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Tim Cook says Nokia died because it didn't innovate, Microsoft now copying Apple

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This came out in 2007:

3g-iphone-1.jpg
This seems like a good time to remind everyone that the first iPhone was a brick with 2G, no app store (in fact, Jobs hated the idea of an app store and wanted everyone to make web apps), no GPS, not even MMS and lightyears behind similar phones in features, except for the touch screen.

Also, here's what it actually looked like at release, the image above is an iphone 3G (released in 2008):

done-apple-iphone-1.jpg
 
Nokia should have adopted UIQ instead of that awful S60 rubbish for their smart phones. They should also have worked closer with Moto/Sony Ericsson back in the day rather than flipping them the finger and buying out symbian.
 
Oh Nokia, if only you weren't so foolish. Half the work was already done for you if you had chose right. Now you have to suffer the indignity of Tim Cook, who once probably had to lug your old bricks around, dance on your grave.

If MS and Android are guilty of copying, what does that say about Apple today? It's only fair to say they are all equal.

That fingerprint reader does sound nice. I'm sure they got the idea organically through R&D. I think other companies will also organically come to the conclusion that fingerprint readers could be useful, in a year or two.
 
I don't think that Apple is copying MIcrosoft 1:1 but I'm starting to see Apple's struggle to stay relevant with mobile computing trends as other competitors like Samsung, Microsoft, Google, LG, HTC, and Nokia have made strides in the past few years to catch up with what Apple started.
 
I still can't believe we're still having this debate for the umpteen millionth time.

As it turns out, all three main companies are taking cues for the other two and implementing it themselves to remain competitive.

Google and MS moved towards having their own hardware divisions to go with their software ones like Apple.
Google and Apple have taken cues from the more minimal and flat style in windows Metro.
All three companies have been copying good visual designs, features and implementations from the other two.

This is natural. It happens in all industries and for all products. Incremental updates to individual components is also the logical way forward. SoCs, antennae, screens, resolution, etc will continue growing in power and efficiency. In terms of innovation, even as an Android lover, I'll be the first to say that the iPhone was the first to unveil a redefined paradigm of interacting with a smartphone. Everyone else instantly agreed and since this new experience depended on having mostly a screen occupying a vast majority of the face of a phone, and large pokeable icons everyone followed suit resulting in of the mobile OSs to be functionally similar but visually different. The same could essentially be said for the iPad except that I wouldn't qualify that as innovative as the iPhone because the whole industry was heading that way anyway, it was just that Apple was the first one to hit the nail on the head.

Honestly with the way tech moves and how we get incremental updates to different parts of the hardware it'll be difficult to come up with a product which would be as innovative as the new method of smartphone interaction the iPhone one introduced. To me, the one really great product that I consider to have been truly innovatory (in the mobile space) in the past few years is Google Now. And again, the implementation isn't necessarily the mind blowing but rather the idea of receiving information passively and with little to no user interaction. It's a redefinition of human-machine interaction which I'm sure will be further expanded on, and to which we'll be seeing competition in the next number of years, especially if wearable computers somehow manage to take off.
 
Honestly with the way tech moves and how we get incremental updates to different parts of the hardware it'll be difficult to come up with a product which would be as innovative as the new method of smartphone interaction the iPhone one introduced. To me, the one really great product that I consider to have been truly innovatory (in the mobile space) in the past few years is Google Now. And again, the implementation isn't necessarily the mind blowing but rather the idea of receiving information passively and with little to no user interaction. It's a redefinition of human-machine interaction which I'm sure will be further expanded on, and to which we'll be seeing competition in the next number of years, especially if wearable computers somehow manage to take off.
Was there really anything revolutionary in the iPhone at launch other than the full touchscreen implementation?
 
Copying iOS? Am i reading this correctly? Lumia series is totally different beast and i really like it,very fast and one of the better phones i have since a long time. Gonna buy a 920 soon and i will never understand that the masses are not willing to even try it out. It is really a good phone.
 
Nokia and Apple had being releasing the same phone for a couple of years right now. What's innovation really?

Samsung Galaxy Note? In my opinion the latest innovation in cellphone history. Sure that Old Dell phone was 5 inches before but it's not who makes it first, but rather who makes it best.

Ipad? Another innovation that has the same rule. Why not make it even bigger. It's so simple and yet it works.

Nokia 808/Galaxy Camera? More Gimmick than innovation. A cumbersome hybrid.
 
Copying iOS? Am i reading this correctly? Lumia series is totally different beast and i really like it,very fast and one of the better phones i have since a long time. Gonna buy a 920 soon and i will never understand that the masses are not willing to even try it out. It is really a good phone.

If you're referring to the OP, no, you're not reading it correctly... at all. The word iOS doesn't even appear in the OP or originating article.
 
"It's very easy to make something that is new, but it won't be new the day after tomorrow. So we are trying to make things that are better."

A quote from Ive.

Being number one to introduce something means shit. It has to be right and that's the hard part. Apple is pretty darn good at that.
 
I'd anything apple popularized and did right with many features that had come before it. No idea is original but apple makes them perfect.
 
Copying iOS? Am i reading this correctly? Lumia series is totally different beast and i really like it,very fast and one of the better phones i have since a long time. Gonna buy a 920 soon and i will never understand that the masses are not willing to even try it out. It is really a good phone.

i'm thinking of getting a lumia tomorrow. I have used Android for years, have had multiple ipads, and would like to try something new.

I just don't know if I can pull the trigger.
 
Damn, we can't even give Microsoft credit for being one of the first major companies to strongly push the flat design language with Metro?


I fucking HATE metro, I think its ugly as sin, but I wouldn't try and take from them what they clearly played a leading role in starting. Everyone is going with flat design after Microsoft pushed it. EVERYONE. Logos changing, OS's being redesigned, everything all over the place, and MS definitely should be credited with being at the helm of that.


So when they decided to switch from their beloved and proven design, accepted by over a hundred million of users, to something new and fresh, maybe even a bit provoking, like iOS 7, then you know people will follow.

All these are apps used by millions of users every single day and they all got to experience this new design from one day to the other. Now that's what I call "setting a trend".

I mean.... Brot you are giving me a headache reading this. You know what else is used by millions of people? Windows 8, Outlook, Skype, Xbox and more. And they were all using MS's new move to a flat look IIRC long before iOS7 entered beta.

I really hate being put in a position where I'm defending Metro of all things, but some of you seem to have really short memories, either that or a problem with giving credit where it is due.
 
htc-touch.jpg


I had this phone in 2007.

The HTC Touch was a direct reply from HTC. It had a small skin over Windows Phone called Sense :P

The LG Prada is a better answer as it was the very first capacitive touch screen phone on sale and was announced literally days after the iPhone so it was in development at the same time.
LG-Prada-Statia-2.jpg


Apple's innovations are usually not being the first at something, but the first at doing something really well. The original iPhone screen res was out of this world when nearly every phone had a 2-2.5 inch QVGA screen.
 
It's not even that Apple copied the look and feel of the Metro flat design. It's that somehow they ended up regressing in terms of design.

It looks plain fugly.
 
I am so confused with Apple. So it is not okay for Samsung to copy something as simple as what a usb phone charger connector looks like, but it is okay to copy the literal brilliance of what these phones are, the software? iOS7 is literally android. How can he say anything like this with a straight face? I love iOS7 but it is coped work. lol
 
Funny when everyone and their mother is copying Metro with flat designs and modern looking fonts. Everyone hates on MS and Metro but the entire computing industry is pretty much ripping it off right now.

Sorry Apple hasn't done crap as far as innovation in years.

everyone went with the flat design, Metro Tile design sucks.

@Knicks

How the fuck is iOS7 literally android?
 
But Metro is far more than just live tiles. A major principle of the language is flat design which, as people have been discussing in this thread, was first heavily pushed by Microsoft.

I hate the metro homescreen on a phone, monochromic grid with typographic icons broken up with live tiles. I hate the vertical downward design for Apps, i don't like there's no launch bar for frequently used apps. I liked how zune HD ui worked since you had very few apps the up down listing of things worked.
 
Nokia died because they tied themselves down to an OS that no one wanted and whose parent company made absolutely no initiative to improve beyond horrible marketing.
 
The things I'm reading here in this thread ... It must be opposite day again. Microsoft setting trends? Isn't that a ridiculous thing to say?

Look, I don't want to discredit them for some of their design ideas and they do have a few people with good taste (but it's more likely that most of them already left again, like Allard), but these days Microsoft is way too irrelevant in tech to lead any trends. Most people use Microsoft products, because they have to, which would be mostly at work. And even at workplaces you see Microsoft fading more and more into irrelevance, with things like BYOD or when most companies use iPads. "Surface? Isn't that the thing they had a huge write-off on?". Seriously, when was the last time people praised Microsoft's products and recommended them over an Apple product? Exactly.

On the other hand you have Apple, who pioneered the smartphone we know to day and probably even boosed us 5 years into the future. That's something that leaves an impression, you know? So when they decided to switch from their beloved and proven design, accepted by over a hundred million of users, to somesthing new and fresh, maybe even a bit provoking, like iOS 7, then you know people will follow.

You don't believe me? Just look at this list of current iOS apps that got updated to iOS 7. https://tapfame.com/ios7/

Facebook, Ebay, Twitter, Pandora, Evernote, Instapaper, Foursquare ... All these are apps used by millions of users every single day and they all got to experience this new design from one day to the other. Now that's what I call "setting a trend". Even AdvertisingAge talked about it in their article about Yahoo's new logo.

Despite the design world's ongoing "flat" trend propelled by the look of Apple's new mobile operating system, Yahoo went classical for its typeface. The font would look at home on the banner of renaissance-era jouster or a British soccer, er, football club. That could invoke the larger renaissance Ms. Mayer is trying to incite at Yahoo and reinforce the company's hope to become a solid business like it once was. "When you want to create an image of stability, for something to be taken seriously as a business, you tend to go toward more classical tropes," said Hunter Tura, president of Bruce Mau Design.

Again, some of Microsoft's ideas weren't bad, but it's simply not what people want.
They even had an entire book explaining people why their airport bathroom toilet signage-inspired Metro design is good. When you feel the need to write an entire book for that, I feel like you've failed. People are individuals and as such they're capable to distinguish good design from bad design. They don't need a book to convince them. And judging by the numbers, I'd say people are pretty convinced that Microsoft and their design isn't the right choice for them.



It's more like they put too much time and resources into Symbian. They put multiple billion dollar into Symbian R&D every year. That is completely insane. Heck, most of their software staff was part of the Symbian team. About 4,000 people, I think. That's four times the amount of people who screwed up the Longhorn project at Microsoft. Apple's not even close with their R&D budget and they stomped them and the competition into the ground with their very first phone.

Microsoft is not irrelevant in technology. They may not be terribly relevant in the smartphone or tablet market but to call them completely irrelevant is misplaced.
 
Apple doesn't innovate. They have excellent marketing that works. They say that they invent this, and innovate that, and the people eat that shit up like breakfast cereal.
How many people think the iPhone was the first touch screen phone to use icons? In 2007? Ha, yeah right. I had an old Motorola touch screen phone with icons back in 2003. And you know what it could do that the first iPhone couldn't? It could do MMS, I could customize my ringtones to whatever I want, I could insert an SD card, it was 3G.
The only good thing that came from the iPhone is that it was ridiculously popular, and thus caused a huge rush from other phone companies to start manufacturing touch screen phones.
And they're one to talk about copying. How many things have they copied off Android with IOS 7? It's about time they finally caught up.
 
I am so confused with Apple. So it is not okay for Samsung to copy something as simple as what a usb phone charger connector looks like, but it is okay to copy the literal brilliance of what these phones are, the software? iOS7 is literally android. How can he say anything like this with a straight face? I love iOS7 but it is coped work. lol

jesus. iOS doesnÂ’t work like Android. it has some flatter design elements. it has no app drawer. it has no widgets. it has a different coding language entirely. itÂ’s not at all a copy of android. iOS came first, for heavenÂ’s sake and has remained fundamentally the same in concept while Android has changed most of all - out of necessity - the past several years.

Android has been playing catchup to iOS for all matters of ease of use, fluid scrolling and animation and discoverability. and a lot of people think itÂ’s still not there. ItÂ’s not at all clear that iOS has been copying Android. I have no idea how people can even come to this conclusion. Apple has been influenced by parts of Android and WP but itÂ’s peanuts compared to what Samsung, specifically, was doing with their early Galaxy phones - which is the other example you bring up.

AppleÂ’s beef with samsung was more than just a USB cable. it was a series of design decisions made by samsung to make every single possible part of their phones, software and accessories look like the iphone 3G and iOS 3. it was blatant and to suggest it was coincidence or just some small stuff is to be blind to the facts.

now, having said all that, the “copying" that Cook talked about in the article wasn’t even about design - from MS or Google. it’s like no one even reads the articles in question. it was about how MS is trying to be a more vertically integrated hardware/software company for devices. And Cook wasn’t even passing judgment on that decision, lol. Just acknowledging the obvious.
 
Apple doesn't innovate. They have excellent marketing that works. They say that they invent this, and innovate that, and the people eat that shit up like breakfast cereal.
How many people think the iPhone was the first touch screen phone to use icons? In 2007? Ha, yeah right. I had an old Motorola touch screen phone with icons back in 2003. And you know what it could do that the first iPhone couldn't? It could do MMS, I could customize my ringtones to whatever I want, I could insert an SD card, it was 3G.
The only good thing that came from the iPhone is that it was ridiculously popular, and thus caused a huge rush from other phone companies to start manufacturing touch screen phones.
And they're one to talk about copying. How many things have they copied off Android with IOS 7? It's about time they finally caught up.

Who wants an sd card when we can pay in $100 increments for slight boosts in internal storage??
 
Had Nokia chose Android, they would be where Samsung is today. They were run into the ground. So much wasted potential. My dream phone will never happen now.
 
Had Nokia chose Android, they would be where Samsung is today. They were run into the ground. So much wasted potential. My dream phone will never happen now.

Only if they would choose it at the same time Samsung did. But they lost that timeframe and instead went for symbian and Meegoo.
It's a shame, they just were completely unable to execute. I've read they've spent like 5 times more on R&D than Apple and yet they had nothing to show for it. It's ridiculous, because stuff like Nokia n800 showed they were on the right path, they suddenly became completely paralyzed.
 
Had Nokia chose Android, they would be where Samsung is today. They were run into the ground. So much wasted potential. My dream phone will never happen now.

Or they could've chosen Android, made one of the worst skins available and tanked because no one wanted the devices.
 
It's not even that Apple copied the look and feel of the Metro flat design. It's that somehow they ended up regressing in terms of design.

It looks plain fugly.

I thought that too until I actually updated my phone and used it on a daily basis myself. Pictures do not do iOS7 justice at all.
 
Or they could've chosen Android, made one of the worst skins available and tanked because no one wanted the devices.

This is Nokia we're talking about, people want their phones, they just don't want the OS it's shipping with.
Heck even Sony fares better with Android than without
 
I thought that too until I actually updated my phone and used it on a daily basis myself. Pictures do not do iOS7 justice at all.

I have to agree. iOS 7 looks much better in motion. It's a bit magical how well the animations were made and how fluid everything is.
 
Apple (2007) clearly innovated in designing a holistic touch interface paradigm and use cases that were really well thought through. Kinetic scrolling, pinch and tap zooming, swipe panning, virtual keyboard - all brought together in a couple of intensely useful apps like a good browser. Although touch screens and these individual methods did exist before, nobody figured out a holistic system before, that's why iPhone made such a splash

Microsoft (2006) clearly innovated as they really began to push the clean, typographic Metro language in Zune after trying it out in WMC earlier. Remember that they did this even before the gaudy wood veneer was even a glimmer in Forstall's eye. They have refined and refined again the language with Zune HD (2009), Windows Phone 7 (2010), Xbox 360 (2011) and Windows 8 (2012) - most years which were marked with Apple winning with skeuomorphism. Again, minimalism and typographic design existed before, but nobody had really figured out how to make an entire usable UI out of it without any of the usual 'push here' affordances.

Google also clearly innovated on Android by creating entire HW agnostic business model that broke the vertical integration that has always existed in the mobile industry. Never before was a mobile OS so well abstracted that any hardware vendor could gobble together a device with no support from the OS provider. Even if some multivendor OSs existed before (like Symbian), they required extensive and involved configuration for each vendor.

From this perspective it is particularily bad judgment from Apple to call out lack if innovation right now when they have not introduced something fundamental in a while but have just hopped on the minimalism bandwagon, and it's borderline ridiculous for them to call out Microsoft for 'copying them' in adopting a vertically integrated model, when that in fact is the only model the mobile industry knew before Google broke free with Android.
 
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