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[AcademicSaucer]

Turkey said it had carried out the strikes against "terrorist havens", vowing to continue acting against groups it links to the outlawed Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK).

In northeast Syria, strikes targeting the Kurdish People's Protection Units (YPG) -- who are leading the offensive against IS stronghold Raqa -- were reported to have killed 20 fighters.

In northern Iraq they killed six peshmerga fighters from the autonomous Kurdish government, usually allied with Ankara, in an apparent accident.

Baghdad condemned a "violation of international law and Iraqi sovereignty".

"The Iraqi government condemns and rejects the strikes carried out by Turkish aircraft on Iraqi territory," said government spokesman Saad al-Hadithi.

The United States said it was "deeply concerned".

"We are very concerned, deeply concerned that Turkey conducted air strikes earlier today in northern Syria as well as northern Iraq without proper coordination either with the United States or the broader global coalition to defeat ISIS," State Department spokesman Mark Toner said, using another acronym for the jihadist group.

The strikes underlined the complexities of the battlefields in Iraq and Syria, where twin US-backed offensives are seeking to dislodge IS from its last major urban strongholds.

They could also exacerbate tensions between Ankara and its NATO ally Washington, which leads an anti-IS coalition carrying out air strikes in Syria and Iraq and sees the Kurds as instrumental in the fight against IS.

- Turkish vow -

Turkey said its strikes aimed "to destroy terrorist havens targeting our country" and vowed to press the offensive "until the very last terrorist is neutralised".

An army statement said the strikes "destroyed" shelter areas, ammunition warehouses and PKK communications facilities.

It said 40 PKK fighters were "neutralised" in Iraq and around 30 in Syria.

Prime Minister Binali Yildirim said if the PKK threatens border securtity, Turkey "will take steps to remove this threat regardless of whether it comes from country A or country B".

"Dozens of simultaneous air strikes" targeted YPG positions near the Syrian city of Al-Malikiyah, including a media centre, a monitoring group said.

The strikes killed three media officers and 15 YPG fighters, one of the highest death tolls from Turkish air raids on Kurdish militia, said Syrian Observatory for Human Rights head Rami Abdel Rahman.

YPG spokesman Redur Khalil said 20 YPG fighters were killed and 18 wounded, three critically. Two civilians were also injured.

An AFP journalist saw collapsed buildings and rescuers searching through the rubble.

source: https://www.yahoo.com/news/turkish-strikes-kill-kurdish-fighters-syria-iraq-105044013.html

 

[TheRealTalker]

What I don't get is the Media's obsession of grouping every Kurd into one conglomerate group.


PKK/YPG are one of many Kurdish groups... There are some in the FSA or pure Kurdish groups like the Peshmerga or even some Kurds in ISIS.

Here is a list of some of these Kurdish majority or Kurdish only groups: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Kurdish_organisations

What the Media does is overly generalize everything by tossing every single Kurd underneath one bush, which in reality is stupid and also dangerous since some of these groups hate each other. It is like calling Deash/ISIS "The Arabs".

You see how STUPID that sounds?



Let me give you an example of the Kurdish rivalry...


The Turks attacked also Northern Iraq and accidentally Killed some Peshmerga when striking some PKK positions.

The Peshmerga and Kurds in that region are now wanting for the PKK to leave while an official statement addresses the issue:

Here is a tweet video of Kurdish Peshmerga protesting PKK's presence currently in the region: https://twitter.com/BaxtiyarGoran/status/857119232903065600


You see were this is going?

Literally having the Press make this into All Kurds vs Turkey or Kurds equal one group leads to simplifying a more complex scenario.


An example is that the PKK and its other affiliated groups are Marxists while some other Kurdish groups are not.

The PKK does terrorist attacks on civilians in Turkey while some other Kurdish groups (even within Turkey) do not.

The PKK/YPG/SDF or whatever other names they call themselves did operations for Assad and gave civilian towns to the regime while other Kurdish groups within Syria did not.

This simplification needs to end, really.

 

[Golden_Pigeon]

You have Kurdish group allied to Turkey, especially in Irak so...

And it's clearly an oriented title to specify that they are fighting ISIS. Turkey are fighting ISIS aswell and if YPG was targeted, it's because it's a PKK satelitte doing terror attack on turkish soil regularly.

 

[Golden_Pigeon]

Here is a tweet video of Kurdish Peshmerga protesting PKK's presence currently in the region: https://twitter.com/BaxtiyarGoran/status/857119232903065600

Very good info, thanks

 

[Frustrated_me]

Good post TheRealTalker.

It should also be noted that Turkey and the PKK have been going at each other in a civil war within Turkey for the past 30 years now.

Turkey is afraid that the US weapon aid given to the YPG (who fight ISIS in Syria) may land in the hands of PKK once the Syrian war is over. A legitimate concern IMO.

The YPG have been one of the most effective "boots on the ground" againts ISIS, it's going to be interesting how the US carefully thread through this one.

 

[TheRealTalker]

Good post TheRealTalker.

It should also be noted that Turkey and the PKK have been going at each other in a civil war within Turkey for the past 30 years now.

Turkey is afraid that the US weapon aid given to the YPG (who fight ISIS in Syria) may land in the hands of PKK once the Syrian war is over. A legitimate concern IMO.

The YPG have been one of the most effective "boots on the ground" againts ISIS, it's going to be interesting how the US carefully thread through this one.

@ bolded

indeed even the main opposition of Turkey brought out a statement supporting the airstrikes

this war between PKK affiliates and Turkey has been raging before Erdogan was ever in power

but it gets even more confusing:

Oops.. US military officer who visited #YPG sites hit by #Turkey was accompanied by #PKK military (HPG) commander:

- "Okay but maybe the US doesn't consider them as a terro-"

#pt: Sahin Cilo (real name: Ferhat Abdi Sahin) is also member of #PKK's transnational KCK leadership.

A designated terrorist, per U.S. law.

No surprise senior #PKK officials are at #YPG bases: it is the same organization, as in literally the same people.

http://bit.ly/2fMEFYq

And now it is escalting as YPG/PKK attacked a

VIDEO: Alleged footage of YPG forces in #Efrin #Syria firing an ATGM at a Turkish military position. - @ThomasOz_

So again this isn't anything new... it has bee going on for decades and literally the PKK isn't representing Kurds as a whole

 

[MonsterHunter]

Their success against Islamic State enrages Erdogan. He'll probably lash out with more airstrikes to deflect from his purges.
It's a little more successful than using the Jihadists Turkey supports.

 

[Golden_Pigeon]

Their success against Islamic State enrages Erdogan. He'll probably lash out with more airstrikes to deflect from his purges.
It's a little more successful than using the Jihadists Turkey supports.

My good friend,
I think you lack some basic knowledge about Turkey's role in Syria.

Here some exclusive intel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_military_intervention_in_Syria

So, yes. Turkey just finished a big military campaign against ISIS in Syria, so when they are targeting YPG/SDF, it's not because they are fighting ISIS but because of the link they have with PKK.

 

[Stereogatari]

Strikes PKK.

It's like saying strikes Muslims/Syrians/Sunnis instead of strikes ISIS.

 

[Sinfamy]

I miss 90's Turkey.

 

[bsp]

Conquer Turkey and give half to the Peshmerga/YPG, half to the Armenians.

 

[Golden_Pigeon]

I miss 90's Turkey.

Yes it was so much better:

1993–1999[edit source]
To counter the growing force of the PKK the Turkish military started new counter-insurgency strategies between 1992 and 1995. To deprive the rebels of a logistical base of operations and allegedly punishing local people supporting the PKK the military carried out de-forestation of the countryside and destroyed over 3,000 Kurdish villages, causing at least 2 million refugees. Most of these villages were evacuated, but other villages were burned, bombed, or shelled by government forces, and several entire villages were obliterated from the air. While some villages were destroyed or evacuated, many villages were brought to the side of the Turkish government, which offered salaries to local farmers and shepherds to join the Village Guards, which would prevent the PKK from operating in these villages, while villages which refused were evacuated by the military. These tactics managed to drive the rebels from the cities and villages into the mountains, although they still often launched reprisals on pro-government villages, which included attacks on civilians.[110]
[67]

The only good part was like 10 years ago, when Ankara and PKK was speaking to each other and were heading toward autonomization of Kurdish territory.

 

[Stereogatari]

Conquer Turkey and give half to the Peshmerga/YPG, half to the Armenians.

Peahmerga are allies with Turkey.

 

[vaderise]

What I don't get is the Media's obsession of grouping every Kurd into one conglomerate group.


PKK/YPG are one of many Kurdish groups... There are some in the FSA or pure Kurdish groups like the Peshmerga or even some Kurds in ISIS.

Here is a list of some of these Kurdish majority or Kurdish only groups: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Kurdish_organisations

What the Media does is overly generalize everything by tossing every single Kurd underneath one bush, which in reality is stupid and also dangerous since some of these groups hate each other. It is like calling Deash/ISIS "The Arabs".

You see how STUPID that sounds?



Let me give you an example of the Kurdish rivalry...


The Turks attacked also Northern Iraq and accidentally Killed some Peshmerga when striking some PKK positions.

The Peshmerga and Kurds in that region are now wanting for the PKK to leave while an official statement addresses the issue:



Here is a tweet video of Kurdish Peshmerga protesting PKK's presence currently in the region: https://twitter.com/BaxtiyarGoran/status/857119232903065600


You see were this is going?

Literally having the Press make this into All Kurds vs Turkey or Kurds equal one group leads to simplifying a more complex scenario.


An example is that the PKK and its other affiliated groups are Marxists while some other Kurdish groups are not.

The PKK does terrorist attacks on civilians in Turkey while some other Kurdish groups (even within Turkey) do not.

The PKK/YPG/SDF or whatever other names they call themselves did operations for Assad and gave civilian towns to the regime while other Kurdish groups within Syria did not.

This simplification needs to end, really.

Thanks for clarification. Much needed. PKK organised a lot of terrorist attacks in many cities past 10-15 years with a lot of civil casualties. I know thr western media is very supportive of this '' Freedom Fighters'' thing is a lot but here's a fact; People don't know even half of the shit going through. These terrorist attacks occured in cities i'm living in several times. Innocent people died. So Turkey is striking against a group considered as terrorists and it's a humanity crime now? Yeah, because Western countries are supporting them. Sure, why not?

 

[Hermii]

 

[TheRealTalker]

and now we see how over the top and overly complicated a scenario becomes due to twisting and turning one's creed instead of being straight forward.

Update:

Wow - U.S troops drove through #Qamishli today - part of which is still controlled by the #Assad regime - to deter #Turkey border incursion.

#pt: This US-#YPG-#SDF-#Turkey-FSA business in N. #Syria is a **mess.**

Totally avoidable.
&
Totally predictable.

... And it will get worse.

#pt: In order to meet short-term objective of ”defeating" #ISIS, the U.S has thrown itself into the middle of a 40-yr #Turkey-#PKK conflict.

#pt: In order to meet short-term objective of ”defeating" #ISIS, the U.S has thrown itself into the middle of a 40-yr #Turkey-#PKK conflict.

U.S. troops attend the funeral of Kurdish militants killed in #Turkey strikes...

... With flag of a Designated Terrorist Organization on show.

Just watch & wait to see how the U.S. must now ”own" what it's created -- repeatedly using troops as peacekeepers & human shields in #Syria.

When you look at this then you ask what the heck is the US even doing in Syria? That the US and other people in the so called Coalition are literally making thing more and more unnecessarily confusing and worse when it can be easily avoided.


The US basically opened a 40 year old gate to Hell because they wanted to solve a short term 5 year old scenario and then said FU to Turkey if a terror group uses the new area to inflict damage to Turkish cities.

Not only does it also fuel the other Kurdish groups rivalry and may lead later on to PKK offensives to gain other Kurdish group territories.