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[GameFreak117x]

Do you realy believe that? I understand that the Wii U is a big failure and that the 3ds is not as big a success as their other handhelds, but one missed generation in a console business is not a long time if we look at the dynamics of the market. They certainly seem to have an interesting idea with the NX.

They haven't lead any generation since the NES... (MAYBE a little whith the SNES; I don't recall.)

Either way all this means is that people will play Mario on their phones and give people even less of a reason to buy Nintendo Hardware.

 

[The Boat]

You misunderstand. I didn't say no one respects Nintendo hardware. I said no one respects Nintendo in particular for their hardware. Their hardware is a very small contribution to society and culture moving forward. It simply hasn't been a valuable part of their business for a long time now. It is only a big part of their business because they force it to be.

Well if we're talking about society and culture moving forward in regards to videogames I also have to disagree. Motion controls and touch screens had a huge, huge impact in how people interact with videogames and on what sorts of games could be made, especially with regards to accessibility.
Before everyone was playing on their phones, touching and tilting, playing simple games in short bursts and trying new concepts to attract non gamers, Nintendo was doing this and making a killing with Wii and DS.

They haven't lead any generation since the NES... (MAYBE a little whith the SNES; I don't recall.)

.

You must live in some sort of alternate reality.

 

[Dark Cloud]

They haven't lead any generation since the NES... (MAYBE a little whith the SNES; I don't recall.)

Either way all this means is that people will play Mario on their phones and give people even less of a reason to buy Nintendo Hardware.

The Wii just lead last generation and motion controls have become more of a staple moving forward. The DS with touchscreen gaming was big and lead last gen and nobody was even close to it. The Wii U is was a mess up, but the 3DS is doing good.

 

[cws]

You misunderstand. I didn't say no one respects Nintendo hardware. I said no one respects Nintendo in particular for their hardware. Their hardware is a very small contribution to society and culture moving forward. It simply hasn't been a valuable part of their business for a long time now. It is only a big part of their business because they force it to be.

Nah, a lot of their software offering were memorably because of the hardware they used and provided. You think Mario 64 would have taken off in the same way without the Analog Stick ? Wii Sports with out the Wii Remote ? Nintendogs without the Touchscreen ?

Nintendo as a hardware company bring a lot to the table - saying that part is irrelevant is wrong. Sure the IPs are most valuable part - but hardware design and the devs at Nintendo are part of why the IPs are so valuable +30 years in.

They haven't lead any generation since the NES... (MAYBE a little whith the SNES; I don't recall.)

Might wanna do some research. Also didnt know that everything you do is irrelevant unless you are the market leader.

 

[ksamedi]

They haven't lead any generation since the NES... (MAYBE a little whith the SNES; I don't recall.)

Either way all this means is that people will play Mario on their phones and give people even less of a reason to buy Nintendo Hardware.

You just ignored huge contributions like Wii and DS. And they definitely did lead. It took twice the time for other consoles to reach the numbers those consoles did in 4 years.

 

[Milly Osworth]

Nintendo got smart.

 

[Neoleo2143]

Do you realy believe that? I understand that the Wii U is a big failure and that the 3ds is not as big a success as their other handhelds, but one missed generation in a console business is not a long time if we look at the dynamics of the market. They certainly seem to have an interesting idea with the NX.

I genuinely think that handhelds are shrinking, If Nintendo were to go "Third Party", I would think they would go to the platform with the best Margins which is PC. Unfortunately, they would likely be hurt somewhat by PC consumer culture in the short term, but they could work their hardware division for those weird games that need them and their audience would easily be able to get to their games without a huge 300 dollar entrance fee, which means that this "Seeding" that they're trying to do would likely have more impact.

 

[Yukinari]

Nintendo should partner up with Hipster Whale to make a Nintendo Crossy Road.

Ive been periodically playing Disney Crossy Road because its addictive and has a good business model.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Just need to look at the stock market to know why.

With the tight margins and very same-y hardware of today I'm having trouble seeing why anyone would want to invest in making dedicated hardware for living room use. Handhelds, however, I can still see them doing because they actually have a good grasp of that market, even if smartphones are eating into it.

Looks at Sony's bottom line that's why

 

[correojon]

You misunderstand. I didn't say no one respects Nintendo hardware. I said no one respects Nintendo in particular for their hardware. Their hardware is a very small contribution to society and culture moving forward. It simply hasn't been a valuable part of their business for a long time now. It is only a big part of their business because they force it to be.

I´m not saying Nintendo invented motion controls with the Wii, but I think there´s no denying the importance the way they implemented them have in the control schemes of things like VR. Not to talk about how it pushed Microsoft to invest in Kinect or Sony in Move (again, used for VR). The SNES pad has been the template for every controller released since, the analog stick made 3D gameplay possible, rumble...

They may have left the power race long ago, but it doesn´t mean they aren´t contributing to hardware in other ways. Sony and MS have opted for the linear way (more power and that´s it) while Nintendo follows a disruptive way were somethings may fail really hard and others become inimaginable breakthroughs.

 

[eXistor]

Mario Run is literally the most obvious and smart thing they could do, so I hope it works out for them

 

[Deku Tree]

Well he's 100% correct.

 

[Toadthemushroom]

It started to shift in the 90s, when kids were growing up with PS1 instead of N64, and it only got worse later.

Nope. The Game Boy became more popular with a younger audience worldwide and as an entry level games platform for that younger audience that generation thanks to Pokémon, and Game Boy Advance carried on that torch (it was the fastest selling system in Japan).

Meanwhile, while Game Boy was making up for N64's weaknesses in Europe and Japan the N64 wasn't a loss in North America. It cultivated the Xbox audience a generation before Microsoft entered the race, thanks to a host of great FPSes and solid support for other genres, like sports titles, from western third parties. And, er, Pokémon spinoffs. That's the reason why Nintendo managed to almost retain the SNES's install base numbers in North America.

And, well, there was then the DS and Wii, which sold through 250 million units combined across a single console generation, and a heap of software to go with it. Games like Mario Kart Wii sold 40 million units, and would have been an influential point of contact for many younger players.

The shift has definitely started this generation, not back with the PS1. 3DS has basically done a reverse N64, with sales holding up in Japan but falling off hugely elsewhere compared with the last generation. We're seeing the effects of the shift to smart devices right now, as Japanese publishers traditionally invested heavily in Nintendo handhelds are putting more of their eggs in the mobile basket. Just look at Level-5's new mobile-centric lineup.

The short story is: Handhelds have always been the most accessible way for Nintendo to reach the widest audiences, let alone younger audiences. And this generation has seen Nintendo's dominance of the handheld market - as an entry level device for portable games - diminish.

 

[Breads]

Took em an embarassingly long time to do it but I hope they make a mint making games for smart phones. It's what I've been asking for for years. Sadly the fact that the 3ds is a seperate device is a big reason why I don't even use it. Their handheld experiances have always been top notch and I hope they put an earnest effort behind this kind of gaming experiance.

 

[Hero]

You misunderstand. I didn't say no one respects Nintendo hardware. I said no one respects Nintendo in particular for their hardware. Their hardware is a very small contribution to society and culture moving forward. It simply hasn't been a valuable part of their business for a long time now. It is only a big part of their business because they force it to be.

Are we just ignoring the Wii and DS here?

 

[jroc74]

They haven't lead any generation since the NES... (MAYBE a little whith the SNES; I don't recall.)

Either way all this means is that people will play Mario on their phones and give people even less of a reason to buy Nintendo Hardware.

I know you didnt mention the Wii but this point still stands in regards to the post this was responding to.

For home consoles the Wii U wasnt a missed generation, it was a continuation of home console sales decline for Nintendo.

The Wii just disrupted that trend, thats it. And with the NX being what it is I dont even know if we can count it as a home console. You have NES and Wii as the only home console market leaders for Nintendo over the years.

I think that was the point of this post.

Nintendo is still fine doing handhelds...but home consoles its looking kinda bleak.

 

[E-Cat]

Miyamoto two years ago on casual gamers: "It's a Pathetic Thing”

Their attitude is, ‘okay, I am the customer. You are supposed to entertain me.’ It’s kind of a passive attitude they’re taking, and to me it’s kind of a pathetic thing. They do not know how interesting it is if you move one step further and try to challenge yourself [with more advanced games].

So much for that, I guess.

 

[JoeM86]

Miyamoto two years ago on casual gamers: "It's a Pathetic Thing”
So much for that, I guess.

I dunno, from what we've seen with Super Mario Run, that seems to be the concept behind it. You get more coins for doing more challenging jumps

 

[E-Cat]

I dunno, from what we've seen with Super Mario Run, that seems to be the concept behind it. You get more coins for doing more challenging jumps

Yeah, but let's be honest here: it's a very contrived concept, and you're not going to get much depth out of it.

A game born out of market necessity.

 

[jroc74]

You misunderstand. I didn't say no one respects Nintendo hardware. I said no one respects Nintendo in particular for their hardware. Their hardware is a very small contribution to society and culture moving forward. It simply hasn't been a valuable part of their business for a long time now. It is only a big part of their business because they force it to be.

When I saw a mod go with this point I said uh oh....triggered....lol This and 3rd party? Damn man...

I would agree for their home consoles but not for peripherals, controllers, etc.

Or maybe you should have said no one respects Nintendo for their hardware anymore.

Its amazing the shift in popularity from Wii to Wii U for Nintendo. Handhelds? They're still hanging in there. With the only other competition for dedicated handhelds being Sony...and how bad the Vita did Nintendo should be fine.

But like what this thread is about...mobile phones is really shaking/has shaken things up for handhelds.

But even for hardware from any of the big 3, we see how one generation the market leader can switch places. Hardware is only a part of it. If ppl really cared about hardware the Wii U would be leading with Sony in last place if going from gen to gen and retaining loyalty. If Sony was to close up shop right now and their games went to MS or Nintendo, many wouldnt bat an eye.

Just like when Sega got out the console business. Its the games at the end of the day, I agree with that 100%.

 

[axisofweevils]

They haven't lead any generation since the NES... (MAYBE a little whith the SNES; I don't recall.)

Either way all this means is that people will play Mario on their phones and give people even less of a reason to buy Nintendo Hardware.

Pokemon Go has already proved the opposite. Sales of the main Pokemon games dramatically increased.

 

[IAmAnAgnostic]

You know, I didn't think much of Nintendo mobile games when they were announced, but Pokemon Go (I know it wasn't made by Nintendo) and now Mario Run are not your average shovel-ware. Sony for example has had mobile titles before using their gaming brands, but all of them have been between terrible and average and thus failed.

I don't think they could have done a better job of porting Mario to smartphones and I was quite impressed with what they showed. I'll almost certainly get it once the game hits Android.

 

[JoeM86]

Pokemon Go has already proved the opposite. Sales of the main Pokemon games dramatically increased.

And with Super Mario Run coming out around the same time as Super Mario Maker for Nintendo 3DS...

You know, I didn't think much of Nintendo mobile games, but Pokemon Go (I know it wasn't made solely by Nintendo) and now this Mario Run are not your average shovel-ware.

I agree, but I corrected that for you Nintendo had a big hand in the creation of GO.

 

[QisTopTier]

battery drain and heat during most long term phone game use makes me continue to avoid them on my phone. Which sucks cause some things are pretty solid.

and I cant ever be in a situation with a dead or near dead phone for safety reasons

 

[TheDinoman]

Nintendo is still fine doing handhelds...but home consoles its looking kinda bleak.

I'd imagine that's why the NX is supposed to be a hybrid that bridges the gap between their console and handheld divisions.

 

[Theonik]

I was discussing this with a friend and might have posted this on GAF threads about Nintendo third party. Nintendo and especially their prized brands cannot survive without exposure.

If kids don't get exposed to Mario they won't become future customers so this approach is a good compromise to going completely third party. Nx will be the real test though.

 

[JoeM86]

battery drain and heat during most long term phone game use makes me continue to avoid them on my phone. Which sucks cause some things are pretty solid.

and I cant ever be in a situation with a dead or near dead phone for safety reasons

Sounds like it's time to get burner phones

 

[GameFreak117x]

I know you didnt mention the Wii but this point still stands in regards to the post this was responding to.

For home consoles the Wii U wasnt a missed generation, it was a continuation of home console sales decline for Nintendo.

The Wii just disrupted that trend, thats it. And with the NX being what it is I dont even know if we can count it as a home console. You have NES and Wii as the only home console market leaders for Nintendo over the years.

I think that was the point of this post.

Nintendo is still fine doing handhelds...but home consoles its looking kinda bleak.

Wow yeah I forgot about the Wii lolz. But yeah that was exactly my point. And I don't see the NX selling close to what the Wii did or the 3DS. I think a lot of people got burned with the Wii U so I wouldn't be surprised to see the NX do slightly worse.

 

[SenkiDala]

Oh I thought it was for money! I must be naive.

 

[QisTopTier]

Sounds like it's time to get burner phones

They already burn my hands

 

[GCX]

You know, I didn't think much of Nintendo mobile games when they were announced, but Pokemon Go (I know it wasn't made by Nintendo) and now Mario Run are not your average shovel-ware. Sony for example has had mobile titles before using their gaming brands, but all of them have been between terrible and average and thus failed.

I don't think they could have done a better job of porting Mario to smartphones and I was quite impressed with what they showed. I'll almost certainly get it once the game hits Android.

It also makes a difference how they announced the game (compared to Sony's mobile game efforts for example). Showing it off at Apple's keynote with Miyamoto tells a different story about how serious they are than just dumping it on the App Store when it's ready.

 

[GameFreak117x]

Pokemon Go has already proved the opposite. Sales of the main Pokemon games dramatically increased.

Pokemon games always sell. If mainstream pokemon games ever made it to phones on top of Nintendo games (Mario, etc) They might as well kiss their hardware sales goodbye.

 

[Aureon]

With the tight margins and very same-y hardware of today I'm having trouble seeing why anyone would want to invest in making dedicated hardware for living room use. Handhelds, however, I can still see them doing because they actually have a good grasp of that market, even if smartphones are eating into it.

50% more revenue from software.

Selling on not-yours console, or smartphones, or steam, is a 30% cut. 70->100 is +50%, and obviously huge.

 

[jroc74]

I'd imagine that's why the NX is supposed to be a hybrid that bridges the gap between their console and handheld divisions.

Yea...I think Nintendo is hoping for another disruption with the NX. Time will tell. I know for mobile phones one thing I and many like about Android is that you can do so much with one.

When the phones came out that could be connected to TV's and you could mirror the phone screen to TV? It was magical, lol

Many praise Off TV Play for the Wii U. Remote Play for the Vita.

Nintendo has a shot with the NX to capture some of that magic back. Might be a good idea to try to capture that vs any Wii magic. Or a combo of both like the rumors, patents show.

 

[Diprosalic]

It started to shift in the 90s, when kids were growing up with PS1 instead of N64, and it only got worse later.

But a late 90s game just became the biggest mobile game thanks to nostalgia. So i would wager that a good amount of kids first exposure to games in the 90s was on a nintendo system and then DS/Wii happened.

 

[DoomGaze]

The hate for Nintendo is palpable.

 

[SporeCrawler]

Basically its advertisement. Good move imho

 

[Theonik]

Oh I thought it was for money! I must be naive.

Nintendo's brands are what makes them money. Protecting them should be Nintendo's priority.

 

[IAmAnAgnostic]

Basically its advertisement. Good move imho

I think it could be very successful. Runners are popular, and this will have actual level design, and superior yet still simple gameplay and a famous brand behind it.

 

[Hermii]

And he got the idea of the game from seeing his wife play smartphone games. (Which is later in the article.)

I guess he wanted to up his wife o meter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GMybmWHzfU

Why is Miyamoto the only one who has ideas at Nintendo?

 

[heidern]

You misunderstand. I didn't say no one respects Nintendo hardware. I said no one respects Nintendo in particular for their hardware. Their hardware is a very small contribution to society and culture moving forward. It simply hasn't been a valuable part of their business for a long time now. It is only a big part of their business because they force it to be.

You really believe Nintendo would be better off making Vita games?

 

[PtM]

Their strategy is IMO pretty intelligent.

They're trying to use this as a tool to create a new generation of kids that experiences Nintendo and, hopefully, wants to get everything Nintendo (as in, the NX. You know how kids are!). They're trying to figure out ways to create new generations of kids that will develop a nostalgic/emotional attachment to Nintendo experiences so that they can simultaneously profit off of their current self as kids via their parents and also off their future nostalgic adult selves. Just like they have been profiting out of people like me.

If they made a typical shallow, abusively F2P experience, kids would just grow out of it like they've done with Angry Birds and countless other mobile hot shots.

Another thing is, bought apps could ease the transition to console gaming, more than f2p.

Why is Miyamoto the only one who has ideas at Nintendo?

He's not much of a gamer.

 

[Air]

If Nintendo really cares about the largest possible audience for their IPs and being a company that truly takes full advantage of brand strength, they should honestly just go third party. No one respects or loves Nintendo for their hardware, it's their software and character brands which have true cultural value. Any innovative ideas they have regarding control schemes, play methods, or whatever can simply be released as peripherals.

If you're a company, you never willingly give up a source of revenue if it can be helped. When your content comes at the expense control, stuff like what happened with Sega becomes a part of your future. Ideally a company would want to control as many points of contact with their customers as possible, so for nintendo- creating consoles is another way. Yeah the audience may not be as large as if they were third party, but the profit margin is, and that's what will keep them in business.

 

[JoeM86]

If you're a company, you never willingly give up a source of revenue if it can be helped. When your content comes at the expense control, stuff like what happened with Sega becomes a part of your future. Ideally a company would want to control as many points of contact with their customers as possible, so for nintendo- creating consoles is another way. Yeah the audience may not be as large as if they were third party, but the profit margin is, and that's what will keep them in business.

Exactly. This is something I don't get. People act like if Nintendo aren't #1 then they have failed and need to go third party. Why is that the logic that constantly exists in gaming discussions.

Obviously growth as a company is nice to have, and being #1 is their goal, but if they're #2 or even #3, that's not bad. They still have customers, they still have profit (success doesn't guarantee profit. Look at the PS3, Xbox 360's early years and even the first year of the 3DS after the price cut for that). Obviously if NX ends up doing worse than the Wii U they'd need to do something, but let's not count them out just because they're not king of the hill

 

[Empyrean Heaven]

If Nintendo really cares about the largest possible audience for their IPs and being a company that truly takes full advantage of brand strength, they should honestly just go third party. No one respects or loves Nintendo for their hardware, it's their software and character brands which have true cultural value. Any innovative ideas they have regarding control schemes, play methods, or whatever can simply be released as peripherals.

Sega thought the same thing and look what happened to them. Having their own platform gives Nintendo a special advantage that gives their games a higher focus than other titles. If the next Zelda games was released for PS4 and Xbox One right alongside the Witcher 4, Elder Scrolls VI, and GTA VI, they would just get lost in the shuffle, and even more so because they're not M rated. By having a dedicated platform, they are able to put their games at a higher pedestal from the others, I can't describe why, it just makes them "special".

And I like Nintendo's hardware.

 

[Makai]

Is it free or paid?

 

[PtM]

Is it free or paid?

Free demo.

 

[JoeM86]

Is it free or paid?

Seems it's free to start like the last Pullblox, so you get a few bits for free but if you want to continue you pay one payment and it's all there

 

[Dragonslayer_023]

Their strategy is IMO pretty intelligent.

They're trying to use this as a tool to create a new generation of kids that experiences Nintendo and, hopefully, wants to get everything Nintendo (as in, the NX. You know how kids are!). They're trying to figure out ways to create new generations of kids that will develop a nostalgic/emotional attachment to Nintendo experiences so that they can simultaneously profit off of their current self as kids via their parents and also off their future nostalgic adult selves. Just like they have been profiting out of people like me.

If they made a typical shallow, abusively F2P experience, kids would just grow out of it like they've done with Angry Birds and countless other mobile hot shots.

Will this actually work though? Why are kids going to care about this when there are a million runners and other things to play out there? There's nothing inherently special about Mario. How is anyone going to get a nostalgic/emotional attachment from this random iPhone game. I can't see any kid experiencing Mario for the first time through this and wanting a Nintendo system right away.

 

[PtM]

Will this actually work though? Why are kids going to care about this when there are a million runners and other things to play out there? There's nothing inherently special about Mario. How is anyone going to get a nostalgic/emotional attachment from this random iPhone game. I can't see any kid experiencing Mario for the first time through this and wanting a Nintendo system right away.

Heh.