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The longest generation; will the WiiU lengthen it further?
- Thread starter Ocaso
- Start date
specialguy
Banned
nope.
the wii u would actually hasten the gen's demise if it was more powerful. thus putting pressure on sony/ms.
people dont realize this gen only lasted so long cause it uniquely could. wont happen again imo.
lets say wii u is a huge failure as i think, and nintendo makes a brand new more powerful box in 2015. that means ms/sony will be feeling pressure before long next gen...and it will be shorter.
or lets say for discussion, ps4 is a big flop and sony goes back to drawing board quickly. or ms.
anytime you dont have three reasonably healthy consoles, the gen is going to be shorter.
the wii u would actually hasten the gen's demise if it was more powerful. thus putting pressure on sony/ms.
people dont realize this gen only lasted so long cause it uniquely could. wont happen again imo.
lets say wii u is a huge failure as i think, and nintendo makes a brand new more powerful box in 2015. that means ms/sony will be feeling pressure before long next gen...and it will be shorter.
or lets say for discussion, ps4 is a big flop and sony goes back to drawing board quickly. or ms.
anytime you dont have three reasonably healthy consoles, the gen is going to be shorter.
IceDoesntHelp
Banned
Just because its comparable to current gen, does NOT make it a current gen system. The Wii is part of this generation, the Wii U is the start of the next generation.
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
No, there will be no delays because of Wii U, although PS3 and Xbox 360 will continue getting software for years thanks to them all being so close in specs.
Mr. B Natural
Member
The WiiU will TRY to extend the life of this generation. I don't see it working but it might.
Rollo Lawson
Banned
So WiiU is not the start of next gen?
Serious question
Serious question
hey_it's_that_dog
benevolent sexism
Bayonetta was a niche title that sold decently on 2 consoles with large install bases. Aside from the intense GAF fervor over the announcement, what makes you think Bayonetta 2 will have a substantial impact on Wii U sales? It may have sparked a huge thread on GAF, but don't mistake that for a pervasive interest among the general public.
I know this is probably debated in every Wii U thread, but "next gen" really only has useful meaning if it connotes significantly better specs. Maybe new input methods count towards something being "next gen" but if Sony and MS revealed new consoles a year after Wii U and they had totally different input methods than we are used to, would that be yet another generation marker? I don't think so. The most meaningful way to define a generation is by hardware specifications. That might change in the future, but in the past we have lumped consoles together by comparable specs. Do people have a big problem when someone calls the Wii "last gen tech"?
Spieler Eins
Member
It is. WiiU is the machine that will compete with PS4 and 720 soon over a certain period of time (aka generation...).
It is the next generation of nintendo consoles that will compete with the next generation of sony consoles and the next generation of microsoft consoles.
Obviously there are people that think it won't compete well, but that doesn't mean it's not a part of next gen.
2014 sounds like a good plan for Sony and MS.
hey_it's_that_dog
benevolent sexism
I see how this definition can work, but marking generations purely by time doesn't communicate what is important about generations to gamers, which I think is the leap in hardware specs. People get excited about new hardware specs. I rarely hear anyone say "I can't wait for another batch of disappointing launch titles!" Sure, there are always some people who are hankering for new hardware with new games regardless of the specs, but I think specs are what stand out for most people and what prompt the desire to upgrade. I could be wrong on that, it's an empirical question.
People get excited by the hardware specs because of the promise of games that use them, not the specs themselves.
People say "I can't wait to get a console which will have new games that I can't play on my previous one", not "I can't wait for 8GB of RAM".
Spieler Eins
Member
Generation is a time-related term, it doesn't matter what ,,gamers'' think. That's just how it is. If the thing uses last generation hardware, that's a different subject. Could be an 8Bit consoles, but if it's the main console they are providing for in the next 5 years to compete with rival products, it's still part of the next gen.
The whole next gen term is completely over- and misused for sensationalism on video game sites.
Which basically means, video game journalism is so bad, it literally makes people dumber. :lol
Rollo Lawson
Banned
It's definitely flawed. Like how this gen is the so called 7th, but it was started by the 360...which is only the 2nd gen xbox. The WiiU being the next Nintendo...by tradition that begins a new generation of consoles. But onLive released a console as well...how does that work? Or the Ouya?
specialguy
Banned
uhh, it's overall "generations" not one specific company.
And boxes that have no popularity or arent even real consoles (ouya, Onlive) dont count
Grok4Spock
Member
There are those who will never get to play Bayonetta 2 simply because Nintendo is the bane of their existence, but one the acceptance stage of their grief has set in there are a lot of bayo fans that might very well realize they have no choice but to get Wii U if they want to play.
Surprise, surprise.. Another specs=next gen post. Since the NES, there has been no major console maker that released 2 consoles in the same console cycle(revisions don't count), and Wii U is no different. Trying to call Wii U current gen, or last gen is just another way to diminish what it does bring to the table. Wii U is the follow up to Wii, therefore it is part of a new console cycle. New console cycle=new generation.
> 1.35 million sales is now "niche" and just selling "decently" ?
I think you're underestimating it a bit.
specialguy
Banned
nope. i think it's independent of any company...
Very simply:
1st: Atari 2600, Colecovision etc
2nd: NES, SMS
3rd: SNES, Genesis, TG-16
4th PS1, N64, Saturn
5th PS2, Dreamcast, Xbox, Gamecube
6th 360, PS3, Wii
7th Wii U, PS4, Xb720
michaelius
Banned
Only if they are suicidal.
Market is so saturated with backlogs and second hand software that it has dire repercussions on software sale numbers as shown through all 2012 so far.
Market is so saturated with backlogs and second hand software that it has dire repercussions on software sale numbers as shown through all 2012 so far.
OnLive didn't release a console. They just released a box that let you remotely control PC games running on a computer over the internet. Ouya probably fits in its own category since it is built around mobile/tablet tech and software.
You missed a generation of consoles. There were two before the NES, with the first generation of consoles taking place before the 2600 released. 360/PS3/Wii are seventh generation consoles. Wii U will be the start of the eighth generation.
EDIT: Magnavox Odyssey was a first generation console. It came out in the early 70s.
I never bought a Wii & I don't plan buying a Wii U. I don't feel like I'm missing anything by skipping out on a console that is a technical generation behind. The Next Xbox will show us what to expect from the future.
theviolenthero
Member
The X360 sold 1.7 million systems last November at a $200 base price.
The X360 sold 1.7 million systems last December at a $200 base price.
The PS3 sold 900k last November at a $250 base price.
They didn't release sales for December 2011.
If they can at least match those sales this fall with price drops then 2014 is when we'll see their next gen systems.
The X360 sold 1.7 million systems last December at a $200 base price.
The PS3 sold 900k last November at a $250 base price.
They didn't release sales for December 2011.
If they can at least match those sales this fall with price drops then 2014 is when we'll see their next gen systems.
Intentions? You mean interesting discussion? Perhaps the TL;DR was a mistake.
The concepts are intimately related. If the hardware truly is similar, software makers have an added incentive to continue development for current-gen specs. If software support remains healthy, it may be in everyone's best interest to keep the focus on 360/PS3 along with WiiU.
As others have pointed out, that this is Nintendo's next-generation offering is irrelevant with regards to the question. If developers treat it and develop for it as they do for the 360/PS3, it will compete with the 360/PS3 for as long as those remain viable platforms. That is question: will the WiiU's release prolong the viability of the 360/PS3?
SatelliteOfLove
Member
Depends on if the AAA
market on the new systems is stillborn or not.
AAAAAAA
I think this is a fascinating proposition, that the WiiU might coexist with the 360/PS3 for a full two years, one with strange repercussions and potential benefits for everyone involved. Software developers get an even bigger installed base to develop for, including one more console on which sales can offset the costs of developers. MS and Sony, who at this point can profit from both console sales and software licensing costs, avoid the potential losses of introducing new hardware (at least for a while) as they continue to benefit from their large installed bases, and gamers get to squeeze more life from their purchases. Indeed, I wouldn't be surprised if MS and Sony opted to implement optional Vita and SmartGlass functionality to their hardwares in order to replicate some of the WiiU's functionality. Nintendo would, of course, benefit from being the only new hardware in town, and one with tons of support and, as I mentioned in the OP, possibly the best versions of third party software. That is, perhaps, what I think might make this scenario least plausible, that MS and Sony wouldn't want Nintendo to become exclusive home to the best versions of third party software.
ColdBlooder
Banned
No because assuming Wii U is only a tad more powerful than current gen by judging launch windows games(!) were devs won´t put any extra effort on because the hardware has no user base yet, is retarded!
(And Nintendo has no "visual showcase" yet because not all games will receive an AAA budget according to Iwata)
Nightstick11
Banned
If Microsoft and Sony are going to be foolish enough to delay their entrants into the next generation until 2014, they can enjoy looking at Nintendo amassing 15 million units sold before they even have a chance to print master copies of their launch games.
I personally hope Sony moves away from the "loss-leading" model they've been using since PSP.
I personally hope Sony moves away from the "loss-leading" model they've been using since PSP.
Evolution_1ne
Banned
Evolution_1ne
Banned
they've been loss leading since they entered gaming...
Yeah I think PS360 and Wii U will help each other get some software support even into 2015. That is already a very extended generation. So yes Wii U will extend the life of this generation but it won't delay the birth of the next generation.
ChiefofCitadelSecurity
Member
Hope so, end this shit MS.
Phonomezer
Banned
No, it really doesn't, and I don't want to wait until 2014 for next-gen consoles.
Smiles and Cries
Member
we can make everyone happy by following these rules:
Last Gen = Wii/PS3/360
Current Gen = Wii U
Next Gen = PS4/720
There is quite literally no such thing as "that's just how it is" in terms of language communicating information. Generation means what the people involved in the conversation understand it to mean in the context of the discussion, no more and no less, it is not some fixed constant throughout eternity ever unchanging it is DECIDED by everyone who uses the term in their daily conversations and yes, They very often use it to refer to a generation of hardware performance in large part because it is a definition that carries the most useful information. Get over it.
But if we follow that, how can they troll Nintendo? >.<
Smiles and Cries
Member
they will have to wait until 2014
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
One thing I don't get is why some are expecting next gen to be shorter than this one, and consider this one a freak accident.
With rising costs, development bloat, increasingly entrenched digital services across generations, and the basic fact of diminishing graphical returns as 3D visuals get more and more complete in terms of features... do people really expect it is feasible, and desirable, for next gen to "start looking old" three or four years in?
That Sony and MS, nevermind Nintendo, will be feeling heat to ring in next-next gen?
This gen lasted so long because hardware was sophisticated enough to supply games with great graphics and production values for years, and because online services gave people a reason to continue to play games beyond merely how powerful the hardware is. I don't think this gen was an accident, it was an evolution.
More and more, it's looking like if you want to chase hardware upgrades, you should go PC and stay on the cutting edge every year. Consoles are not the devices you buy for staying on the edge, but for standard specs, convenience, and a single investment lasting for years while providing decent median of quality in software and performance.
With rising costs, development bloat, increasingly entrenched digital services across generations, and the basic fact of diminishing graphical returns as 3D visuals get more and more complete in terms of features... do people really expect it is feasible, and desirable, for next gen to "start looking old" three or four years in?
That Sony and MS, nevermind Nintendo, will be feeling heat to ring in next-next gen?
This gen lasted so long because hardware was sophisticated enough to supply games with great graphics and production values for years, and because online services gave people a reason to continue to play games beyond merely how powerful the hardware is. I don't think this gen was an accident, it was an evolution.
More and more, it's looking like if you want to chase hardware upgrades, you should go PC and stay on the cutting edge every year. Consoles are not the devices you buy for staying on the edge, but for standard specs, convenience, and a single investment lasting for years while providing decent median of quality in software and performance.
I think you're oversimplifying in trying to define what consoles are about and it seems like the rest of your logic follows a lot from that oversimplification.
IMO this generation needs to be extended for the sake of the industry. Hardware costs need to come down, as do development costs. Shit isn't selling well right now. Game and Hardware prices need to come further down so the industry can survive on more than a few blockbuster successes to drive development of all their other IPs.
Wafflecakes
Member
Love the fools on GAF who think generations have anything to do with power or graphics. I don't care blue it makes your balls......Wii U is next generation.
The ports will last for like...a year. Then it will be same situation as the Wii.
The ports will last for like...a year. Then it will be same situation as the Wii.
Projectjustice
Banned
Next Gen starts 11/18. Thought you would like to know.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I'm going off what developers themselves have said about this gen, about costs, about the challenges of changing generations.
And what are consoles about now? Their utility has objectively changed a lot this generation. They are much more focused on services and being social / media hubs.
Given the challenges that have been faced this generation, I don't see how a significantly shorter next generation would be so great. Unless consoles move into the realm of being truly linear upgrades, where you are just replacing the box that runs the same software and services without an interruption. Essentially cheap gaming PCs in a single package.
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