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The Order: 1886 main characters run over 100K polys each

D

Dictator93

Member
teknix said:
When you have a character with that many polys it usually means the environment size will suffer. So you will see (like we have so far) the characters in small rooms, tight hallways, and overall smaller locations on screen at any given time. The large open areas we saw in the trailer were all cg I think (please correct me if I'm wrong).
Click to expand...

You are wrong.

Next gen machines are pretty good with poly counts on main characters (environments will not suffer too much). If anything, the PS4 is not horribly shading limited...

I was actually surprised that the game just normal mapped the bricks on the wall. To think PDZ of FEAR used POM like... so long ago...
 
P

Persona7

Banned
So is this going to have real time cutscenes or are they going to pull a naughty dog and just throw pre-rendered compressed movie files on the disk?
 
N

nycgamer4ever

Member
Darknight said:
Roll my eyes with "bu bu bu diminishing returns!".

We havent hit anything near that, on consoles. It may happen first on PC games but console games have a long ways to go (years) and this is the right direction that Sony/RAD is going for.

Seems like those who hold their biased close to their heart seem to always say something negative.
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Every thread, anywhere, whether twitter, Neogaf, gaming sites, I see a lot of hate for this game even though they have not show much. I wonder why? I'm actually really optimistic about the game as I've loved all the other games that RAD has made on the psp.
 
S

SniperHunter

Banned
teknix said:
When you have a character with that many polys it usually means the environment size will suffer. So you will see (like we have so far) the characters in small rooms, tight hallways, and overall smaller locations on screen at any given time. The large open areas we saw in the trailer were all cg I think (please correct me if I'm wrong).
Click to expand...

this is false, we have seen pics of open street level fighting in the game informer story. i doubt the entire game will take place on narrow streets of london
 
C

copelandmaster

Member
That's pretty good. Not enough for CG quality though.

That Aki example, polycount wise, should be the norm in a few years. Keep in mind that the movie is over 10 years old, and was rendered on Pentium 3's. Not to mention that the film had really early and funky (from numerous tool switches) implementations for things like subsurface scattering. They also had no proper way to easily and quickly render hair.

In 2012, The Agni tech demo was running on an i7, a 680, and 32GBs of ram.

Now look at what the PS4 is capable of in 2014. Can wait for the near future.
 
N

nycgamer4ever

Member
Dictator93 said:
You are wrong.

Next gen machines are pretty good with poly counts on main characters. If anything, the PS4 is not horribly shading limited...
Click to expand...

Stop with the CG bullshit. unless you saw the developers say this it's nothing but bullshit. As a matter of fact the developers have said everything is rendered in engine and real time and there are many instances when you can interact during scenes. pretty much there will be no distinction between cutscenes and gameplay. This isn't last gen anymore.

Sorry Dictator meant to respond to:


Originally Posted by teknix

When you have a character with that many polys it usually means the environment size will suffer. So you will see (like we have so far) the characters in small rooms, tight hallways, and overall smaller locations on screen at any given time. The large open areas we saw in the trailer were all cg I think (please correct me if I'm wrong).
 
I

i-Lo

Member
teknix said:
When you have a character with that many polys it usually means the environment size will suffer. So you will see (like we have so far) the characters in small rooms, tight hallways, and overall smaller locations on screen at any given time. The large open areas we saw in the trailer were all cg I think (please correct me if I'm wrong).
Click to expand...

Uncharted 2 was putting out around 1.2M poly/frame at peak at 720p and 30fps. Discounting the parts in liverpool designed to aid texture (resolution) rendering, the upgraded core clock, compute capability and most importantly much improvement in efficiency in architecture means that we ought to see at least ~ 3 to 4 million poly/frame at 30fps at resolutions of 1080p in future games.
 
D

dragonbane

Member
Loudninja said:
Look at inFamous.

I dont think that means much.
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Well to be fair Troy Baker doesn't have that many polygons compared to The Order. Especially since they save the entire hair ^^


Persona7 said:
So is this going to have real time cutscenes or are they going to pull a naughty dog and just throw pre-rendered compressed movie files on the disk?
Click to expand...
Real time, all the time. Like Quantic Dream and how it should be. Pre-rendered needs to die, hope ND moves away from it.
 
N

nelsonroyale

Member
copelandmaster said:
That's pretty good. Not enough for CG quality though.

That Aki example, polycount wise, should be the norm in a few years. Keep in mind that the movie is over 10 years old, and was rendered on Pentium 3's. Not to mention that the film had really early and funky (from numerous tool switches) implementations for things like subsurface scattering. They also had no proper way to easily and quickly render hair.

In 2012, The Agi tech demo was running on an i7, a 680, and 32GBs of ram.

Now look at what the PS4 is capable of in 2014. Can wait for the near future.
Click to expand...

Agni demo was run on PS4 at the PS meeting as well...
 
V

viveks86

Member
teknix said:
When you have a character with that many polys it usually means the environment size will suffer. So you will see (like we have so far) the characters in small rooms, tight hallways, and overall smaller locations on screen at any given time. The large open areas we saw in the trailer were all cg I think (please correct me if I'm wrong).
Click to expand...

You mean like this?

imu4pB3yVOMiL.gif
 
M

MercuryLS

Banned
dragonbane said:
Well to be fair Troy Baker doesn't have that many polygons compared to The Order. Especially since they save the entire hair ^^



Real time, all the time. Like Quantic Dream and how it should be. Pre-rendered needs to die, hope ND moves away from it.
Click to expand...

They probably will since they can now do TLOU cutscenes in real-time without issue.
 
mckmas8808

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
i-Lo said:
One other thing, iirc, an object with multiple joints that need to be rigged for proper animation bereft of clipping requires more polys in comparison to the same object if it was designed to have a single pose.
Click to expand...

Ah thanks. So the animation will probably be great on the characters too then.
 
D

dragonbane

Member
i-Lo said:
Uncharted 2 was putting out around 1.2M poly/frame at peak at 720p and 30fps. Discounting the parts in liverpool designed to aid texture (resolution) rendering, the upgraded core clock, compute capability and most importantly much improvement in efficiency in architecture means that ought to see at least ~ 3 to 4 million poly/frame at 30fps at resolutions of 1080p in future games.
Click to expand...
Dark Sorcerer was pushing about 4m polys/frame and ran between 30 and 90 fps unoptimized. So yeah.
 
G

G_Berry

Banned
So all we really know is that the game has good graphics.

Im sorry but thats not enough. We need a dev video explaining gameplay mechanics, story etc.

Make me excited for this!!
 
T

tryagainlater

Member
It could be made up of a billion polygons but it won't mean much if it's just another boring shooter. I hope RAD have some interesting stuff to show us at some point.
 
X

XANDER CAGE

Member
viveks86 said:
You mean like this?

imu4pB3yVOMiL.gif
Click to expand...

To be fair, we don't know how much of that is part of an explorable level. There are plenty of ways to "cheat" in scenes outside of the player's control. For all we know, moving the camera high enough to see down those alleys would reveal complete emptiness.
 
C

copelandmaster

Member
nelsonroyale said:
Agni demo was run on PS4 at the PS meeting as well...
Click to expand...

I hope so. I'm sure the demo will no doubt run on a PS4. I'm doubtful of that, however. It takes time to get these demos running onto dev kits, and with mixed results, as seen with the UE4 demo. Take Deep Down for example. It turned out that capcom's demo was running on a PC with an i7 and a gtx 570. Same thing with FF XV. All the footage we've seen so far is actually PC footage using DX11.
 
N

nycgamer4ever

Member
King_Moc said:
If that's how they've chosen to debut the gameplay footage, then it's perfectly fine for people to make a judgement based on that.
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And therein lies the problem. People should just wait for more info before making any judgement. It's like meeting a girl for 10 minutes and thinking you already know them, without ever thinking of what their past was.

Ready at Dawn has done some fantastic games on the psp so I will give them a benefit of a doubt and wait for more info before judging. However even basing off what has been show so far, it looks and sound good. If you read the game informer issue a while ago there were a lot of information in it too regarding the physics engine. Too many gamers are just way too negative.
 
R

RoboPlato

I'd be in the dick
100k is what I estimated given the number of joints necessary for high quality facial animation and the separately modeled clothes. Really impressive stuff.
 
Oppo

Oppo

Member
tryagainlater said:
It could be made up of a billion polygons but it won't mean much if it's just another boring shooter. I hope RAD have some interesting stuff to show us at some point.
Click to expand...

Ok to this, and the dozens other sentiments like it, here's a tip: wait till it launches, then pull up Live From PlayStation. There will be tons of The Order steams on launch day and you can spoil yourself all you like.
 
T

TatteredHat

Member
I imagine that a lot of this budget will go into making the clothing and character props more detailed, we'll see. I'd rather they just release some actual gameplay instead of giving us these fairly pointless technical details.
 
I

i-Lo

Member
tryagainlater said:
It could be made up of a billion polygons but it won't mean much if it's just another boring shooter. I hope RAD have some interesting stuff to show us at some point.
Click to expand...

Comments like this are really getting tiresome. The poly count and consequently this thread is about the capability of their engine and ramification for all future games pertaining to character detail and animation quality.

Why must people drag in a tangential point time and again to derail this thread?
 
D

dragonbane

Member
copelandmaster said:
I hope so. I'm sure the demo will no doubt run on a PS4. I'm doubtful of that, however. It takes time to get these demos running onto dev kits, and with mixed results, as seen with the UE4 demo. Take Deep Down for example. It turned out that capcom's demo was running on a PC with an i7 and a gtx 570. Same thing with FF XV. All the footage we've seen so far is actually PC footage using DX11.
Click to expand...
Well Dark Sorcerer is rendered in real time on a PS4 (with 4GB RAM) and it looks pretty damn amazing too. Unoptimized it runs between 30 and 90 fps so Agni should be totally possible. Games later in the cycle as well.
 
U

ultratruman

Banned
I hope this game isn't just a pretty husk a la Crysis and Ryse. Literally my least favourite type of game.

Ghosts of Sparta has me hopeful. Gimme dat RAD magic.
 
L

Leb

Member
Maybe instead of constantly drip feeding us irrelevant minutiae they could release an actual gameplay trailer that shows actual gameplay. I mean, everyone agrees it looks awesome; now we want to see how it plays.
 
L

Loudninja

Member
i-Lo said:
Comments like this are really getting tiresome. The poly count and consequently this thread is about the capability of their engine and ramification for all future games pertaining to character detail and animation quality.

Why must people drag in a tangential point time and again to derail this thread?
Click to expand...
Yes I am enjoying the tech discussion here.
 
N

nycgamer4ever

Member
i-Lo said:
Comments like this are really getting tiresome. The poly count and consequently this thread is about the capability of their engine and ramification for all future games pertaining to character detail and animation quality.

Why must people drag in a tangential point time and again to derail this thread?
Click to expand...

I don't understand how all of a sudden TPS is so hated and yet everyone is loving Titanfall, which is a FPS, which was the most hated genre last gen. This gen has been strange so far.
 
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