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[Nemesis_]

I'm really sorry first off because this doesn't seem thread worthy but I don't know where else to ask.

I was under the impression that Resident Evil 3, Resident Evil CODE: Veronica and Resident Evil 4 (and by extension, Devil May Cry) were all developed kind of close together and there was a lot of goings-ons behind the scenes at Capcom during this time regarding the titles in terms of marketing and development.

Does anyone know if there are any articles talking about such? I'm preparing a podcast about the game and wanted to spend some time talking about it.

Right now all I know is that SEGA kind of demanded an exclusive from Capcom (I believe) and as a result assisted with development duties of CODE Veronica. Resident Evil 3 was being developed in parallel and was not meant to be Residen Evil 3, but there's where I get lost.

I consider myself a bit of an RE nut but I'm just lost on this particular part of the series past.

 

[Smooth Operator]

Let's summon News Bot !

 

[duckroll]

It's been a really long time, but my recollection is that Sega and Capcom made a deal for an exclusive RE, and Nextech helped developed it. It wasn't entirely an internal Capcom project, and at the time it was assumed to be a true exclusive because a Sega affiliated developer helped make it. Of course none of that mattered after Sega threw in the towel in the console race.

 

[Alo0oy]

Code Veronica wasn't made by the same team that made the original trilogy, that info wasn't well known because I remember when it released Dreamcast fanboys made up a rumor about RE3 that stuck around for a while, that kind of information wasn't easy to find back then.

 

[Anung]

I'm not sure if I'm remembering this wrong but didn't Capcom basically owe Sony a PS1 Resident Evil. They got Resident Evil: Last Escape but they forced them to add the 3 so the series remained consistent on the PS1. Code Veronica was worked on at the same time I think.

Been a while since I've read up on this stuff.

 

[Gen X]

All I know is that RE3 was originally going to be a spin off story but Capcom demanded it be a sequel. Was on one of the older VG podcasts around episode 67-71 (listened to these four today at work).


*edit*
Beaten

 

[Sakujou]

IIRC there is a archive with sega mags from the 90ies some where. you should check that out.

i think that some kind of deal from saturn-days

 

[Nemesis_]

Been a while since I've read up on this stuff.

This is the thing, there is little to no information on the internet as far as I can find where I can read up on this stuff. The Resident Evil wiki is just awful and Project Umbrella is more about in-canon / in-universe components of the series.

 

[Xav]

I think Code Veronica happened because the team didn't want to lower the quality level of Resident Evil 2 to get it running on a Sega Saturn. Capcom instead decided to give Sega fans a Resident Evil game so they wouldn't feel left out. Actually Capcom probably thought that ignoring Sega fans cost them some extra sales. I don't think Sega demanded anything in particular.

Resident Evil 3 started off as a side story featuring Jill but Capcom decided to throw in a 3 into the title so it would sell more. Officially they like to say that Nemesis was worthy of being a numbered title which is true but unlikely the main reason.

In my head, I always think of Code Veronica as Resident Evil 3. I think of the actual Resident Evil 3 as Resident Evil Nemesis.

That's generally the story that stuck in my head over the years. I'm probably misinformed.

 

[JohnSpartanLee]

In my head, I always think of Code Veronica as Resident Evil 3. I think of the actual Resident Evil 3 as Resident Evil Nemesis.

Me, too. Should they remake RE2 one day they should include Jill's adventure as RE2: Nemesis.

 

[PensivePen]

Need to check my sources. Fairly sure the info is correct but don't really want to post anything if I can't find an article to back it up. Something I will say though is that DMC was originally RE3, and it was only after the game that we know as RE3 got rebranded to that, that it was bumped up to 4, and then finally DMC.

http://youtu.be/TpdZUaUlvbw?t=12m10s

 

[Korigama]

RE3 wasn't meant to numbered initially, but at the same time, neither was CODE: Veronica. Either way, the right choice was made regarding which one to assign it to (I bear no love for anything concerning C:V beyond its soundtrack, and continue to consider it the weakest game among the old school RE titles).

 

[Y2Kev]

Newsbot about to tell yall why yall wrong

 

[duckroll]

This is the thing, there is little to no information on the internet as far as I can find where I can read up on this stuff. The Resident Evil wiki is just awful and Project Umbrella is more about in-canon / in-universe components of the series.

You should check out interviews instead of reading general articles if you're looking factual stuff with sourcing.

Some examples:
http://www.mastergamer.com/featuresinterviewcap.html
http://projectumbrella.net/articles/Satoshi-Nakai-Interview-Project-Umbrella

 

[Arkanius]

RE3 wasn't meant to numbered initially, but at the same time, neither was CODE: Veronica. Either way, the right choice was made regarding which one to assign it to (I bear no love for anything concerning C:V beyond its soundtrack, and continue to consider it the weakest game among the old school RE titles).

I really loved Code Veronica, why is it considered the weakest? :/

 

[Nemesis_]

I really loved Code Veronica, why is it considered the weakest? :/

It's really poorly paced and particularly unfocused in my opinion. It used to be one of my favourites (I really cannot get enough of the PSYCHO homage) but repeat plays have started to make me realise why I don't like it.

Also, thanks duckroll

 

[News Bot]

The Resident Evil wiki is just awful and Project Umbrella is more about in-canon / in-universe components of the series.

I've been working on the game articles for a while, there's a lot of information to go through. But we do have a fair amount of information on CV's development.

Basically;

In 1997, CAPCOM contracted the Sega subsidiary Nextech Co., Ltd to handle the Saturn port of BIO1 under the direction of planner Hiroki Katoh. In the same year, BIO3 was in development for the PlayStation, before the release of BIO2. It was directed by Masaaki Yamada with chief planner Hideki Kamiya.

The team attempted to port BIO2 to the Saturn. However, they couldn't achieve it without sacrificing some of the game's quality, so it was scrapped. As an apology to Sega fans for the loss, Yoshiki Okamoto proposed a brand new title exclusive to the upcoming Dreamcast which would enable the team to create something of significant quality.

However, Yamada's team was occupied with BIO3 and another team led by Kazuhiro Aoyama was handling BIO1.9, a side-story title also for the PlayStation. Development also began on BIO0, a prequel for the Nintendo 64 initially under Kamiya's direction. On top of this, several members of BIO2's development staff left the company under sour circumstances after its release. With most key development staff preoccupied with other titles, the Dreamcast title was not only outsourced to Nextech, but also the ghost development company TOSE.

Hiroki Katoh was selected to direct the Dreamcast title (named "CODE:Veronica" from its inception) due to his previous experience working with Nextech while directing the BIO1 Saturn port. Outside of the FLAGSHIP writing staff, the only development staff from CAPCOM were director Katoh and stage planner Kaori Nishio. The rest was handled by Nextech and TOSE. Even lead artist Satoshi Nakai was a freelancer brought in by Nextech.

In mid-1998, BIO3 was moved to the PlayStation 2 at Okamoto's order in order to give CAPCOM's staff time to familiarize with the new console to ensure quality. Hideki Kamiya was promoted as director based on BIO2's resounding success, being replaced on BIO0 by Koji Oda. In order to make up for the loss of a main title on the PS1, Okamoto also ordered that BIO1.9 be scaled up as part of the main storyline. New staff were hired to accommodate this change.

Around June 1999, BIO1.9 was renamed BIO3. In turn, Kamiya's BIO3 was renamed BIO4 (and evolved into Devil May Cry). This year also greatly affected CV's development as the game was rampantly censored in every regard, from story (removal of Nazi backstory) to gameplay. A number of TOSE's Korean staff were hired by CAPCOM to develop BIOHAZARD GUN SURVIVOR.



Some common misconceptions are that CV was originally titled BIO3 and that Sony had anything to do with any of this. They had absolutely zero say in the series. All decisions were made by Yoshiki Okamoto or other members of the BIO team. The game's name was always "CODE:Veronica" as Okamoto personally wanted only numbered titles on the PlayStation brand. People took an interview with Mikami the wrong way where he says he views CV as the "true BIO3." He was speaking purely from a story perspective.

FUN FACT: Jill Valentine was CV's original protagonist. Claire Redfield was added after BIO2's release because of a cliffhanger line added to the scenario by Kamiya during voice recording sessions. Noboru Sugimura felt like he needed to resolve Claire's story.

 

[The Last One]

I've been working on the game articles for a while, there's a lot of information to go through. But we do have a fair amount of information on CV's development.

Basically;

In 1997, CAPCOM contracted the Sega subsidiary Nextech Co., Ltd to handle the Saturn port of BIO1 under the direction of planner Hiroki Katoh. In the same year, BIO3 was in development for the PlayStation, before the release of BIO2. It was directed by Masaaki Yamada with chief planner Hideki Kamiya.

The team attempted to port BIO2 to the Saturn. However, they couldn't achieve it without sacrificing some of the game's quality, so it was scrapped. As an apology to Sega fans for the loss, Yoshiki Okamoto proposed a brand new title exclusive to the upcoming Dreamcast which would enable the team to create something of significant quality.

However, Yamada's team was occupied with BIO3 and another team led by Kazuhiro Aoyama was handling BIO1.9, a side-story title also for the PlayStation. Development also began on BIO0, a prequel for the Nintendo 64 initially under Kamiya's direction. On top of this, several members of BIO2's development staff left the company under sour circumstances after its release. With most key development staff preoccupied with other titles, the Dreamcast title was not only outsourced to Nextech, but also the ghost development company TOSE.

Hiroki Katoh was selected to direct the Dreamcast title (named "CODE:Veronica" from its inception) due to his previous experience working with Nextech while directing the BIO1 Saturn port. Outside of the FLAGSHIP writing staff, the only development staff from CAPCOM were director Katoh and stage planner Kaori Nishio. The rest was handled by Nextech and TOSE. Even lead artist Satoshi Nakai was a freelancer brought in by Nextech.

In mid-1998, BIO3 was moved to the PlayStation 2 at Okamoto's order in order to give CAPCOM's staff time to familiarize with the new console to ensure quality. Hideki Kamiya was promoted as director based on BIO2's resounding success, being replaced on BIO0 by Koji Oda. In order to make up for the loss of a main title on the PS1, Okamoto also ordered that BIO1.9 be scaled up as part of the main storyline. New staff were hired to accommodate this change.

Around June 1999, BIO1.9 was renamed BIO3. In turn, Kamiya's BIO3 was renamed BIO4 (and evolved into Devil May Cry). This year also greatly affected CV's development as the game was rampantly censored in every regard, from story (removal of Nazi backstory) to gameplay. A number of TOSE's Korean staff were hired by CAPCOM to develop BIOHAZARD GUN SURVIVOR.



Some common misconceptions are that CV was originally titled BIO3 and that Sony had anything to do with any of this. They had absolutely zero say in the series. All decisions were made by Yoshiki Okamoto or other members of the BIO team. The game's name was always "CODE:Veronica" as Okamoto personally wanted only numbered titles on the PlayStation brand. People took an interview with Mikami the wrong way where he says he views CV as the "true BIO3." He was speaking purely from a story perspective.

FUN FACT: Jill Valentine was CV's original protagonist. Claire Redfield was added after BIO2's release because of a cliffhanger line added to the scenario by Kamiya during voice recording sessions. Noboru Sugimura felt like he needed to resolve Claire's story.

Thanks for this, I really didn't know most of this stuff.

 

[Jawmuncher]

Thank goodness for that right up.
Also I know it's because of different teams, but man the gameplay shift from 3 to CV is always jarring to me when I play through the series. Oddly enough it's the only game in the series that I feel that way with.

 

[Korigama]

I really loved Code Veronica, why is it considered the weakest? :/

I didn't always dislike it, but what bothered me about it did become clearer in retrospect, comparable to what Nemesis_ already said. I posted a long while back in a different thread concerning what I thought of it and how it compared to RE3.

In regards to reusing a lot of RE2 assets and setting it within the same general timeframe in being both a prequel and a sequel to that game, I could understand RE3 being viewed as less of a "true" RE3 when Code: Veronica actually advanced the story...even if that story had a lot of really dumb things about it, even by RE standards.

That said, I can't understand how CVX could be in any way be regarded as the more playable game, be it back then or now, when it...

-got rid of the dodge system introduced in RE3
-had much worse enemy design
-went back to requiring pressing a button to climb or descend stairs after 3 introduced moving up or down them at your leisure with the D-pad
-was even worse about how it handled fetch quests and backtracking
-neither kept 3's Live Selection system, nor introduced any new or interesting mechanics in its place that affected the events of the story
-had a design flaw in that it was actually possible to make the game unbeatable if someone didn't

Spoiler

leave some healing items with Claire before the first switch to Chris, meaning she would be unable to survive running away from mutated Steve once you switched back, as she had to take hits during the chase no matter what the player did

-didn't even let players blow off the heads or legs of zombies anymore (a personal gripe more than anything else, I admit)
-was in full-3D, yet made no effort to utilize this to its advantage in combat beyond the use of the sniper rifle in one boss battle
EDIT: Forgot a couple.
-had no weapons parts to acquire and combine to make new guns
-got rid of the ammunition creation system

 

[encephalon]

Maybe this is unwarranted, but I guess this is why realization of the art direction in CV just feels so stale. It's also hard to believe it's music from the same guy as 2.

FUN FACT: Jill Valentine was CV's original protagonist. Claire Redfield was added after BIO2's release because of a cliffhanger line added to the scenario by Kamiya during voice recording sessions. Noboru Sugimura felt like he needed to resolve Claire's story.

Does this explain the plot hole where Claire goes searching for her brother, but when she gets in trouble she just calls Leon and asks him to tell her brother to save him (she was always just a phone call away)? How far into development was CV before they injected Claire into the story?

 

[shanafan]

The team attempted to port BIO2 to the Saturn. However, they couldn't achieve it without sacrificing some of the game's quality, so it was scrapped.

They should have contacted Factor 5, which was able to bring RE2 to the N64 - a cartridge based system. I wonder what obstacles were in their way? Of course, maybe even the quality of RE2 on N64 wasn't up to this team's standards.

 

[Sevket-Erhat]

http://youtu.be/u-1nVFFwClw

 

[industrian]

I really loved Code Veronica, why is it considered the weakest? :/

It's the "classic" Resident Evil formula taken to its logical and craziest extreme. So much stuff to collect for puzzles, so much backtracking, so many slow doors, etc. That sort of gameplay is relatively fine in a confined and singular environment (such as a Mansion, Police Station, etc) but Code Veronica is a huge game. You can tell why they'd want to streamline the formula with Resident Evil 4 after playing it.

That said, I liked Code Veronica. Even though I left the empty fire extinguisher in the metal detector, was unable to beat the final boss without the magnum, and had to start from the beginning again.

 

[shanafan]

I really loved Code Veronica, why is it considered the weakest? :/

It's my favorite RE title. I love the plot, and Arthur Ashford was a great character.

 

[Alo0oy]

RE3 wasn't meant to numbered initially, but at the same time, neither was CODE: Veronica. Either way, the right choice was made regarding which one to assign it to (I bear no love for anything concerning C:V beyond its soundtrack, and continue to consider it the weakest game among the old school RE titles).

That rumor actually wasn't true, RE3 was always supposed to be a numbered title, I can't find any links right now since this is very old (maybe someone on GAF has one?), why would the main team work on the supposed "spinoff"? Code Veronica was outsourced to a different developer altogether, which is why a lot of the gameplay improvements found in RE3 didn't make it to Code Veronica.

 

[Freedom = $1.05]

Thank goodness for that right up.
Also I know it's because of different teams, but man the gameplay shift from 3 to CV is always jarring to me when I play through the series. Oddly enough it's the only game in the series that I feel that way with.

The true RE series has always felt (to me) to be RE1->RE2->RECV. RE3 always felt out of place and more of a side story than a true part of the RE series (makes sense given its development history) and anything past RECV felt like a different series altogether, including REmake and RE0. Both series feel great (i loved RE4, RE5, and RErelevations and have RE6 collecting digital dust in my steam backlog) but i still prefer those older games to the newer stuff if only because of the nostalgia i have for them

 

[Xpliskin]

News bot bat signal

Edit: nvm

CV and Re3 are equally fine in my eyes.

I mean, a battery hidden inside a statue in one of raccoon's park's has nothing on CV.
Edit 2:
I remember the local game mag claiming RE3 to be a spin-off while the true sequel (CV) was unannounced and in development, might still be in one of those boxes in the cellar

 

[News Bot]

http://youtu.be/u-1nVFFwClw

They're quite wrong on a few points.

That rumor actually wasn't true, RE3 was always supposed to be a numbered title, I can't find any links right now since this is very old (maybe someone on GAF has one?), why would the main team work on the supposed "spinoff"? Code Veronica was outsourced to a different developer altogether, which is why a lot of the gameplay improvements found in RE3 didn't make it to Code Veronica.

The BIO3 we have now was originally "BIO1.9." Technically numbered but it was a side-story. The main team didn't work on it, a newly hired team of students did. The main team was working on the original BIO3/BIO4 on the PS1/PS2.

Does this explain the plot hole where Claire goes searching for her brother, but when she gets in trouble she just calls Leon and asks him to tell her brother to save him (she was always just a phone call away)? How far into development was CV before they injected Claire into the story?

It's not really a plot hole, Claire wasn't expecting to get caught. Jill's artwork is dated February 1998, so a few months.

 

[Mellahan]

Times like this I wish there was a singular site, a hub, that documented all the early/development Residet Evils. Everything is pretty scattered as is.

 

[News Bot]

Times like this I wish there was a singular site, a hub, that documented all the early/development Residet Evils. Everything is pretty scattered as is.

I'm working on it

 

[Mr. Pointy]

Bit of a tangent.

Any idea how long Kamiya was working on BIO0? And how much did they get done on the N64 version before it got transferred to the GC?

 

[Nemesis_]

Bit of a tangent.

Any idea how long Kamiya was working on BIO0? And how much did they get done on the N64 version before it got transferred to the GC?

The only part that was publicly demoed was the train. I don't know how far along they got, I feel like they got pretty damn far before scrapping it.

Or I am just getting my wires crossed with 1.5

 

[joeygreco1985]

I've been working on the game articles for a while, there's a lot of information to go through. But we do have a fair amount of information on CV's development.

Basically;

In 1997, CAPCOM contracted the Sega subsidiary Nextech Co., Ltd to handle the Saturn port of BIO1 under the direction of planner Hiroki Katoh. In the same year, BIO3 was in development for the PlayStation, before the release of BIO2. It was directed by Masaaki Yamada with chief planner Hideki Kamiya.

The team attempted to port BIO2 to the Saturn. However, they couldn't achieve it without sacrificing some of the game's quality, so it was scrapped. As an apology to Sega fans for the loss, Yoshiki Okamoto proposed a brand new title exclusive to the upcoming Dreamcast which would enable the team to create something of significant quality.

However, Yamada's team was occupied with BIO3 and another team led by Kazuhiro Aoyama was handling BIO1.9, a side-story title also for the PlayStation. Development also began on BIO0, a prequel for the Nintendo 64 initially under Kamiya's direction. On top of this, several members of BIO2's development staff left the company under sour circumstances after its release. With most key development staff preoccupied with other titles, the Dreamcast title was not only outsourced to Nextech, but also the ghost development company TOSE.

Hiroki Katoh was selected to direct the Dreamcast title (named "CODE:Veronica" from its inception) due to his previous experience working with Nextech while directing the BIO1 Saturn port. Outside of the FLAGSHIP writing staff, the only development staff from CAPCOM were director Katoh and stage planner Kaori Nishio. The rest was handled by Nextech and TOSE. Even lead artist Satoshi Nakai was a freelancer brought in by Nextech.

In mid-1998, BIO3 was moved to the PlayStation 2 at Okamoto's order in order to give CAPCOM's staff time to familiarize with the new console to ensure quality. Hideki Kamiya was promoted as director based on BIO2's resounding success, being replaced on BIO0 by Koji Oda. In order to make up for the loss of a main title on the PS1, Okamoto also ordered that BIO1.9 be scaled up as part of the main storyline. New staff were hired to accommodate this change.

Around June 1999, BIO1.9 was renamed BIO3. In turn, Kamiya's BIO3 was renamed BIO4 (and evolved into Devil May Cry). This year also greatly affected CV's development as the game was rampantly censored in every regard, from story (removal of Nazi backstory) to gameplay. A number of TOSE's Korean staff were hired by CAPCOM to develop BIOHAZARD GUN SURVIVOR.



Some common misconceptions are that CV was originally titled BIO3 and that Sony had anything to do with any of this. They had absolutely zero say in the series. All decisions were made by Yoshiki Okamoto or other members of the BIO team. The game's name was always "CODE:Veronica" as Okamoto personally wanted only numbered titles on the PlayStation brand. People took an interview with Mikami the wrong way where he says he views CV as the "true BIO3." He was speaking purely from a story perspective.

FUN FACT: Jill Valentine was CV's original protagonist. Claire Redfield was added after BIO2's release because of a cliffhanger line added to the scenario by Kamiya during voice recording sessions. Noboru Sugimura felt like he needed to resolve Claire's story.

This is great stuff. I've always found the development history of the Resident Evil games to be super interesting.

 

[Toxa]

That rumor actually wasn't true, RE3 was always supposed to be a numbered title, I can't find any links right now since this is very old (maybe someone on GAF has one?), why would the main team work on the supposed "spinoff"? Code Veronica was outsourced to a different developer altogether, which is why a lot of the gameplay improvements found in RE3 didn't make it to Code Veronica.

well the quick back turn was on both games

 

[bigkrev]

Around June 1999, BIO1.9 was renamed BIO3. In turn, Kamiya's BIO3 was renamed BIO4 (and evolved into Devil May Cry). This year also greatly affected CV's development as the game was rampantly censored in every regard, from story (removal of Nazi backstory) to gameplay. A number of TOSE's Korean staff were hired by CAPCOM to develop BIOHAZARD GUN SURVIVOR.

Can you talk more about the censorship? I found it odd that CV is the only RE game without any Gore.

 

[News Bot]

Can you talk more about the censorship? I found it odd that CV is the only RE game without any Gore.

I don't think the reason has ever been stated. Gun Survivor is also lacking in gore, and the US release has GunCon compatibility removed.