Support NeoGAF

[Dunki]

You're saying silly things my guy. Why do you care so much about what some people on Twitter are saying? Okay Snoop says that he's white now. So WHAT! That's not what most black people are saying.

And your stats are just wrong. You clearly know nothing about black people if you think Trump is bringing black people into the Republican fold.


https://www.factcheck.org/2016/02/trump-and-the-black-vote/

Ronald Regan also got about 10% of the Black vote. It was Obama that made the black vote for the REPs to go down to 4%. And it was the lack of Obama running that allowed the black vote for Trump to go back up to 8 or so percent.

it was the lack of Obama and Hillary being the candidate. The fact that still so many people did vote for trump. Just shows that the most people wanted was change no matter what.

 

[EviLore]

Hold on, Kanye rolled up to TMZ's offices and victim blamed black people for being complicit in 400 years of slavery? O_O He seems unwell.

 

[Helen Keller the Musical]

A post similarly that was said on the new site, the left don't want to hear voices from PoC unless they fall in line with the leftist agenda.

 

[Moneal]

Hold on, Kanye rolled up to TMZ's offices and victim blamed black people for being complicit in 400 years of slavery? O_O He seems unwell.

He was talking about the mindset. Slavery didn't even go on in the US for 400 years. The trans-atlantic slave trade started in 1520s(not even in north america at that point) and slavery ended in the us in 1865. Thats 340 years at most. He was saying you hear about slavery for 400 years, and you are stuck in the mindset of being a slave or as he said its better to say prisoner. He is saying that black people are prisoners of the mindset, similarly to what Candace Owens mentions about victim mentality, and bringing up slavery and Jim Crow over and over.

 

[TrainedRage]

Hold on, Kanye rolled up to TMZ's offices and victim blamed black people for being complicit in 400 years of slavery? O_O He seems unwell.

I think when he was referencing slavery he was trying to quote Candace Owens and what she was saying here....


Its near the end. Talking about the 'victim mentality of blacks'.

"...400 years of slavery, Jim Crow, which by the way none of you lived through."

 

[mckmas8808]

He was talking about the mindset. Slavery didn't even go on in the US for 400 years. The trans-atlantic slave trade started in 1520s(not even in north america at that point) and slavery ended in the us in 1865. Thats 340 years at most. He was saying you hear about slavery for 400 years, and you are stuck in the mindset of being a slave or as he said its better to say prisoner. He is saying that black people are prisoners of the mindset, similarly to what Candace Owens mentions about victim mentality, and bringing up slavery and Jim Crow over and over.

Why don't people ever say this same thing about the Jewish population? I mean for god sakes we literally still have The Passover. And that was 2,000 years ago! But now black people have to forget the wrongs of a nation with respect to slavery and Jim Crow segregation.

Especially when some of that Jim Crow stuff is alive today, but in different forms. Sick of people telling us to leave our history and the nation's history in the past. Candance Owens says that no one there lived through Jim Crow laws, yet my dad was born in 1958 (before the Civil Rights law was signed).

 

[Moneal]

Why don't people ever say this same thing about the Jewish population? I mean for god sakes we literally still have The Passover. And that was 2,000 years ago! But now black people have to forget the wrongs of a nation with respect to slavery and Jim Crow segregation.

Especially when some of that Jim Crow stuff is alive today, but in different forms. Sick of people telling us to leave our history and the nation's history in the past. Candance Owens says that no one there lived through Jim Crow laws, yet my dad was born in 1958 (before the Civil Rights law was signed).

Do jewish people still talk about slavery in egypt holding them back? They celebrate their coming out of bondage. They don't even do that with the Holocaust. Im not saying forget our history, but yes our history needs to be left in the past. It isn't why we are succeeding or failing in the present.

As for Owens, she was at a college speaking to college kids. No one in that room lived through any of it.

 

[pramod]

Jews still remember the Holocaust but they're not using it as an excuse for any of their current challenges, instead they use it as motivation to overcome them. I wonder why black Americans cannot do the same.

 

[Vicetrailia]

Black people still deal with lingering issues from Jim Crow, defacto and dejure discrimination, the cycle of poverty and more. They want to eliminate those issues to further equality of opportunity.

You wonder why black people can't do the same, but yet they are. The difference is that you get mad about it when black people talk about it. As if talking about things is victimization.

Owens is apparently a commentator for white people, not actually black people. What Kanye said about having Michael Jordan rather than Harriet Tubman on the $20 makes sense even though it's still off-base, while Candace would say some zany shit that black people would scoff at.

 

[Shiki_]

*sigh*

The Civil Right movement in the USA was something it happened not too long ago, which it don't was resolved immediatly, because the opossition lasted even until the 70's. The victims can be parents or grandparents from young people, and many of them are still alive, so even if the youth are not living (thank god!) in Jim Crow laws era, still can see people who suffered under it.

And because the same people who were victims can be alive, the same can be say about the people who opposed to the movement. They had children, and they educate them. How many of them had a change of heart the following years, or at least, instead, their children don't followed their bigotry? It's not saying black people want to fault to someone, it's because they know damn the racism won't die easily.

I'm not from USA but it break my heart to read that mothers like Mamie Till outlived their sons, victims of a barbarie practice known as lynching. His son Emmett Till died at 1955, and she died at 2003. It's not fair a mother passed decades without her son.

 

[mr2xxx]

Why don't people ever say this same thing about the Jewish population? I mean for god sakes we literally still have The Passover. And that was 2,000 years ago! But now black people have to forget the wrongs of a nation with respect to slavery and Jim Crow segregation.

Especially when some of that Jim Crow stuff is alive today, but in different forms. Sick of people telling us to leave our history and the nation's history in the past. Candance Owens says that no one there lived through Jim Crow laws, yet my dad was born in 1958 (before the Civil Rights law was signed).

It'll be those same people waving a confederate flag and not realizing the irony.

 

[mckmas8808]

Do jewish people still talk about slavery in egypt holding them back? They celebrate their coming out of bondage. They don't even do that with the Holocaust. Im not saying forget our history, but yes our history needs to be left in the past. It isn't why we are succeeding or failing in the present.

As for Owens, she was at a college speaking to college kids. No one in that room lived through any of it.

So does racism just disappear because a bill is signed? And the Jews in America and Isreal absolutely talk about the Holocaust. Like ALL THE TIME! It's one of the reasons why they didn't want American Presidents to work with Iran over the years. Because the Prime Minister was a Holocaust denier.

Jews still remember the Holocaust but they're not using it as an excuse for any of their current challenges, instead they use it as motivation to overcome them. I wonder why black Americans cannot do the same.

Is racism in America an excuse for underachieving or a reason? Have some of you not realized that Black people had to create their own colleges, fraternties, TV Networks, Sporting Leagues, Banks, etc because we literally weren't allowed to be apart of any of those American institutions? Black Americans are literally the most "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" race in America. Everything we have is because we studied, worked, fought, died, etc hard for it. We went from America making it illegal to teach slaves how to read (1620s), to building and running our own Universities (Wilberforce University - 1856).

Now we have black Billionaires and had a Black President. So we know a lot about defeating the odds/challenges. All we ask for is for the oppressors to move out of the way and let us live freely and equally. Is that too much to ask?

 

[pramod]

Now we have black Billionaires and had a Black President. So we know a lot about defeating the odds/challenges. All we ask for is for the oppressors to move out of the way and let us live freely and equally. Is that too much to ask?

How are blacks still being oppressed? I'm not saying there's no more discrimination against blacks in society, but I don't see anything that white people are doing that is preventing black people from succeeding if they have the will to do so. On the other hand I see a lot of self-inflicted problems like 75% or something of black kids being born to single moms. That's just mind boggling to me. There's no way a culture like that can ever improve unless the root problem is solved.

 

[Moderator 10]

MODERATION INTERLUDE:

Please bare with me and excuse my limitations and faults. The following words hide no ill intentions or motives. Also most people here are rather smart and knows this, but in the heat of an argument feelings tend to take over reason.

There's a difference between "moderation" and "censorship". When the mod team doesn't censor a given opinion (either way) it doesn't mean it carries some sort of official "Neogaf seal of approval". It just means "freedom of speech" is been respected. Of course within the boundries of reasonable and respectful discourse. The examples where moderation has been strict exist and are there for everyone to see.

With that said if we censor everything you don't like or agree with or isn't "politicaly correct enough"to your standards then there's absolutely no point in threads such as these to exist or for users to create or interact with them.

So in this sense is up to the community to tackle and challenge the questionable ideas and expose them for what they are through debate, reason and logic instead of hiding them under the rug with censorship.

For what is worth take it as a "positive". The freedom to exchange and debate these ideas that might be unsettling or hard to digest at the least means there's some honest discussion happenening instead of everyone wearing a mask and just saying what is cultury acceptable at a given point in time.

Let's carry on with the thread and be a bit more mindfull of what we denounce through the report function. Thank you.

 

[SatansReverence]

So does racism just disappear because a bill is signed? And the Jews in America and Isreal absolutely talk about the Holocaust. Like ALL THE TIME! It's one of the reasons why they didn't want American Presidents to work with Iran over the years. Because the Prime Minister was a Holocaust denier.



Is racism in America an excuse for underachieving or a reason? Have some of you not realized that Black people had to create their own colleges, fraternties, TV Networks, Sporting Leagues, Banks, etc because we literally weren't allowed to be apart of any of those American institutions? Black Americans are literally the most "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" race in America. Everything we have is because we studied, worked, fought, died, etc hard for it. We went from America making it illegal to teach slaves how to read (1620s), to building and running our own Universities (Wilberforce University - 1856).

Now we have black Billionaires and had a Black President. So we know a lot about defeating the odds/challenges. All we ask for is for the oppressors to move out of the way and let us live freely and equally. Is that too much to ask?

So which is it? You've been overcoming the oppression for the last few hundred years or are still inescapably oppressed in 2018 because white people.

You quitr literally contradicted yourself because of your victim mentality and it is exactly wgat Kanye was talking about.

The only thing oppressing you in 2018 is yourself and anyone who supports your victim narrative.

M Moderator 10 I'm assuming users are back to using the report button as a dislike button.

 

[TrainedRage]

How is pulling yourself up by your boot straps a bad thing? I never got that.

"OTHER people should pull up YOUR boot straps"!? Nah, i'm gonna pass.

 

[mckmas8808]

How are blacks still being oppressed? I'm not saying there's no more discrimination against blacks in society, but I don't see anything that white people are doing that is preventing black people from succeeding if they have the will to do so. On the other hand I see a lot of self-inflicted problems like 75% or something of black kids being born to single moms. That's just mind boggling to me. There's no way a culture like that can ever improve unless the root problem is solved.

Have you ever heard of the term "The New Jim Crow"? Perhaps if the nation got rid of these New Jim Crow laws, more black men would be with their kids.

But you seem to bring this up as if it's some sort of moral dilemma that black people have. Like it's a morality issue and we are too wild and untamed to understand how we are destroying ourselves from the inside. And that's just not true.
Some of the reason that the number is 70% of black kids or born out of wed-lock is because more "married" black women are having less kids. So that makes the "unmarried" black women having kids % go up. That's just math. Compared to the past, when black women get married they are choosing to NOT have kids more than ever, whereas with white women when they get married they are having kids as normal. But since the 1960s married women have decided to have less and less kids. The drop from married women having kids is WAAAY bigger than the increase of un-wedded women having kids regardless of race.

It is important to realize that the "percent of births" is not a birth rate. The birth rate is the number of births for every 1,000 women in a specific category. The last marital birth rates calculated by the National Center for Health Statistics were for 2002. In 2002, the black marital birth rate was 64.9 births for every 1,000 married black women. The white marital birth rate was 88.2 for every 1,000 married white women. The black marital birth rate was 23.3 births less than the white rate. In the past, the black marital birth rate was higher than the white rate. Because there is such a low number of births among married black women, the percent of births to unmarried black women is especially high.

The percent of women ages 18 to 44 who were not married and have no children is higher for blacks than for whites. By my calculations from the American Community Survey, in 2006, 32.8 percent of white women in this age range were single without children. There were 6 percent more black women in this category, 38.8 percent. As recently as 1990, only 29.3 percent of black women in this age group were unmarried and without children.
Last year, scholars at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill reported that these single adults living alone were making up a larger share of the black middle class. Black middle-class adults, who in the past were married and with children, are now single and living alone. This development too is decreasing the number of marital births and therefore increasing the percent of births that are out-of-wedlock.

The changes in black family structure are far more complicated than most people realize. Few people know that there are three separate factors producing the high percent of births that are out-of-wedlock among blacks.

http://www.blacknews.com/news/thora_institute101.shtml#.Wuzo7sgvyUk

 

[Shiki_]

How is pulling yourself up by your boot straps a bad thing? I never got that.

"OTHER people should pull up YOUR boot straps"!? Nah, i'm gonna pass.

It's a noble sad situation, but the fact it happened by necessity because the existences of racists laws tell a lot how many things had to improve in the following years. You know, like the civil right movements.

 

[mckmas8808]

So which is it? You've been overcoming the oppression for the last few hundred years or are still inescapably oppressed in 2018 because white people.

You quitr literally contradicted yourself because of your victim mentality and it is exactly wgat Kanye was talking about.

The only thing oppressing you in 2018 is yourself and anyone who supports your victim narrative.

M Moderator 10 I'm assuming users are back to using the report button as a dislike button.

Both are true. We've overcome our previous oppression, yet there's still more work to do. It's not over is the point. And nobody said the oppression is inescapable. I literally said above that we have escape alot of it in the past and present. But we aren't going to sit here and allow laws and white supremacists to try to hold us back either. Luckily there are enough nice white people in the country that agree with that and are helping the cause. Because it's a human rights issue at the end of the day and not just a "black" issue.

 

[TrainedRage]

It's a noble sad situation, but the fact it happened by necessity because the existences of racists laws tell a lot how many things had to improve in the following years. You know, like the civil right movements.

I can agree with that. Its just hard to imagine how we will move past all this. Maybe we can come together by realizing we are all oppressed in some ways (obviously its a sliding scale) and we should strive for equality of opportunity.

 

[TrainedRage]

Both are true. We've overcome our previous oppression, yet there's still more work to do. It's not over is the point. And nobody said the oppression is inescapable. I literally said above that we have escape alot of it in the past and present. But we aren't going to sit here and allow laws and white supremacists to try to hold us back either. Luckily there are enough nice white people in the country that agree with that and are helping the cause. Because it's a human rights issue at the end of the day and not just a "black" issue.

That's a great sentiment. Honestly that thought gets lost in conversations like this when it should be at the forefront. I wish more people felt this.

 

[Vicetrailia]

That's a great sentiment. Honestly that thought gets lost in conversations like this when it should be at the forefront. I wish more people felt this.

It would be nice if you didn't say "well, what's in it for me" everytime an issue is brought up concerning a different group.

It's okay to admit that the rich are owning all of us, and that there are separate issues as well.

 

[Ke0]

A post similarly that was said on the new site, the left don't want to hear voices from PoC unless they fall in line with the leftist agenda.

That seems to be a thing for both of your political parties. I routinely see right wing people in America say blacks are "on the plantation" and other really fucked up statements if they vote or support democrats. I mean actually Kanye West is a great example. The right wing hated him when he used to say things about how problematic we (white people are), now he's one of a good ones because he's saying what other right wing folks say about black people.

Likewise, I imagine if a right wing Muslim said disparaging things about Muslims as a group, he or she would be embraced whereas if he or she said disparging things about right wing ideology, they'd be called all manner of things.

You guys really need proportional representation and to get rid of your first to the post system so you can have more viable parties, because both left and right wing act supporters act so much alike all the while going "lol look at those naz/libtards over there lol we're way better!"

 

[Dunki]

So does racism just disappear because a bill is signed? And the Jews in America and Isreal absolutely talk about the Holocaust. Like ALL THE TIME! It's one of the reasons why they didn't want American Presidents to work with Iran over the years. Because the Prime Minister was a Holocaust denier.

There is a difference between talking about it and use this as argument how oppressed black people still are. So what i understand of Owens is that she does not deny slavery but that she is fed up with playing the slavery victim card. She does not need it because she has no Victimhood complex like some people who use this race card on a constant basis when something does not go their way. And Jewish people do not do that at all.

Newest example the fat black women who blamed it on her race and body that she was removed from an airplance and not her really dickish behaviour and filming the white women next to her. Instead she cried that its all becasue she is black and also fat.

 

[Cato]

So does racism just disappear because a bill is signed? And the Jews in America and Isreal absolutely talk about the Holocaust. Like ALL THE TIME! It's one of the reasons why they didn't want American Presidents to work with Iran over the years. Because the Prime Minister was a Holocaust denier.

Jews in America is a poor example for your narrative.
Maybe some of them do talk a lot about the Holocaust and its horrors that were the culmination of centuries of ill treatment and oppression.
It is an important thing to talk about and be reminded of because it is the ultimate outcome of identity politics when taken to the extreme.

To be honest, slavery and discrimination was bad. We all agree. It was also bad when we vikings used to sell poor white folks to other white folks.
It was bad when brown people in the middle east captured, enslaved and cut of the genitals of male slave calling them enuchs.
It was bad all around. And we moved on.

No matter how sad the story of the american black slave was, in order of oppression, you are way below what happened to the Jews.
You do realize that the Jews were not just enslaved, there were actual large scale attempts of actual genocide.
It is really rich if you try to compare the Jews struggles with some, comparably, banal poor treatments of blacks in america hundreds of years ago.

Seriously, you have no idea of history if you say that. Yeah, I said it, american black slavery was bad but pales in comparasion with what the Jews
had to live through during the millenias.


A big difference between american blacks and the Jews is that the latter did not use the past injustices to excuse current cultural failures.
The Jews, on average, do not make up excuses for todays failures based on historical wrongs. They dig in, improve themselves, overcome and succeed.
Those are very good traits that every group in society should strive for. Blacks in america should try to emulate the rise and overcoming of struggle that the
Jews showed and stop whining about history all the time.

You do realize that while the Jews had struggles and oppressions that are magnitudes worse than anything that the american blacks ever encountered,
instead of adapting a perpetual victim complex, they overcame and they succeeded.
We should all try to be more like Jews and less like the Blacks.

 

[Punchpudding]

I finally actually watched some of these interviews with Kanye and I don't get the feeling he is a full blown Trump supporter. I get the feeling he wants to do for black and white America what Trump did for North and South Korea.

 

[JDB]

I finally actually watched some of these interviews with Kanye and I don't get the feeling he is a full blown Trump supporter. I get the feeling he wants to do for black and white America what Trump did for North and South Korea.

This legitimately made me laugh.

 

[Vicetrailia]

Jews in America is a poor example for your narrative.
Maybe some of them do talk a lot about the Holocaust and its horrors that were the culmination of centuries of ill treatment and oppression.
It is an important thing to talk about and be reminded of because it is the ultimate outcome of identity politics when taken to the extreme.

To be honest, slavery and discrimination was bad. We all agree. It was also bad when we vikings used to sell poor white folks to other white folks.
It was bad when brown people in the middle east captured, enslaved and cut of the genitals of male slave calling them enuchs.
It was bad all around. And we moved on.

No matter how sad the story of the american black slave was, in order of oppression, you are way below what happened to the Jews.
You do realize that the Jews were not just enslaved, there were actual large scale attempts of actual genocide.
It is really rich if you try to compare the Jews struggles with some, comparably, banal poor treatments of blacks in america hundreds of years ago.

Seriously, you have no idea of history if you say that. Yeah, I said it, american black slavery was bad but pales in comparasion with what the Jews
had to live through during the millenias.


A big difference between american blacks and the Jews is that the latter did not use the past injustices to excuse current cultural failures.
The Jews, on average, do not make up excuses for todays failures based on historical wrongs. They dig in, improve themselves, overcome and succeed.
Those are very good traits that every group in society should strive for. Blacks in america should try to emulate the rise and overcoming of struggle that the
Jews showed and stop whining about history all the time.

You do realize that while the Jews had struggles and oppressions that are magnitudes worse than anything that the american blacks ever encountered,
instead of adapting a perpetual victim complex, they overcame and they succeeded.
We should all try to be more like Jews and less like the Blacks.

Nope. We shouldn't do the comparative suffering game, and resort to stereotyping to spread a narrative. What's important is that 370 years of the slave trade has generational consequences of deep structural inequality, poverty, discrimination, and more that's not yet dead. We work to improve that, and per every American strive to succeed.

 

[Blood Borne]

Black people still deal with lingering issues from Jim Crow, defacto and dejure discrimination, the cycle of poverty and more. They want to eliminate those issues to further equality of opportunity.

You wonder why black people can't do the same, but yet they are. The difference is that you get mad about it when black people talk about it. As if talking about things is victimization.

Owens is apparently a commentator for white people, not actually black people. What Kanye said about having Michael Jordan rather than Harriet Tubman on the $20 makes sense even though it's still off-base, while Candace would say some zany shit that black people would scoff at.

I like how you know more about being black than black people.

 

[RokkanStoned]

I dislike the use of "The Left" and such things in titles, as I do believe there are tons of left-wing people not caring at all, but staying mostly silent.

The whole Kanye West thing should've been "ooookay, whatever" and people should've moved on. "Wow, some famous person who's black said he liked this right-wing thing, better make a big deal out of it" is a thing I really dislike in regards to American politics. Especially when it's Kanye West and a guy who most likely views self-empowerment as a big reason behind his own achievements, it shouldn't be a big deal that gets taken way out of proportions. It just feeds the whole "fall in line" rhetoric and further just makes Hollywood and the black community seem like a homogenous monolith. It basically feeds the "us vs them" narrative.


Kanye, I give you the O.K., you can support whoever you want. Your welcome.

 

[Dr. Claus]

I dislike the use of "The Left" and such things in titles, as I do believe there are tons of left-wing people not caring at all, but staying mostly silent.

The whole Kanye West thing should've been "ooookay, whatever" and people should've moved on. "Wow, some famous person who's black said he liked this right-wing thing, better make a big deal out of it" is a thing I really dislike in regards to American politics. Especially when it's Kanye West and a guy who most likely views self-empowerment as a big reason behind his own achievements, it shouldn't be a big deal that gets taken way out of proportions. It just feeds the whole "fall in line" rhetoric and further just makes Hollywood and the black community seem like a homogenous monolith. It basically feeds the "us vs them" narrative.


Kanye, I give you the O.K., you can support whoever you want. Your welcome.

Agreed, but I think it was trying to insinuate that "the left" in this case is the "far left" or "authoritarian left". Though I wouldn't mind a mod changing the title to "far-left freak out..."

 

[Shiki_]

You do realize that while the Jews had struggles and oppressions that are magnitudes worse than anything that the american blacks ever encountered,
instead of adapting a perpetual victim complex, they overcame and they succeeded.
We should all try to be more like Jews and less like the Blacks.

I don't know what think it's worse, the fact you think black people are just crying about victim complex, the fact you downplay the racism in USA or the fact to try to compare the struggles of jew people from Nazis persecution and the black people from white supremacy in the USA when both are really horrible events.

He's a thing: in Germany the goverment and social groups are really aware of the Holocaust and they are determined to don't forget the events or even try to downplay it. There's a term even for such action: Vergangenheitsbewältigung.

Vergangenheitsbewältigung

describes the attempt to analyze, digest and learn to live with the past, in particular the Holocaust.

In the USA, have the president Trump commented something about the opening of the The National Memorial for Peace and Justice, which intent to commemorate the victims of lynching in the United States? No. I think actual USA goverment isn't interested in remember those atrocities.

Source

Lynching in the USA was something horrible, it was source of entertainment in the form of souvenirs and postcards. Not even the Nazis trying to make the Holocaust something to witness, something to make fun.

Source

But well, I will go back to talk about what jew communities do, but now in the USA. They are really good to identify anti-semist rethoric, and they will dennounce loudly when the goverment fail to answer to it, like the poor response from President Trump regarding Charlottesville's rally. They have also a "perpetual victim complexity" when they arise such problems, too? Hell no. And neither black people are.

 

[Ke0]

Really weird to say black people need to get over it by saying look what Nazi did the Jewish people, considering the Nazi got the idea of inhumane treatment from America's treatment of black people.

Really does your country not teach you guys anything about your own history?

 

[Moneal]

Really weird to say black people need to get over it by saying look what Nazi did the Jewish people, considering the Nazi got the idea of inhumane treatment from America's treatment of black people.

Really does your country not teach you guys anything about your own history?

Yea nope. Not even close might want to read some on German philosophers that had been going on and on about the extermination of the Jews since before Marx. or maybe the historical treatment and attitude of Jews in Europe before the trans Atlantic slave trade.

 

[bucyou]

Really weird to say black people need to get over it by saying look what Nazi did the Jewish people, considering the Nazi got the idea of inhumane treatment from America's treatment of black people.

Really does your country not teach you guys anything about your own history?

Might want to make sure you're correct before going the condescending route.

 

[Ke0]

Might want to make sure you're correct before going the condescending route.

The Nazi used America's racial laws and eugenics as one of the foundations for the treatment of Jewish people under his regime. Edwin Black wrote a book on it.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/04/30/how-american-racism-influenced-hitler
https://historynewsnetwork.org/article/1796
https://www.dnalc.org/view/15466-Th...n-eugenics-and-Nazi-Germany-James-Watson.html
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2004/feb/06/race.usa
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1299061/

We were taught this in secondary school, though I guess our countries have always been quick to teach about the atrocities of other countries, while omitting our own. UK is pretty guilty of that too tbh

 

[Moneal]

The Nazi used America's racial laws and eugenics as one of the foundations for the treatment of Jewish people under his regime. Edwin Black wrote a book on it.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/04/30/how-american-racism-influenced-hitler
https://historynewsnetwork.org/article/1796
https://www.dnalc.org/view/15466-Th...n-eugenics-and-Nazi-Germany-James-Watson.html
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2004/feb/06/race.usa
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1299061/

We were taught this in secondary school, though I guess our countries have always been quick to teach about the atrocities of other countries, while omitting our own. UK is pretty guilty of that too tbh

Those dont say he got the idea of inhumane treatment from america's treatment of blacks, more that he got the laws of segregation and second class citizenship. The idea came from the antisemetic philosophers from germany's past and the attitude of antisemitism that existed in europe since the middle ages.

 

[SatansReverence]

Agreed, but I think it was trying to insinuate that "the left" in this case is the "far left" or "authoritarian left". Though I wouldn't mind a mod changing the title to "far-left freak out..."

Agreed.

The vast majority of this board is still left leaning but this outrage is from the looney far left and that should be reflected in the thread title.

 

[mckmas8808]

Jews in America is a poor example for your narrative.
Maybe some of them do talk a lot about the Holocaust and its horrors that were the culmination of centuries of ill treatment and oppression.
It is an important thing to talk about and be reminded of because it is the ultimate outcome of identity politics when taken to the extreme.

To be honest, slavery and discrimination was bad. We all agree. It was also bad when we vikings used to sell poor white folks to other white folks.
It was bad when brown people in the middle east captured, enslaved and cut of the genitals of male slave calling them enuchs.
It was bad all around. And we moved on.

No matter how sad the story of the american black slave was, in order of oppression, you are way below what happened to the Jews.
You do realize that the Jews were not just enslaved, there were actual large scale attempts of actual genocide.
It is really rich if you try to compare the Jews struggles with some, comparably, banal poor treatments of blacks in america hundreds of years ago.

Seriously, you have no idea of history if you say that. Yeah, I said it, american black slavery was bad but pales in comparasion with what the Jews
had to live through during the millenias.


A big difference between american blacks and the Jews is that the latter did not use the past injustices to excuse current cultural failures.
The Jews, on average, do not make up excuses for todays failures based on historical wrongs. They dig in, improve themselves, overcome and succeed.
Those are very good traits that every group in society should strive for. Blacks in america should try to emulate the rise and overcoming of struggle that the
Jews showed and stop whining about history all the time.

You do realize that while the Jews had struggles and oppressions that are magnitudes worse than anything that the american blacks ever encountered,
instead of adapting a perpetual victim complex, they overcame and they succeeded.
We should all try to be more like Jews and less like the Blacks.

This might be the worse post in this thread. I have no clue where to start or end. I just decided to bold the parts that were head-scratching. This is why we in the black community will never stop pointing out issues in this country. Because clearly there's enough people that don't actually understand what racism is or what has been done in this country.

I dislike the use of "The Left" and such things in titles, as I do believe there are tons of left-wing people not caring at all, but staying mostly silent.

The whole Kanye West thing should've been "ooookay, whatever" and people should've moved on. "Wow, some famous person who's black said he liked this right-wing thing, better make a big deal out of it" is a thing I really dislike in regards to American politics. Especially when it's Kanye West and a guy who most likely views self-empowerment as a big reason behind his own achievements, it shouldn't be a big deal that gets taken way out of proportions. It just feeds the whole "fall in line" rhetoric and further just makes Hollywood and the black community seem like a homogenous monolith. It basically feeds the "us vs them" narrative.


Kanye, I give you the O.K., you can support whoever you want. Your welcome.

Good points, but the issue starts when you know Kanye the artist said when he first started. The people that are the most upset at him are the ones that he's distancing himself away from the most. You can't get rich off the backs of a certain fanbase and then 15 years later say stuff that's 100% different and expect them to not care.

 

[BANGS]

This is why we in the black community will never stop pointing out issues in this country. Because clearly there's enough people that don't actually understand what racism is

Only black people know what racism is now? LMFAO gtfoh

 

[mckmas8808]

Only black people know what racism is now? LMFAO gtfoh

If someone says something like this.....

A big difference between american blacks and the Jews is that the latter did not use the past injustices to excuse current cultural failures.
The Jews, on average, do not make up excuses for todays failures based on historical wrongs. They dig in, improve themselves, overcome and succeed.
Those are very good traits that every group in society should strive for. Blacks in america should try to emulate the rise and overcoming of struggle that the
Jews showed and stop whining about history all the time.

You do realize that while the Jews had struggles and oppressions that are magnitudes worse than anything that the american blacks ever encountered,
instead of adapting a perpetual victim complex, they overcame and they succeeded.
We should all try to be more like Jews and less like the Blacks.

That tells me they have zero clue to the black experience in America from 1609 to today. Dude probably needs to check out the new African American Museum in D.C. and learn something.

 

[PerezDeCorcho]

Always disliked him, his music and personality. Now it's doubly so.

What a pathetic outlook. What ever happened to "agree to disagree"?

 

[jrush64]

At least this place is transforming into The_Donald. Amazing how they all hate rappers up until the point rapper agree with them.

 

[Tired-Of-Winning]

Cant spell Left/Liberals without the L. Whenever someone doesnt share their opinion its instantly wrong-think

 

[Dr. Claus]

If someone says something like this.....



That tells me they have zero clue to the black experience in America from 1609 to today. Dude probably needs to check out the new African American Museum in D.C. and learn something.

It is easy to conflate the issues that trouble sections of the American population if you rely solely on particular aspects of the media (whether that be social, certain corners of the internet, or cable news channels). Depending on what you view and where you live, it could be very easy to see that certain small portions of the black community complain specifically about the past (such as slavery) instead of present day issues and how to deal with/fix them. They then attribute this to the whole community. As an example, it is like thinking that the alt-right is the entire republican base, or that all liberals are the far-left.

That is where I think the poster you are responding to is getting confused. They attribute the smaller portions of the black community that make these petty, disingenuous complaints to the whole - not the genuine issues or concerns that many still face today. They also see the Jewish community as a good example of a victimized group that has "moved on" from their past issues (though there are still a good minority of that community that does the same as the aforementioned minority inside the greater black community).

Though the idea of "who had it worse" is quite silly between the Jewish and Black American communities. We don't need to push some competition for who suffered the worst.

Pardon if this is worded confusingly, have the flu and am on medication.

 

[mckmas8808]

It is easy to conflate the issues that trouble sections of the American population if you rely solely on particular aspects of the media (whether that be social, certain corners of the internet, or cable news channels). Depending on what you view and where you live, it could be very easy to see that certain small portions of the black community complain specifically about the past (such as slavery) instead of present day issues and how to deal with/fix them. They then attribute this to the whole community. As an example, it is like thinking that the alt-right is the entire republican base, or that all liberals are the far-left.

That is where I think the poster you are responding to is getting confused. They attribute the smaller portions of the black community that make these petty, disingenuous complaints to the whole - not the genuine issues or concerns that many still face today. They also see the Jewish community as a good example of a victimized group that has "moved on" from their past issues (though there are still a good minority of that community that does the same as the aforementioned minority inside the greater black community).

Though the idea of "who had it worse" is quite silly between the Jewish and Black American communities. We don't need to push some competition for who suffered the worst.

Pardon if this is worded confusingly, have the flu and am on medication.

You couldn't have said any of this better. It was perfect.

 

[Big4reel]

Well I think its brave of him to stand up for what he believes in.

Not sure why people are accusing him of being alt right though

 

[Crazyorloco]

The problem I have with people that say things like this, is that you are suggesting that if a rapper or a black person says something pro-Trump it means they are "speaking their mind" with "no fear". Whereas a guy like J. Cole or Kendrick Lamar don't get that same credit. You think they are following the masses because they are saying things that liberals typically say.

People like camelCase won't give credit to people like Colin Kaepernick for speaking their mind and being brave because they can't (as he puts it) "see past their own race card". And some of you guys are really telling on yourselves with the things that you are saying. And I appreciate you doing so. Don't hide that bias. Keep letting it flow.

Allow me a chance to clarify then. I actually like what J Cole and Kendrick talk about, but I don't see it their views as being as controversial as wearing a hat that stands something "evil" according to some. Changing what people think of that hat. Making people think. I think what Kanye was trying to do is allow it to be ok to like certain things about someone and not agree with everything about them. Things are not so black and white, and that's fine.

I do understand why people would be super-anti trump, and that's fine too.

 

[nemiroff]

I find it rather tragicomical that Kanye's basic message about love and free thinking receives so much misunderstanding and hate out there.

I watched a few interviews with the guy (I knew almost nothing about him, not my kind of music, so I was curious). I found that he's not always very precise in his language, and it often leads to lots of misinterpretations, especially from the left in this case. Anyway, when Kanye said that thing about "400 years of slavery sounds like a choice" (not what he said..), I didn't find it that hard to understand what he meant. There were a couple of obvious reasons for that; His actual words where different than some of the misinterpreted quotes, and moreover, in the full clip the host actually asked him what he meant by what he said, and then KW went on to do exactly that.

Kanye: "I only want people to think for themselves and to love each other"
Response from the liberal media: "Kanye West is an asshole!"

Fascinating stuff..

 

[mckmas8808]

I find it rather tragicomical that Kanye's basic message about love and free thinking receives so much misunderstanding and hate out there.

I watched a few interviews with the guy (I knew almost nothing about him, not my kind of music, so I was curious). I found that he's not always very precise in his language, and it often leads to lots of misinterpretations, especially from the left in this case. Anyway, when Kanye said that thing about "400 years of slavery sounds like a choice" (not what he said..), I didn't find it that hard to understand what he meant. There were a couple of obvious reasons for that; His actual words where different than some of the misinterpreted quotes, and moreover, in the full clip the host actually asked him what he meant by what he said, and then KW went on to do exactly that.

Kanye: "I only want people to think for themselves and to love each other"
Response from the liberal media: "Kanye West is an asshole!"

Fascinating stuff..

It's the job of the communicator to clearly explain what they are saying. The words slavery and choice should never be used together. Especially since they are polar opposites. How does the number 400 make sense if he also wasn't lumping in actual slaves into the equation?