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[BGBW]

So
1. I have to buy two systems to play games rather than one like I could before.
2. I have to juggle two systems when I'm out and about to play game when before I could just hold one. Imagine that on a bus, holding phone in one hand, controller in another. Yeah brilliant(!)

Awful awful awful.

 

[MEsoJD]

I think it's a great idea! These new phones are usually more powerful than Nintendos handhelds anyway. I use my DS3 with a phone mount and play games just as well dedicated gaming devices.

 

[1st Course]

That's a incorrect deduction you have there you stated it' fine for the Playstation brand to decline because console industry expanded. While using that as counter to handhelds ignoring the fact the console industry has also massively contracted (the wii audience isn't coming back) so in absolute terms that line of thought really doesn't make sense. Also on track doesn't really mean anything the 3DS was beating the DS for a long while, we know how that turned out. We still need two years to get better estimate of the overall market.

I understand your point but that argument on it's own isn't a logical conclusion you need more factors than that.

3DS sales already shown big decline from last year, both in US and Japan. The thing is never going to sell as much as the DS, even GBA numbers are doubtful at this point.

And yes I agree that the console market as whole will diminish because of the Wii. Didn't thought that very well I admit.

 

[Dr. Buni]

No, it totally shouldn't. The next Nintendo handheld should be the next Nintendo home console. An hybrid.

 

[stevil]

This is not 2010 anymore. No one buy shit on mobile anymore, it's all about F2P games with IAPs now. The top mobile games make billions of $$$ from IAPs. Games like Candy Crush and Clash of Clans make GTA level revenue.

this is what I mean, really no businesses for Nintendo. Unless they make free to play Mario games where you can bu booster packs for mushrooms and bananas. But even than a controller for mobile is a stupid idea

 

[Storm Kyleis]

The "Nintendo should go third party" argument again.

Maybe it looks simple -- "you take a developer and he does the thing on a popular platform, where's the downside?". Their revenues, their budgets, their investors, their creative talents and their creative freedom are there because they make hardware, they have control over them, and they make long term profits out of them. Dropping your own system to focus on a competitor's system is a suicide.

 

[Yoshi]

That's a fantastic idea, provided Nintendo wants to lose me as a customer .

 

[elyetis]

Not to be offensive, but I think it's closed minded to not see where the future is heading. Cell phones are only going to become more and more important in our lives, and people don't want dedicated devices anymore.

I'm not a Nintendo shareholder, I want good games.

 

[Principate]

3DS sales already shown big decline from last year, both in US and Japan. The thing is never going to sell as much as the DS, even GBA numbers are doubtful at this point.

And yes I agree that the console market as whole will diminish because of the Wii. Didn't thought that very well I admit.

My argument there wasn't really that, more that it wasn't exactly a sure fire thing the PS4 XB1 final install base be equal or greater than the PS3 X360.

 

[kinggroin]

No one wants to carry two things around with them. So now, they only have to carry two things!

 

[1st Course]

My argument there wasn't really that, more that it wasn't exactly a sure fire thing the PS4 XB1 final install base be equal or greater than the PS3 X360.

Agreed. No one know for sure, the consoles just launched.

 

[ExFalsoQuodlibet]

And it should be a requirement to play their games on said operating systems.

This solves many problems:

- Nintendo uses the app market to their favor, instead of slowly letting phones take over the space
- It opens them up to a MASSIVE market... One that I'm sure would buy Mario Kart
- Removes cost of dedicated hardware
- Keeps touch screen aspects of their games
- Creates a standard controller with a big name behind it, something 3rd parties would love
- Allows them to utilize a cell phone connection without having to charge another service fee

And so on... I can just see a device like this bundled with New Super Mario Bros or Mario Kart selling a billion units.

Anyone agree? Disagree?

I agree-ish, but it's not possible in the terms you're suggesting on iOS because Apple doesn't allow games to require external controllers to be played, but if you drop the requirement it's fine. Actually, why a controller should be a requirement in any case? And why the very Nintendo controller should be required? Maybe someone makes a better controller for the same games. As you can see your scenario basically leads to a simpler "make games for mobile platforms" end, and this doesn't seem a very good solution for Nintendo on the long term, if they don't want to downgrade themselves to a simpler software company with a side of hardware with low relevancy.

 

[stevil]

Not to be offensive, but I think it's closed minded to not see where the future is heading. Cell phones are only going to become more and more important in our lives, and people don't want dedicated devices anymore.

I think there will be a (niche) market for dedicated gaming devices in the years to come. It might not be as big a market as it is now but if there is money to be made there will be companies providing goods. Perhaps not the AAA games from yesteryear's but look at the PSV lots of indy and niche games sell really well on this platform. If you look at other industries that are upset by new technology/business models the old once survive for a long time (although the market will be smaller), for instance even to day you are able to buy new records in many different genres.

What this means for Nintendo is that they have find new ways to stay relevant or reinvent gaming as we know is. But I can imagine they could stay a relatively big portable game company and perhaps third party on other platforms. Or a big venture capitalist firm will buy a big stake and force Nintendo to sell it self

 

[Ascenion]

 

[Malio]

Once I find a phone game that's worthy, sure.

...waiting.

 

[Interceptor]

I think the next Mercedes should be steering wheel for a motorbike. Bikes are way faster than cars and won't take as much space. Dont force me to buy a a car just to get a steering wheel Mercedes!

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

Fun fact: with the exception of the Wii and the DS, every Nintendo home console has sold worse than the previous one and every Nintendo handheld has sold worse than the previous one. What reason is there to believe that Nintendo's next handheld will sell as well as the 3DS?

Fun fact: with the exception of the PS2, every Sony console has sold worse than the previous one and every Sony handheld has sold worse than the previous one. What reason is there to believe the PS4 will sell as well as the PS3?

 

[jts]

I think the next Mercedes should be steering wheel for a motorbike. Bikes are way faster than cars and won't take as much space. Dont force me to buy a a car just to get a steering wheel Mercedes!

Plus all the kids riding a hand me down bike these days!

 

[stilgar]

That is "invade Russia in the Winter" level of bad idea.

Lol not bad

 

[7DollarHagane]

I think if anything this should be a "third pillar" type experiment like the DS was. If it takes off, good. If not, fine.

But ouside of that no, they should continue making their own high quality handhelds and hardware.

 

[Storm Kyleis]

Fun fact: with the exception of the Wii and the DS, every Nintendo home console has sold worse than the previous one and every Nintendo handheld has sold worse than the previous one. What reason is there to believe that Nintendo's next handheld will sell as well as the 3DS?

I still fail to understand the logic by which you can simply "exclude" an entire generation.

What reason was there to believe the successor of the GameCube would sell 4x as much?

 

[Fred-87]

phone people dont wanna buy 30/40+ euro games

 

[Stumpokapow]

Not that this is the chief concern of your idea but not everyone has nor wants a smartphone.

Insofar as the term "everyone" is at all realistic or meaningful, they really do. There are over 1.5 billion smartphones in use right now. There are more smartphones in use right now than computers. In the US, more than 65% of all US adults have smartphones, more than 80% of 18-34 year olds in the US have smartphones. Based on current trajectories (and there's no sign of inflection), more US adults will have smartphones than televisions in the next five years.

I guess I feel like the term "everyone" is a useless term. Not everyone has an internet connection or a television or a refrigerator, but at some point, enough people do that we stop considering the technology's penetration as a burden on the adoption of some second-order product. Like, Apple didn't say "we should open a CD store because not everyone wants an internet connection so this will limit our ability to sell music". Now two thirds of all sales and more than half of all revenue is digital.

But I'll just make one other observation. As of last year, the number of iOS/Android devices sold since 2007 was at about 1.5 billion. The total amount of dedicated handheld and console sales from all companies since the beginning of home gaming in the 70s was less than 1.5 billion. That gap is growing. We're not talking about any one piece of hardware, we're talking about all of them combined.

 

[Comandr]

I'm trying to think of a way for a controller attachment to work while avoiding rampant knockoffs and pirating with rooted hardware.

Perhaps each controller has a serial code.

Nintendo uses a companion app that acts as a portal to their store. So you launch the Nintendo Zone app and you have access to your library and a dedicated eshop, effectively making the games IAPs.

The app requires you to register your controller serial number (to verify purchase and legitimacy), and then your game purchases are tied to your app, which is tied to your Apple ID. That circumvents Nintendo's nasty "lose the hardware lose it all" tendency.

I envision basically an OG 3DS that you can just slot a phone into the middle of.

I don't think the games all need to be $60 dollar games either.

Nintendo could easily sell ports of older titles that have more or less had their run and made their money. There's still no GC VC so that would be a good start.

I don't think captain toad is a full $60 game. I have no idea what the intended price point is but I would be comfortable playing a game like that on a phone and I think it could sell at $10-15.

Just playing devil's advocate.

The handheld market is shrinking fast. People say that games sell hardware, well in terms of sheer quality, I think that the 3DS outpaces the DS by far and the numbers are in black and white.

So maybe even really good software isn't enough any more. That's also not factoring in the level of satisfaction in the purchase. I wonder what the breakdown of the population is. Loved it would buy again. Liked it okay, will see next time. Didn't like it, wouldn't buy next one.

It astonishes me how the hardcore Nintendo fans will come out yelling and screaming about how things can never ever change and if they do they will abandon ship. That makes me kind of sad. So if Nintendo doesn't do what you think they should do, you're going to abandon them entirely.

Entertainment is changing. The way we consume entertainment is changing. The way entertainment is delivered is changing. We need to embrace change. It is inevitable.


tl;dr Companies will go where the money is. And there's money in mobile. It's only a matter of time before Nintendo shifts gears.

I love Nintendo. I really wish for them to succeed. I am frustrated because despite best possible odds, they aren't. Amazing games have been launching and the sales just aren't there.

If Nintendo can successfully deliver high quality games on a platform, and people will buy them, the rest shouldn't matter. Who cares about their margins and accessory income and licensing fees. Unless you're getting a cut of that check it doesn't apply to you the consumer. If Nintendo can pull something off and come out in the black enough to keep going at the end of the day, I say more power to them.

 

[DESTROYA]

Hey the Wii U sales are bad enough as it is....they don't need too add to them.

 

[pinkurocket]

Nintendo knows money is in Mobile gaming. But it's not clean money. It's microtransactions, ads and freemium models. I've said this before, they could release an Animal Crossing on ios/android and it would be huge. But it doesn't fit their vision and I don't see them succumbing to that kind of platform unless there is some serious desperation happening or the platform somehow raises the norm in terms of quality.

 

[xaszatm]

Short Answer: No

Long Answer:

Look, mobile gaming as it currently stand is dying. DYING. Yes, games like Candy Crush and Clash of Clans still sell huge amounts. But they are an exception to the rule. The mobile gaming market is currently a bloated, unsustainable mess right now. First off, $15 is downright expensive for the initial price for a video game. hell, even $1.99 is considered expensive for the "entry" fee. How will standard 3DS or PS Vita games, costing at least $39.99, compete with that? The few types of games to survive for the most part were freenium games that sucked cash from you with psychological cruelty. Which brings me to my next point.

For Nintendo to succeed in the current mobile market, it will transform into something that is no longer Nintendo. Do you really want to see Mario levels locked behind a paywall? Maybe they should pay $.99 to make Mario jump a little higher?

Additionally, you are forcing Nintendo to compete with hundred of new titles that come out every day. Yes, Nintendo's brand will give them some legs...right until the next big thing comes along and that game's profits sink back to nothing.

This isn't even half of the problems with your idea but suffice to say, it will only create more problems then it will solve.

 

[AtomicShroom]

- Creates a standard controller with a big name behind it, something 3rd parties would love

Why would Nintendo care about catering to 3rd parties when they would, themselves, become 3rd party? In fact, there would no longer even be "3rd parties". Their games wouldn't go through Nintendo and Nintendo wouldn't get royalties from them. They would all play on the same field now.

You really haven't thought this through, OP.

 

[Cave Johnson]

OP doesn't take into consideration the segregation of the market. If it was that simple to penetrate into the smartphone market then we would've seen a COD port right now. Nevermind Nintendo's unique approach to input design per generation.

 

[1st Course]

Look, mobile gaming as it currently stand is dying. DYING. Yes, games like Candy Crush and Clash of Clans still sell huge amounts. But they are an exception to the rule. The mobile gaming market is currently a bloated, unsustainable mess right now.

Mobile game market as whole is still growing, it's not only candy crush.

http://venturebeat.com/2014/06/18/m...ly-29b-by-2016-by-squeezing-players-for-more/

http://techcrunch.com/2014/06/23/go...over-past-year-thanks-to-games-freemium-apps/

http://venturebeat.com/2014/05/06/c...s-year-to-3b-will-surpass-u-s-in-2015-report/

 

[xaszatm]

Mobile game market as whole is still growing, it's not only candy crush.

http://venturebeat.com/2014/06/18/m...ly-29b-by-2016-by-squeezing-players-for-more/

http://techcrunch.com/2014/06/23/go...over-past-year-thanks-to-games-freemium-apps/

http://venturebeat.com/2014/05/06/c...s-year-to-3b-will-surpass-u-s-in-2015-report/

But is that truly growth for the entire mobile market, or the growth for certain companies such as King that dominate it? I can't seem to find any chart, article, etc. that breaks down who is profiting from what (asides from the big ones like King, obviously).

Even if it is successful, my other points still stand. Nintendo would have to fundamentally change itself to be successful on mobile phones and I don't think everyone would like what it would become.

 

[xaszatm]

- It opens them up to a MASSIVE market... One that I'm sure would buy Mario Kart

Actually, this brings up another problem with this. Potential market doesn't mean ACTUAL market. If the potential market equaled actual, then a whole lot more then 2 million people would have bought Mario Kart 8 during its first month launch.

 

[1st Course]

But is that truly growth for the entire mobile market, or the growth for certain companies such as King that dominate it? I can't seem to find any chart, article, etc. that breaks down who is profiting from what (asides from the big ones like King, obviously).

Even if it is successful, my other points still stand. Nintendo would have to fundamentally change itself to be successful on mobile phones and I don't think everyone would like what it would become.

Growth for mobile game market in general. King is a big player but there also many big players like Kabam, EA, Gungho, Tencent, CJ etc.

 

[AltDynamics]

The few games I like playing on my phone work fine with touch input.

Also, there is the whole market segmentation of smartphones.

Unless the controller itself is the console and can stream to a phone (or a tv) I don't see this happening.

 

[Haines]

I do not want to play Nintendo games on my nexus 5/iPad Air

I want to play them the way I can today.

 

[Herb Alpert]

this is the fusion of "nintendo must go third party" and "Nintendo must go smartphone".

I don't like it and I think this doesn't apply to Nintendo's strategy at all.

 

[Spinluck]

The reactions to the OP are quite amusing. Everyone here seems to think that we are the target market and thus if we don't like it then Nintendo shouldn't do it. I like my 3DS but I think everyone here is in denial.

Here's the first thing that you need to understand: the current cell phone subsidy model is absolutely destroying the market for other electronic devices. People have been conditioned to buy a brand new cell phone every two years for $200+ with a contract. Of course the actual cost of an iPhone 5S 16GB is $649, not $200. How do you possibly think that Nintendo can compete with their next portable with a $649 device that is being upgraded on a two year schedule? They can't! People wouldn't even buy the 3DS at $250 at launch! I bought one and maybe you did too but that wasn't enough. Nintendo simply can't build a $200 device that is competitive with a $649 device. Even if they could, they are soon competing with brand new $649 device in two years.

But the 3DS is doing great, right? Wrong. 3DS sales are falling off fast. This time last year they were moving more than 200k a week but now it is more like 100k. The DS sold over 150M units while the 3DS has only sold 45M. The 3DS's screen looks ancient next to an iPhone 5 and will look even worse when Apple launches their larger phones in a few months. Nintendo can't compete with a more expensive subsidized device that is on a two year upgrade cycle. It's over.

I recently spent a week in Tokyo. With 3DS street pass on I ran into a good number of people but in my whole time I saw only one 3DS being used. The subways were full of people either reading books or playing on their phones, not on their 3DS or PSV. Even in Japan I think it's over.

If you can't beat them, join them. If I were Nintendo, I would approach both Google and Apple and offer to release the entire Nintendo back catalogue over the course of several years, with a game or two a week. I would also offer to develop new games. All games would be compatible with a Nintendo branded controller, which would come bundled with one free downloadable Mario game and one free Zelda game. The catch for Google and Apple? Nintendo needs to be the only official game controller and Nintendo needs to get a better revenue sharing deal. If Google or Apple refuses, threaten to go to the other with an exclusive deal.

Of course I don't think Nintendo will do any of this but it's the only path that makes sense in my view.

Time to end console gaming, nothing will ever sell as much as the PS2, Wii, or DS!

 

[MrBadger]

Out of interest, how many mobile games that aren't f2p or more than £1 get hugely successful? The people who play Candy Crush or Angry Birds on the bus or the shitter aren't the same kinds of people who spend £40 on Mario games. The only Nintendo gamers that have moved to Smartphones are the people who played Wii Sports and Brain Training. Plus, who honestly wants to stick extra crap onto their phones in public?

 

[Spinluck]

No one wants to carry two things around with them. So now, they only have to carry two things!

Yeah

Let's ignore all the potential compatibility issues they could run into, and all the bullshit they'd have to go through to release such a device.

Let's not want our games in the best possible form they can deliver to us.

 

[TheOhrenberger.]

I swear I always hear how mobile gaming is ruining the industry and yet every day I come to GAF I see a thread explaining why Nintendo should go mobile.

 

[Spinluck]

I swear I always hear how mobile gaming is ruining the industry and yet every day I come to GAF I see a thread explaining why Nintendo should go mobile.

It was fun browsing this forum when there were people thinking that mobile games would stop the current gen consoles from selling, and that the Wii U was the sign of things to come.

Now everyone likes to act like those threads never existed.

 

[Peltz]

I don't think Nintendo really needs to stay a champion of the handheld space to thrive. Nintendo adapting with the times doesn't = Nintendo releases mobile games.

Rather, they have to continue to carve out innovative new hardware experiences that are uniquely "Nintendo" that other companies don't do. For example, the Wii was successful because it truly was a new concept that was, at the same time, very fundamentally similar to the original NES. It had a simple controller that was easily grasped by the public and it came out with simple games like "Golf", "Baseball" and "Tennis" that allowed families to have very simple fun. In the case of the NES, that fun was had with the D-Pad. With the Wii, that fun was had with motion controls.

Nintendo just needs to find that next very simple hardware innovation that captures the hearts of the general public again. It can be a handheld device or a console. Or, it could be something else entirely.

I don't think we could ever count them out. I wouldn't be surprised if the non-wearable tech of the QOL product they've hinted at was something crazy like hologram technology. The moment they seem like they're predictable, Nintendo does something we never see coming (like most recently, GCN controller slots for Wii U). To say they have to "compete" with smartphones is just as misguided as saying that prior to the Wii, they needed to "compete" with Sony or Microsoft. They didn't. They forged their own path last gen.

There's no reason to believe (even with recent missteps) that they don't have the vision to surprise us again.

 

[aeolist]

I swear I always hear how mobile gaming is ruining the industry and yet every day I come to GAF I see a thread explaining why Nintendo should go mobile.

it's almost as if those viewpoints were coming from multiple sources in a non-homogeneous community

that said this kind of thing is crazy difficult and would require nintendo to be good at a lot of things they're traditionally not. probably the best way to go would be putting out their own hardware running an android fork with their own app store for games. maybe they could support the amazon app store too.

supporting third party android hardware would be an inconceivable leap for them, even if they only go with a small set of whitelisted devices. they could still go with their own app store if they wanted to avoid the 30% cut but it would be such a fundamental shift i don't know how much of nintendo as it is would survive. ios would clearly be easier with regards to hardware but they'd still have to support multiple screen sizes and SoC platforms, not to mention the fact that there's no way around apple and they'd be giving up a huge chunk of their revenue.

i can see nintendo doing some crazy stuff in mobile within the next few years but this specific idea will not be happening any time soon.

 

[Mike Golf]

And just how is Nintendo supposed to make the great games they do while also ensuring they're compatible with the hundreds of iterative Android/iOS devices out there? More so for Android seeing as it's not locked to just one company. Even if by some miracle their games could still sell for $30 to $40 on mobile phones profitably they'd need to do massive amounts of continuing QC and QA to make sure the same exact experience is had on all devices. Not to mention making the sure the controller is supported, fits, and works, with every one of these devices too. And then continue to do massive amounts of QA and QC for the new phones coming out on a monthly basis, not just the big two or three well known set manufacturers like Samsung, HTC or Apple.

Exclusive hardware is what drives these games, ensuring everyone has the same experience and their games run exactly as intended. Ignoring the large amount of other obstacles to overcome, making this happen for all the different kinds of devices out there without downgrading their games from what we get today to something very simple that the lowest capable phone can play is not something I'd want to see happen.

 

[zruben]

It was fun browsing this forum when there were people thinking that mobile games would stop the current gen consoles from selling, and that the Wii U was the sign of things to come.

Now everyone likes to act like those threads never existed.

well... the three "next gen consoles" are still selling like shit, so what's your point?

 

[Camjo-Z]

I see "Nintendo should go third-party" is finding new ways of disguising itself.

Anyways, no, this would be awful. My phone already has a shitty battery life as it is without having to use it as a serious gaming device as well.

 

[Solid Samus]

It was fun browsing this forum when there were people thinking that mobile games would stop the current gen consoles from selling, and that the Wii U was the sign of things to come.

Now everyone likes to act like those threads never existed.

everybody around here is an armchair pachter and sometimes it's just downright fucking hilarious ^ like in that instance, or OP

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

everybody around here is an armchair pachter and sometimes it's just downright fucking hilarious ^ like in that instance, or OP

Lets not forget Pachter said that Nintendo should move completely to mobile and then put their entire back catalogue on mobile for free

 

[Beelzebub]

This idea is disgusting. blegh

 

[Spinluck]

well... the three "next gen consoles" are still selling like shit, so what's your point?

Right.

I don't even know why I come on this side of GAF anymore.