Support NeoGAF

[ShinNL]

I can't address the reviewer's systems and their 360 copies. I personally do not know if there's a conspiracy or not. The bug appears after many many hours of play, even reviewers would not catch wind of this, as many GAFfers did not in the beginning as well. It was all positive for everyone for quite a while.

No, we wanted the game to perform as promised on DAY ONE;

Look, I'm saying this was practically impossible. First, you assumed they knew about this bug for 100%, which is the problem here. Second, depending on the first time they knew about this bug, whether before or after release, it needs time to fix. If they knew it before, they had 2 choices: release now and patch later, or delay it. You have 2 choices now: get it performing close to promised on DAY ONE, or get it working perfectly on DAY NINETY. These are the realistic options. If they knew about it after release, then there wasn't even an option for them. Well, they could've chosen to not fix it. Instead they gave a temporary fix first, then a permanent fix later. To me, that's a sign of caring.

Do they also pay full retail price for those betas, without knowing if the game will ever be improved upon beyond the state it's in? For all we knew this was a seemingly unfixable problem, much like the persistent framerate problems that still plague the PS3 versions of Fallout 3 & New Vegas to this day.

Uhm, yes, aren't there plenty of PC games giving you access to free beta if you pre-order it? It's unreasonable to expect everything to be completely bug-free. It's reasonable to see major issues being fixed. Bethesda did fix. 3 months really isn't a lot when it comes to software.

Wow you finally get a sorry and you throw it back in their face. Some of you guys are pathetic.

Again, the publisher is the one who chooses when a game launches, not the studio. The publisher, and their marketing team, sent out the 360 version instead of the Ps3 version for reviews, not the studio.

I understand being upset over a broken game, but this level of irrationality is pretty sad.

Seriously. If I was a Bethesda developer, right now my reaction would be: WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT FROM US!? We worked to fix the game for you! Do you want me to commit seppeku or something!?

 

[CadetMahoney]

Not ignore but a complete ban from publishing on playstation products. That would be the right thing and respectable thing to do.

But of course Sony are gutless these days. And probably need the royalties too.

pretty much.

 

[DarkFlow]

This thread is just turning sad. Yeah they released a buggy game. Yeah it took them 3 months to fix it. But they did fix it, and fixed it rather well I'd say. At this point it just seems to be trendy to bash on them. How much more blood do you guys want to wring from this stone?

 

[KageMaru]

I can't address the reviewer's systems and their 360 copies. I personally do not know if there's a conspiracy or not.

The gist of the events were:

-writer asks marketing for Ps3 version, they say no problem
-writer receives 360 version instead with no explanation from marketing.

Even with the writer acknowledging that this wasn't Todd's or the studio's fault, people here want to pin the blaim on them.

 

[marathonfool]

I've avoided playing Bethesda games because of their inability to provide a smooth experience on the PS3.

After the buggy Fallout 3, PS3 players were promised and reassured a better experience by Bethesda. The developers deserve everything thrown at them at this point because of their failure.

If you defend Bethesda now, you'll defend them again on the next buggy release saying how they were able to patch game breaking bugs 3 months after release. Well, thank you for fixing what was suppose to be working in the first place?

 

[SolidSnakex]

This thread is just turning sad. Yeah they released a buggy game. Yeah it took them 3 months to fix it. But they did fix it, and fixed it rather well I'd say. At this point it just seems to be trendy to bash on them. How much more blood do you guys want to wring from this stone?

This game wasn't buggy, it wasn't completely broken. It would frequently drop to 0fps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBRf9bsML6M

Just watch that. And what exactly does this patch do for the people that don't have their PS3's connected to the internet?

 

[DarkFlow]

We're definitely sorry about it. As Todd said, we feel terrible when folks have problems playing our game.

I know it sounds like a broken record, but the team is focused on fixing issues that are being reported. We're grabbing PS3 saves, reading forums... anything we can do to look at the problems folks are having.

Also, just wanted to say thank you for fixing the game and making it playable. You might have made a big boo boo with the ps3, but at least you made it right.

 

[cgcg]

Wow you finally get a sorry and you throw it back in their face. Some of you guys are pathetic.

Again, the publisher is the one who chooses when a game launches, not the studio. The publisher, and their marketing team, sent out the 360 version instead of the Ps3 version for reviews, not the studio.

I understand being upset over a broken game, but this level of irrationality is pretty sad.

People don't care for insincere BS apology. You sound pretty damn pathetic for defending a company that purposely released a broken $60 product while at the same time pretending they didn't know about the issues. Are you gunning for a PR job over at Bethesda?

 

[ShinNL]

The gist of the events were:

-writer asks marketing for Ps3 version, they say no problem
-writer receives 360 version instead with no explanation from marketing.

Even with the writer acknowledging that this wasn't Todd's or the studio's fault, people here want to pin the blaim on them.

I caught a glimpse of this story in this thread. I assumed:

-writer then still reviewed 360 version
-writer did not state they have not reviewed the PS3 version
-writer did not delay the review of PS3 version and pretended it to be the same as the 360

So while the initial prologue of the events was nice, the writer did not seem to have that amazing of a resolution as if they cared for PS3 userbase that much. Because if they did, they would state what actually happened before any backlash.

 

[Uno Venova]

I didn't read the whole thread, but is there an explanation as to why the PS3 version was kept from reviewers.

 

[British Monsoon]

Look, I'm saying this was practically impossible.

Look, I'm saying that it was practically impossible for them to NOT know about this pre-release. They've even said as much themselves, but hoped it wouldn't affect too many users. An IGN poll of 37,000+ PS3 users had SEVENTY FOUR PERCENT complaining of game breaking problems for god's sake. That being the case, do you really think it was wise for Pete Hines to tell fans of the game, fans looking for assurance over the quality of the port given the shaky nature of previous Bethesda PS3 ports, that they had achieved "parity" between the console versions?

Uhm, yes, aren't there plenty of PC games giving you access to free beta if you pre-order it?

Actually, I said (and please note the bolded) "Do they also pay full retail price for those betas, without knowing if the game will ever be improved upon beyond the state it's in?" - I guess Minecraft would be the only example I can think of there.

It's unreasonable to expect everything to be completely bug-free.

Of course it's unreasonable - hell, this isn't my first time at the Bethesda rodeo. I played over 200 hours of vanilla Morrowind on the OG Xbox without problems anywhere NEAR as game-breaking as the Skyrim PS3 frame-rate problem.

And believe me, I'm glad it's fixed and APPLAUD Bethesda for getting it fixed in such a timely fashion (hell, I waited 6+ months for a fix in the game-breaking Far Cry 2 bug that affected such a minor number of users it was barely even worth UbiSoft bothering about, yet they did) - but just because it's now fixed I'm suddenly supposed to forgive what I feel was a duplicitous, disrespectful and disingenuous way to treat their fans before and after release? Please.

 

[KageMaru]

People don't care for insincere BS apology. You sound pretty damn pathetic for defending a company that purposely released a broken $60 product while at the same time pretending they didn't know about the issues. Are you gunning for a PR job over at Bethesda?

If having a level of rationality makes me pathetic, great I'm pathetic.

I just don't believe in acting so inappropriate towards people who have their hands tied and no control over factors like release dates.

People in this thread wanted a fix, they get a fix then it's "what about people without internet?".

People in this thread wanted an apology, they get an apology and it turns into "You're not really sorry...".

You guys just want to be mad, I'm convinced by now that there is nothing Bethesda can do with Skyrim to make some of you happy.

Edit:

I caught a glimpse of this story in this thread. I assumed:

-writer then still reviewed 360 version
-writer did not state they have not reviewed the PS3 version
-writer did not delay the review of PS3 version and pretended it to be the same as the 360

So while the initial prologue of the events was nice, the writer did not seem to have that amazing of a resolution as if they cared for PS3 userbase that much. Because if they did, they would state what actually happened before any backlash.

IIRC the review was delayed because the writer wanted the PS3 version so he waited to pick it up from the store before reviewing.

He basically questioned by PS3 owners were being treated the way they were, which is a legit question, but he was more so pointing his questions towards the publishing arm and not the studio. At least that's the way it seemed from the other forum I visit where he is also a member.

I didn't read the whole thread, but is there an explanation as to why the PS3 version was kept from reviewers.

Marketing sent out the 360 version with no explanation, that's all we know.

 

[Philthy]

Reading all this just makes me even angrier.

At this point there is not much Bethesda can do to get me back onboard with their products. They could make all DLC free on the PS3 for life, and I'd still think poorly of their company. To think I held them with such high praise back when they released stuff like Terminator: Future Shock. How the mighty have fallen.

 

[Nizz]

The gist of the events were:

-writer asks marketing for Ps3 version, they say no problem
-writer receives 360 version instead with no explanation from marketing.

Even with the writer acknowledging that this wasn't Todd's or the studio's fault, people here want to pin the blaim on them.

So who do you blame then?

 

[ShinNL]

And believe me, I'm glad it's fixed and APPLAUD Bethesda for getting it fixed in such a timely fashion (hell, I waited 6+ months for a fix in the game-breaking Far Cry 2 bug that affected such a minor number of users it was barely even worth UbiSoft bothering about, yet they did) - but just because it's now fixed I'm suddenly supposed to forgive what I feel was a duplicitous, disrespectful and disingenuous way to treat their fans before and after release? Please.

This is just a grudge. No offense, but something like this is your problem. You have a Bethesda developer here personally apologizing. You have the Bethesda team work and fix the problem within 3 months. You still have a grudge. A grudge like this is something that no one can do anything about, not even Bethesda. Yeah, maybe give you 3 free copies of their next games maybe. But that's unreasonable. I think your grudge is unreasonable. Just my opinion on this matter.

 

[KageMaru]

So who do you blame then?

The publisher, it's really that simple.

Edit:

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure there are things the studio could have done better, but that's always the case even with more polished titles. In the end I don't think they deserve people literally saying "fuck you!" or to throw their apology back in their face.

 

[Erasus]

The PS3 needs more RAM. Sure nits faster then DDR2, but I have 4GB of that.

Cant they use swap?

 

[British Monsoon]

This is just a grudge. No offense, but something like this is your problem. You have a Bethesda developer here personally apologizing. You have the Bethesda team work and fix the problem within 3 months. You still have a grudge. A grudge like this is something that no one can do anything about, not even Bethesda. Yeah, maybe give you 3 free copies of their next games maybe. But that's unreasonable. I think your grudge is unreasonable. Just my opinion on this matter.

"We're sorry players are experiencing problems we knew about but hoped many wouldn't experience"

and

"We're sorry Pete Hines lied to and deceived many fans about the quality of Skyrim's PS3 port pre-release".

Are not the same thing. But whatever.

 

[cgcg]

If having a level of rationality makes me pathetic, great I'm pathetic.

I just don't believe in acting so inappropriate towards people who have their hands tied and no control over factors like release dates.

People in this thread wanted a fix, they get a fix then it's "what about people without internet?".

People in this thread wanted an apology, they get an apology and it turns into "You're not really sorry...".

You guys just want to be mad, I'm convinced by now that there is nothing Bethesda can do with Skyrim to make some of you happy.

How convenient. They had their hands tied. Oooohh that's a perfectly fine excuse to purposely release a broken product. Give me a break. That's why QA exists. By your logic it's perfectly OK for every company to release broken products.

It might be excusable* if this was their first product with this type of problem, but it isn't and that just makes them that much worse.

*not really.

 

[whalleywhat]

This is just a grudge. No offense, but something like this is your problem. You have a Bethesda developer here personally apologizing. You have the Bethesda team work and fix the problem within 3 months. You still have a grudge. A grudge like this is something that no one can do anything about, not even Bethesda. Yeah, maybe give you 3 free copies of their next games maybe. But that's unreasonable. I think your grudge is unreasonable. Just my opinion on this matter.

If somebody spits in your eye but then wipes it up and apologizes, it's certainly better than them spitting in your eye a second time, but they still spit in your eye. Bethesda has no right to expect full forgiveness at this point in time, because they willfully did a shitty thing. At best, they can make attempts to repair their reputation over time.

 

[Uno Venova]

Marketing sent out the 360 version with no explanation, that's all we know.

Seems like they knew what was going on with the PS3 version then.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Seems like they knew what was going on with the PS3 version then.

This is what many of us have been saying. There would be no reason for them to hold back on the PS3 version if it was fine. If they knew that it was screwed then obviously Bethesda knew the same thing.

 

[ShinNL]

If somebody spits in your eye but then wipes it up and apologizes, it's certainly better than them spitting in your eye a second time, but they still spit in your eye. Bethesda has no right to expect full forgiveness at this point in time, because they willfully did a shitty thing. At best, they can make attempts to repair their reputation over time.

Well, I could take your analogy further and say that people who still have a grudge now probably won't have many friends, since they would hold a grudge if they ever have a single fight with their friends.

Then we can take this analogy even further, since it's about reputation and honor and shame, so we can put everything into context and realize that you guys are all experts when it comes to WRPGs, because they shot themselves an arrow in the foot, and PS3 owners will never forget this.

 

[Nizz]

The publisher, it's really that simple.

Edit:

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure there are things the studio could have done better, but that's always the case even with more polished titles. In the end I don't think they deserve people literally saying "fuck you!" or to throw their apology back in their face.

Well, Bethesda themselves locked in that hard 11-11-11 date. In a perfect world, release dates wouldn't be announced ahead of time until the team felt comfortable enough in the quality of the game.

 

[Erasus]

If somebody spits in your eye but then wipes it up and apologizes, it's certainly better than them spitting in your eye a second time, but they still spit in your eye. Bethesda has no right to expect full forgiveness at this point in time, because they willfully did a shitty thing. At best, they can make attempts to repair their reputation over time.

This is not like getting spit in the eye.

Did everyone on PS3 have problems like this? No.
Did a lot have these issues? Yes.

Are consoles way more complicated now then before? Yes.
Is the PS3 one of the most complicated hardware designs ever? Yes. HURR LETS PUT A SUPER CPU WITH 256MB RAM AND AN AWESOME GPU. OOPS SORRY MAKE THAT A SINGLE 7600 INSTEAD OF DOUBLE 7800GTX LIKE IN THE DEVKITS TROLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Oh and it seems like split arch is shit for consoles. It works on PC because there is loads of RAM, LOADS
Love the Cell and Ray though

I have a PS3 and LOVE the exclusives but Skyrim is a very big game that is hard to bugtest. Its fixed with the 1.4 patch.
You guys should never play an MMO at launch or something, my god you would explode.

 

[whalleywhat]

Well, I could take your analogy further and say that people who still have a grudge now probably won't have many friends, since they would hold a grudge if they ever have a single fight with their friends.

Then we can take this analogy even further, since it's about reputation and honor and shame, so we can put everything into context and realize that you guys are all experts when it comes to WRPGs, because they shot themselves an arrow in the foot, and PS3 owners will never forget this.

Publishers and devs aren't your friends. And they shot themselves in the knee with an arrow.

 

[ShinNL]

Publishers and devs aren't your friends. And they shot themselves in the knee with an arrow.

You missed the brilliance of my post

 

[AstroNut325]

My F*** you attitude towards Bethesda doesn't stem from Skyrim. It's the long history of bug infested releases over the years. I have more problems with Bethseda games than ALL other games on the PC and consoles COMBINED! They will not get any pity from me nor a single penny in the future.

 

[KageMaru]

How convenient. They had their hands tied. Oooohh that's a perfectly fine excuse to purposely release a broken product. Give me a break. That's why QA exists. By your logic it's perfectly OK for every company to release broken products.

It might be excusable* if this was their first product with this type of problem, but it isn't and that just makes them that much worse.

*not really.

When did I ever say it's ok for every company to release broken products?

It's obvious that you much rather dwell in your hatred or anger than have a discussion about the possibilities surrounding this, so why should I bother talking to you?

Well, Bethesda themselves locked in that hard 11-11-11 date. In a perfect world, release dates wouldn't be announced ahead of time until the team felt comfortable enough in the quality of the game.

If by Bethesda the publisher, yes they locked down the date. If Bethesda the studio could have more time, I'm sure they would have loved to hold back the game. People seem to forget there is Bethesda Softworks the publisher and Bethesda Game Studios which are the actual developers.

 

[R_thanatos]

This is not like getting spit in the eye.

Did everyone on PS3 have problems like this? No.
Did a lot have these issues? Yes.

Are consoles way more complicated now then before? Yes.
Is the PS3 one of the most complicated hardware designs ever? Yes. HURR LETS PUT A SUPER CPU WITH 256MB RAM AND AN AWESOME GPU. OOPS SORRY MAKE THAT A SINGLE 7600 INSTEAD OF DOUBLE 7800GTX LIKE IN THE DEVKITS TROLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Oh and it seems like split arch is shit for consoles. It works on PC because there is loads of RAM, LOADS
Love the Cell and Ray though

I have a PS3 and LOVE the exclusives but Skyrim is a very big game that is hard to bugtest. Its fixed with the 1.4 patch.
You guys should never play an MMO at launch or something, my god you would explode.

i'm sorry but those were know issues since fallout 3 ..
Everyone knew about it ... in the end it WASn't fixed .
Knows and documented problems from your community are there and in the next game you don't fix them ? WHAT'S THE POINT ? did they spent of their time texturing and scripting their world they had no one to spare to make a test to properly TEST IT to eliminate a KNOW issue ?

This isn't a spit in the eye , it's throwing you off a cliff after being spit in the eye while saying sorry .
I'm not Holy enough to forgive that .

1 )Besides its' proven that it could have been fixed on release if they tested it hard enough.
2 )PS3 has open world games ..lots of them bethesda games are the only ones with this issue ..the problem lies within bethesda not the console
3 )MMos at launch ( if the work is done correctly ) mostly have servers load problems it's totally different problem here ....

 

[Throwaway123456789]

This is just a grudge. No offense, but something like this is your problem. You have a Bethesda developer here personally apologizing. You have the Bethesda team work and fix the problem within 3 months. You still have a grudge. A grudge like this is something that no one can do anything about, not even Bethesda. Yeah, maybe give you 3 free copies of their next games maybe. But that's unreasonable. I think your grudge is unreasonable. Just my opinion on this matter.

Bullshit. They lied through their teeth before launch saying the PS3 version was awesome and just like the 360 version, then deliberately withheld it and refused to let anyone have a glimpse at it before launching it straight into a shitstorm.

Community Manager != Developer

But we're not pointing fingers at individual dev grunts, we're pointing fingers at Howard and Hines for not fuzzing up, at the PR department and at the absolutely horrible way they looked the other way during testing. There is no logical way they didn't know these faults existed before releasing the game, something that's confirmed now by comments made by the CM here and Howard in the Kotaku interview.

Even if they fixed the game now, it's undeniable that they sold a broken product to hundreds of thousands of people, even when they knew it was broken.

 

[Zero Hero]

I've owned a PS3 since launch, I never did buy a 360 since I never had the time to even play all of the games I wanted to play on PS3 anyway. So, that makes me - console wise - a PS3 fanboy according to some peoples twisted logic.

That being said, the PS3 never blossomed into the beautiful butterfly that it was promised to with all of that untapped power that was supposed to eclipse the competitor. Sure, there are a few exclusives that look better than what the 360 has had to offer but nothing that has made the 360 look second class. Now with this kind of BS still happening after all these years, forget it...

Was the PS3 still worth the price premium over the 360 - well, yeah... it has been a great blu-ray player and has continued to be one even now serving 3D etc. Am I done expecting great things gaming wise to come out of the thing, yep, long ago.

Same story as me except I bought a 360 2 years ago and haven't looked back. I haven't bought a PS3 game since then either. It's a BR/Netflix machine.

It's sad to hear people getting burn on bad PS3 ports 5 years later. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me for the past 5 years, I'm a masochist.

 

[LuchaShaq]

Honestly still think the shitstorm would have been even worse if they said.

"Can't make Ps3 version not enough ram"

The fanboys would have maxed out this thread 4-5 times before release.

As someone who owns both consoles, I'm really glad I hate the ps3 controller because if this were the opposite I'd just not buy anything until 2-3 months after release and I'm sure it's not fucked.

Still regret my initial PS3 purchase since it get's used once a year for an exclusive like Uncharted, 5-6 times a year for a blu ray rental, and an hour here or there for exclusives I try but don't like (infamous/LBP/GT5/etc).

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Honestly still think the shitstorm would have been even worse if they said.

"Can't make Ps3 version not enough ram"

The fanboys would have maxed out this thread 4-5 times before release.

As someone who owns both consoles, I'm really glad I hate the ps3 controller because if this were the opposite I'd just not buy anything until 2-3 months after release and I'm sure it's not fucked.

Problem is that it's not just the fanboys who are pissed at Beth right now, they appear to have made a concerted effort to deceive PS3 owners so it doesn't really matter whether you're a fanboy or not. I mean, if they'd been upfront and said that they had canned the PS3 version because they couldn't get it to run well then it would be only fanboys complaining, because other people would just say "oh well I'll get the 360/PC version instead".

 

[Nealand Liquor]

We're definitely sorry about it. As Todd said, we feel terrible when folks have problems playing our game.

I know it sounds like a broken record, but the team is focused on fixing issues that are being reported. We're grabbing PS3 saves, reading forums... anything we can do to look at the problems folks are having.

While I'm pretty doubtful you would be allowed to answer this question if you had the information available to you, but why couldn't the ps3 versions release just simply be delayed until the major errors were fixed?
Was it fear of backlash from the PS community? Were there corporate pressures from Sony forcing a same day release? Or was it more of a "have to strike while the iron is hot" sales strategy?

As a follow up to the above, has Bethesda learned from this rather large mistake and what steps are Bethesda going to take to ensure the same issues that plagued both Fallout & Skyrim do not happen again?

It's obvious to most on the outside that steps will have to be taken going forward in order to mend some seriously damaged fences. With that in mind what actions are Bethesda going to take to win back ps3 owners trust and ultimately their future support?

 

[KageMaru]

I mean, if they'd been upfront and said that they had canned the PS3 version because they couldn't get it to run well then it would be only fanboys complaining, because other people would just say "oh well I'll get the 360/PC version instead".

Studios usually don't decide what versions they can develop for and there's no way the publisher is going to pass up on the PS3's install base.

While I'm pretty doubtful you would be allowed to answer this question if you had the information available to you, but why couldn't the ps3 versions release just simply be delayed until the major errors were fixed?
Was it fear of backlash from the PS community? Were there corporate pressures from Sony forcing a same day release? Or was it more of a "have to strike while the iron is hot" sales strategy?

Wouldn't know the exact reason, but Sony does have a policy that additional content need to be included in the PS3 version if it's not released alongside the other versions. I imagine that played a part in it.

 

[Codeblue]

The publisher, it's really that simple.

Edit:

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure there are things the studio could have done better, but that's always the case even with more polished titles. In the end I don't think they deserve people literally saying "fuck you!" or to throw their apology back in their face.

I absolutely agree that the publisher is at fault and shares the majority of the blame. I don't think the developer is innocent though. You don't think anyone from the development team knew what was up? The least they could have done is throw a warning our way that the the console versions may not be at parity, particularly after seeing one of their co-workers lie about it?

 

[KageMaru]

I absolutely agree that the publisher is at fault and shares the majority of the blame. I don't think the developer is innocent though. You don't think anyone from the development team knew what was up? The least they could have done is throw a warning our way that the the console versions may not be at parity, particularly after seeing one of their co-workers lie about it?

I agree that things should have been handled differently by the developer.

If anything they should have just kept quiet, though I'm not familiar with the situation when they claimed parity. If they were pressured to give an answer, they had to say something. IF they truly believed the last minute fixes were sufficient, maybe they didn't think they were lying. Like I said, I'm not familiar with the situation, all I saw was the tweet which was made by Pete Hines who is part of the publishing and marketing branch, NOT the developer side.

However one thing's clear, they could not have told the community that the PS3 version was the inferior version. Pressure to hit parity is at an all time high by publishers and anyone on the team openly admitting that one version suffers would likely result in a termination.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Studios usually don't decide what versions they can develop for and there's no way the publisher is going to pass up on the PS3's install base.

Hey it's you again, the expert on how software companies are run in spite of never having worked for one. I notice that you've continued to repeat the claim that the technical guys had no hand in sending out the review builds and that it was all marketing despite my putting the lie to that claim several pages ago and you not responding.

But thanks for the info anyway, very informative and not something of which I was completely aware.

 

[ShinNL]

Problem is that it's not just the fanboys who are pissed at Beth right now, they appear to have made a concerted effort to deceive PS3 owners so it doesn't really matter whether you're a fanboy or not. I mean, if they'd been upfront and said that they had canned the PS3 version because they couldn't get it to run well then it would be only fanboys complaining, because other people would just say "oh well I'll get the 360/PC version instead".

Are you suggesting that 360 and PC owners are complaining as well? Because I'm not seeing that happening. The only ones holding a grudge atm are PS3 owners. Those from the side just see that they fixed the problem: it's strange to still hold a grudge afterwards.

 

[KageMaru]

Hey it's you again, the expert on how software companies are run in spite of never having worked for one. I notice that you've continued to repeat the claim that the technical guys had no hand in sending out the review builds and that it was all marketing despite my putting the lie to that claim several pages ago and you not responding.

But thanks for the info anyway, very informative and not something of which I was completely aware.

Wait, wat? I don't recall you responding to me, if so I didn't see it, sorry.

Man some of you guys really.....dickish when someone doesn't agree with you. =/

 

[SolidSnakex]

Are you suggesting that 360 and PC owners are complaining as well? Because I'm not seeing that happening. The only ones holding a grudge atm are PS3 owners. Those from the side just see that they fixed the problem: it's strange to still hold a grudge afterwards.

I believe that he's suggesting that this is an issue that all gamers should be upset about. Developers knowingly releasing broken products isn't something that deserves excuses.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Are you suggesting that 360 and PC owners are complaining as well? Because I'm not seeing that happening. The only ones holding a grudge atm are PS3 owners. Those from the side just see that they fixed the problem: it's strange to still hold a grudge afterwards.

Hi, I don't own a PS3. Did I just blow your mind?

I'm pissed off at Bethesda for this too, because I think it's seriously underhanded and shitty behaviour. If I buy Skyrim eventually I'll buy the PC version, but that doesn't change the fact that from an objective standpoint they have mislead and mistreated a group of their customers. And nothing they say now can change that.

Wait, wat? I don't recall you responding to me, if so I didn't see it, sorry.

Man some of you guys really.....dickish when someone doesn't agree with you. =/

Cool, well you should go back and look it up. You might even learn something!

And if you're going to call another man names you should at least have the balls to not be so passive-aggressive about it. I'm a big boy, I've been called much worse than a dick before.

I believe that he's suggesting that this is an issue that all gamers should be upset about. Developers knowingly releasing broken products isn't something that deserves excuses.

bro-fist.jpg

 

[Throwaway123456789]

Are you suggesting that 360 and PC owners are complaining as well? Because I'm not seeing that happening. The only ones holding a grudge atm are PS3 owners. Those from the side just see that they fixed the problem: it's strange to still hold a grudge afterwards.

There are tons of people doing that in this very thread, what the hell?

I haven't even played the PS3 version. I'm playing and enjoying the hell out of the 360 version and that one is filled with weird bugs as well. At least it's playable *shrug*.

 

[Vaporizer]

kagemeru,

to do in once is understandable, twice is pushing it, three times is taking the piss. It seems everytime bethesda releases something on the ps3 it's riddled with bugs and problems.

They knew the scale of the problem They knew skyrim ps3 was broken and yet they shipped it with no constraints. That's a complete disgrace. that's nothing more than daylight robbery of gamers. No excuses no sympathy.

If they said to the publisher, 'listen folks we can't release this game at the moment. It's unplayable' then the backlash would not be so great. Instead now after months later they are telling people on how sorry they are and they are doing everything to make things right. They should have done that alot earlier. Not when they ripped off gamers and counting the dollars of their loot.

 

[Stoffinator]

The publisher, it's really that simple.

Edit:

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure there are things the studio could have done better, but that's always the case even with more polished titles. In the end I don't think they deserve people literally saying "fuck you!" or to throw their apology back in their face.

Doesn't Bethesda self publish?

 

[ShinNL]

Hi, I don't own a PS3. Did I just blow your mind?

I'm pissed off at Bethesda for this too, because I think it's seriously underhanded and shitty behaviour. If I buy Skyrim eventually I'll buy the PC version, but that doesn't change the fact that from an objective standpoint they have mislead and mistreated a group of their customers. And nothing they say now can change that.

I thought you were going somewhere with your first sentence but then I realized you don't even own Skyrim. I seriously doubt you're holding a grudge as a non-owner, heck, I doubt you're even interested in these type of games. It's easy for you to pretend to have any emotion about something you have no passion for in the first place. Yes, I'm calling your bullshit right now.

If properly patching and fixing problems and bugs is considered mistreating, oh hell yeah, consider my mind blown.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

I thought you were going somewhere with your first sentence but then I realized you don't even own Skyrim. I seriously doubt you're holding a grudge as a non-owner, heck, I doubt you're even interested in these type of games. It's easy for you to pretend to have any emotion about something you have no passion for in the first place. Yes, I'm calling your bullshit right now.

If that's your only counter-argument then I declare myself the victor and demand the spoils. Also... do you realise that I maintain the Fallout 3 and New Vegas mods thread? Don't tell me I have no interest in these types of games.

If properly patching and fixing problems and bugs is considered mistreating, oh hell yeah, consider my mind blown.

So you're saying that it's better to say you're sorry than ask for permission?

The state in which the game released on PS3 was a shameful joke. They sent 360 review builds to PS3 exclusive publications. They mislead and mistreated a section of their customers and they deserve no sympathy for the relatively lukewarm rage being directed at them now.

 

[railGUN]

I thought you were going somewhere with your first sentence but then I realized you don't even own Skyrim. I seriously doubt you're holding a grudge as a non-owner, heck, I doubt you're even interested in these type of games. It's easy for you to pretend to have any emotion about something you have no passion for in the first place. Yes, I'm calling your bullshit right now.

If properly patching and fixing problems and bugs is considered mistreating, oh hell yeah, consider my mind blown.

I don't own it and I'm holding a major grudge. In fact, I have stated numerous times that I won't buy anything from Bethesda after this. Not because I was personally burned, but because I don't like companies that treat a portion of their customers like shit.

And how exactly do people without internet access patch their broken PS3 versions? I don't expect you to answer this though, as I've asked about half a dozen times in multiple threads that Bethesda employees have posted in, and have yet to receive an answer.

 

[gokieks]

Doesn't Bethesda self publish?

Bethesda Game Studios is an in-house development studio of Bethesda Softworks, the publishing arm of ZeniMax for PC/console games.

Whether you want to pin the blame on the development or the publishing side of things is almost irrelevant, because when it comes down to it it's the same company. And that company mislead a sizable portion of their customers in knowingly releasing a severely buggy, if not outright broken, product.

And somehow this isn't enough for some to understand the outrage of customers.