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[Granger Danger]

It's not an exclusively gay thing, Edward Norton and Scott Speedman have it too.

 

[PhoenixDark]

does that mean he came out to everyone but your dad?

He came out to his friends but not the family. I pretty much knew since he didn't know how to erase his internet history on my computer, and later a gay friend of mine confirmed it (craigslist...).

 

[levious]

It's not an exclusively gay thing, Edward Norton and Scott Speedman have it too.

plus any spanish teacher I had originally from Spain.


PD,

My brother did the same... hopefully yours doesn't wait til he's near middle aged to finish...

 

[GloveSlap]

It's originally forced but then it becomes second nature.

Yeah. I also think it comes down to the fact that many gay guys hang out with other gay guys so it kind of catches on that way.

Some might have it naturally though.

 

[Magnus]

As a gay dude who hates this bullshit:

It's forced. Very forced. Maybe a few people naturally have it, and I feel AWFUL for them, but 99% of its usage is by the kind of gays who look for attention anywhere they can get it, and attract overweight females with guy issues like goddamn tubs of Ben & Jerry's.

I have been refusing to date guys who speak like this since I was thirteen, and I stand by my condemnation of anyone who would turn themselves into a stereotype. So, straights, you wonder if it's PC to call bullshit on that fake "gay" accent? You have my approval.

My favorite thing to do when a guy starts flirting with me in that accent is to put on a fake, incredibly thick Bostonian accent. Basically talk like a combination of the scout from TF2 and John Linell for the rest of the conversation. It's ridiculously fun.

Wow.

I love you. Marry me.

Honestly, this is exactly the view I have (as a fellow homo), and any time I try to vocalize it, I get accused of actually being homophobic or a self-hating queer. It's unbelievable.

 

[ToxicAdam]

I think all of us are 'vocal chameleons' to certain degrees. We are constantly adapting our language or tone based upon the people we have around us. Or even based upon how we want them to perceive us.

It happened to me when I was working in and around all black people for 2 years. I began to pick up the verbal tics and slower rhythym of their speaking pattern and began to emulate it. It wasn't something I did conciously.

I would think if someone is speaking in a fey voice, it's because they feel more comfortable and relaxed with their surroundings and their 'true self' emerges.

 

[dudeworld]

the ones I remember from high school would put on the lisp so they'd be the "fun gay friend" to all the girls.

 

[RoodyPooUS]

I think a lot of gay people actually change their voice intentionally to this.

A lot of people in the gay community in SF really embrace that flamboyant type of behavior, the walk, the talk, mannerisms etc.

Maybe it gives them more of an identity and its easy to meet others that you know are gay.

I don't have a problem with it, just like how you can tell a New Yorker by his accent, etc.

 

[Poindexter]

the voice you grew accustomed to sounded more natural? shocking.

Oh jeez thanks for points out the obvious. I also said it sounds like he's forcing it. Sometimes you can identify when someone is speaking in an unnatural manner. And I also conceded it was up for debate and I wasn't positive.

 

[mil6es]

Talking "black", real or forced?

what..wait...all black people talk the same???? Mind Blown!

 

[Count Dookkake]

what..wait...all black people talk the same???? Mind Blown!

Just like gay people. It's true, I saw it on TV.

 

[daviyoung]

Coo-eee

 

[BocoDragon]

I've known kids who had it since they were young. When they come out in their teens it's kind of a "no kidding" moment because they had always acted/talked feminine. Obviously not all gay people have it, though, not even close... I know gay dudes who are much more manly than I

 

[Muffdraul]

This topic reminded me of the scene in GTAIV where Bernie/Florian gets so pissed off that he accidentally speaks in his "real"/masculine voice. So awesome.

 

[Magnus]

I think all of us are 'vocal chameleons' to certain degrees. We are constantly adapting our language or tone based upon the people we have around us. Or even based upon how we want them to perceive us.

It happened to me when I was working in and around all black people for 2 years. I began to pick up the verbal tics and slower rhythym of their speaking pattern and began to emulate it. It wasn't something I did conciously.

I would think if someone is speaking in a fey voice, it's because they feel more comfortable and relaxed with their surroundings and their 'true self' emerges.

I was with you until that very last sentence. True self? So they aren't just being vocal chameleons when it comes to the 'gay voice', but instead, their environment is breaking down an internal barrier and allowing a true voice to come through?

 

[dudeworld]

I think a lot of gay people actually change their voice intentionally to this.

A lot of people in the gay community in SF really embrace that flamboyant type of behavior, the walk, the talk, mannerisms etc.

Maybe it gives them more of an identity and its easy to meet others that you know are gay.

I don't have a problem with it, just like how you can tell a New Yorker by his accent, etc.

I've seen some gay men that do the whole thing with the walk, the walk, and mannerisms. They literally look and sound like girls. excuse my ignorance, but is that what other gay men want? A guy that's basically a girl?

 

[patrickthehedgehog]

I'm gay and when drunk or angry (or both) I can get a little sassy sounding. *shrugs*

 

[Yoritomo]

Probably just a way to differentiate and identify as gay. Gay dudes and straight dudes are exactly the same physically so the only marker to know who to approach is how they act or what they say. Add the accent in and boom you know who might be a homophobic us congressman.

 

[Kinyou]

Always wondered what comes first. The "gay" voice, or the realization that you're into men.

Also do have lesbians have anything similar? Like an anti-lisp?

It's not an exclusively gay thing, Edward Norton and Scott Speedman have it too.

Well maybe....

 

[HylianTom]

They literally look and sound like girls. excuse my ignorance, but is that what other gay men want? A guy that's basically a girl?

Ouch.. touchy subject within the gay community. I've seen GayGAF tear each other to bits over this isssue.

Probably just a way to differentiate and identify as gay. Gay dudes and straight dudes are exactly the same physically so the only marker to know who to approach is how they act or what they say. Add the accent in and boom you know who might be a homophobic us congressman.

Without the lisp, you can often go by a certain knowing moment of eye contact. It's difficult to explain.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

I had a gay friend jokingly tell me once the lisp was caused from sucking too much cock.

Daniel Tosh sort of has it and as far as I know he's not gay. I think we all had one or two kids in primary school that talked like that and they are they ones everyone assumed were gay. Strange phenomenon.

 

[Tathanen]

My best friend and his circle don't outwardly project gay

I like the use of "gay" as a non-human noun. Like they are spurting it as a fluid from their glands. Just spraying it everywhere.

"Oh.. oh god. I'm covered in it. Absolutely covered in gay."

ahem

Carry on.

 

[levious]

Also do have lesbians have anything similar? Like an anti-lisp?

leather sandals

 

[TheRagnCajun]

Speech patterns, dialect and accents are all aquired (developed) aren't they? The lisp would be developed with the intent of sounding 'gay'...I think.

 

[Snytbaggen]

I'm currently learning the programming language Lisp, and the thread title put some very strange images in my mind...

 

[Data West]

Man, people sure do get defensive about a theoretical. It's a pretty known thing. Just because you don't know anyone who has it doesn't mean it's a product of television or whatever insane theory you've cooked up.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Daniel Tosh sort of has it and as far as I know he's not gay. I think we all had one or two kids in primary school that talked like that and they are they ones everyone assumed were gay. Strange phenomenon.

Plus kids have higher voices in general, and might be more prone to nasal issues that lead to lisps.

 

[Slappers Only]

Just like the flouncing around or flapping of wrists and whatnot, it's a learned behavior.

 

[Yoritomo]

Without the lisp, you can often go by a certain knowing moment of eye contact. It's difficult to explain.

If I ask a gay friend to give me a gay look he might punch me. I need more explanation.

Or I could just ask my friend, but that seems antithetical and far less fun than asking someone to explain it on the internet.

Hell I have a weird habit of winking at literally everyone, but it never sends the wrong signals, I am a bit ugly though :/

 

[benzy]

Tough to say. I had a Biology lab TA who would try to speak normally and near the end of his sentences he would start to lisp and really enunciate his S's. Not sure if he was gay or if it was a speech impediment.

 

[Lord Ghirahim]

Ouch.. touchy subject within the gay community. I've seen GayGAF tear each other to bits over this isssue.

Intrahomo bigotry is amusing. Slightly reminiscent of the "paper bag test" too.

 

[braves01]

Anderson Cooper doesn't have a lisp, unless he saves it for when he's off-air.

 

[besada]

You don't?!

I've only ever heard that lisp in two situations:

1. Man is gay.

2. Person is mimicking a gay man.

Really? I've known several guys who had an effeminate voice that weren't gay. The first one -- a kid named, unfortunately, Jussy Schwam -- took beatings nearly constantly over it, and everyone assumed he was gay, but it turns out he wasn't. He just had an effeminate voice and a terrible name.

I've met a handful of other guys with a similar problem. I think there are multiple parts to it, too. Plenty of people with lisps, who don't have high-pitched effeminate voices, and plenty of people with effeminate voices who don't have lisps.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

Not the same thing, talking "black" or any other race is a product of where you grow up. The lisp I don't know where it comes from and it's interesting thing. Of course we're generalizing or stereotyping but there is no denying that it's really common among gay men.

Dave Cross has a really funny routine where he points out that it's like the redneck voice and you can be from anywhere, but the accent remains the same.

 

[thezerofire]

plus any spanish teacher I had originally from Spain.


PD,

My brother did the same... hopefully yours doesn't wait til he's near middle aged to finish...

Spanish people have a most lisp-ish pronunciation than people who speak Mexican Spanish, so that could be it.

 

[HylianTom]

If I ask a gay friend to give me a gay look he might punch me. I need more explanation.

Hmm.. it's usually a look that men give each other when they're out looking for a hook-up, out cruising for a date, etc. No words are exchanged, eye contact is a little bit longer than usual, there may or may not be a subtle smile involved, and you can feel a certain degree of tension. That's the best way I can describe it.

Your friend won't be offended if you describe it within that context. I guess it's pretty similar to when a guy and a girl are eyeing each other at a club, before the first moment of verbal contact.

Really? I've known several guys who had an effeminate voice that weren't gay. The first one -- a kid named, unfortunately, Jussy Schwam -- took beatings nearly constantly over it, and everyone assumed he was gay, but it turns out he wasn't. He just had an effeminate voice and a terrible name.

This sounds incredibly similar to a guy I went to grade school with. He was made fun of constantly, and I was able to stay blended-in in the background. Turns-out he was straight, but I still felt guilty for saying nothing while he took the teasing and the heat.

 

[ZeroCypher]

Thinking it's forced/habit/association. With enough effort, anyone can get rid of an accent. People associate the lisp with gays mostly and so, I assume, most gays recreate the lisp on purpose.

Question: As a kid, before a guy knew he was gay, did he speak naturally with the lisp? I have a gay friend who didn't as we were growing up but gradually developed one after he came out.

 

[umop_3pisdn]

I've seen some gay men that do the whole thing with the walk, the walk, and mannerisms. They literally look and sound like girls. excuse my ignorance, but is that what other gay men want? A guy that's basically a girl?

Personally I'm not really into it, but regardless it's rather unlikely that an effeminate dude would ever be mistaken for a girl, they're both apparently different things, so yes there is at least some demand for that.

 

[ToxicAdam]

I was with you until that very last sentence. True self? So they aren't just being vocal chameleons when it comes to the 'gay voice', but instead, their environment is breaking down an internal barrier and allowing a true voice to come through?

Well, I put true self in quotes for a reason. But, you would think that 'true voice' would manifest itself when you feel the most at ease.

 

[Koodo]

Speech patterns, dialect and accents are all aquired (developed) aren't they? The lisp would be developed with the intent of sounding 'gay'...I think.

Pretty much. They're all a social product, at least when dealing with differences within one language. Something like "black talk" or "NY italian" might be more ingrained, and the gay lisp might be forced and temporary, but that doesn't differentiate both at their core: they're social, not biological or genetic or what have you.

In terms of different languages, I believe there are some biological differences where speakers of a particular language might have longer tongues than speakers of other languages, but I'm just speaking from memory and have no receipts of this.

 

[Yoritomo]

Hmm.. it's usually a look that men give each other when they're out looking for a hook-up, out cruising for a date, etc. No words are exchanged, eye contact is a little bit longer than usual, there may or may not be a subtle smile involved, and you can feel a certain degree of tension. That's the best way I can describe it.

Your friend won't be offended if you describe it within that context. I guess it's pretty similar to when a guy and a girl are eyeing each other at a club, before the first moment of verbal contact.

Goddammit. Being Gay sounds awesome. Women are ridiculous. And yeah I know what you mean but it's way more inconsistent with women.

 

[Dice]

I'm way more confused by lesbians who date women who make themselves like men in every way except for having the equipment, and even that they take care of with some hardware (is this still too detailed for google?) I'm all like "but I thought you like women..." vice-versa for some gay guys on that, too. No offense, I'm just confused by it.

As for the "gay talking" ask a female friend to "talk like a gay guy" and she will just sound like a cheerleader stereotype. So it's not a lisp so much as it is just effeminate.

 

[HylianTom]

Goddammit. Being Gay sounds awesome. Women are ridiculous. And yeah I know what you mean but it's way more inconsistent with women.

It can be. You ever hear the metaphor that men are gas pedals and women are the brakes?

You can guess what happens when there are no "brakes," the right eye contact is made, and you or your target live right nearby. Both good and bad can come of it.

 

[Acerac]

I'm gay and know a lot of gay people but none of them have a lisp. Some talk in a higher pitch voice maybe, but there is no lisp. Do you get all your information from television?

I'm gay and don't have the lisp, but I have 2 coworkers who are openly gay and have an extremely pronounced lisp.

In conclusion, I have no clue if they're forcing it or not, but I do know that not everyone who is gay ends up with it.

 

[Marleyman]

Not the same thing, talking "black" or any other race is a product of where you grow up. The lisp I don't know where it comes from and it's interesting thing. Of course we're generalizing or stereotyping but there is no denying that it's really common among gay men.

lol @ Luc Longley avatar.

 

[Kai Dracon]

Gay dude reporting in:

Neither I nor Mah Guy have the slightest "lisp" and we're as unashamedly gay and non-conformist as they come.

I don't know any gay dudes in either of our circles who have "the lisp" either. That means perhaps 50-100 gay dudes (tm) we've met in person.

Here's the trick, IMHO: neither of us, nor most of the people we know, have participated in "gay culture" as is typically defined in the stereotypes. Don't go to gay bars, never lived in those suspiciously congregated gay urban areas, etc. I figure this has had an effect on us.

Sometimes, when I meet a gay person from one of those social backgrounds, it's so weird. To me (us) gay mans don't actually act like that, talk like that, or even think like that. It's all a stupid thing in the mass media. Then we meet someone who is that way and it's... so weird.

 

[teruterubozu]

It seems to be a phenomenon amongst younger gay men. Usually older guys lose it when they realize how ridiculous it is, otherwise they end up sounding like Harvey Fierstein.

 

[royalan]

As a gay dude who hates this bullshit:

It's forced. Very forced. Maybe a few people naturally have it, and I feel AWFUL for them, but 99% of its usage is by the kind of gays who look for attention anywhere they can get it, and attract overweight females with guy issues like goddamn tubs of Ben & Jerry's.

I have been refusing to date guys who speak like this since I was thirteen, and I stand by my condemnation of anyone who would turn themselves into a stereotype. So, straights, you wonder if it's PC to call bullshit on that fake "gay" accent? You have my approval.

My favorite thing to do when a guy starts flirting with me in that accent is to put on a fake, incredibly thick Bostonian accent. Basically talk like a combination of the scout from TF2 and John Linell for the rest of the conversation. It's ridiculously fun.

Wow...just wow.

Yeah, some gays came up with an exclusive accent as a direct means to piss off heterosexuals and their "upstanding" gay counterparts.

Look, don't like guys who talk "gay"? Your biz. Doesn't mean that they're less-than and deserving of condemnation or any form of disrespect. It's really not for attention. In fact, most of the gay guys I know who speak in that stereotypical way are also the type who really wouldn't give a crap about what you think of them.


Anywho, I wouldn't really say it's "forced." Just kinda learned. I know I've personally taken on a few "gay" affectations after I came out and started spending more time in the community and socializing. A few friends and I were just having this discussion, about how we used to say things like "truf!" and "gurrrlll" to make fun of the stereotype, but now we do it naturally. And it's all in good fun.

And don't most people do this? I know before I came out, I still had different ways of relating and communicating depending who I was talking to. The way that I talked to my friends was much different than how I spoke to my parents, for example. The "gay lisp" (which really isn't even a lisp) is just an extension of that.

 

[Tenks]

I know a guy who was married and had 2 kids. The moment he came out he started taking with a lisp.


The guy who installed my cable was also gay and unless he told me I would have had no clue. I think some dudes just force it.

 

[Bel Marduk]

The lisp is much more of a transgender thing than a gay thing. It, like all other transgender characteristics, is almost always forced.

I'm gay and know very few people with a lisp.