I think so, personally. I really don't think he's made a solid game ever since. Thankfully, FFT is one of the best srpg's ever, and he'll always be associated with that. Also, even though it is not a part of the numbered series, I still consider it the second-best game using the "Final Fantasy" name. I know, I know. Vagrant Story. The game started out ok, but I just wasn't into it. And he totally botched FFXII, IMO.
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Was Final Fantasy Tactics Matsuno's swan song?
- Thread starter Diablos
- Start date
Red Scarlet
Member
Only good game he's made that I've played (FFT), bwa ha ha.
Chairman Yang
if he talks about books, you better damn well listen
Diablos said:
How so? Most of the things I love about FFXII (like intelligent, political plot and characters and deep, varied gameplay) seem much more in line with Matsuno rather than the other Final Fantasy games.
Joe Molotov
Member
Diablos said:
All two of them.
Bizarro Sun Yat-sen
Banned
This thread started out okay*, but I'm just not into it
* I'm a big fan of the letter W
* I'm a big fan of the letter W
Bizarro Sun Yat-sen
Banned
P.S. Why do Matsuno-bashers never bring up the PlayOnline Viewer?
Joe Molotov
Member
Diablos said:
I didn't think he made that one.
Green Biker Dude
Banned
I've played FFT, FFTA, Vagrant Story and FFXII, but the only one I really liked was FFT. I wish it would've lasted a little longer though, and that the Serpentarius stone had a use.
FFTA was mediocre, but still better than VS and FFXII imo. I couldn't really get into VS, so I read about its story and thought it wasn't that great. Maybe the way it was told just made it better or something.
I stopped playing FFXII around 60 hours, I didn't like the lack of storyline/character development and I felt like I wasn't doing anything outside of boss battles or marks. This one was really disappointing.
FFTA was mediocre, but still better than VS and FFXII imo. I couldn't really get into VS, so I read about its story and thought it wasn't that great. Maybe the way it was told just made it better or something.
I stopped playing FFXII around 60 hours, I didn't like the lack of storyline/character development and I felt like I wasn't doing anything outside of boss battles or marks. This one was really disappointing.
DarknessTear
Banned
FFT is Matsuno's best game hands down. I bet if he worked on FFXII until the end it may have rivaled FFT, though.
Yeah, the game had potential. The story just completely... disappearing, and the gameplay being way too automated is what hurt FFXII.DarknessTear said:
FFXII is basically Matsuno there for 1/3 of the development, then he's kicked out and a bunch of devs are faced with the question: "Can I be Matsuno?" And the answer was clearly no. Although, I'm not sure if FFXII would have been that great even if Matsuno was there the whole way through, considering how mediocre VS and FFTA are.
Also, FFT does have a good story, it's just hard to follow because it must have been translated by people who learned the English language 15 minutes ago.
(until his next game that is 
)DarknessTear
Banned
Fady K said:
I'm afraid you're where it begins to suck.
The level designs and story and stuff all go downhill from there.Also they didn't really knock him off, he left because they were messing with his world.
FFT was ok, but I honestly never finished it. I tried 3 times or so and just couldn't. I think the plot was hurt a lot by the translation and the fact that it just felt like it was trying too hard to be complex for complexities sake.
Still a more complete game than his other games I've played (VS, FFXII, I think I played a TO game but don't remember which ones).
Still a more complete game than his other games I've played (VS, FFXII, I think I played a TO game but don't remember which ones).
I saw it falling apart long before that, but yeah, I guess that's when your really come to the realization that the story barely serves any type of purpose.DarknessTear said:I'm afraid you're where it begins to suck.
Also they didn't really knock him off, he left because they were messing with his world.
Chairman Yang
if he talks about books, you better damn well listen
Diablos said:
FFT's story was excellent and deep, and the characters were some of the most nuanced and original for console RPGs of the time. The translation definitely hurt, though.
DarknessTear said:I'm afraid you're where it begins to suck.
Also they didn't really knock him off, he left because they were messing with his world.
Where its beginning to suck?? Oh no...
Might you know anything about him leaving? Cause im completely clueless about it. So far, the game oozes Matsuno's style, so i dont get it..
Red Scarlet
Member
Aeana said:Oh, you.
Well, I hated Vagrant Story, didn't like FF12, and what I played of Tactics Ogre and FFTA (very little of either) didn't impress me. I really think the only reason I gave FFT a real try was because of the job system and having just gone through FF5 for the first time immediately before. His type of game just isn't what I'm interested in at all, going by what I have played of his.
The story stuff he does has never mattered; I played through the JP FFT before the one or two times in English, so whatever he supposedly does that's magical for storylines has never been a factor..so I simply don't like his 'game style'.
Catchpenny
Member
Vagrant Story was his last great game. FFT is overrated, FFTA is worse, and I still don't know what to make of FFXII.
gamergirly
Member
Chairman Yang said:
Yeah, especially some of the later events with Delita and Princess Ovelia
Red Scarlet said:Well, I hated Vagrant Story, didn't like FF12, and what I played of Tactics Ogre and FFTA (very little of either) didn't impress me. I really think the only reason I gave FFT a real try was because of the job system and having just gone through FF5 for the first time immediately before. His type of game just isn't what I'm interested in at all, going by what I have played of his.
I understand. Do you like Tactics Ogre/FFT-style "SRPGs" at all? If not, it's certainly understandable. And Vagrant Story is extremely love/hate.
Red Scarlet
Member
Aeana said:
FFT is the only one I've gone through. I don't think I've played any aside from it, FFTA, and Tactics Ogre. I played FFTA and TO combined for about an hour.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Diablos said:
Wait until his Wii game comes out before making such comments
MoxManiac said:
I stopped arguing with people over VS during the summer. Now I just wish plagues upon their houses!
My friend said he hated Vagrant Story and then later that day he got hit by a car. And then poked to death by eagles as he lie in the street. I'd say rest in peace, but that bastard hated Vagrant Story!
Anyway, I've decided not to argue with anyone over FFXII similarly to my no VS arguing rule. It's not just worth it.
People like what they like and that's fine with me.
Bizarro Sun Yat-sen
Banned
just to make this clear, nobody really knows why or under what circumstances Matsuno left.
Final Fantasy XII is by far the best game associated with him.
FFT and Vagrant Story had better stories, but neither come close to being as FUN and good to play as FFXII.
As a matter of fact, I think FFXII is the best J-RPG ever, none come close to its gameplay. (and I've played tons, from Vandal Hearts to Wild Arms, from Suikoden to Xenogears, Star Ocean, Dragon Quest, etc.)
FFT and Vagrant Story had better stories, but neither come close to being as FUN and good to play as FFXII.
As a matter of fact, I think FFXII is the best J-RPG ever, none come close to its gameplay. (and I've played tons, from Vandal Hearts to Wild Arms, from Suikoden to Xenogears, Star Ocean, Dragon Quest, etc.)
Bizarro Sun Yat-sen said:
I think it is reasonably easy to figure out though.
Guy struggled managing a huge team, game faced numerous delays, Square was rather unhappy with this, he was probably pressured inordinately by management, and something occurred in that cycle that would either have A) forced Matsuno out of the company (I understand there are no "firings" in Japanese corporations like there are in the west) or B)made his time at the company not worthwhile (never would lead another project).
Obviously something happened during development that caused him to step down...and it isn't health. Health doesn't cause someone to leave a company.
Fady K said:You think FFXII has a lot of VS similiarities too? I did, loved em.
By the way, please tell me you didnt hate the FFXII story too
Btw, whats going on in your avatar?
I think FFXII kind of has more of an Ogre Battleish feel.
But I could see why you would link VS with FFXII stylistically...I think there are a lot of the same aesthetic factors in play...plus, Sakimoto's score.
1) FFTA was produced by Matsuno but most of the work was done by the director of tactics ogre gaiden (he was director of FFTA, not Matsuno). So FFTA isnt' really a Matsuno game.
2) :lol at people who think FF12 had a bad story, or even if they do consider it to have a bad story, actually use that as an argument for the game being bad.
Anyway here is what I rank Matsuno's games:
1) Tactics Ogre
2) Vagrant Story
3) FFT
4) FF12
5) Ogre Battle
They are all great games IMO, easily superior to anything else released by the Square side of Square Enix. undisputable fact akin to saying Tetris Attack is the best puzzle game ever.
2) :lol at people who think FF12 had a bad story, or even if they do consider it to have a bad story, actually use that as an argument for the game being bad.
Anyway here is what I rank Matsuno's games:
1) Tactics Ogre
2) Vagrant Story
3) FFT
4) FF12
5) Ogre Battle
They are all great games IMO, easily superior to anything else released by the Square side of Square Enix. undisputable fact akin to saying Tetris Attack is the best puzzle game ever.
As much as I enjoyed FFT, this game is IMO a far cry from Tactics Ogre. If you have yet to play TO on the SNES with good transltion (if any), then you might overlook something significant about Matsuno.
Also, it's notable that as for FFT Matsuno worked mainly on the story part and left the battle part to Ito. So, Ito should deserve credit for the good parts of FFT. The job system that reminds me of FF5 was awesome, whereas the story lacked catharsis and develpment.
Considering VS of which Matsuo planed the battle system without Ito, I personally think Matsuo's strength is just to create the elegant atmosphere and he often can't develop as interesting system as Ito. I enjoyed VS, FFTA and FFXII a lot, though.
Also, it's notable that as for FFT Matsuno worked mainly on the story part and left the battle part to Ito. So, Ito should deserve credit for the good parts of FFT. The job system that reminds me of FF5 was awesome, whereas the story lacked catharsis and develpment.
Considering VS of which Matsuo planed the battle system without Ito, I personally think Matsuo's strength is just to create the elegant atmosphere and he often can't develop as interesting system as Ito. I enjoyed VS, FFTA and FFXII a lot, though.
Krowley said:
ssoass said:
Nice to see some love for this game. Im currently having a blast too.
Y2Kevbug11 said:
Yeah, there are a lot of aesthetic factors indeed. And the score, i love it to bits.
Pellham said:
Woo! I was sure Matsuno wasnt as involved in FFTA as I thought he was! I agree with what you said - easily superior to anything else release by the Square side of Square-Enix (even love em more than Enix's stuff too), the only thing thats up there from Square-Enix (or should I say Square-Soft) is FFVI and FFVII.