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Valve locks Dota 2 game modes behind Kickstarter-esque goals.
- Thread starter Archie
- Start date
The issue here is that you are purchasing a product, The Compendium, which has it's own features and rewards that are valuable to the International's festivities, while you can also level it up for different rewards. A quarter of the purchases go towards the prize pool. It isn't crowd funding specifically for the new modes or any of the tiered bonuses, it's crowd funding for additional funds to the prize pool. Furthermore, any feature involving game mechanics is available to everyone, not just compendium owners. For the minority that may be purchasing the compendium just for a game mode, you should really ask them why they are doing it. I would guess that most people are purchasing to both take part in the compendium activities during the event as well as help support the competitors taking part
And still people do not understand it or are to biased to even play dota 2 or even know what is really happening and just complain for the sake of complaining.
blitzcloud
Banned
I just said that I don't like the precedent. Sugarcoating it with virtual items doesn't change it.
Economically, it's a good idea, I just don't like it. I didn't like the crate system and it proved that they'll release anything that can potentially make money even if it butchers the artstyle. As the above poster says anyways, I shouldn't care because I don't play dota. Wrong... this can possibly be contagious to other games/genres.
The problem is the premise that this funding being successful unlocks the gamemodes. It's a reverse psychology tactic that builds on social power to combat the imposition.
"So you're telling me that for $10 i'm letting everyone have new gamemodes, items (virtual, they hold no value other than what's imposed by the company), I also take part on the compendium and i'm making the prize pool bigger? Count me in!"
They're just exploiting what is known about the crowdfunding phenomenon.
Me not liking it has nothing to do with the value the product holds or how financially successful it's going to be.
In the other post you mentioned TF2 and I agree with you a bit there. All valve do in terms of cosmetics, is make sure the broadly match the aesthetics. From the very start of Dota2 however, they made a very concerted effort to make sure that the themes and aesthetics for the cosmetics maintain the integrity and style of the art by screening the workshop user content. You would be hard pressed to find any type of cosmetics that look out of place in the game. The original FAQ about such issues that was put out when the original beta started has been adhered to, at least in my experience http://www.dota2.com/spoilsofwar/faq
Back to the "funding" stuff, do you understand what the compendium is, what it does, and why the majority that watch the tournament wants it and need it?
This sentence tells me that you probably don't, as that isn't the full story and I suggest you read up on it, if you care enough. I'll try now but I'm not going to able to write it all here and go into things like the fantasy league, fan card systems, objectives, random hero quest and a like.
You are entitled to your own opinion of course, but I get the distinct impression that you think people are not buying the compendium with full knowledge of what it does, why they want it, and what makes it so sought after during the international events. Without it, the entire viewing experience of the event is different, and a lot less interactive and rewarding in the long term. On top of that, people like to support the prize pool as it goes directly to the winners and losers of the competition throughout. Others like to buy it to be involved and collect as much of the rare and mythical drops in the event to sell later for profit, while other want that stuff anyway. On top of that comes the tier goals, which happens to include 2 game modes. Again, you would have to determine why people are buying the compendium. So far at least looking at the previous threads and my own friends, it is for the above reasons than for a specific game mode.
Several people have pointed out what happened last year - a stretch goal to allow compendium owners to choose what the new Dota2 characters would be was added, but the goal wasn't met. A few months later they came out anyway, although not necessarily the choice that the compendium owners would have voted for.
Also the whole items value being governed by valve is half true in that they can choose the scarcity of the items, but the can't control user pricing directly and in fact greatly benefit by essentially triple dipping since every transaction gives valve a cut, so the more sales, the better.
Anyway, my point before and again is simply that I have yet to see anyone that is buying the compendium and saying that "OMG, I wanted the new game mode so I bought 10". People want to be involved in the international event rather than just spectating, and to do that you have to buy and activate the compendium and follow the tournament with it. In fact, that is even the item description of the compendium. The fact that a game mode is a tier unlock is of no consequence to the vast majority that value the compendium
To clarify, IF they were to accept money just to reach that goal of a game mode, I would completely agree with you
Dreams-Visions
Member
You got it, n0tail.
Also, good luck at TI4. Your GAF fanbase runs deep. Style on them bitches, homie.
I don't even know how to respond to something like this.
Oh noes didn't see this post it's n0tail from fnatic! And yes i agree with this post.
Spirit of Jazz
Banned
I don't buy cosmetics but I'll happily buy the compendium each year to support a game I play regularly and the teams at The International.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Considering the userbase, people want the pudge courier more.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Battle Point Bonuses are temporary, but they just increase the pace at which you level which only increases the pace you get drops (since you get a drop every level). They last for like three months tho
Everything else, couriers, loading screens, new game modes, that's all permanent
blitzcloud
Banned
The problem is including the gamemode part as a clause. They're preaching "power to the people" of kickstarter inducing a psychological behavior of the user being the decider of gamemodes being or not being implemented. This will turn, in the long run, into normal behavior.
Can't prove it to you right now, for reasons of long-term evolution. What I can tell you is: anything that gives less risk and more benefit is bound to be used by any company.
blitzcloud
Banned
Hey there, i'm not saying that other companies do it better. Valve is still on the top in terms of content for free delivery. But I'd dislike if people embrace valve so much that they don't see the bad into placing the modes as a stretch goal, because that traslates into other companies thinking "they'll gladly pay for it as long as..." and that's why I said I believe it sets a bad precedent.
Nothing else.
SteveWinwood
Member
yeah thats not the real notail we went through this last time
hbkajshdvfbkjhvgkahsgdfka
Member
Whoa. n0tail posts on GAF
I think it's weird to put these features on a f2p game. Not because valvesogreed, but rather that this is an evolving game with features being added all the time.
So if the goal isn't met are they saying that these features will never come out? If they're not, then what's the point of the goal, to get it sooner? How much sooner? Etc.
So if the goal isn't met are they saying that these features will never come out? If they're not, then what's the point of the goal, to get it sooner? How much sooner? Etc.
If last year's failed "pick what hero we do next" goal was any indication, sooner. Would be a little insane to hold back heroes or features because a TI kickstarter didn't reach them.
If Valve's past behavior is any indication, the stretch goals are just pushing fun things (completely unnecessary to the base game) to the top of the priority list
Purchasers are given the Compendium (an interactive guide throughout the event) and if they decide to spend more money, they get more in-game cosmetics/items.
On top of all that, 25% of the purchases go directly into the prize pool.
It feels like the people who see this as a negative are just uninformed when it comes to what the money is actually being spent on.
Maybe they'd work over their usual time commitment to get them done ASAP
Awesome, it's n0tail on gaf