutilising the i/o and streaming comparable to a 5400 rpm hdd, it will be achievable on a large sway of hardware.

It’s well documented what epic was tapping into.

Something, something, logic.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Panajev2001a

IntentionalPun

Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Aug 28, 2019
7,835
14,536
640
Things can be cross platform when the power and hardware is within a certain window, not top to bottom the same game. The engine is scalable allowing for it to be deployed on all manner of hardware, doesn’t mean a game targeting a high end spec can just work on a calculator. That makes no logical sense due to basic physics.

Tim Sweeney said this:

"To maintain compatibility with the older generation platforms, we have this next generation content pipeline where you build your assets or import them at the highest level of quality, the film level of quality that you'll run directly on next generation consoles," continues Tim Sweeney. "The engine provides and will provide more scalability points to down-resolution your content to run on everything, all the way down to iOS and Android devices from several years ago. So you build the content once and you can deploy it everywhere and you can build the same game for all these systems, but you just get a different level of graphical fidelity."

Much of their tech is about importing the highest possible assets into the engine itself; then dynamic runtime scaling of those assets (and pre-runtime scaling them down to something reasonable for a given platform.)

Tim Sweeney implied you could target high end next-gen consoles, and then have the game work on phones from "several years ago." Could be marketing fluff; but their tech is heavily geared towards scalability not just from an engine perspective but from a game perspective.

 
Last edited:
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: DonJuanSchlong

Shmunter

Member
Aug 25, 2018
9,931
22,828
775
Tim Sweeney said this:



Much of their tech is about importing the highest possible assets into the engine itself; then dynamic runtime scaling of those assets (and pre-runtime scaling them down to something reasonable for a given platform.)

Tim Sweeney implied you could target high end next-gen consoles, and then have the game work on phones from "several years ago." Could be marketing fluff; but their tech is heavily geared towards scalability not just from an engine perspective but from a game perspective.

The tools are there, but it’s all within reason obviously.
 

DonJuanSchlong

Spice Spice Baby
Jul 15, 2020
3,429
8,691
745
Ah, naming calling. That's nice. And I did check those threads out which is exactly why I said what I said. Regardless, why is that one point so important for that you can't move on? Most people understand Unreal is a multi-platform engine.
Not name calling, but sometimes I seriously wonder... I literally provided the posts, not sure why it's so hard just to click and read?
You haven't presented the evidence. If you have quotes, please do share them since you are being a stickler on this point; why don't you quote the ones you seem to be so fixated on, the ones whose opinion is the only one that matters to you? Asking people to go dig up quotes that only you are putting so much importance on.....it is on you to share those. Not us to find it for you.
Uhhhh, yeah I have. I'm starting to think that you guys are just a little off your rockers or something. With everyone trying to spin things one way, imma defend myself. Not sure why everyone is ignoring the elephant in the room, and pretending that UE5 demo was considered built for ps5, only able to run on ps5, and some went so far too say the ENGINE was exclusive on ps5. We have already clarified from day one, that is not true. There would be no degradation on pc or Xbox, as matter a fact, it more than likely performs better. That's been my point this whole time, and it'll be put to rest when the demo launches this year.
 
  • LOL
Reactions: Darius87

DenchDeckard

Member
Feb 28, 2021
1,387
2,346
320
Can’t believe people genuinely think that Xbox and pc couldn’t run that unreal engine demo as good as the ps5, if not better.

GG Epic and Sony supported marketing.
 
Last edited:
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: DonJuanSchlong

MonarchJT

Member
Sep 25, 2020
2,266
3,311
375
It’s the most basic thing, assuming the demo was hammering the PS5 I/o to achieve the result, anything else from there is downhill. If it was underutilising the i/o and streaming comparable to a 5400 rpm hdd, it will be achievable on a large sway of hardware.

It’s well documented what epic was tapping into.

Something, something, logic.
We don't know anything or have any data about the demo. We know only that it was built for the PS5 in agreement with Sony. While the PS5 definitely has the fastest I/O it has with the same certainty the least powerful and sophisticated GPU among PC,xs and everything else I have really (really) hard time to believe that what runs on a PS5 does cant be replicated exactly the same or better on xs and leveling up on PC. The words of the engineer Epic China that Sweeney has denied , denial that I absolutely do not believe in, hammered on these doubts. After all we are seeing how the console are performing, and they are doing this way not because the ps5 or xs are using to the fullest their i/o subsystem but because in some cases the GPU already can't keep up with the rest.

I wish that the demo would be released on PC so we could test it and i could eat my crows or see if all the buzz around the i/o was mostly driven pr in agreement with Sony hyping the launch of their new console aiming at its strongest point. ...but something something .....maybe maybe they aren't releasing it for a reason
 
Last edited:

Shmunter

Member
Aug 25, 2018
9,931
22,828
775
We don't know anything or have any data about the demo. We know only that it was built for the PS5 in agreement with Sony. While the PS5 definitely has the fastest I/O it has with the same certainty the least powerful and sophisticated GPU among PC,xs and everything else I have really (really) hard time to believe that what runs on a PS5 does cant be replicated exactly the same or better on xs and leveling up on PC. The words of the engineer Epic China that Sweeney has denied , denial that I absolutely do not believe in, hammered on these doubts. After all we are seeing how the console are performing, and they are doing this way not because the ps5 or xs are using to the fullest their i/o subsystem but because in some cases the GPU already can't keep up with the rest.

I wish that the demo would be released on PC so we could test it and i could eat my crows or see if all the buzz around the i/o was mostly driven pr in agreement with Sony hyping the launch of their new console aiming at its strongest point. ...but something something .....maybe maybe they aren't releasing it for a reason
People can hold onto their conspiracy theories -or- rely on official information.

Even if not willing to rely on a single source, adding up 1 + 1 should inform any reasonable person that Sony made targeted design decision on the i/o to facilitate a specific design philosophy gong into next gen. All explained by Cerney in his presentation.

And even if not relying on Cerney, basic common sense should kick in how a multi-decade secondary storage bottleneck has kept asset streaming potential to a trickle, of which now is an open dam. Sony leads here, Xbox also has skin on the game - but not to the same extent. Anything else is not even in contention at the moment.

Conspiracy Vs Official Info + Logic. Not going to say backing which horse is more foolish.
 
  • Fire
Reactions: Md Ray

DenchDeckard

Member
Feb 28, 2021
1,387
2,346
320
I try to stay as straight down the middle as I can, but after the recently released emails that leaked showing epic were suggesting how they could work more closely with Sony to shape marketing and narratives it’s pretty damn obvious what that whole engine unveiling was.

Epic want as many people as possible to use the engine, the pc version of that demo....if it is ever released .(som may pay to stop this from happening, or at least delay it)...will smoke that demo, by the time it releases there will be pcs with tech strong enough to smash that demo at 4k 30 FPS with drs I bet.
 
  • Fire
Reactions: DonJuanSchlong

DenchDeckard

Member
Feb 28, 2021
1,387
2,346
320
People can hold onto their conspiracy theories -or- rely on official information.

Even if not willing to rely on a single source, adding up 1 + 1 should inform any reasonable person that Sony made targeted design decision on the i/o to facilitate a specific design philosophy gong into next gen. All explained by Cerney in his presentation.

And even if not relying on Cerney, basic common sense should kick in how a multi-decade secondary storage bottleneck has kept asset streaming potential to a trickle, of which now is an open dam. Sony leads here, Xbox also has skin on the game - but not to the same extent. Anything else is not even in contention at the moment.

Conspiracy Vs Official Info + Logic. Not going to say backing which horse is more foolish.

this could very well be true, but business and the worldwide situation right now is going to make cross Gen last for so much longer than ever seen before. So yes, Sony exclusives...(that don’t use unreal engine 5) will show some I/o work. Ratchet for example.

There is no way Epic are stupid enough to invest in a tech demo and technology that would only be possible on one console that doesn’t even use their engine outside 1 or 2 games. You only need to step away for a second to really think about this logically.

it was a pure marketing move, and a genius one I may add. Cemented in sonys continued investment into the studio and the recent emails that leaked.

apologies for double post.
 
Last edited:
  • Praise the Sun
Reactions: DonJuanSchlong

Shmunter

Member
Aug 25, 2018
9,931
22,828
775
this could very well be true, but business and the worldwide situation right now is going to make cross Gen last for so much longer than ever seen before. So yes, Sony exclusives...(that don’t use unreal engine 5) will show some I/o work. Ratchet for example.

There is no way Epic are stupid enough to invest in a tech demo and technology that would only be possible on one console that doesn’t even use their engine outside 1 or 2 games. You only need to step away for a second to really think about this logically.

it was a pure marketing move, and a genius one I may add. Cemented in sonys continued investment into the studio and the recent emails that leaked.

apologies for double post.
Pushing boundaries and innovation happens by certain players in all industries. Concept cars, fully RT marble demos etc. it’s a glimpse into what is coming.

Epic sells games on PC. This i/o demo is as much a push for tech evolution on that platform as much as it is showing off their engine via virtue of PS5.

It’s well documented Epic influenced tech as far back as the xbox 360 with their engine and ram requirements. It’s not new to them to take lead as tech influencers.
 

Godot25

Member
Apr 7, 2021
229
640
280
It's funny, how Epic and Sony got together to promote Unreal Engine 5 when probably one Sony first party developer will be using it (Sony Bend).
Meanwhile new games from XGS like Hellblade 2, Gears 6, new IP from Coalition, new RPG from inXile, new game from Compulsion, Perfect Dark, maybe Avowed and The Outer Worlds 2 and State of Decay 2 are all using Unreal and Unreal 5 in future :D

But I mean. Money certainly does not stink...
 

DenchDeckard

Member
Feb 28, 2021
1,387
2,346
320
Pushing boundaries and innovation happens by certain players in all industries. Concept cars, fully RT marble demos etc. it’s a glimpse into what is coming.

Epic sells games on PC. This i/o demo is as much a push for tech evolution on that platform as much as it is showing off their engine via virtue of PS5.

It’s well documented Epic influenced tech as far back as the xbox 360 with their engine and ram requirements. It’s not new to them to take lead as tech influencers.
everything you’ve written here i true and makes sense, but the fact is still they wouldn’t make that demo solely for the ps5. They’ve even said it would be release at the start of 2021 on pc, but its been delayed. I’ll say because of Covid But who really knows.

put me in the camp of when that tech demo gets released, like every other demo epic has made before it, it will run the same or better on pc. If it doesn’t get released there’s something even more fishy going on.
 
  • Love
Reactions: DonJuanSchlong

Shmunter

Member
Aug 25, 2018
9,931
22,828
775
everything you’ve written here i true and makes sense, but the fact is still they wouldn’t make that demo solely for the ps5. They’ve even said it would be release at the start of 2021 on pc, but its been delayed. I’ll say because of Covid But who really knows.

put me in the camp of when that tech demo gets released, like every other demo epic has made before it, it will run the same or better on pc. If it doesn’t get released there’s something even more fishy going on.
Whatever Epic release will be eyeball melting. Will it be that exact demo? Doubt it.

People will still take the eye popping demo and hold it up as a told ya so, even if the demo is leveraging completely different strengths of the hardware/engine -not- I/o to the same extent.

And on and on we’ll go.
 

systemr123

Member
Apr 16, 2021
132
255
230
I don't want to burst the bubble of some people here, but the demo shown by Epic was to show off asset streaming and the level of detail in any given scene it can create. They chose the PS5 to demo this new tech because its SSD tech is lightyears ahead of any other competition. They said the demo will run on all machines and it will look beautiful nonetheless. It will look best on PS5 though and then scale down depending on IO speed because of the amount of assets needing to be loaded/streamed during the scene.

On top of this, why would Epic lie about this? Their engine is supposed to run on all platforms, and they make money because of being available on all platforms. If Epic would lie about this it would set a terrible precedent and it would be severely bad for their image (e.g. Microsoft can decide not to use the engine on their games), so you can trust them to be honest on this. And if you don't believe what they're saying, it is time to do some actual research into the subject instead of just negating facts because it doesn't suit your opinion.