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U.S Fast Food workers protest for $15 minimum wage

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MVP said:
Then why work at all? Only reason to work is to make a better living?

No wonder this country has a reputation around the world as being lazy and entitled, unbelievable. I'd usually laugh and assume you were joking, so if you were then haha you got me, but I wouldn't be surprised if you were serious.
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You realize us "lazy and entitled" Americans work more than pretty much every other country and still get shat on by on employers right?
 
equippedwithtowel said:
Adults who work.

Full fucking stop. The living wage is by definition something we should aspire to extend to every citizen.
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That would push many companies into unprofitability, many companies which currently provide a "living" for people who otherwise wouldn't have one, but they made their life match their paycheck. Sure, it's not the Starbucks everyday and new iPhone every year life that people here think everyone is entitled to no matter how easy their job is, but a living nonetheless.
 
MVP said:
That would push many companies into unprofitability, many companies which currently provide a "living" for people who otherwise wouldn't have one, but they made their life match their paycheck. Sure, it's not the Starbucks everyday and new iPhone every year life that people here think everyone is entitled to no matter how easy their job is, but a living nonetheless.
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Yup, I'm sure the single Mom with three kids who's working 29 1/2 hours at two different fast food jobs is just throwing out dolla bills for some iPads. I'm sure she's getting out of her new Cadillac to buy some t-bone steaks too, right?
 
MVP said:
That would push many companies into unprofitability, many companies which currently provide a "living" for people who otherwise wouldn't have one, but they made their life match their paycheck. Sure, it's not the Starbucks everyday and new iPhone every year life that people here think everyone is entitled to no matter how easy their job is, but a living nonetheless.
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Point to one single person in this thread advocating this or quit strawmanning.
 
Why do you have to justify a living wage for the guy doing the unskilled labor, but no one asks the few living in opulence from their labor to justify their profits? Money gained from marketing a life of diabetes and heart disease to children, with the help of a fucking clown.
 
MVP said:
That would push many companies into unprofitability, many companies which currently provide a "living" for people who otherwise wouldn't have one, but they made their life match their paycheck. Sure, it's not the Starbucks everyday and new iPhone every year life that people here think everyone is entitled to no matter how easy their job is, but a living nonetheless.
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Yeah a living by making their employees go on public assistance programs and/or work 2 jobs and yet still in poverty. You know a living.
 
MVP said:
That would push many companies into unprofitability, many companies which currently provide a "living" for people who otherwise wouldn't have one, but they made their life match their paycheck. Sure, it's not the Starbucks everyday and new iPhone every year life that people here think everyone is entitled to no matter how easy their job is, but a living nonetheless.
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Companies deserve to exist more than citizens deserve to be able to live and eat?
 
MVP said:
That would push many companies into unprofitability, many companies which currently provide a "living" for people who otherwise wouldn't have one, but they made their life match their paycheck. Sure, it's not the Starbucks everyday and new iPhone every year life that people here think everyone is entitled to no matter how easy their job is, but a living nonetheless.
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Of course they're saying that, they don't want to increase wages. People's real purchasing power has been dropping since the late eighties, fixing that is entitlement?
 
MVP said:
That would push many companies into unprofitability, many companies which currently provide a "living" for people who otherwise wouldn't have one, but they made their life match their paycheck. Sure, it's not the Starbucks everyday and new iPhone every year life that people here think everyone is entitled to no matter how easy their job is, but a living nonetheless.
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Then they shouldn't exist. I am sick and tired of this country throwing huge swathes of people under the bus so a few people at the top can profit. Who, by the way, then spend their ridiculous sums of money on telling people like you that everyone working shit jobs are just lazy and entitled.

Oh, and other countries laugh at us for not having universal health care and slipping in literally every meaningful category, from education to happiness.
 
MVP said:
Because some jobs aren't meant to provide a living wage. How about we make sure people who deliver newspapers get $15/hr? How about people holding up cardboard signs outside of stores? How about we just literally wire unemployed people $15/hr "livable wages" for scratching their balls all day, to make it fair?

Where does it stop? What's the cut-off on who deserves a living wage and who doesn't? Is it just the mere fact that you are doing anything at all for a company that now entitles you to make a living off menial work?
.
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Jesus christ dude. Get some empathy. Every job should provide a liveable wage, especially when the job markets are incredibly competitive and difficult. Your whole attitude is dismissive of how hard retail and food work can actually be.

It astounds me that anyone would be against people making liveable wages. It's not asking for large amounts money, it's just making it so people can actually eat and live safely without fear of becoming homeless.
 
They're not going to get $15. Maybe $9-10, which it should be.

But if we want something more palatable and something that most people should be able to agree on, then as a stepping stone this country needs to at least index minimum wage to inflation. The fact that we have to manually catch up the minimum wage with the depreciating dollar only once every 10-12 years is ridiculous. You're effectively getting away with paying your employees less every year.
 
MVP said:
No, I live in the real world, this place seems to live in some fantasy world where fast food places should pay $15/hr and payday loans should have reasonable interest rates. I mean shit, McD's jobs aren't there to fund your retirement, they're there as a stepping stone, as an emergency, you're not meant to look at fast food joints as a place to hope to retire from, just like payday loans aren't meant to be reasonable, they have to be just shitty enough to make you not want to go through it again, same with fast food jobs. Come in, make your quick cash, and move on so the next person who needs quick cash can take your place, don't stay here and make this a living.

Minimum wage right now is too low yes, but $15/hr is a joke for some shit my little cousin can do. Get serious, if you can't EVER get a better job than that and have to live off it forever, then you don't have enough skills or drive to deserve $15/hr. People out there working jobs they can DIE in making less than $15/hr, and spoiled brats out here complaining they get screamed at or have to deal with managers so they "deserve" $15/hr.

I swear, I'm all for gay marriage and legalized marijuana, but this place is slowly turning me into a conservative. I feel it.
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I agree with the majority of this; especially your last paragraph xD
 
MVP said:
They absolutely do, I don't even really want to get into this debate, because people's feelings always end up getting hurt, but anyone without 5 kids or taking care of every member of their sick family who says they don't have time to improve their life is a liar, and/or is just unmotivated to do it and needs an excuse on why they can't.
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you left after your first paycheck? it sounds like you have the means that most people dont.
 
So the sentiment from some people in this thread is "if you weren't able to go to school, then get a career, tough luck, homelessness and death await you". Smh.
 
I need to know what some of you people do. I've never gone into a fast food place and thought the work they do was lesser. Hell they get me food for cheap when I need it they are probably more valuable than some of the people here.

And this idea that since some people are getting screwed they everyone should is silly.
 
MVP said:
Nothing less than $15/hr will provide food, shelter or healthcare nowadays.
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I'd like to see you get all that on a job without benefits. Especially adequate healthcare without relying on government subsidies. And to preface, I don't think the 15 dollar minimum wage should be done on a federal level but I don't know why I'm responding to a guy who thought the Heat were going to go 72-10 last year.
 
-COOLIO- said:
you left after your first paycheck? it sounds like you have the means that most people dont.
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I was 16 and living with my parents. Learned how to type faster and eventually got a job at Sprint Relay typing all day like a mindless drone making $8/hr. I should've demanded $15/hr.
 
MVP said:
I mean shit, McD's jobs aren't there to fund your retirement, they're there as a stepping stone, as an emergency, you're not meant to look at fast food joints as a place to hope to retire from, just like payday loans aren't meant to be reasonable, they have to be just shitty enough to make you not want to go through it again, same with fast food jobs.
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Literally how can a job that pays 7.25 an hour be a stepping stone? It's not even a liveable wage.
 
equippedwithtowel said:
When capitalists ask for more then the bare minimum they need it's a bargaining technique.

When service workers do it it's whiny entitlement.
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Well if it's a negotiation tactic then I'm all for it. Hell, ask for $20 and maybe you'll get $15.

My points are mainly for the people who act like $15/hr is the bare minimum needed to not be living on the streets eating from trashcans.

ezrarh said:
I'd like to see you get all that on a job without benefits. Especially adequate healthcare without relying on government subsidies. And to preface, I don't think the 15 dollar minimum wage should be done on a federal level but I don't know why I'm responding to a guy who thought the Heat were going to go 72-10 last year.
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Why not rely on government subsidies if that's what they are there for? They could have gone 72-10 if they wanted to, Lebron won 66 games with Cleveland with no help, Miami wasn't 6 games better?
 
Booty Patrol said:
Literally how can a job that pays 7.25 an hour be a stepping stone? It's not even a liveable wage.
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From what I understand, McDonald's doesn't keep people at minimum wage for long, which is cool if not amazing or anything. They and retail often have an interest in keeping good people who aren't going to bail in a month or so.
 
I'd have to say that if only this were to go into effect, I could understand the argument of those who work much harder and more skillful professions. If it were me, everyone would get a massive pay increase due to inflation but because that's not going to happen, lets be real.

I recently threw my hat into a subject such as this months ago where I compared the starting salary of a Firefighter/Paramedic in my city during the time in which we had Financial urgency. At that time, we had guys starting at $13/hr. Think about that for a second, people who save lives/property and are subject to disease, infection, physical and mental harm constantly were getting paid shit. If this subject were to be brought up then, i'd laugh and tell whoever the fuck suggested it to throw themselves into a river. However, bringing other people down is not the right way to handle things.

I'm all for a pay increase to MAYBE $10/hr and even that's pushing it due to how menial that job really is. Like I stated above, when you have people in professions that are actually doing work that's worth a shit making less than what's being asked here, there's issues.
 
MVP said:
My points are mainly for the people who act like $15/hr is the bare minimum needed to not be living on the streets eating from trashcans.
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That's the thing... it's higher then the Bare Minimum. Living wage notionally includes a degree of human dignity.

edit: actual readability
 
MVP said:
I was 16 and living with my parents. Learned how to type faster and eventually got a job at Sprint Relay typing all day like a mindless drone making $8/hr. I should've demanded $15/hr.
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then do you really feel qualified to give the bootstrap lecture without working a full time minimum wage job as an adult with responsibilities?
 
equippedwithtowel said:
That's the thing... it's higher then the Bare Minimum. Living wage notionally includes a degree of human dignity.

edit: actual readability
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Yes but raising the minimum wage to that level, like I said before, would shut down a lot of the companies who provide people with the living they have now, people who don't whine about how they need $15, but people that have made $10/hr work. If those companies close, you think they are all going to get hired by the companies that now pay $15/hr?

You'll have people who went from a bare minimum living to no living, but I can tell people here just think of things from one side and don't really think of the long-term effects. Same people arguing against payday loans, instead of giving people in dire straits any help at all, nah fuck it, reasonable interest rate loan or NO loan and I'll live on the street. $15/hr or NO job. Time to get back to reality.
 
MVP said:
You're right, why strive for anything in life when you can pass out flyers all day and make a living.
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I don't think you understand.

You said minimum wage jobs are a stepping stone. When I think of the phase 'stepping stone', I think of an opportunity that gives you the chance to get by while finding something better for yourself. Minimum wage employment in the US does not offer you that kind of opportunity. Good luck keeping a roof over your head making minimum wage. Of course, you can make more than that by not being a lazy fuck and working two jobs, but how are you gonna find the time to improve your situation while in that position?
 
backslashbunny said:
No, silly. Companies deserve to have billions of dollars in PROFIT NOT REVENUE, more than citizens deserve to live and eat.




Bolded, amen. America is going to the shits. Just look at the Scandinavian's quality of life, and even Canada... and then us. wtf.
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The sad thing is, Canada isn't great either, particularly in Vancouver where the living costs are insane while minimum wage is the lowest in the country. :/
 
MVP said:
Yes but raising the minimum wage to that level, like I said before, would shut down a lot of the companies who provide people with the living they have now, people who don't whine about how they need $15, but people that have made $10/hr work. If those companies close, you think they are all going to get hired by the companies that now pay $15/hr?

You'll have people who went from a bare minimum living to no living, but I can tell people here just think of things from one side and don't really think of the long-term effects. Same people arguing against payday loans, instead of giving people in dire straits any help at all, nah fuck it, reasonable interest rate loan or NO loan and I'll live on the street. $15/hr or NO job. Time to get back to reality.
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If people had more money to spend then they would spend more.

Yeah those whiners wanting to be able to actually live.

Somehow companies survived in the past when minimum wage was comparable to 15-20$ an hour.
 
outunderthestars said:
Just for a frame of reference, in my town in NC a living wage is $10.00 per hour according to that site.
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And it says NYC is $12.75. The point is that the $15/hr is a starting point in the negotiations. $15 would be great, but I guarantee if $12.75 was offered that everyone would readily agree. It's like no one understands how to negotiate, you start high so the other side can talk you down to the number you actually want and not feel like they got hosed. It's just like how management will always low ball you at first then slowly increase their offer.
 
MVP said:
Yes but raising the minimum wage to that level, like I said before, would shut down a lot of the companies who provide people with the living they have now, people who don't whine about how they need $15, but people that have made $10/hr work. If those companies close, you think they are all going to get hired by the companies that now pay $15/hr?

You'll have people who went from a bare minimum living to no living, but I can tell people here just think of things from one side and don't really think of the long-term effects. Same people arguing against payday loans, instead of giving people in dire straits any help at all, nah fuck it, reasonable interest rate loan or NO loan and I'll live on the street. $15/hr or NO job. Time to get back to reality.
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I think more than anything people are arguing for unshackling our country and culture from the absolute vicegrip executed by corporations. Workers' rights depreciate as quickly as their value, whereupon people become disposable and dependent on the government regardless. America fails a great many of its citizens in a variety of ways, and it is the privileged and informed and powerful who are taking advantage of this malfeasance.
 
backslashbunny said:
Bolded, amen. America is going to the shits. Just look at the Scandinavian's quality of life, and even Canada... and then us. wtf.
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You know that they aren't really that different. You're going to find all these countries in the same decile.

Compare the median standard of living to Eastern Europe, Asia as a whole, South America...
 
reckless said:
If people had more money to spend then they would spend more.
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But is the $8/hr extra money to spend more or to reach the bare minimum of liveability?

Trey said:
I think more than anything people are arguing for unshackling our country and culture from the absolute vicegrip executed by corporations. Workers' rights depreciate as quickly as their value, whereupon people become disposable and dependent on the government regardless. America fails a great many of its citizens in a variety of ways, and it is the privileged and informed and powerful who are taking advantage of this malfeasance.
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Agreed with all of this, I'm the "fuck corporations" type, but people here are arguing that $15/hr should be the bare minimum anyone makes no matter what they do, and that's just bullshit.
 
B-Dubs said:
And it says NYC is $12.75. The point is that the $15/hr is a starting point in the negotiations. $15 would be great, but I guarantee if $12.75 was offered that everyone would readily agree. It's like no one understands how to negotiate, you start high so the other side can talk you down to the number you actually want and not feel like they got hosed. It's just like how management will always low ball you at first then slowly increase their offer.
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How do workers negotiate when they literally have no leverage? They can be fired and replaced with incredible ease as their jobs, by design, have an absurdly low skill level and take a few hours to train someone to do?
 
MVP said:
But is the $8/hr extra money to spend more or to reach the bare minimum of liveability?



Agreed with all of this, I'm the "fuck corporations" type, but people here are arguing that $15/hr should be the bare minimum anyone makes no matter what they do, and that's just bullshit.
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Both...

Yeah its too low if minimum wage kept up with inflation and productivity it would be over $20 an hour.
 
outunderthestars said:
How do workers negotiate when they literally have no leverage? They can be fired and replaced with incredible ease as their jobs, by design, have an absurdly low skill level and take a few hours to train someone to do?
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Congress and the individual state legislatures are responsible for the minimum wages. They are the ones that these workers need to convince, not management. My mention of management was just as an example everyone would have experience with.
 
B-Dubs said:
Congress and the individual state legislatures are responsible for the minimum wages. They are the ones that these workers need to convince, not management.
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Well the people that need help have no money for campaign contributions so that ain't gonna work.
 
B-Dubs said:
Congress and the individual state legislatures are responsible for the minimum wages. They are the ones that these workers need to convince, not management. My mention of management was just as an example everyone would have experience with.
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How much lobbying power does the $7.25/hr crowd have?
 
MVP said:
Minimum wage right now is too low yes, but $15/hr is a joke for some shit my little cousin can do. Get serious, if you can't EVER get a better job than that and have to live off it forever, then you don't have enough skills or drive to deserve $15/hr. People out there working jobs they can DIE in making less than $15/hr, and spoiled brats out here complaining they get screamed at or have to deal with managers so they "deserve" $15/hr.

I swear, I'm all for gay marriage and legalized marijuana, but this place is slowly turning me into a conservative. I feel it.
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WTF. Maybe you know people in dangerous work should be paid more?
 
MVP said:
You're right, why strive for anything in life when you can pass out flyers all day and make a living.
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who are you to tell me what i am allowed to strive for in life? maybe i like passing out those god damn flyers and i do a damn good job at it.
 
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