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[Mesoian]

I'm grandfathered into unlimited data with Verizon for $70. Yiiiiisssss.

Me too.

 

[PackerinMN]

Fuck Verizon. Downtown Minneapolis has been a reception black hole for years. I'll probably switch to T-Mobile this summer, but I need to wait until I can afford to buy two phones cash. I don't feel like financing phones anymore.



His PR approach is a little transparent in wanting to be "the cool CEO" - however I can't help but admire his willingness to Tweet some of this shit:

"What a stupid, broken, arrogant industry."

"Here's my theory. 'Oh shit' is really an abbreviation for 'Oh shit I'm tied to a fucking contract and I'm stuck with a toilet phone for two years."

"AT&T is a total source of amusement for me. They are the ones that take my bullshit. Dumb move. They take the bait."

"I thought he looked better fat." (referring to ATT CEO)

"We are either going to take over this whole industry, or these bastards are going to change."

Why not finance? It's not like they're charging you interest for the phones. It's a free loan... 0% APR for 2 years.

 

[luxarific]

T-Mo really is amazing, but Verizon still has the best coverage in many parts of the country. That coverage lets them get away with screwing over their customers w/r/t data.

 

[radioactivez0r]

Over/under on another release using the 3 positive reactions they received as proof that "the customers agree!"?

 

[biggersmaller]

Why not finance? It's not like they're charging you interest for the phones. It's a free loan... 0% APR for 2 years.

I want to keep the number of pesky $10 - $30 recurring bills I have to a minimum. Also, it's a sort of insurance if something happens to my device I can always jump into that financing if it's really needed.

 

[jwhit28]

With Fiber it truly is just a matter of infrastructure, albeit expensive infrastructure. I'll agree that Verizon's wording is poor, but I think their sentiment stands.

Suppose Verizon has ten customers who are using its service 10% of the time. At full efficiency, each customer is using the service alone and has access to the full bandwidth. At minimum efficiency, each customer is using bandwidth at the same time and only gets 10%, and 90% of the bandwidth is wasted. I imagine Verizon is banking on some middle ground efficiency, but the more people simultaneously using a significant amount of bandwidth the harder it is for them to keep their promises.

So they probably should have promised less. T-Mobile gets away with unlimited because they have relatively fewer users compared to the bandwidth space they own. But to say Verizon can just infrastructure this is categorically wrong.

It's still hard to believe that the tiered data limits are there for the networks protection when they already have fail-safes in place to limit congestion or even throttle customers that shouldn't be such as those grandfathered in to unlimited data who get throttled at around the 7GB range even though both companies offer data plans that allow for bigger caps than that. It's also crazy to think that the same data limits should apply in smaller cities as in NYC or LA. Overage charges and tiered data plans are there to make money not for our own good. Both companies managed to find the bandwidth real quick to match Sprints double the data deal last year.

 

[andycapps]

I just switched. Haven't even completed my first month on att yet. I've never complained about call quality or dropped calls. Their data speeds where I live (a 400-500,000 metropolitan area population) sick duck,full stop. You sound like the sprint girl trying to convince me not to leave. "In the future we won't suck so bad, sir." Ummm that's great and all but no thanks.

Haha I'm just saying what the state and national rankings from RootMetrics were saying and what I've personally experienced. I'm not saying what you experienced wasn't valid. Most of the people that I've encountered on here that had Sprint and switched did so several years ago when it was a much different network, that's why I asked when you switched.

 

[DonasaurusRex]

...are they kidding?

The bottom line is the requirements to be a competitive and successful wireless carrier are going to go up not down regardless of what Verizon Wireless wants. They have the most customers in the US still "i think" but now that you dont have to be locked in for years at a time with phones and the basic smartphone is becoming the old flip / feature phone. Verizon can get with it and provide or get dropped. They charge too much already hope they figure out a better way to deal with traffic.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

Data caps are an awful way to handle that, though. A data cap doesn't distinguish between using data when it has no impact at all on congestion vs. when it's highly congested.

That's true, but I don't see a better way to handle it.

Well, the fact is, voice, text and internet are all "data".

Yes, but they know that there's a limit to the amount of data you will realistically be able to use via those avenues. Similar to how even T-Mobile doesn't allow you to purchase a plan with unlimited data AND tethering. The data is unlimited, but there's a limit to how much you can use on just your phone. I don't think that's actually so bad.

Spectrum again is carrier dependent... think of spectrum as the conduit of how the carrier gets service to you just like copper or fiber.

Still though, there's a limit to how much spectrum is out there in general. Granted, the carriers are sitting on a lot of it as an investment, but there's a reason they're investing in it... if mobile internet usage continues to rise, we're going to run out of capacity.

I'm no fan of Verizon BTW! They've been very anti-consumer in an innumerable number of ways. But I don't think anything they said in this blog post specifically was completely ridiculous.

 

[Earendil]

I haven't read through the thread, but I feel bad for anyone that isn't on TMobile at this point.

$100 gets me two lines, unlimited everything.

How unlimited is unlimited?

I've been tethering one of the lines to my home network via DDWRT since september. I have been using this as my home internet connection since then. I average 30Mbps down, and 15Mbps up with latency similar to my old DSL line. I've spoken with TMobile about this twice, and they confirm no action will be made on my account (although we didn't directly refer to is at tethering, they referred to it as "extremely high usage")

How high is high usage? Each month I have went over 1TB of download, and close to 500GB upload (I was streaming full time on twitch at the time)

They are a great company.

I'd love to hear more about this because I'd like to do the same thing. PM me if you wouldn't mind please.

 

[johnny956]

I haven't read through the thread, but I feel bad for anyone that isn't on TMobile at this point.

$100 gets me two lines, unlimited everything.

How unlimited is unlimited?

I've been tethering one of the lines to my home network via DDWRT since september. I have been using this as my home internet connection since then. I average 30Mbps down, and 15Mbps up with latency similar to my old DSL line. I've spoken with TMobile about this twice, and they confirm no action will be made on my account (although we didn't directly refer to is at tethering, they referred to it as "extremely high usage")

How high is high usage? Each month I have went over 1TB of download, and close to 500GB upload (I was streaming full time on twitch at the time)

They are a great company.

They have stated they'll start going after users like you who host a home connection or server through their phone. I've already noticed speed slow downs where I work downtown so clearly they are adding more users. My guess is they'll have to start throttling even the unlimited users but hopefully it's nothing crappy like 5gb. I average about 20gb a month on my unlimited plan

 

[Wowfunhappy]

I've been tethering one of the lines to my home network via DDWRT since september. I have been using this as my home internet connection since then. I average 30Mbps down, and 15Mbps up with latency similar to my old DSL line. I've spoken with TMobile about this twice, and they confirm no action will be made on my account (although we didn't directly refer to is at tethering, they referred to it as "extremely high usage")

Curious, do you use a VPN to hide the fact that you're tethering?

 

[Senoculum]

The first part is absolutely true and the second part is also true.


True; LTE requires SC-FDMA vs. Ethernet's CSMA/CD, however, the issue is dealing with power efficiency's which isn't the fault of the consumer, it is the supplier... I.E. handset makers, cell carriers, etc. While they could technically be more prone to slowness because of a single stream to the end user, it is up to the carrier to ensure speeds promised and/or advertised and paid for by the consumer are granted given their monetary commitment to said carrier. TL;DR, Verizon, ATT and others have a commitment to give you the bandwidth you are currently paying for.


Again, not the end users problem, this is the carriers problem.


No shit sherlock.


Needs citation...

inelastic demand bitch.



Says the man who wants to line his pockets with more money.


*rolleyes*

Because goods and services priced competitively is too much to ask for some people.


Jackie Gold? Really? Lulz.


If you care to, (since I am) feel free to contact Jackie:

Jack E. Gold
President and Principal Analyst
jack.gold@jgoldassociates.com
1-508-393-5294
Follow me on Twitter: @jckgld

I'm Canadian, and we have our own problems, but I still tweeted Mr. Gold calling him out on this bullshit. I love my American neighbours, but you have a much greater power than me in putting these assholes in the spotlight!

 

[DarkFlow]

Which company is the least evil?

I've had and hated US Cellular and AT&T in the past, but haven't been on a major carrier in about five years. I'm only asking here because I was thinking of picking up Verizon, but these remarks are idiotic, and now I'm uncertain again.

I'm on AT&T, I don't find them all that bad. They let me double my data pool from 10 to 20GB for free awhile back.

 

[titiklabingapat]

This is the reason why despite having a smaller (but more than adequate!) network, I switched to T-Mobile. Really, how often do people go out in the boonies? 99% of the time, you are where civilization is, and T-Mobile covers you.

Staying with Verizon is like buying a full size SUV because you *might* go off-roading. Everyone knows 99% of SUV owners just drive it within the city and suburbs.

 

[commish]

I'm on AT&T, I don't find them all that bad. They let me double my data pool from 10 to 20GB for free awhile back.

I had AT&T for years and my only problem was a bunch of dropped calls, which I didn't care too much about. I have Verizon now and miss AT&T, as AT&T gave me a superior data/internet experience. That said, I'm paying under $60 on verizon for data/service, so I can't complain and will probably never leave unless AT&T matches this deal somehow.

 

[RCSI]

Well it's not like you're gonna download GTA V on your phone is it ?

Then how would I download a car?


Ridiculous statement and excuse for the use of a paywall behind unlimited data.

 

[DarkFlow]

I had AT&T for years and my only problem was a bunch of dropped calls, which I didn't care too much about. I have Verizon now and miss AT&T, as AT&T gave me a superior data/internet experience. That said, I'm paying under $60 on verizon for data/service, so I can't complain and will probably never leave unless AT&T matches this deal somehow.

I pay $45 as part of my share of the data plan, that includes my next payments.

 

[Verelios]

Man, I just had an enema recently. I wish Verizon would slow down, a man can only get reamed so many times in a day.

 

[Husker86]

This is the reason why despite having a smaller (but more than adequate!) network, I switched to T-Mobile. Really, how often do people go out in the boonies? 99% of the time, you are where civilization is, and T-Mobile covers you.

Staying with Verizon is like buying a full size SUV because you *might* go off-roading. Everyone knows 99% of SUV owners just drive it within the city and suburbs.

T-Mobile has shit coverage in many places that aren't "the boonies". They have those deals for a reason; their network, overall, is far behind AT&T and Verizon. I say that as someone who'd love to support T-Mobile, but can't.

Yes yes, I know T-Mobile is great in some areas.

 

[titiklabingapat]

Oh yeah, Tmobile has also locked me into the price I've been paying them for life so no more price increases for me.

T-Mobile has shit coverage in many places that aren't "the boonies". They have those deals for a reason; their network, overall, is far behind AT&T and Verizon. I say that as someone who'd love to support T-Mobile, but can't.

Yes yes, I know T-Mobile is great in some areas.

I travel a lot for work, and the amount of places where I have encountered shit T-Mobile coverage is very very small. Usually when I'm on the train between cities. I usually fly to Seattle, Bay Area, Chicago, DC, Boston, SoCal and NYC metro areas.

 

[Nastrodamous]

i have ATT 30gigs for $90, eat one Verizon.

GSM is the nice

 

[VoxPop]

Its really sad Verizon is still in the business despite butchering phones with their ugly logos + crapware and not even being GSM to boot. I remember working at Verizon years ago peddling Motorola Droids having to tell everyone it was better than the iPhone. Good times.

 

[DarkFlow]

Its really sad Verizon is still in the business despite butchering phones with their ugly logos + crapware and not even being GSM to boot. I remember working at Verizon years ago peddling Motorola Droids having to tell everyone it was better than the iPhone. Good times.

It was.

 

[Telephoto999]

Curious, do you use a VPN to hide the fact that you're tethering?

I use a useragent switcher on the browsers on my MAC to hide the traffic origin. Otherwise I get a upsell page. Newsgroups, torrents and twitch still work great no matter.

I also might have overstated my traffic. Here is a picture from January as I had reset my logs at the start of the year.

Still, a fuck ton of data.

 

[DOWN]

I don't use LTE in my area anymore because it is much slower than the 4G signal, despite the strength being equal.

 

[Husker86]

Oh yeah, Tmobile has also locked me into the price I've been paying them for life so no more price increases for me.



I travel a lot for work, and the amount of places where I have encountered shit T-Mobile coverage is very very small. Usually when I'm on the train between cities. I usually fly to Seattle, Bay Area, Chicago, DC, Boston, SoCal and NYC metro areas.

Well...yeah, I assume coverage is going to be good in those areas. Those are some of the biggest metros in the country!

They're big, but they aren't the majority of this country.

I like what T-Mobile is doing, I'm not trying to shit on them for fun. Between cities is a lot of the times the places I want data, too. Tethering and all that fun stuff.

 

[kyser73]

I'm deeply impressed by the J.Gold Associates website. Looks like the kind of up-to-the-minute design and functionality you'd expect from a firm of leading technology analysts.

 

[TAJ]

I still have a grandfathered unlimited data plan from verizon. They call me up like twice a month and try to talk me out of it.

I have it and they've never bothered me about it.

Curious, do you use a VPN to hide the fact that you're tethering?

I also tether and do nothing to hide it, but I'm only tethering to another Android device. (Tab S 10.5)
I'm using their official tethering app, just not paying for it. I rooted my phone and turned off the notice that asks you to upgrade your plan. (To get something that back that I already had before, but was put behind a paywall. Fuck them. I sleep like a baby.)

 

[WorldStar]

I'd be more upset if WiFi wasn't everywhere around me

Thank god I don't live in some bumfuck state

 

[TAJ]

I'd be more upset if WiFi wasn't everywhere around me

Thank god I don't live in some bumfuck state

WiFi availability sucks in SoCal. No idea what you consider civilization. Where do you live?

 

[WorldStar]

WiFi availability sucks in SoCal. No idea what you consider civilization. Where do you live?

SoCal

 

[Vilam]

Hey Verizon, get fucked. I still have my unlimited and use it as much as possible just to stick it to you miserable greedy pricks.

 

[Husker86]

I have it and they've never bothered me about it.



I also tether and do nothing to hide it, but I'm only tethering to another Android device. (Tab S 10.5)
I'm using their official tethering app, just not paying for it. I rooted my phone and turned off the notice that asks you to upgrade your plan. (To get something that back that I already had before, but was put behind a paywall. Fuck them. I sleep like a baby.)

When was tethering from a smartphone ever allowed on Verizon unlimited plans?

 

[liliththepale]

WiFi availability sucks in SoCal. No idea what you consider civilization. Where do you live?

Er, no? I have WiFi basically everywhere I go except while driving (Newport/Costa Mesa).

 

[WorldStar]

Er, no? I have WiFi basically everywhere I go except while driving (Newport/Costa Mesa).

ditto (LA county)

no fucking clue what TAJ is talking about

 

[Earthpainting]

They're not wrong about the limitations of mobile data, but their measures against it definitely do not favour the consumer. Throttling the heaviest traffic seems like the simplest solution. Another thing that would help alleviate the problem is turning your home modems into wireless hotspots that Verizon users can freely connect to and offload some of the mobile data strain to. Ultimately they're only temporary bandages though, and the only true solution is invest in updating and expanding infrastructure. This is what this measure is about anyway. Trying to put off modernising and expanding their network for as long as possible. If the current infrastructure keeps showing its limits, then the comparison with competitors happens a lot quicker than it normally would.

 

[twinturbo2]

I'm switching to Sprint once I get my iPhone 6, no doubt about it.

Verizon turned me off with their anti-net neutrality stance, and now this?

 

[CrispyBoar]

Glad that I don't use Verizon for my cell phone service. Scumbags.

Edit: Wow, didn't realize that this was an old thread.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

So, I have a (completely unlimited) T-Mobile plan and I love unlimited data, however...

Many believe that unlimited data is about the ability to do whatever you want on a mobile device while enjoying the freedom of not being required to pay extra charges. Nobody likes to think that they are restricted when they access the Internet, and we have grown accustomed to wired Internet access from home or work that doesn’t impose limits.

However, wireless connectivity is different than wired connections and more susceptible to “traffic jams” that slow down the networks for everyone. This is usually the result of too many people trying to do too much over their connections at the same time.

The quality of connection is important to wireless users, and when connections become slow or disconnections occur due to overcrowding, users become disappointed. Let’s face it, if everyone had unlimited data and used it fully, the performance of the networks would suffer because of bandwidth restrictions and the “shared resource” nature of wireless.

Is anything he says actually wrong? It actually sounds like a PR guy being pretty frank about the situation. There's a limited amount of spectrum, so extra use really does slow the overall network down. Actually, I think we're going to have even larger issues with not having enough spectrum in the future.

I'm kind of playing Devil's Advocate, but only kind of.

Edit: Oh, also, screw Verizon for their scummy and anti-competitive practices. I still hate them.

 

[braves01]

I used 35 gigs last month. Sorry for taking up the shared resource bros.

 

[Marty Chinn]

What a weird necro bump for this thread...

 

[Bubba T]

 

[LCGeek]

So, I have a (completely unlimited) T-Mobile plan and I love unlimited data, however...


Is anything he says actually wrong? It actually sounds like a PR guy being pretty frank about the situation. There's a limited amount of spectrum, so extra use really does slow the overall network down. Actually, I think we're going to have even larger issues with not having enough spectrum in the future.

I'm kind of playing Devil's Advocate, but only kind of.

Edit: Oh, also, screw Verizon for their scummy and anti-competitive practices. I still hate them.

Consumer pays for access and the ability to reasonably be able to view what they want. It's not the consumers job to makeup for a company which be it wireless or not doesn't want to build a proper network to handle peak usage.

The problem with the wireless spectrum is it's very new compared to traditional networking and still has flaws. Buffering is one them and it only makes the problem of bufferbloat worse. Yet this company as you can google bufferbloat is one of the few making it harder on themselves and the industry to move to an internet most wouldn't think was possible even a few years ago.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

Consumer pays for access and the ability to reasonably be able to view what they want. It's not the consumers job to makeup for a company which be it wireless or not doesn't want to build a proper network to handle peak usage.

Which, one could argue, is why Verizon doesn't let you pay for unlimited data. Verizon can't (or doesn't want to?) handle constant usage of its network, so it forces people to limit their data consumption.

 

[maximum360]

How much is unlimited on T-mobile?

There's a promotion unlimited calls, texts, and data for 4 lines at a cost of $150 per month. You can't beat that. My previous plan was $180 for 4 lines and I was able to get on the new promotion since it's for new and current customers. I also was still able to keep the $200 credit for each of the 4 lines when we switched from Sprint in December. I also have free tethering and a cheaper plan than I had with Sprint. I'm loving T-Mobile.

 

[Slayer-33]

WOW.

 

[Tesseract]

hahahahahaha

okay old white dude, whatever you say

 

[WaterAstro]

If they are worried about that, why don't they implement a cap throttle?

If someone downloads 100 gb on their phone a day, throttle their speeds because they're obviously abusing it.

 

[Your Entertainer]

So, I have a (completely unlimited) T-Mobile plan and I love unlimited data, however...


Is anything he says actually wrong? It actually sounds like a PR guy being pretty frank about the situation. There's a limited amount of spectrum, so extra use really does slow the overall network down. Actually, I think we're going to have even larger issues with not having enough spectrum in the future.

I'm kind of playing Devil's Advocate, but only kind of.

Edit: Oh, also, screw Verizon for their scummy and anti-competitive practices. I still hate them.

It's their fault for not building or maintaining a network capable of handling modern, reasonable usage by their subscribers. The paltry caps in this day and age are just not consistent with the increasing bandwidth requirements of even moderate usage.

Also, it is a completely transparent attempt to dig into consumers' wallets, as if all of the rest of their blatant anti-consumer policies didn't make it obvious enough. If the problem is peak bandwidth, then why not throttle during peak hours? Why cap? And why count data used at non-peak hours towards the cap? And why charge overages? The answer is pretty clear.

At least that's my understanding.